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Rogues are demonized in PVP
murmaz
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 13 Arc User
GWF's can perma-stun-lock you, one hit and you're dead 90% of the time.
Devoted Clerics can become godlike and tank 3-4 people for a long duration of time.
GF's can guard all your encounters then put you in a semi stun-lock which usually eats 75% of your hp if you get caught.
Control Wizards can dash away THREE << profanity removed >> times, repel and also push away with their shield while maintaining CC.
Drumroll....
Rogues can become invisible until their stealth meter runs out or they get targeted with an AoE, if they however choose to reduce their dps they can maintain long periods of invisibility to extend their survival.
For all perma-stealth haters, please hear me out here and read this with an open mind.
1) Playing perma-stealth takes SKILL, it is definitely not an easy style of gameplay
2) There are so many ways to counter their stealth bar (AoE, DoT and pure pvp instincts).
3) Rogues DEPEND on their stealth. 1v1 without stealth a Rogue will barely make it out from a cleric.
I play as a TR but I am no perma-stealth, but I do sympathize with them. TR's have been nerfed to breaking point and there is even an artifact designed ESPECIALLY to destroy rogues (artifact of revelation).
Where are the artifacts to counter a GWF's unstoppable and stunlock? Where are the artifacts to counter a clerics immunities? Where are the artifacts to escape from a GF's stun lock? NO WHERE TO BE FOUND. But just because everyone has a big sook that "Oh I can't see rogues and I'm too much of a nub to counter them with skill I'm gonna go on the forums and cry a ****ing river" and they get an artifact that strips every rogue at a considerable distance naked.
What is the future of the TR class? Will other classes have artifacts to counter their intrinsic mechanics (unstoppable etc)?
Devoted Clerics can become godlike and tank 3-4 people for a long duration of time.
GF's can guard all your encounters then put you in a semi stun-lock which usually eats 75% of your hp if you get caught.
Control Wizards can dash away THREE << profanity removed >> times, repel and also push away with their shield while maintaining CC.
Drumroll....
Rogues can become invisible until their stealth meter runs out or they get targeted with an AoE, if they however choose to reduce their dps they can maintain long periods of invisibility to extend their survival.
For all perma-stealth haters, please hear me out here and read this with an open mind.
1) Playing perma-stealth takes SKILL, it is definitely not an easy style of gameplay
2) There are so many ways to counter their stealth bar (AoE, DoT and pure pvp instincts).
3) Rogues DEPEND on their stealth. 1v1 without stealth a Rogue will barely make it out from a cleric.
I play as a TR but I am no perma-stealth, but I do sympathize with them. TR's have been nerfed to breaking point and there is even an artifact designed ESPECIALLY to destroy rogues (artifact of revelation).
Where are the artifacts to counter a GWF's unstoppable and stunlock? Where are the artifacts to counter a clerics immunities? Where are the artifacts to escape from a GF's stun lock? NO WHERE TO BE FOUND. But just because everyone has a big sook that "Oh I can't see rogues and I'm too much of a nub to counter them with skill I'm gonna go on the forums and cry a ****ing river" and they get an artifact that strips every rogue at a considerable distance naked.
What is the future of the TR class? Will other classes have artifacts to counter their intrinsic mechanics (unstoppable etc)?
Post edited by murmaz on
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Comments
Honestly, its rare if you even find anyone using the lantern in PvP. Most people would rather get a healing artifact over one that is EASILY countered by moving away until those few seconds are up, then you have nothing to fall back on for another 2-3 minutes.
Any of those abilities listed here, plus many ones not mentionned would make TR an OP class. But TR has them all.
All this needs to get nerfed, at any level. The absurd damage spike, the range, the stealth.
Mod3 id the right opportunity to do that. Devs, nerf the TR as hard as you can. the communty already had to live for too long with this oh-so-OP class.
So at the risk of sounding like a douch, you're doing it wrong.
You should be running a stealth based build with SS, ITC, and PoB as your encounters and duelist/Cloud of steel for your at wills. Dailies should be shocking and bloodbath.
Weapon enchant should be Bile.
It takes a little more skill and awareness to play this build well than most other builds (referring to landing duelists, and keeping your rotations tight so you are not vulnerable).
Check out Jerkface's stream on twitch, and Blacksheep has some vids up on youtube that will demonstrate how to play this build most effectively.
Since the latest changes it's possible to just slot bait and switch and run around on the point hitting ITC if you get caught with something. You can hold 3 pugs solo on a point for pretty much the entire game.
Once you get better with your rotations and landing Duelists there won't be much that can stop you.
And yeah, if one of your opponents are using lantern you are in good shape as there are not very many experienced players who would use this, the healing from waters is MUCH more useful.
Any different class you can kill in 3-5 players (on Gauntylgrym) but no perma-stealth.
It is not rare, ever second PVP match I play one of the opposing team uses a lantern. And it's not so difficult to rearrange the slots of your artifacts if you know you're up against TR's.
Which at wills are you talking about please enlighten me? The DoT whisperknife attack? Or the Duelist Flurry which got nerfed to the point where it is subject to CC? How the hell are you meant to get the 3rd strike for the bleed stack (which FYI isn't close to being as powerful as a daily)
"Tons of protection" is a load of HAMSTER, we only have stealth and only one paragon path has ITC and even so a few seconds of deflect for a wasted encounter slot isn't the clear choice. On the topic of dodges, you are mistaking TR's for HR's which dodge every second attack and buff their allies with fox cunning.
Definitely not a bug, the description on stealth clearly states at wills do not drain stealth. And again, you missed my entire post, the WHOLE point of a TR is to use deception and stealth. WITHOUT stealth there is no deception and there are already a load of methods to counter perma-stealths (who by the way take a good 1m-2m to kill anyone). An artifact to further nerf rogues is not the answer.
You are the epitomy of a nub. Just because you completely lack skill and can't counter rogues doesn't mean the game is broken, it means you should play runescape or another game which doesn't require as much real time reaction and skill.
Here is a website that will cater for your gaming abilities:
<< link removed >>
This guy is just silly, ignore him.
Ugh.... I wanted to be nice and help you so badly.... Why did you have to write this?
I find it odd how HR wasn't mentioned as a good HR is the best counter to a perma TR. <_<
A Playlist of my CO PvP video's
I agree, but it is the only viable spec right now, denying it does not help. I like to pound the point home as there is still a large portion of PvP TRs that don't use this spec and then come here on the forums arguing that their spec performs just as well because their play style is special or some HAMSTER. It's not... Your build sucks, the issue needs to be addressed, stop fighting it.
I would also like to point out:
Look up sir:
I could go on and on with things that are OP/broken about TR.
This is understandable. I mean, after the PvP moaners got the class nerfed into the ground sixteen times already, TR is barely viable in PvE anymore and nobody wants them, preferring to stack ever more CWs and GWFs because why would you bring a class that after an endless series of PvP-based nerfs can no longer effectively do its PvE job?
But please, do go on about how OP the TR is. I'll be over here. Bitter. Nursing my hate. Never even touching PvP Domination because I can't bloody stand it. Waiting for the next class-destroying nerf that will make it even more pointless to play my TR.
Also, my PvE TR likes Permas in GG PvP, which unlike Domination is harder to avoid since most GG teams want to do the PvP. They tickle. And it's fun to smack them upside the head. But I suppose who better than a TR to know what a TR does and how to yawn at it.
Ugh...This thread should have been closed.
Lol this is such an ignroant statement I don't even....
Perma stealth can't pull that off. When you're overwhelmed as a perma stealth. YOU ESCAPE, which means the point is for them. A perma can't contest a node long enough if he has 5+ people on him.
Definitely.. that ITC bug has got me killed so many times.
Anyway, having read through this thread I just want to cringe, half the people saying how TRs are an untouchable god class that can 1 shot you and are immune to everything... and the other half are saying they are so absurdly trash they get out dpsed by a cleric companion... both sides are just stupidly over exaggerating.
I will agree that I hate perma-stealth, Since there is no counter mechanic to stealth (like spot/listen) Then there is no way you should be able to stay stealthed indefinatly.
I have never played a permastealth TR, and I do fine in PvP as an in-your-face evasive type rogue relying on ITC, dodges and investing in some defencive stats (hp, regen etc) and using my stealth wisely. Yes, sometimes I get beaten, yes sometimes I get out played, but No, I am not useless not by a long shot.
TRs are good in PvP, but not the best. (clerics are actually probably the strongest class in PvP, people just overlook them because everyone wants to be Rambo and ignore the benefit of a strong team player.) But I do think a counter mechanic to Permastealth like Spot/listen checks would be a good idea just so people can deal with them.
this thread is finished.