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An apology

rougedroguerougedrogue Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 25
edited April 2014 in The Wilds
Well, I'll start this off by apologizing to the devs and producers. Some of my comments (rare as they are.) were not in the best form lately and I'm sorry.

I'm sure most of you have kept your ear to the ground on the preview server catching the latest on mod 3. I've been spending a lot of time there testing the new paragon path. As a non pvp combat ranger, I fit in a mold of my own and Pathfinder isn't for me, but It's still being worked on.

However, Mod 3 is brilliant. From what I've played and seen this is an open dynamic world that encourages group play and pvp in a delineated yet common plane that is expansive enough to encourage play for quite some time. There are subtleties to work out, including class balances, and well, we got nerfed a bit. Now we are getting some buffs across the board to compensate... and that's not why I'm apologizing.

I'm apologizing to the devs and producers because as I play (my GF, GWF, CW, DC, TR and HR) and read the forums I can't imagine a tougher job than balancing classes. As a programmer I have enough time bug fixing simple applications. I can simply not imagine the headache. They are always on the preview channel working, poking and tweaking and giving updates.

My hat is off to them, and my thanks, and my apologies.
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • kindwarfkindwarf Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    ....... There are subtleties to work out, including class balances, and well, we got nerfed a bit.......
    .

    Nerfed a bit? That's a contender for understatement of the year isn't it?
    HR hasn't been "balanced", its been destroyed.
    Why did it need balancing anyway, that's what no one is telling us.
    If they wanted Rangers to use melee skills more, then why make the Melee weapon do half the standard damage of the missile weapon?
    Even worse, they are also nerfing the only useful melee encounter.

    There might be less hostility to the changes if there was an official explanation for them.
    Customer service seems not to be part of the PWE / Cryptic culture.
  • rougedroguerougedrogue Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 25
    edited March 2014
    kindwarf wrote: »
    Nerfed a bit? That's a contender for understatement of the year isn't it?
    HR hasn't been "balanced", its been destroyed.
    Why did it need balancing anyway, that's what no one is telling us.
    If they wanted Rangers to use melee skills more, then why make the Melee weapon do half the standard damage of the missile weapon?
    Even worse, they are also nerfing the only useful melee encounter.

    There might be less hostility to the changes if there was an official explanation for them.
    Customer service seems not to be part of the PWE / Cryptic culture.

    Ah, but there has been.

    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?635201-Official-Feedback-Thread-Ranger-Paragon-Path-Pathfinder/page21

    I urge you to keep an eye on this thread.
  • froszztfroszzt Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 284 Bounty Hunter
    edited March 2014
    Open world PvP is just a chance for trolls to become even trollier. With the current lack of balance between classes in PvP this is hardly good news. Good news would be full class balance and new modes AND maps.

    1 year later and still only 2 5v5 PvP domination maps? Believe it or not, NW have a lot of nice settings in the campaign. A lot of them are very big and well done. Even if you level up 5 classes you will not see it all, and even if you actually do see it all, you will not see it for very long. Such a waste of work.

    USE IT! Take a part of the Chasm or whatever and make a PvP map out of the content. That can surely not be hard now can it? This is what they have done with all the skirmishes, taken a part of a map and made it something. I would settle for more maps with domination. But making a deathmatch and 3v3 2v2 etc should really already be in the game.

    I have no clue why there is not 10+ maps and 5+ modes already. Especially since they seem to "focus on pvp" as of late. This content is already in the game so there is no excuse not to slap a few cap points on it and serve it up to us.

    -EDIT

    This would go for new dungeons as well. I don't say that Cryptic needs to get creative or put any effort into creating some new dungeons for their players. (hehe) Just use something you already made but few have fully experienced fully. I don't say that you should create new enemy types and items to drop either. (hehe, no really, I am not saying that)

    Just take some of the bigger, tougher enemies and place them in the dungeon and make them even more deadly. (more HP, higher dmg, less CD on their powers etc) And for the love of all that is holy, don't make bosses drop BLUE ITEMS!

    Make it a real 15k+ dungeon, hell make the drops BoP as long as they are awesome. And regarding bosses, there is a crapload of bosses that you only see for a total of 2 minutes in the campaign. Use one of them!!

    I DON'T GET IT?!? WHY NOT?!?
  • kindwarfkindwarf Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited March 2014

    Okay, I've read the entire thread, and still not one word of an explanation. Just some knee jerk reaction changes to pacify the angry mob. I stand by my earlier comment.
  • alvadimarcoalvadimarco Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    One nice thing about Module 3 is displayed in this thread.

    A lot of the chaff will be separated from the wheat and cast into the fire.
  • tajah23tajah23 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 32
    edited April 2014
    froszzt wrote: »
    Open world PvP is just a chance for trolls to become even trollier. With the current lack of balance between classes in PvP this is hardly good news. Good news would be full class balance and new modes AND maps.


    Open world pvp is better than instanced any day. You worried about getting facerolled all the time? Run with the zerg. There is relative safety in numbers.

    The "trolls" are going to be ganking people, not battling overwhelming odds. The true elite guilds only will rise to the top & be able to fight large numbers. With the HR/GWF nerfs, cryptic has specifically made that more difficult.

    Open world pvp opens up a TON of possibilities. If you want 2v2, etc.... talk to people in game and you're able to meet in a specific location & set it up yourself.
  • goldheartgoldheart Member Posts: 236 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    tajah23 wrote: »
    The "trolls" are going to be ganking people, not battling overwhelming odds. The true elite guilds only will rise to the top & be able to fight large numbers. With the HR/GWF nerfs, cryptic has specifically made that more difficult.

    It is sad that you lie yourself about there is something like "true elite guilds". The MMOs are best in one thing for which they are made - to lose time of people (if you can understand what this mean in our real life of course).
    OWPVP is nice thing when is not connected with something so important like campaign that all we need. Now if I want to do something there I must get with me 5-10-15 people more and to lose their time ;) If you do not know OWPVP from this kind fail a lot in every game that I know, most people just try and start to skip it because there isn't something like "true elite guilds" but guilds where have or not online people that want and can to help you.

    Same as 30 min penalty that was introduced, before 500 people lost their time because "leavers", now 50000+ lost their time in waiting something to finish... fair ? I do not think. Do we get more PVP ? Do this fix something ? Yes so much people leave the game because they cannot do something alone but need "party". Do we get better PVP ? Yes but this is because in Dominations now enter true PVP or half true which one can be done very easy without this draconian measures, but then this will not fall in to the "lost time" description (like start new mmo, new money for it, new time to leveled+gearing etc..) ;)

    About "TON of possibilities" I think that you can't define more than 5 :D
  • query523query523 Member Posts: 1,515 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    This thread which is sanitized on an almost daily basis to remove criticism? I'm sure your post however will not get 'moderated' as it is the sort they want people to see.
  • spacejewspacejew Member Posts: 1,044 Bounty Hunter
    edited April 2014
    Well if it is massive uncapped player count PvP it will be entertaining to watch GWF's destroy entire guilds of players with Avalanche of Steel/Slam combos while being 100% untouchable and invisible during their cast animation. Hooray!

    And really the biggest hurdle of all is making sure that open world PvP isn't simply a lag/DC fest period. Server stability and optimization for larger than 20-40 people doesn't really exist as is, so lets just say I'm not feeling enthused about mass open world PvP being 'balanced' in any real way. (Or even being functional with current game code.)

    So it might be premature to apologize to them given that it's pretty likely from the seasonal events that open world PvP will be virtually unplayable for a variety of technical issues let alone adding class balance issues into the mix.

    I find it really strange that they went through all the trouble of introducing Tenacity then they release PvP that encourages you to not use Tenacity sets given that they happen in a PvE environment. I have no clue what they are thinking, but it's not unlike Cryptic to completely misunderstand PvP in a very fundamental way.

    There also aren't any real methods to quickly or easily switch out PvE powers/gear to PvP powers/gear and most players generally agree that the rotations you will use are different between the two by a fairly large margin. So more questions without any real answers.
    MoF/Thaum CW SS/Thaum CW IV/Protector GF SW/Combat HR SM/Destroyer GWF WK/Executioner TR DO/Faithful DC
  • oicidrazoicidraz Member Posts: 627 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    spacejew wrote: »
    Well if it is massive uncapped player count PvP it will be entertaining to watch GWF's destroy entire guilds of players with Avalanche of Steel/Slam combos while being 100% untouchable and invisible during their cast animation. Hooray!

    And really the biggest hurdle of all is making sure that open world PvP isn't simply a lag/DC fest period. Server stability and optimization for larger than 20-40 people doesn't really exist as is, so lets just say I'm not feeling enthused about mass open world PvP being 'balanced' in any real way. (Or even being functional with current game code.)

    So it might be premature to apologize to them given that it's pretty likely from the seasonal events that open world PvP will be virtually unplayable for a variety of technical issues let alone adding class balance issues into the mix.

    I find it really strange that they went through all the trouble of introducing Tenacity then they release PvP that encourages you to not use Tenacity sets given that they happen in a PvE environment. I have no clue what they are thinking, but it's not unlike Cryptic to completely misunderstand PvP in a very fundamental way.

    There also aren't any real methods to quickly or easily switch out PvE powers/gear to PvP powers/gear and most players generally agree that the rotations you will use are different between the two by a fairly large margin. So more questions without any real answers.

    And to change enchantments from one equip to another cost me 2,5G, so to change all the enchantments is unavailable....Idk how they want me to PvP and PvE...
  • kindwarfkindwarf Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited April 2014

    Okay, I've done that for a while now, even commented a few times.
    They have not answered any of my questions or countered any of my arguments.
    So what is the point of a thread that only acknowledges what little positive feedback there is?

    I'm being led to understand that the killing off of the HR is to "Balance PVP".. (admittedly only by other players, PWE/Cryptic are staying close lipped on the subject.)
    This game bears the hallmarks of Dungeons and Dragons, and Neverwinter Nights, neither of which had any PVP content.
    In fact both games encourage player co-operation. The vast majority of the player base neither enjoy, nor want PVP content. The only reason most actually do PVP is so that they can get a second artifact, then they stop. (which also explains the vastly lopsided nature of most domination battles. PVE players do not spec, or gear for PVP. The just grind it out as best they can with their PVE gear and loadout.)

    If you want to make Neverwinter a PVP game, please be honest about it, and remove the PVE endorsement. At least then, the majority of players can move on and find a game more suited to their PVE tastes.
  • gabrieldourdengabrieldourden Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,212 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    kindwarf wrote: »
    This game bears the hallmarks of Dungeons and Dragons, and Neverwinter Nights, neither of which had any PVP content.
    In fact both games encourage player co-operation. The vast majority of the player base neither enjoy, nor want PVP content. The only reason most actually do PVP is so that they can get a second artifact, then they stop. (which also explains the vastly lopsided nature of most domination battles. PVE players do not spec, or gear for PVP. The just grind it out as best they can with their PVE gear and loadout.)

    If you want to make Neverwinter a PVP game, please be honest about it, and remove the PVE endorsement. At least then, the majority of players can move on and find a game more suited to their PVE tastes.

    You basically nailed it down. I fully agreed.
    Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
    Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
  • goldheartgoldheart Member Posts: 236 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    kindwarf wrote: »
    This game bears the hallmarks of Dungeons and Dragons, and Neverwinter Nights, neither of which had any PVP content.
    In fact both games encourage player co-operation. The vast majority of the player base neither enjoy, nor want PVP content. The only reason most actually do PVP is so that they can get a second artifact, then they stop. (which also explains the vastly lopsided nature of most domination battles. PVE players do not spec, or gear for PVP. The just grind it out as best they can with their PVE gear and loadout.)



    You are totally right ... but... this is MMO and this game is really faaar from D&D and NWN. This game is one casual MMO game and nothing more. Welcome in world of NWO :D
    Every big and casual MMO have PVP part do you like it or not - I do not see who care about that. I can say only I so sorry for that you do not like it.
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