Review Trade: Hunger in Icewind Dale

melinden · January 2014

Hunger in Icewind Dale: NW-DRMA5379B

I have another new quest I would love to get some feedback on. Here's the official blurb:

The Academicals' Study Abroad Director needs someone to go and help the Elderwoman in Bryn Shander, the capital of the human settlements in the far north region of Icewind Dale. Are you willing (and broke enough) to brave traveling north of the Spine of the World in the middle of the winter?

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Plain English: This is a large exploration map with clue-hunting and jumping puzzles. A fast horse is recommended. The quest path is unreliable due to customization. Optional fights are difficult. Depending on your quest choices NPC help is available for the last required fight.

Some dialogue choices appear as "Choose Your Own Adventure" style due to limitations of the Foundry to handle OR logic.

So I'll warn you, this one's a long one. Just under an hour when I played with my DC and I just followed the quest trail. Didn't wander much or fight the optional fights. My husband clocked in at 1 hour 20 minutes but he tends to refuse to follow the trail and he looped the entire map once before actually doing anything.

This was an interesting quest to make. I wanted to do something in Icewind Dale and I really wanted to emphasize the danger in the environment as much as the monsters. The fact that we only have 2 preset snow maps and really limited snow details made this one a good candidate to make a "mega map" quest. I'm not sure I'd do it again but I'm glad I did it once. I also had to do lots and lots of custom interiors and Bryn Shander I had to build from nothing. Again, I'm not sure if the payoff is worth it for all quests but the experience was good to have.

I should have time to get a bunch of trade reviews done this weekend. Leave the quest shortcode if you want me to look at yours.

As always, thanks for your help!

myrmecoleon · January 2014

I played through Hunger in Icewind Dale - the quest was excellent throughout, with some very well designed custom environments, creative ideas and very solid, setting-consistent dialogue. The little portal areas in the snowy forest map were all very good indeed (especially the half-built dwarven hold), and there's a good amount of exploration and little touches which set off the setting - e.g. the orc camp, the buried journal, the scenes with the bears and the trolls, the scene with the airship above Bryn Shander. Combat was generally simple throughout, but that's not a bad thing. Overall, a very good adventure! A few additional notes below.

- I like the use of the storm effect! I was worried that I wouldn't be able to see anything through half the quest, but that got settled quickly enough. During the objective "Wait out the storm", I exited the inn rather than going to the room with the bed first - and the storm appears to have disappeared.

- When approaching the injured boar, the ghost is visible at a distance.

- The frozen waterfall is nice! On the way down, I did just jump down without interacting with the relevant invisible sphere; I'm not sure whether it's worth amending the quest text there, because I assume you would prefer to keep the surprise element.

- Kuldahar is great - the verdant greenery's a nice contrast to the snowy terrain. Some good optional dialogue there too!

- After the hermit dialogue, the werewolf encounter didn't seem to fight back. I'm not sure why that is - maybe it was just bugged on my run.

- There are some rocks at 692, 1408 which look misaligned

- Floating trees are visible from 1995, 1428 - if the player explores the ice shelf area eastwards before entering the dwarven ruins.

- I chose to take the culprit to Suvetar. However, despite taking Suvetar's letter and placing it next to Tulla, the letter didn't seem to show up on the table and I didn't have the option to choose the corresponding dialogue (I had to choose the kill dialogue instead).

Hope that's helpful! I wouldn't mind a playthough of Crimson Descent if you have the time, but no worries if not.

melinden · January 2014

Thanks for the play through!

Some of those **** floating trees are just on the map and not mine. I shoved snow drifts under the worst offenders. I could also add some invisible walls. Unfortunately I am really close to my detail limit.

Through no fault of your own it looks like you went in the wrong order with Tulla: she asks you to place the letter (or other item) after you talk to her. It is just a disposal spot. I can fix that with spawn triggers so it is less confusing.

Let me think about the waterfall objective. I suppose I could wall in players with more invisible elements. If you have any suggestions feel free to send me an in game mail.

Thanks for all the detailed notes, I will head off to play yours now!

melinden · January 2014

OK, I used some more snow drifts to cover Cryptic's floating rocks. *grrrr* I also did some landscaping so players shouldn't be able to see over the hills to the floating trees. I also used some triggers and now it shouldn't be possible for players to get rid of the items they need before talking to Tulla when they return. Thanks again!

myrmecoleon · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

Some of those **** floating trees are just on the map and not mine. I shoved snow drifts under the worst offenders. I could also add some invisible walls. Unfortunately I am really close to my detail limit.

melinden wrote:

OK, I used some more snow drifts to cover Cryptic's floating rocks.

Ah, right - you did a good job on the others, because I didn't notice any floating trees other than those!

melinden wrote:

Through no fault of your own it looks like you went in the wrong order with Tulla: she asks you to place the letter (or other item) after you talk to her. It is just a disposal spot. I can fix that with spawn triggers so it is less confusing.

melinden wrote:

I also used some triggers and now it shouldn't be possible for players to get rid of the items they need before talking to Tulla when they return.

Ah, so that's how it works! I did wonder about that.

melinden wrote:

Let me think about the waterfall objective. I suppose I could wall in players with more invisible elements. If you have any suggestions feel free to send me an in game mail.

Hmm, I can't think of anything off-hand which wouldn't be unduly restrictive on the player's freedom and/or give away the surprise. I think it probably works as it is - I might need to be a little more observant with these interactions.

orangefiree · January 2014

I will play through this shortly. Any chance you could play through one or more quests in "The Planar Conflict"? You played through part of the original version a while back but didn't finish it due to connection issues. I since took your advice and split it into three quests as well as adding a fourth part. (Fifth is on the way but not out yes.) So if it seems familiar, that is why. I changed it around a lot though

orangefiree · January 2014

Play through notes:
The Bridge on the skyship was kind of hard to interact with for some reason.
"The captain appear" should be "The captain appears".
Invisible walls are blocking the way to Tulla's house, I wonder if I missed something.
While trying to figure out if I can find a way to complete the quest, I noticed the torches are burning in the middle of a blizzard.

Sorry, the quest seems to be impossible to complete as Tulla's house is blocked on every side by invisible walls. I will give it a try later to see if that is fixed.

melinden · January 2014

Orangefiree:

I'm suspecting you might have taken a very wrong turn. Since the map is custom the quest path is nearly useless and that may have been the problem. Hence the torches in the storm. Maybe I need to add more in this case.

Did you try and go around Bryn Shander? The Council House is accessed via a teleporter inside the city gates. The walls are there to try and keep players from leaving the area that I was able to make a "snow" map.

If you think you did something else can you describe it? I'll see what I can do to keep it from happening again.

orangefiree · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

Orangefiree:

I'm suspecting you might have taken a very wrong turn. Since the map is custom the quest path is nearly useless and that may have been the problem. Hence the torches in the storm. Maybe I need to add more in this case.

Did you try and go around Bryn Shander? The Council House is accessed via a teleporter inside the city gates. The walls are there to try and keep players from leaving the area that I was able to make a "snow" map.

If you think you did something else can you describe it? I'll see what I can do to keep it from happening again.

At first, when I got the objective, I decided to head to where it was on the map. Since I couldn't get out, I jumped on some firewood, used that to get on a house roof, and proceeded to jump on roofs until I reached one that was high enough to get on the wall. After that, I ran along the wall until I reached the side where the map said the house was and jumped down. From there, I tried to walk towards it but ran into an invisible wall and used /killme. I then approached the house from the start area and ran into an invisible wall from that direction. So yes, it seems I made a very wrong turn. I will try again using the teleporter that I previously didn't notice this time.

orangefiree · January 2014

New play through notes: (For second attempt, previous ones are not being mentioned here as they are in my other post already.)

To fix my above problem, I would recommend adding a campfire in the city area and invisible wall somewhere to prevent to climbing I mentioned in order to avoid possible glitching of the quest.

Wait, the animals have been killed but not eaten and yet somehow, the people here can't just eat that? The work was already done for them, that should be a good thing. I think am missing something here.

Some customization on the goblins would be nice. Same thing goes for the werewolves. (And every other enemy really.)

Ajattar doesn't really have a shrine full of rimefire golems considering there was only one. Maybe replace that with winter wolves. I counted four of those.

The wolves talking to me was a little weird. You might want to take the dialogue out of encounters with actual wolves in them.

The ladder to enter the werewolf den said "Press F to teleport back" and the other side just said "Press F to teleport". You might want to reverse the two sides.

Using my rogue dodge ability, I actually managed to jump over the pit that I was told I couldn't jump over.

Banhat doesn't follow me even though I took him prisoner.

I forgot to jump on my way out and fell into the pit. I managed to actually beat the "Falling to your death" guys, you might want to make it a little tougher.

Who was the drow ranger? The dialogue acted like I should know him, but I have no clue who he is.

melinden · January 2014

Thanks for having the patience to try again!

I have a couple of ideas to try and get people in the right place. You were certainly very energetic and creative trying to get over the wall!
-Most of the meat has gone to waste. There is an interactable that tries to indicate that but I can make it clearer.
-I am pretty much OUT of NPCs and encounters at this point. It was the downside to making the mega-map. I can see if I can eke out a couple of more. The Rimefire line is a warning in case you decide to mess with her later.
-Yep, that teleporter has one that has the "Back" line. I spent about 20 hours on teleporters for this quest so I'm just going to leave it. Touching teleporters....well, you know.
-there is an OOC note that says you won't see Banhat follow you when you take him prisoner (it is the last line). Since you pretty much immediately go through a teleporter and NPCs won't follow you through them, having him appear seemed a waste of my few NPCs
-again, I am sadly out of encounters, I wish I could have 30 ogres down there in the pit. Another reason I don't think mega-maps are worth the pluses they offer.
-the ranger is a very famous Easter Egg for any fans of Forgotten Realms or Icewind Dale. I kept him subtle but he's a big enough deal that NOT having him there would have been weird.

I'll go work on those fixes now, thanks again!

orangefiree · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

Thanks for having the patience to try again!

I have a couple of ideas to try and get people in the right place. You were certainly very energetic and creative trying to get over the wall!
-Most of the meat has gone to waste. There is an interactable that tries to indicate that but I can make it clearer.
-I am pretty much OUT of NPCs and encounters at this point. It was the downside to making the mega-map. I can see if I can eke out a couple of more. The Rimefire line is a warning in case you decide to mess with her later.
-Yep, that teleporter has one that has the "Back" line. I spent about 20 hours on teleporters for this quest so I'm just going to leave it. Touching teleporters....well, you know.
-there is an OOC note that says you won't see Banhat follow you when you take him prisoner (it is the last line). Since you pretty much immediately go through a teleporter and NPCs won't follow you through them, having him appear seemed a waste of my few NPCs
-again, I am sadly out of encounters, I wish I could have 30 ogres down there in the pit. Another reason I don't think mega-maps are worth the pluses they offer.
-the ranger is a very famous Easter Egg for any fans of Forgotten Realms or Icewind Dale. I kept him subtle but he's a big enough deal that NOT having him there would have been weird.

I'll go work on those fixes now, thanks again!

Ok, I assumed the cold weather would pretty much act like a freezer based on the description of the temperature.
I misread the OOC note and thought it was telling me that he was going to follow me but not act like a prisoner; my bad.

melinden · January 2014

I raised the bridge on the skyship so hopefully it is easier to see. Rimefire Golems now in the shrine and a Reach Point objective should help get folks to the doorway of the Council House.

Thanks again!

orangefiree · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

I raised the bridge on the skyship so hopefully it is easier to see. Rimefire Golems now in the shrine and a Reach Point objective should help get folks to the doorway of the Council House.

Thanks again!

Your welcome.

rigellia · January 2014

I just did this quest. Really nice job! Nice reference to Harry Potter in the Chancellor's room? In any case, really good quest on the whole. The only thing I noticed was some grammar in the first NPC conversation with the study abroads person: "I see you've worked in academics before" should be either "worked with academics" or "worked in academia"

Otherwise, well done!

antonkyle · January 2014

Hi, I just played this and came across a problem that I was unable to move past. I will write my review up until that point.

Quest: Hunger in Icewind Dale: NW-DRMA5379B

First of all the maps were all very nice, there were some floating objects, but nothing major and hardly noticeable. The story was good from what I could tell although I think I may have missed much.

The wait out the storm interaction should be longer with an animation attached like lie down. I don't like the depthfade blocking the stairs, It didn't feel right to me. The sky is black & white, would be better to use another one. These are all subjective opinions so don't worry about them.

The stairs up to the battlements in the village don't sit flush, you have to jump halfway up. At first I thought it was an invisible wall. When at the top of the stairs I turned left, mounted up and ran to the corner of the wall jumped on the house and attempted to jump onto the taller house next to it. I missed and fell through the floor and ended up inside an Ice cave. At first I thought this was intentional, but after looking around and being unable to find a way back up I think it was a glitch.

At this point I had to leave using the mini map icon, but I was pleased to find I could just come back in. I found myself just in-front of the Dwarven ruins, so decided to carry on. I'm not sure if I missed any story but was able to piece things together fine. I ran this map fine up untill 'Track down the Malarites.

I found my way to the snow coverd mountain interaction and got the impression that I may have missed something, like a spade. The snow wouldn't move, but the text was telling me to climb down. I tried to find another way and failed in an epic way. Somehow I manged to get behind your map under the floating trees you had hidden and under the ship. As much as I tried I could not find a way back to the other side so I had to leave again. I came back in and found the same problem of the snow interaction not working.

I may try to repeat this from the start when I have a bit more time. It was good up until this. I have added some pics so you can see the problems I found.

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melinden · January 2014

My word! You folks like to go out of bounds. I need to think of ways to keep you all contained! Of course if you are doing it that means other players are as well.

Antonkyle: I appreciate your persistence! I probably would have given up given how many times you got stuck.

I'll think of a way to keep people off the stairs in the first Bryn Shander map I guess. I need them for the last map so they need to be there on the first. There should be an invisible floor under the skyship to catch you if you walk off the gangway in Kuldahar. Did you go off the far side?

Did you talk to the hermit? He can help you with the snow pack issue.

Added: I tried the laying down sleeping animation in the bed in my first draft. The toon ends up laying down in some random position on the floor, so it didn't survive that draft.

Added Yet Again: There is now an invisible wall that -should- keep people off the town wall in the first visit to Bryn Shander.

antonkyle · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

My word! You folks like to go out of bounds. I need to think of ways to keep you all contained! Of course if you are doing it that means other players are as well.

I'll think of a way to keep people off the stairs in the first Bryn Shander map I guess. I need them for the last map so they need to be there on the first. There should be an invisible floor under the skyship to catch you if you walk off the gangway in Kuldahar. Did you go off the far side?

Did you talk to the hermit? He can help you with the snow pack issue.

Added: I tried the laying down sleeping animation in the bed in my first draft. The toon ends up laying down in some random position on the floor, so it didn't survive that draft.

I didn't fall of near the ship, I did that trying to find another way down where the snow is but was able to walk round most of the map. I couldn't find a way back.

I may have missed the hermit, I'll try again. I've still got the quest so maybe can start from there again.

antonkyle · January 2014

Ok! I finished it now. I had no more problems at all.

Was a nice quest over all. To prevent people falling through like I did rather than stopping people climbing the stairs I would put a load of crates with an invisible wall at the top to make it look like they are in your way.

Was a very good quest over all, I think I may have bumped your time up somewhat, sorry about that. I left an in game review for you.

melinden · January 2014

Thanks again for sticking with it. The crates suggestion is a really good one. I -might- have a few details left on the Dale map to corral people in by the dungeon entrance.

The teleporters on that map defeated me so soundly that the entrances to all the places you teleport to? Completely dictated by where I could find on the map that was the same Y value and then get a player to with any reason.

I wish there was a way for me to know what endings people are trying. Anyone give Banhat to Ajattar yet?

antonkyle · January 2014

I gave him to the druid and then Ajatter had a go at me and said she would post... well you know.

Now I'm intrigued!!

lightbringer1102 · January 2014

I saw 2 versions of the tower of the lost wizards ? Is there a specific one to play?

melinden · January 2014

Hi Lightbringer: One is the featured copy and one is the copy I still have control over. They are the same copy. However the speed runners have taken both to 14 minutes at this point, so if you want daily credit Return to the Clock Maker's Tomb might be a better one for you.

Antonkyle: I was trying to push my ability to provide different endings in this quest. Unfortunately that means I have to send people back to both women and it also means I had to do the "choose your own adventure" options since I couldn't disable responses. I will say the nice thing about the mega-map was that I could do more with triggers very far apart in the story.

lightbringer1102 · January 2014

@Melinden I played it with a group, i liked it lot , it also gave me ideas for future quests. I'm going to try to solo it , to read through the lore .

orangefiree · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

Thanks again for sticking with it. The crates suggestion is a really good one. I -might- have a few details left on the Dale map to corral people in by the dungeon entrance.

The teleporters on that map defeated me so soundly that the entrances to all the places you teleport to? Completely dictated by where I could find on the map that was the same Y value and then get a player to with any reason.

I wish there was a way for me to know what endings people are trying. Anyone give Banhat to Ajattar yet?

I gave Banhat to the druid. (Sorry, I can't remember her name anymore.)

godwin1978 · March 2014

I actually google searched the name of this one to both give you praise and beg for assistance. As an FYI, like others I've read here - I fell through areas tons and actually went from the airship to inside the golem area before I was intended to be there. I made it work out well enough and progressed to the point below that Anton addressed above. I cannot get past attempting to clear the snow and go down. I've used the F trigger at a billion points where its possible (a wide area it seems), but am not getting any different results.

melinden · March 2014

Godwin,

Thank you for trying the quest and I'm sorry you are having trouble. Could I get some more information from you so I can locate the problem areas?

-when you say golem area, do you mean Ajattar's ice cave? In which case, does this mean you could interact with the teleporter before you solved the puzzle or you fell off the invisible floor under the airship and ran around the outside border of the map?

-could you describe any other areas where you fell through?

-what kind of trouble are you having with the snow? Are you unable to get close enough to interact or are you missing the item? If you are missing the item I recommend you find the Hermit in a small pass area to the south of where you are trying to dig through the snow.

Thanks again for your help and again I'm sorry for your frustration.

melinden · April 2014

Thank you for review, I'm glad you liked it! Of course it will be a historical artifact soon once the module comes out.

When you say teleporter do you mean the gate out of the city? That's been problematic for a bit, but I can rethink it and see if I can come up with another solution now that I've had some time away from it.

Thanks again!

dtz · April 2014

That was a cool quest, though all the backtracking across Icewind Dale did get a bit tiresome. I loved all the references to things like the Battlehammer Clan (though, come to think of it, I don't recall ever having an opportunity to report those dead scouts...)

Overall, though, very sold. Have some astral diamonds!

melinden · April 2014

Thank you!
Yeah the running around is a downside. I was trying a "mega map" to see if I could do it. The upside is that I can have players trigger events on the far side of the map and have NPCs or effects waiting for them when they get there. Not sure I would do it again (and if we had had more snow maps to use I might not have made this one as complicated) but I learned a lot doing it.

Review Trade: Hunger in Icewind Dale

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