purple end game gear and high level enchantments in low level PVP

marc8219 · September 2014

Seems like over half of the pvp queue is vet players leveling alts using this and making it near impossible for new players to pvp while leveling up, this kind of gear should not be useable until end game it is ruining low level pvp.

emilemo · September 2014

You're right, there is no excuse for that. A low level toon with purple rings, artifact and even weapon + high rank enchants leaves no room for ordinary players to compete. But not to worry things dont get much better post 60, the gap is still there and quite noticeable too

yoadoad · September 2014

Why should it be changed? If you want to compete with them, regardless of your level, you can buy packs or zen. There's no other way for you right now, maybe after 3-4 months of complete farming you could fight with about equal terms.

In the meantime, things that could help you right now are the Dragonborn legend pack (Gives a great artifact and a nice enchantments) and the Zen-AD exchange by purchasing Zen.

eldarth · September 2014

Welcome to twinking. Definitely annoying for anyone who wants to "earn" what their character uses instead of relying on a "rich" uncle to buy them expensive toys. It's powergaming to feed their pathetic min-max ego.

Unknown · September 2014

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joncans · September 2014

Disagree. I am twinking right now on my HR. PF enchant, all R8's, 7k GS at level 45. He's my alt, but sorry, already did the grind on my main for a year to get to where he is now. I think I earned the right to kick back and power level him up to 60. Plus, the hardcore PVP guilds have alts leveling up in the brackets too, and they are twinked way harder than I am.

Welcome to PVP new players. If you haven't figured out by now that PVP is ONLY about gear, then this game is not for you. If you are QQing about lack of gear now, while leveling up, you will surely rage quit the game the second you step into an end game Dom match.

edit:
Just buy the SW pack. Whatever comes in that pack must be nice, because SW in the pre 60 brackets are destroying EVERYTHING.

yoadoad · September 2014

magenubbie wrote: »

Not an option. There's a limit to how much zen people can spend on their first 60- character, and even if you spend zen on your first low level character -not that I see why you should. I'd try the game properly before I spend money- this limit ensures you'll never buy mulhorand or xim gear unless you're a DC or TR.
And low lvl PvP should be what it is. Low level PvP. While I have no objection to lvling a new character through PvP, it shouldn't come at the cost of a new player. It's not even a quicker way to level. It just gives you a head start on the leaderboard.

I'm not saying this benefits the community or the fun of the players - It does not.
But it benefits the creators of this game the most. And in this game, it is the most important factor.
Sooner or later the new players will find that the gap between them and the established or p2w players is huge. It doesn't matter if it's when they're at level 29 and pvping for the first time or just made it to 60 & run around with T1 and 10k GS while competing with (and against) 16k guys in domination.

zshikara · September 2014

I will have to admit to twinking my 3rd character. I went through the leveling process legit for my first 2. My 3rd gets some help. Granted I don't pvp that much though.

Unknown · September 2014

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myowmyow · September 2014

Why would anyone attempt to "level" a character in PvP? Working quests is so very, very, very much faster!

Maybe they just want to try out lower-level PvP with account-bound purple equipment they traded from their level 60 character? Things like the Xvim set come to mind . . .

pointsman · September 2014

myowmyow wrote: »

Why would anyone attempt to "level" a character in PvP? Working quests is so very, very, very much faster!

Because, strangely, there are quite a few people here who come to this MMO based on the idea of killing dragons in dungeons, but who dislike the idea of killing dragons in dungeons.

asterotg · September 2014

I played other MMORPGs and there was QQ about twinking oe. everywhere. If I spent multiple hours or money in a game and boons are available to me, WHY should I not se them. I know, that it sucks to be a newbie and to get killed by ppl with 10x your GS, but everyone with one or more lvl 60 chars did this at last one time and livest to play on.

IMO the bigger problem is, that he gap at lvl 60 is getting bigger and bigger. A BIS player with all the boons and artefacts will sit at 20k+ GS, while a new lvl 60 can either spent cash for sharandar and dread ring and grind for month in IWD and TOD or grind for even more month, to do all four. While ok for PVE, it is a huge imbalance in PVP.

rashylewizz · September 2014

Yup it is imbalanced. But having rank 10 enchants, legendary artifacts is also working as intended in low level pvp

yoadoad · September 2014

magenubbie wrote: »

I don't get how new players getting frustrated benefits anyone, least of all the publisher. It only drives people away. It certainly doesn't motivate people to PvP again at the very least.

It greatly matters when they get to that gap. If they get to PvP normally against similar geared players they learn to play and understand their opponents. Getting 1 shot at lvl29 by a certain class only makes them resent that class and possibly PvP in general. This in turn results in the ever so loud part of the PvP community crying about OP classes with no idea how they work. And we all know how many uncalled for nerfs there have been because of this.

At lvl 60 any player using half his IQ can reason out that there's going to be a gap between veterans and new lvl60s. There's nothing wrong with that. Of course, when they are constantly outnumbered and can't find a decent match, they'll quit PvP sooner or later anyway. But that's not an excuse to deny them some normal matches while they are leveling.

But you see, This is how you build a good P2W game. You "tease" them when they're at low level that there are other players who are much, much better than them at the same level. Most players wouldn't mind at this point - When you're focused at leveling you just continue doing quests. The players who do mind? Some will leave. Others will open their wallets for the first time in this game (And I'm willing to bet that not the last for most).
Then when they get to the level 60 zone, the gap will be even bigger, and the players will know that they have the possibility to pay to be good. They will look at the amount of content that they'd need to do - Sharander, DR, Dragon, T2 Dungeons (which will take them a while to even get into). We're talking about 3-4 hours of farming alone every day, and they'll have to repeat it for what, a month? Just to "get started" at level 60. Of course all these things have solutions with money: You can buy the Sharander pack, DR pack, or just another pack that gives you AD that you could buy T2 gear with. Back to our heroes, Then they'd farm to get lesser enchantments, feel great about themselves, join PvP thinking they're now ready to start playing, and get pwned by black ice dudes with perfect enchantments. Now they know - Pay now, or keep doing the repetitive stuff for months - This is a great formula for making people pay.

djarkaan · September 2014

Most new player will do the exact same thing once they are not new anymore and have leveled, accumulated enough wealth and created an alt. And the new newer players will come to the forum and whine about it.

What you are saying is akin to: Letting the new kid play in the sandlot with his plastic shovel when the other kids are all playing with Tonka trucks. If you don't want to wait until you find an abandon Tonka truck get daddy to buy you one, otherwise tough luck.

magiquepurse · September 2014

yoadoad wrote: »

But you see, This is how you build a good P2W game.

This guy gets it.

Frustration CAN lead to SOME people leaving. But it needs to be done properly so most don't leave, but pay up. Frustration is bad for everybody but the producer lol.

These things being said, twinking is sad, and people doing it are sad beings too. I only sent my enchants to my HR alt when it reached 60. I didn't even buy Mulhorands.

I am not gonna pollute low level PvP meant to be played by people with rank 1-4 enchants and greens&blues with my gear from 1 year of grinding. But that's just me. Others just don't care.

joncans · September 2014

Here's the thing OP. You are playing a F2P game. All content unlocked. PVP is completely optional. Yes there is the PVP campaign with boons, but the majority only help you when flagged for PVP.

I did not spend a dime on this game until well after 60. I had PVP'ed and managed to get R5's and T1 PVP set (before tenacity). I just happen to be a competitive individual who enjoys PVP more than the repetitious daily grind and easy mode T2's. CN was a blast, until speed runs were the norm.

Point is, you come here, complain about a purely optional aspect of a free to play game. If you want to do well at PVP, get some Dragon Bone main and off hand off the AH or pay some money and buy the Dragonborn or SW pack with some leveling purples and blues. If this is not in your interest, stay focused on PVE and enjoy the game.

marc8219 · September 2014

I understand its a f2p game with p2w, but items, powers, and such that are only available to end-game players being useable on their low level alts is ridiculous. most items in other games and even this game have a minimum level to use this stuff except for all these purple items I see them using. Also enchantments need to have a level cap, it should be low level enchants at low levels.

I can somewhat manage and still can win half the time and have won matches using only blue stuff and rank 5 or less enchants on my level 40 when against teams with more p2w and endgame gear then on my team, but I do see it discouraging many other new players who sometimes leave the match or just wait at the spawn for it to end. My rating gets trashed enough by this though so since I am not to worried about it I have no problem sacrificing myself constantly make these twinkers die while ignoring legit players to trash there ratings too regardless if we win or lose, I have seen people go back a few pages after doing this.

This is just bad game design, nobody is saying p2w doesn't belong in a f2p game, it just needs to be at the appropriate level and accessible to all people of that level.

marc8219 · September 2014

magenubbie wrote: »

I don't get how new players getting frustrated benefits anyone, least of all the publisher. It only drives people away. It certainly doesn't motivate people to PvP again at the very least.

It greatly matters when they get to that gap. If they get to PvP normally against similar geared players they learn to play and understand their opponents. Getting 1 shot at lvl29 by a certain class only makes them resent that class and possibly PvP in general. This in turn results in the ever so loud part of the PvP community crying about OP classes with no idea how they work. And we all know how many uncalled for nerfs there have been because of this.

At lvl 60 any player using half his IQ can reason out that there's going to be a gap between veterans and new lvl60s. There's nothing wrong with that. Of course, when they are constantly outnumbered and can't find a decent match, they'll quit PvP sooner or later anyway. But that's not an excuse to deny them some normal matches while they are leveling.

You summed it up perfectly, I agree. I am not saying there should be no p2w or a gap between players that are using free stuff or zen store stuff, but there is something wrong when the low level pvp queue is dominated by max level players leveling alts using gear only available at end game it is bad for the community and to get new pvpers interested. Low level pvp should be about learning and having normal matches before it gets too crazy.

benskix2 · September 2014

If you are new to this game and try out PVP at lower levels right now you aren't going to think wow I need to spend some money to catch up, you're going to think wow this is really stupid and you're going to go play something else. This games PVP isn't good enough to justify paying cash up front just to participate when there are so many other FTP options out there.

marc8219 · September 2014

magiquepurse wrote: »

This guy gets it.

Frustration CAN lead to SOME people leaving. But it needs to be done properly so most don't leave, but pay up. Frustration is bad for everybody but the producer lol.

These things being said, twinking is sad, and people doing it are sad beings too. I only sent my enchants to my HR alt when it reached 60. I didn't even buy Mulhorands.

I am not gonna pollute low level PvP meant to be played by people with rank 1-4 enchants and greens&blues with my gear from 1 year of grinding. But that's just me. Others just don't care.

Thank you for being a decent vet player, too bad more aren't like you.

benskix2 wrote: »

If you are new to this game and try out PVP at lower levels right now you aren't going to think wow I need to spend some money to catch up, you're going to think wow this is really stupid and you're going to go play something else. This games PVP isn't good enough to justify paying cash up front just to participate when there are so many other FTP options out there.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Nobody is going to drop the kind of money on zen and ad to get the stuff end game players are using at low levels on their alts, its just ridiculous.

New players just see a toxic pvp community so hostile to new players that they can't even let them have decent normal matches leveling up without being dominated by 4x gear score and premades of vet players who are too scared to take their premades and end game gear into level 60 pvp where it belongs so they hide in low level queues.

purple end game gear and high level enchantments in low level PVP

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