HR PvP

johnnywad309 · February 2014

How much CON do you guys recommend for PvP? I'm primarily focused on PvP and currently have only 24.5k health and 15 CON. I've taken all the bonus health feats I could get as well as boons for more defensive stats, but it still feels like I don't have enough. I can survive in fights for very long periods of time, but I get torn to pieces by well geared/skilled GWF's once they land a knockdown on me.

goldheart · February 2014

CON, as much as you can. Glass cannon do not work well in endgame PVP.
VS GWF, well this depend if GWF is Destroyer you can try to kill him, if he is Sentinel better find someone to help you or just run/slow him around. Stupid/low skilled Sentinel can be killed easy but premade one you cannot kill or will be very hard, and this is wasting of time.

johnnywad309 · February 2014

I just finished respeccing and enchanting my 2nd set of gear (pvp set). Now I'm sitting at 27.2k health with 16 CON (the most I can get unfortunately) with much better defense and deflect stats. I still feel like I'm lacking though, primarily in regeneration and life steal, though I'm not sure how important those stats are in PvP.

goldheart · February 2014

You talk for pvp vs GWF or at all ? Because vs GWF at moment all classes except high skilled CW fail 1vs1.

shadow5930 · February 2014

To deal with a GWF, you need to play hit and run. When they're not unstoppable, rush em, boar rush to knock them down, fox shift to beat on em, daze em if you can and hit em. As soon as they go red, MR away, in range, hit and move. Reset your buffs while you're kiting them and as soon as US drops, rush em again. Make sure you know what a GWF does for their hits, so you can avoid the knock downs. Also if you slot aimed shot/strike, remember that it can home, so if MR is on cooldown, use it to get them. Bleed plus closes distance.

goldheart · February 2014

shadow5930 wrote: »

To deal with a GWF, you need to play hit and run. When they're not unstoppable, rush em, boar rush to knock them down, fox shift to beat on em, daze em if you can and hit em. As soon as they go red, MR away, in range, hit and move. Reset your buffs while you're kiting them and as soon as US drops, rush em again. Make sure you know what a GWF does for their hits, so you can avoid the knock downs. Also if you slot aimed shot/strike, remember that it can home, so if MR is on cooldown, use it to get them. Bleed plus closes distance.

Yeah, next one hero HR that can beat GWF

Please I am really curious, make one video an show us how to do it. Especially with this setup BR/FS,MR or whatever you want.

kaylos29 · February 2014

My HR has 18 con and over 30K HPs. I also run 2500 defense and around 1400 regen. Lifesteal isn't that great in PvP, but it isn't useless. I would have 20 con if I had leveled my Halfing HR first instead of my human. The 3 extra feats though are kind of nice.

ap326 · February 2014

Hey johnnywad309,

I have an HR specifically built for PvP and nothing else. To answer some of your questions:

1. CON is absolutely essential for end-game PvP. As mentioned in the thread, glass cannon builds are frowned upon in PvP because of how ineffective they can be. Have you noticed the old 1-SHOT Lashing Blade TR's are now, Jump Around and Stealth and wear the enemy down TR's? Yeah. I would say if you were making a character for PvP, in the future keep in mind to maximize CON when you roll your toon.
-HP stacking is the most effective defense stat for PvP in combination with a hefty amount of regeneration, which is why CON (adds percentage to HP) is essential.

2. I'm a fully Rank 9 HR with Perfects and Artifacts, you name it. This does not help diddly squat when a GWF is able to catch me and crits me for 10K+. Our only line of defense with a GWF is to either wait for backup or annoy the absolute HAMSTER out of them and restrict their mobility and wait for a team mate to prone them. I usually bait GWFs into chasing me off point where I root them and point and laugh from the node. GWFs do not like roots..

3. Life Steal is not essential at the moment. Maybe it will be once the new module comes out for PvP with Tenacity and Healing Depression, but I'm not sure about now. Right now your go to stat for PvP should be Regeneration. It will keep you alive the most since it passively heals you every couple of seconds.

Overall, it all depends on how you play off with your feats and how you play your HR. I play a very dodgy and annoying HR that can dish out decent DPS. Overall, I am usually surviving and stalemating and rotating to different nodes causing havoc.

I have about 31-32K health with I believe 1700 regeneration or so.

If you have more questions, feel free to PM me.

jaotut · February 2014

I currently have 34k hp, got 2 rank 10s, the rest are still rank 9s, one of them in a brutal, rest are radiants.

Getting both your defense and hp up is very important in PvP.

If you're looking for a way to last longer in battle in PvP, while still able to help your team out, check out my Nature spec build, I feel Nature spec is very underrated atm as people like to choose a more dps spec which is definitely better if you want more kills.

However, if you're looking for a chance to take down a GWF 1v1, then I feel a full combat spec works the best and I've managed to almost get a geared GWF down but I was using a GPF and not vorpal which I feel would be better for that fight. You'll need to Boar Charge a GWF while he's not in unstoppable, then use Fox Shift which is your hardest hitting skill. Switch to range and use Constricting Arrow, reason for Constricting Arrow is it'll screw up the GWF's rotation. Then the rest you'll just have to pray he doesn't crit that much on you, coz once he has you down with Frontline Surge (almost impossible to dodge), he can end you with 1 or 2 rotations no matter what you do.

johnnywad309 · February 2014

After respeccing, re-gearing, and enchanting my gear I'm not sitting at about 28k health with a fair balance of defense, deflect, and regen. It's not a lot. but I've already noticed an immediate change. My damage output is roughly the same, but I can now survive much longer than before against very well geared opponents. I can stall out a GWF for a long time, but dedicated PvP GWF's still tear me apart in seconds. Not sure who thought it was a good idea to give a class the kind of mobility and damage a GWF has and give them the ability to prone you from a distance, but whatever. Unfortunately, I was brand new when I made my HR so I didn't know the value of a high CON stat and the highest I can get now is 16. I've tried to make up for it by stacking up some R7 radiant enchants in my defense slots, but that's cost me in other areas now.

xmousepadx · February 2014

Stacking con on an HR is actually a pretty bad idea since dex/wis offer u way way more important stats.
Even when u go full con it wont change the fact that u wont be able to hold a point 2v1 for a long time and a 1v1 shouldnt be an issue when ur geared with atleast r8s+ and no points in con.

jaotut · February 2014

I think stacking con on any class for PvP is important. From my experience in tough matches, being able to stay alive a bit longer outweighs doing more damage.

This can depend on your playstyle, however in order for your team to win, you will need to help cap the point. If you're a glass cannon build that snipes from up top, that's fine until they catch onto that and send someone after you. If you're contesting a point by yourself, what do you do when an enemy comes over?

I can hold a point against a lot of 1v2 situations that doesn't involve a GWF, while holding point 1v1 against GWFs are the biggest challenge. Holding point against a GF is also quite difficult as even though they can't kill you, they can just keep knocking anyone off the point.

kaylos29 · February 2014

xmousepadx wrote: »

Stacking con on an HR is actually a pretty bad idea since dex/wis offer u way way more important stats.
Even when u go full con it wont change the fact that u wont be able to hold a point 2v1 for a long time and a 1v1 shouldnt be an issue when ur geared with atleast r8s+ and no points in con.

It is not just about con, but how all the defensive stats together increase survivability. Total HPs synergizes very well with regeneration, since the tick value of regeneration is higher and your max regeneration vaule kicks in at a higher HP value the higher your HP total is. Damage resistance and Deflection increase your effective HPs so that regeneration is even more effective.

Glass cannon for anyclass is pretty much a bad idea idea except in specific situations or with a team that accounts for that members vulnerability. Most teams don't bother with that since even survivability based CWs need protection.

The only problem you will generally have against any of the classes with the right build is GWFs, but that is hardly a HR issue, but an issue with the current state of GWFs since it pretty much affects every class. On my GWF, the only classes I worry about 1v1 is other GWFs and the occasional near max built TR who really, really know how to play his class. To be fair, the only TR I can remember having any issues with on my GWF is Sicarious form Chocolate Stand, and even then it was pretty even until his teammates showed up. And I will flat out say Sicarious is a much better player than I am.

davidtogi · February 2014

So, basically an HR can only run at the sight of a GWF? I mean, isn't that just pathetic? And somehow i doubt that they even annoyed, i believe most GWF senti (most of my friends played GWF so its not my imagination) would laugh looking at an HR that try to entangling him just to desperately run away.

I choose HR as my class was simply for hit and run. And by "hit and run" it means the enemy died while trying to catch me, not running and hope somebody would help me gank this thing that is impossible for me to kill. Well i do kill GWF in 1vs1 condition several times, but it was just because i got far more advantage like more HP left or more geared, and sometimes it was just pure luck. Most of the time i'd died even against GWF with less HP left or even less geared.

So i came to a question that bothers me at the time.
Is this class really suitable for PvP?
If there will be a 1vs1 tournament on neverwinter, will this class even have a chance at it?
Is it worth to choose an HR for PvP over other classes?

The questions was rather silly though, but i've played other MMO where the archer class is a joke when it comes to PvP. So if HR is on the same level as that then i'd prefer not wasting my time anymore for something that is impossible to begin with.

xmousepadx · February 2014

kaylos29 wrote: »

It is not just about con, but how all the defensive stats together increase survivability. Total HPs synergizes very well with regeneration, since the tick value of regeneration is higher and your max regeneration vaule kicks in at a higher HP value the higher your HP total is. Damage resistance and Deflection increase your effective HPs so that regeneration is even more effective.

Glass cannon for anyclass is pretty much a bad idea idea except in specific situations or with a team that accounts for that members vulnerability. Most teams don't bother with that since even survivability based CWs need protection.

The only problem you will generally have against any of the classes with the right build is GWFs, but that is hardly a HR issue, but an issue with the current state of GWFs since it pretty much affects every class. On my GWF, the only classes I worry about 1v1 is other GWFs and the occasional near max built TR who really, really know how to play his class. To be fair, the only TR I can remember having any issues with on my GWF is Sicarious form Chocolate Stand, and even then it was pretty even until his teammates showed up. And I will flat out say Sicarious is a much better player than I am.

Dex and wis scale even better with your offensive stats. If you look at it 1 con is worth like 120~of any enchantable stat, dex/wis are around 400-480 of enchantable stats, depending on your gearlevel.
I'm not saying u should go classcannon, just saying that dex/wis are better as soon as u are fully geared.
I have no points in con and sit on 31k-ish hp with 2k regen.
So im far away from being a class cannon. It's all about playing smart.
Oh and his name is Sicarius and even he dies in 1 pronechain against a fully geared gwf and he has like 32kish hp.
The extra Con you could get may keep u like 3sec longer alive which isnt bad at all but on the other hand the extra dex/wis help you to clear a point faster and since HR isnt a pointholder like gf/gwf/tr are i would always pick dex/wis over con.
On top of that wis offers u control resist which will keep u way longer alive than extra 440ish hp from con when u resist a prone.

kaylos29 · February 2014

xmousepadx wrote: »

Dex and wis scale even better with your offensive stats.
I'm not saying u should go classcannon, just saying that dex/wis are better as soon as u are fully geared.
I have no points in con and sit on 31k-ish hp with 2k regen.
So im far away from being a class cannon. It's all about playing smart.
Oh and his name is Sicarius and even he dies in 1 pronechain against a fully geared gwf and he has like 32kish hp.

You can still maintain a high Dex with a high con, so it really comes down to Wis vs Con. I am going to take the HPs from Con over crit from Wis. The extra HPs from con allow me to build my defense as well by allowing me to use a few brutals. With my damage reduction on top of my HP/Regen, I almost never die in a single prone chain 1v1, unless my HPs were low to begin with. Given that crit is taking a big nerf in PvP with tenacity, I am even more happy with my choice. I still have around 37% crit, which is fine for me.

I thought I was mispelling his name. And yes he can still die in a prone chain, but he is very good 1v1 at avoiding it. I thought I had him a couple times and he kept getting me close, but each time Steamroller and buddies showed up before it could before our match could be carried through to completion. Such is life in premade vs premade.

edit: you added more while I was typing. I get your point, but my HR still does more than adequate burst damage when combined with another person attempting to take a point quickly. The extra survival allows me to play up closer as well making timing for it easier.

teflondon75 · March 2014

xmousepadx wrote: »

Dex and wis scale even better with your offensive stats. If you look at it 1 con is worth like 120~of any enchantable stat, dex/wis are around 400-480 of enchantable stats, depending on your gearlevel.
I'm not saying u should go classcannon, just saying that dex/wis are better as soon as u are fully geared.
I have no points in con and sit on 31k-ish hp with 2k regen.
So im far away from being a class cannon. It's all about playing smart.
Oh and his name is Sicarius and even he dies in 1 pronechain against a fully geared gwf and he has like 32kish hp.
The extra Con you could get may keep u like 3sec longer alive which isnt bad at all but on the other hand the extra dex/wis help you to clear a point faster and since HR isnt a pointholder like gf/gwf/tr are i would always pick dex/wis over con.
On top of that wis offers u control resist which will keep u way longer alive than extra 440ish hp from con when u resist a prone.

That's great to hear one can still have a nice high HP/Regen level with no con investment. I was worried I'd have to re-roll my human HR. Do you mind posting what armor set/accessories you are using for that? I'm thinking of switching over to full PvP rather than using my hybrid pve/pvp spec. Anyhow, thanks! That makes me feel better hearing that.

goldheart · March 2014

1 vs 1 ?
In 5 vs 5 ?

You mistake the game.

In most games I like to play glass cannon. In this game my HR like Con instead of Wis. The problem is not to find the way vs GWF's prone chain but to be death less in the PVP and of course to have high enough DPS to kill FAST your target. HR's work in PVP is to be support DPS but not main tank. If you like to play main tank, capture the point, 1 vs 1 well but this can be done with random PUG with 10k GS but not with premade group.

Burst DPS on this class is strongly specific, a bit broken and is support.

I really wonder on players that try to use Thorn Ward in the center of melee when I see this I know that this is 1vs1 player that do not know his skills. Thorn Ward can hit only ONE target and rush you to go on half of your Range for what ? 1 hit per ~1,5 sec ?
Thorn Ward is for Combat spec because of Thorn Strike which can hit up to 5 targets and Thorn Ward became as support on this. To use Thorn Ward as main encounter for Archery spec is not good idea.

HR PvP

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