On Probation, if I buy keys now, will it affect me later?

echokazul · August 2014

So I decided to go ahead and splurge a little, buying a $20 gift card. I had planned on buying keys while they were on sale, as I'm saving up tradebars and I enjoy a little bit of randomness.

But when I went to buy them out of the zen shop, I got a message saying that my account was on probation, and anything I bought, including items from opened lockboxes, would become BoA. I've never gotten that before. I still want to take advantage of the key sale, though, since I already bought the zen and it's in my account. I'm just worried about that message saying all items from the lockboxes I open will be BoA. If I buy the keys, and wait however long it takes for my probation to end to use them, will the items from the lockboxes I then open be normal and sellable, or will those keys carry over the 'BoA' condition with it?

Unknown · August 2014

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echokazul · August 2014

Yeah, that's what I'm worried about. I put in a ticket as well, but I'm half afraid either I'll just get a generic automated response, or I won't get an answer until after the sale is over. I am trying to leave my feelings out of this, as I do want it to get answered and not locked, but as a legit player who's sunk far more money in this game then I probably should, I'm not feeling the love.

Eh, it's not the biggest deal in the world, more then likely I'd keep the items from the boxes anyways, but, knowing my luck, that's when I'd get the rare mount that I don't need but is worth millions.

Unknown · August 2014

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refracted0dawn · August 2014

If you open the boxes, all the items will be bound to your account forevermore.

I really do not know what will happen if you buy the keys and wait until the probation is over and then open the boxes (why would they put you on probation?).

Maybe a moderator would know for sure.

But, as you say, you've already spent too much money. I would normally have bought €180.00's worth of Zen this week (about 25,000 with the +15% bonus on top of the normal bonus) and bought a load of keys and wards in the Sale.

But as I told them, I stopped buying Zen due to the Dragonborn fake sale. Crediting me with 2150 Zen (25% of the 8600 Zen's worth I spent in Euros) would restore some of the trust they have destroyed.

Unknown · August 2014

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echokazul · August 2014

refracted0dawn wrote: »

I really do not know what will happen if you buy the keys and wait until the probation is over and then open the boxes (why would they put you on probation?).
~

It really surprised me when I got the message. I'm a player who won't even exploit dungeon runs, completely legit and rule-following. I'm thinking it's because I bought zen using my Steam Wallet instead of the Ultimate Gamer Card like I usually did (since they went out of business and all, I switched to buying Steam Gift Cards). Steam being a second party and all. I hope it doesn't do that every time. That's really going to put me off buying Zen. Like I said, I'm really trying to keep my personal feelings regarding how I'm being treated as a customer out of this, and just get my question answered.

If not, I guess I'll be a guinea pig and post the results in the weeks or so it'll take for me to get off probation.

Unknown · August 2014

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anharmon · August 2014

echokazul wrote: »

It really surprised me when I got the message. I'm a player who won't even exploit dungeon runs, completely legit and rule-following. I'm thinking it's because I bought zen using my Steam Wallet instead of the Ultimate Gamer Card like I usually did (since they went out of business and all, I switched to buying Steam Gift Cards). Steam being a second party and all. I hope it doesn't do that every time. That's really going to put me off buying Zen. Like I said, I'm really trying to keep my personal feelings regarding how I'm being treated as a customer out of this, and just get my question answered.

If not, I guess I'll be a guinea pig and post the results in the weeks or so it'll take for me to get off probation.

It's unfortunate, many legit players are being hurt by the probation. If it makes you feel better, it's not you're fault and plenty of others have been unfairly pegged by it. I don't know what their criteria for putting people on "probation" is, but it's waaaaaay too loose. And yeah, might be because of Steam.

I wouldn't be too worried about lockbox stuff being BoA. If you weren't intending to open lockboxes only to make a profit, probably you'll be pretty happy with what you find.

zshikara · August 2014

I am pretty sure the probation is just temporary until they can get their funds from Steam. Once Cryptic has your money then you'll be off probation. Someone described how this process works in another thread, so I'll try to explain to the best of my knowledge what he said.

Basically when you buy stuff through steam for Neverwinter its steam that gives you your Zen or item pack. Cryptic has no idea if you purchased this legit or not since they haven't gotten your money yet. This can take as long as 3 weeks in some cases. Once Cryptic can verify that you obtained it legit-ly then you will no longer be on probation.

I really wish Steam would let players know this would happen before buying things through steam. The only way to avoid this is to always purchase your zen and products for Neverwinter directly through the Arc/ PWE site.

refracted0dawn · September 2014

echokazul wrote: »

I hope it doesn't do that every time. That's really going to put me off buying Zen.

I'm really trying to keep my personal feelings regarding how I'm being treated as a customer out of this

I guess I'll be a guinea pig and post the results in the weeks or so it'll take for me to get off probation.

I would not risk it with more than one key.

With the Dragonborn fake sale, I felt like I was being treated with no respect and they were taking me for a chump, smirking at me anonymously behind Support e-mails.

They should read about the fable of the Goose that laid the Golden Egg. They have lost far more than they gained; €179.99 so far.

anharmon wrote: »

If you weren't intending to open lockboxes only to make a profit, probably you'll be pretty happy with what you find.

Only if he gets useful stuff he can use. If he gets anything he does not really want, he should be able to auction it. That is the whole point of lock boxes and the AH. You trade stuff you don't want and buy stuff you do want. One of my characters has about 20 rings, amulets and belts from lock boxes and a vault of enchants and runes. I have not found a use for them yet, but if I want to Auction them, I can. That is the customer's choice.

zshikara wrote: »

I really wish Steam would let players know this would happen before buying things through steam. The only way to avoid this is to always purchase your zen and products for Neverwinter directly through the Arc/ PWE site.

I wish PWE did not do such ludicrous things. I don't know why they sell stuff through Steam or why Steam sells their stuff if PWE are going to make it so difficult. It's really am attempt to make Arc more convenient than Steam, so PWE get all the cash instead of paying a cut to Steam.

zshikara · September 2014

refracted0dawn wrote: »

I wish PWE did not do such ludicrous things. I don't know why they sell stuff through Steam or why Steam sells their stuff if PWE are going to make it so difficult. It's really am attempt to make Arc more convenient than Steam, so PWE get all the cash instead of paying a cut to Steam.

This really isn't ludicrous. I work at a hotel, and we do everything we can to encourage our guests to book directly with us instead of going through 3rd party sites like travelocity or expedia. Why? So we don't have to pay them a cut of what we make from that guest.

What Cryptic is doing makes perfect business sense. And this game is a business. I promise you it wouldn't exist if it didn't make money.

Unknown · September 2014

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query523 · September 2014

zshikara wrote: »

This really isn't ludicrous. I work at a hotel, and we do everything we can to encourage our guests to book directly with us instead of going through 3rd party sites like travelocity or expedia. Why? So we don't have to pay them a cut of what we make from that guest.

What Cryptic is doing makes perfect business sense. And this game is a business. I promise you it wouldn't exist if it didn't make money.

Sure but if a vacationing familly that did book on Orbitz shows up and you haven't got the check yet do you tell them to camp in the parking lot until the check clears? Of course not. Because they are an industry leader in your business and treating their customers like that has a bigger negative impact on your business than it does theirs. PWE is a local hotel and Steam is what would happen if Orbitz, Travelocity, and Expedia had a merger. They are the dominant force in the computer gaming industry and every major publisher treats their sales as legit instantly. Because they are. It's one of the reasons their market share is so huge.

zshikara · September 2014

query523 wrote: »

Sure but if a vacationing familly that did book on Orbitz shows up and you haven't got the check yet do you tell them to camp in the parking lot until the check clears? Of course not. Because they are an industry leader in your business and treating their customers like that has a bigger negative impact on your business than it does theirs. PWE is a local hotel and Steam is what would happen if Orbitz, Travelocity, and Expedia had a merger. They are the dominant force in the computer gaming industry and every major publisher treats their sales as legit instantly. Because they are. It's one of the reasons their market share is so huge.

That is a good point I hadn't really thought of.

Unknown · September 2014

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query523 · September 2014

The point is Steam, for better or worse, is the industry standard. Every major house considers a Steam transfer to be better than money because it is. That's one of the things that made them an industry standard. I will admit I am an unabashed Steam Fanboy. They've saved me hundreds, maybe thousands of dollars over the years. But they became dominant for a reason. Let's face it ARC browser is a cheap copy of Steam browser. Probationing Steam transfers honestly seems, well, petty and childish.

namelesshero347 · September 2014

I just bought some zen through the PWE site. Keys are still BtA. So steam purchaser at any point are screwed. Oh well, get to save some money until they stop treating steam users like second class citizens.

adinosii · September 2014

tousseau wrote: »

as I just found that BoE items gained from Seals of the Pegasus are apparently BoP while on probation...

I thought all Seal-purchased items were BoP (even though the descriptions say BoE).

echokazul · September 2014

namelesshero347 wrote: »

I just bought some zen through the PWE site. Keys are still BtA. So steam purchaser at any point are screwed. Oh well, get to save some money until they stop treating steam users like second class citizens.

I think keys are always BtA now, no matter where you get the Zen. That's a change they made a few months back, if memory serves right. Something about the gold sellers. I'm just worried about the items from the lockboxes I open with said keys.

Honestly, they really need to put a disclaimer up. If I had known there's a waiting period with Steam, I wouldn't have minded so much. Heck, I could've used paypal or something instead. I just thought that Steam would be convenient.

EDIT: Ah, here we go. Link to Post where they talk about Keys being Bound

anharmon · September 2014

echokazul wrote: »

I think keys are always BtA now, no matter where you get the Zen. That's a change they made a few months back, if memory serves right. Something about the gold sellers. I'm just worried about the items from the lockboxes I open with said keys.

Honestly, they really need to put a disclaimer up. If I had known there's a waiting period with Steam, I wouldn't have minded so much. Heck, I could've used paypal or something instead. I just thought that Steam would be convenient.

EDIT: Ah, here we go. Link to Post where they talk about Keys being Bound

Yeah, keys are. But OP is worried about the stuff that he gets out of the lockbox, because his account is on probation.

echokazul · September 2014

anharmon wrote: »

Yeah, keys are. But OP is worried about the stuff that he gets out of the lockbox, because his account is on probation.

I'm the OP. :P Hence the fourth sentence restating my concerns. I was just replying to another poster who was talking about keys being BoA.

I have found out why my account is on probation, and generally how long it takes to get off, so this thread is helpful so far, though my question is still up in the air. I'm hoping since it's an automated thing, and not because I've done something suspicious, that the keys will open lockboxes normally once I'm off, and I can sell things if I so desire. It seems like it would be easier to program a period of time where everything is BoA, instead of binding specific lockbox keys to have an altered behavior. Not everything Cryptic does seems to be logical, though.

thehumancodex · September 2014

When will people wake up? It seems to me after I see so many of these posts that PWE is targeting Steam users trying to push them to Arc via underhanded tactics. I'm glad I walked away after I got tired of shady marketing and a push towards gambling away your real money. If you are on Steam I recommend not getting zen that way, though honestly I don't recommend spending a dime with these people either. I lost money wasted on the game and that's on me. Don't make the mistakes I did.

mircalla83 · September 2014

thehumancodex wrote: »

When will people wake up? It seems to me after I see so many of these posts that PWE is targeting Steam users trying to push them to Arc via underhanded tactics. I'm glad I walked away after I got tired of shady marketing and a push towards gambling away your real money. If you are on Steam I recommend not getting zen that way, though honestly I don't recommend spending a dime with these people either. I lost money wasted on the game and that's on me. Don't make the mistakes I did.

Steam isn't innocent either. They themselves kicked an EA game out when said game offered the ability of MTs that circumvented Steam and went 100% to EA. They also, without any compensation ever, removed a game from player libraries, they didn't even give those people the ability to regain a legal, digital copy from the original developer.

Unknown · September 2014

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refracted0dawn · September 2014

query523 wrote: »

The point is Steam, for better or worse, is the industry standard. Every major house considers a Steam transfer to be better than money because it is.

Exactly. The suggestion that this is a "security measure" is transparently juvenile and treating us like fools. Steam performs the credit checks at the point of purchase.

You CAN claim a chargeback from Steam with a Credit card (not a Debit card), but Steam will lose the money, not PWE. And Steam will probably ban your account. I think it's in their ToS.

As soon as you make any digital purchase trough Steam, you have the stuff and can't back out according to their ToS. Except you have to enter a redemption code into Arc to get any DLC, and your account is on probation if you buy Zen.

This is, at best, an underdeveloped, inexperienced and immature business ethic. All it does is vastly lower PWE and Cryptic's estimation in the eyes of their paying customers. And, like me, people will eventually cease to be paying customers.

As for the post claiming that they made enchanted keys BtA in order to protect players who were buying pirate resources from 3rd parties and then got hacked?

I am sorry. That story is simply not believable.

~

lewstelamon01 · September 2014

All right, guys, this thread has run its course. When it's requesting information, that's one thing, but when it's starting to turn into direct or indirect attacks on the company and its policies (which are their prerogative to create and enforce as they deem fit) and accusations of bias against users of third party services, then it's no longer productive or informational, but confrontational.

Thread done. If you have any further questions about this policy, contact support with a Billing ticket.

On Probation, if I buy keys now, will it affect me later?

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