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ToD GF Changes PvP Discussion!
cilginordek
Member Posts: 459 Arc User
I'm overally positive with the new changes, they open up some new possibilities. Obviously It is a huge change for PvE but I want your opinions about it for PvP and there is mine:
-Extra HP is lovely; finally we are the class with most hp on the battlefield. This affects regeneration as well making us a bit more tougher.
-Frontline Surge is no more prone; I will definitely miss it but this nerf makes Iron Vanguard more on par with Swordmaster, both have same amount of Prones now.
-Different Guard; I will wait for my Preview to update. I want to see it in action with profound set and buffs etc. before making any comments.
-Threatening rush; I don't think this will be a big issue but I really hope it wont get consumed when we rubberband to where we started. Anyways it is probably a bigger concern for PvE where you need that to move around between adds.
Edit: I tested the shield and the concept simply doesn't work in PvP. It is so terrible that it alone is enough to make my overall feelings about those changes a negative one.
-Extra HP is lovely; finally we are the class with most hp on the battlefield. This affects regeneration as well making us a bit more tougher.
-Frontline Surge is no more prone; I will definitely miss it but this nerf makes Iron Vanguard more on par with Swordmaster, both have same amount of Prones now.
-Different Guard; I will wait for my Preview to update. I want to see it in action with profound set and buffs etc. before making any comments.
-Threatening rush; I don't think this will be a big issue but I really hope it wont get consumed when we rubberband to where we started. Anyways it is probably a bigger concern for PvE where you need that to move around between adds.
Edit: I tested the shield and the concept simply doesn't work in PvP. It is so terrible that it alone is enough to make my overall feelings about those changes a negative one.
Post edited by cilginordek on
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and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
The thing is I was really used to the other one and I used it very effectively. This one will need some getting used to but I guess it will be just as good if not better.
Important Edit: Found some people and did some PvP. My guess was terribly wrong. No player will attack you when your shield is up and if you keep it up stamina will drain away in no time. If you put it down you will be attacked. The game is way too fast paced and shield is way too slow for you to be able to block attacks. The current shield mechanic seems terrible and completely useless for PvP.
1- Con now gives 4% instead of 2%, nice!.
2- While you guard you can move at the same speed that you run, nice!. (however the char look very weird when he is doing this lol).
3- Guard is constantly and quickly drained when you have your guard up, but it's also regenerates faster, however it drains so fast that I can only guess it will work better than the previous mechanic just if you are in 1v3 situations and they are continiously attacking you (however the difference is not too great).
What I see that could be a high disvantage of this method is vs a TR, if we use our guard preemptively (for a stealth TR) it will not last nearly nothing and then he will do whatever he want, our shield will regen fast but again, it last nearly nothing.
Idk, for what I saw I prefer the previous guard, they should make it last at least 2x or 3x more to make it worth.
PS: Now that Con gives 4% of HP I would love a re-roll in ability scores
Yes because gwfs woke up one day and thought " I will take skills from the GFs". How bout you thank the devs instead? Never mind the fact that a lot of the gwfs on this forum try to put in a good word for GFs needing some help but we don't don't even get a reach around. Instead, GFs make it a point to blame us as if we created all of your problems. Nice.
Anyway, it's all about surviving the nerfs isn't it... ._.
WTB Class Reroll please
For PVE however, the changes are immense. Enforced Threat being able to hit more than 20 enemies in a burst means you can deal massive DPS if you spec for it correctly, plus you get to Taunt enemies away from your allies and bunch them all up for a classic PVE perma-CC beatdown.
Enforced Threat being able to hit 20 enemies will also present a couple of possible combos with skills and enchantments. My personal favorite so far is Fighter's Recovery + Lightning Enchantment + Enforced Threat. I got as high as to 40k heals as per my testing in Preview. It was fun to watch, specially when I had Steel Blitz slotted. It was a guaranteed Blitz for each and every one of the enemies I was able to hit.
It's also possible to provide a massive 20 enemy debuff via Perfect Feytouched, or freeze the enemies on their tracks via Perfect Frost. Having an encounter that hits that many enemies presents us with a whole lot of possibilities. Not to mention the Hard Taunts. Things are looking better for us GFs, finally.
I like the idea of perfect lifedrinker with enforced threat though. It's like you agroo them and heal by big ammount at the same time. Will see though, this 20 targets gap change is interesting.
WTB Class Reroll please
More aggro - faster death. gg/hf/bb
.Suicide Squad.
"You know nothing Jon Snow"... test your GF on preview then speak
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
It probably will be an insta-suicide button for Glass Cannon Conquerors, but if a person were to spec his GF as a tank, he will become a valuable asset to the party, being a viable replacement for Arcane Singularity. With the recent nerfs to many of the CWs powers and their synergistic effects with the Thaumaturge tree, retaining their old ways of stacking more than 2 CWs in one party will be harder. They can continue doing so and go for a 5 man CW party if they so wish but then again it would be easier if people just brought a rainbow party of a GF, GWF, CW, HR, and DC. TRs still have no place in there.
I'm spec-ed as a Swordmaster Tactician, maximizing AP gain and self-healing. What I do in order to prevent myself from dying from 20 mobs is I... kite, lol. Guard's not that useful anymore since damage will pass through Guard and it doesn't last as long, which sucks. It doesn't feel like I'm guarding anything. But anyway, with Life Steal and Regen I can keep myself topped up in HP (I have 10% on both), specially when I pop my Supremacy of Steel + Steel Defense combo. I pop SoS/KV + SD then pop Enforced Threat on 20 mobs, steal their HPs via Life Steal (I usually get around 4-6k heals here), 20 mobs attack me but I'm immune for 5 seconds, so what happens is that I reflect their damage, the reflected damage steals HP from them, then before SoS ends I pop it and fling swords all over to steal even more HP.
This just gets better with Endless Consumption's x3 Life Steal proc chance and Regeneration's passive heal.
PVP is a different story, however.
In PVP, this new block mechanic totally destroy the GF, as it is now. The PvP GF MUST use block before enemies' attaks are fired. This means that we cannot wait CWs, TRs, HRs and other classes to use thier powers; GFs have to guard before any power is used. Therefore, the block meter should start to get consumed only when it receives the first enemy's damage. Moreover, its duraton should be slightly increased to 8 seconds (at least), and defensive encouters and at-wills should recharge more guard meter over time.
These are some of my thoughts after I logged off the server. Please, let me know what are your ideas, I would love to share good opinions with you.
I was wondering how you can get 10% on both LS and regen. Would you kindly share this info with me? Thank you
I'll post a screenshot of my character tomorrow. It took me some planning before figured out the right gear and enchantment allocation to support 50% Damage Reduction, 15% RSI, 10% Regen, 10% Life Steal. And it still has a lot of improvement because I have yet to change my armor set to my preferred set.
But to not keep you in the dark, the biggest contributors to this stat allocation is the House Xorlarinn Rings you can get in Whispering Caverns that give 175 Life Steal and 150 Regen, Bloodied Frostwolf Pelt, and Reinforced Frostpelt Girdle. All of which give Life Steal and Regen. I also have Dark Enchantments slotted in my Defense slots. You can improve this further by using an Ioun Stone, but I'd much rather stack offensive stats in my stone since 10% LS + Reg is plenty for PVE.
I don't know how you come to the conclusion of things are looking better for GFs.
First off, the new block mechanism sucks. 2 simple reasons why it does: doesn't mitigate 100% of the damage, and drains on itself without being attacked. I don't care how long they make the shield last. If it drains without anyone doing anything to it, it doesn't work.
Enforced Threat being able to hit 20 enemies is nice, but situational at best. How often do you run into 20 adds? And when you do, how often can you get off Enforced Threat in time before GWF or CW kills a portion of them?
On the test shard right now, GF is nerfed severely. It's looking anything but better.
But chill. It's the first set of mod 4 patch notes, which is pretty much just the tip of the iceberg. Things are looking better because FINALLY, we're getting reworks. I don't care how or what gets reworked, I just want this awfully bland class to become... something, anything. I personally am not settling for what it currently is. If the devs change more things, specially the feats and powers and their interaction with our tab mechanic, I'll test and provide my opinions, like I usually do. The cries for doom and gloom can wait.
If you see the devs reworking ENTIRE feat trees (HR, CW), we can be **** sure they've got something in store for everyone else. And that is why I am happy with the changes. Finally the class won't be as boring and plain with the coming mod 4. Tab is HAMSTER, powers are HAMSTER, feats are HAMSTER, it's tough to make sense out of the current version of the GF.
Your keen insight / strategies into playing rogues seems to be carrying over to the guardian fighter class. I enjoy both classes, and appreciate this information.
Thanks todesfaelle!
I will be waiting for your post, thought I somehow figured out how to get similar stats without those rings, necklace, and belt
Those rings are massively underrated. I've had them on my GF for about 4-months now and some wise guy always calls me a ''nub'' for wearing green rings until I tell him to check the stats. I wear it in PVP as well because it is regen and offensive slots for Arpen. Purple isn't always better.
Mark ~ should have been made a little more snazzy, maybe allow the GF Combat Advantage as he rarely ever has it.
Fighters Recovery should have been given CC immunity, or Villains Menace should have been given % of DR mitigation, this is the reason GWF are still superior they can heal, do faster, damage and gain dr mitigation (its been lowered but still good) and cc immunity.
Would have liked some crit changes Weapon Mastery feat from 1-2-3% up to 3-6-9% would be huge!
Weapon Damage still lower then a DC symbol?
No word on Defense diminishing returns? Extra threat I hope they raise Defense cap so we GF can truly take a beating?
No word on Cleave being changes to 180 arc, or animations being sped up on dailies and other lengthy encounters?
No word on giving the GF Deflection at a higher rate?
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
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~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
This is what is worrying me. Our guard is worse (albeit a better concept), we've had no major defensive buffs aside from HP (which isn't that much in reality), they've taken the CWs control and damage away, they've nerfed the GWFs DR and have ramped up out threat. By activating Enforced Threat (which I love, by the way) with the above in mind, we may be hitting the ''Commit Suicide'' button. I can see what they are trying to do with the tweaks on all 3 classes, but the GF may not be able to cope with it as the class is.
TL;DR - I hope the GF is tough enough to deal with its own increased threat and the loss of damage, control and DR on other classes.
We need this.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!