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My Beef with Valindra's Tower and Malabog's Castle for PVE loot
ayroux
Member Posts: 4,271 Arc User
I doubt a DEV will read this, but when broken down this just seems really really lame.
1) Ill start with the newer dungeon first. Valindra. Ok so the dungeon is super short (like 15 min tops) to clear, no big deal... But heres the BIG issue, say I want to try and farm my dread legion weapons... The ONLY way I have a chance of getting them is from doing VT during DD.
This really really limits not only the number of times I can run VT (since I can only do it during that hour) it also severely limits the time of day I can play... Its really frustrating to get on and you have 2-3 hours allocated to play after work etc, and guess what, DD isnt running. So much for doing anything that night... With the lack of PVP content as well, I end up just logging off...
REALLY a buzz kill guys....
2) Malabogs Castle. This is something I ended up farmed alot recently for my formorian off hand as a GWF. This entire loot system is just crappy! The majority of classes off hands drop from the other bosses, absolutely NO good loot really drops off the last boss so there is really NO incentive to run it. If you want to BUY the gear you can just do speed runs of the first two bosses.
It just seems backwards to me. The GEAR is bought through "farming" bosses, but the LITTLE items like offhands are the stuff that drops?
Seems like it should be reversed.
IN MY HONEST OPINION, I would make it so (for instance) The first boss has a CHANCE to drop EACH classes gloves...
Malabog has a chance to drop each classes Helm
The dragon has a chance to drop each classes Chest.
And the boots can either drop from the chest, or be bought. The Weapons can also be thrown in as loot tables throughout the instance.
1st boss can drop either of them, so can second etc...
But the BEST loot that drops off the dragon is either the DC or the GWF off hands for a weaponsmithing set.... Just seems so un-climactic and completely not worth the time spent. Even the chest doesnt provide much rewards.....
Youve basically given ZERO incentive for any group to run 3/3 MC outside of DD and same with valindra.... zero incentive to run 2/2 VT outside of DD...
With the limited content we have, it really hurts the game....
1) Ill start with the newer dungeon first. Valindra. Ok so the dungeon is super short (like 15 min tops) to clear, no big deal... But heres the BIG issue, say I want to try and farm my dread legion weapons... The ONLY way I have a chance of getting them is from doing VT during DD.
This really really limits not only the number of times I can run VT (since I can only do it during that hour) it also severely limits the time of day I can play... Its really frustrating to get on and you have 2-3 hours allocated to play after work etc, and guess what, DD isnt running. So much for doing anything that night... With the lack of PVP content as well, I end up just logging off...
REALLY a buzz kill guys....
2) Malabogs Castle. This is something I ended up farmed alot recently for my formorian off hand as a GWF. This entire loot system is just crappy! The majority of classes off hands drop from the other bosses, absolutely NO good loot really drops off the last boss so there is really NO incentive to run it. If you want to BUY the gear you can just do speed runs of the first two bosses.
It just seems backwards to me. The GEAR is bought through "farming" bosses, but the LITTLE items like offhands are the stuff that drops?
Seems like it should be reversed.
IN MY HONEST OPINION, I would make it so (for instance) The first boss has a CHANCE to drop EACH classes gloves...
Malabog has a chance to drop each classes Helm
The dragon has a chance to drop each classes Chest.
And the boots can either drop from the chest, or be bought. The Weapons can also be thrown in as loot tables throughout the instance.
1st boss can drop either of them, so can second etc...
But the BEST loot that drops off the dragon is either the DC or the GWF off hands for a weaponsmithing set.... Just seems so un-climactic and completely not worth the time spent. Even the chest doesnt provide much rewards.....
Youve basically given ZERO incentive for any group to run 3/3 MC outside of DD and same with valindra.... zero incentive to run 2/2 VT outside of DD...
With the limited content we have, it really hurts the game....
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I've done Malabog a lot in the last 2 or 3 months. Its kind of easyish but the fact is its 9200 dungeon that drops blues or bind on pickup stuff so its pointless unless you are doing it because you enjoy it. What I actually want are the crafting components but I've seen them like five times ever and so far someone else has always won. I don't begrudge them the win because a million ad is nice but its kind of starting to get annoying and the fun is totally sucked out of the experience at this point.
I don't care about Valindra at all because luckily I got the weapons and the suit early but when I go back I only get bound salvage stuff or a chance to roll on some t1 boots or garbage like that. The fight is pretty fun but with no chance at anything sellable its a waste of time. Who needs the hassle really?
Oh yeah artifacts can drop, the twice I've seen that I lost and then it bugged and didn't let me roll. The tiny tiny chance of getting one of those doesn't really justify the time when you could do spellplague and get a chance to roll on hats that drop a good bit more often and sells for a bundle. If I wasn't generous and kind of loose with ad I could get the ad to buy the riser, quillon and stone from that but that isn't paying the iron price.
Smack me in the face some more, Cryptic!
Most have a weekly lockout for end game gear dungeon/raid runs soooooo...I don't see the huge complaint other than if you're not on at the right time I guess it could suck.
Explosivo - Scrub geared MoF CW - Climb upon my BIG ASSED steed....
This. A weekly timer isn't uncommon in MMOs. So really this complaint is weird, to say the least.
Fulminorax still drops GWF and DC offhand (bis one for dps), and the chest has no T1 drop. The emblem of Seldarine should indeed drop from the dragon only, but in Valindra's Tower, the loot table has been greatly improved. I have done 30-40 final boss kills maybe, and even if i have yet to see the cleric armor i'm looking for, i've seen a ton of other classes armor, an artifact, not that rare crafting materials (a lot more from valindra than from the first boss), or unbound T1 gear i've been able to sell for quite a lot of ADs (high prophet boots come to my mind).
I see many false claims in these posts: Yes drops still suck in MC, and yes the best loots should come from the final boss, but the chest rewards are ok and the dragon is easy (I don't remember the last time i've failed). The way from Malabog to the dragon is also short, so why not giving it a try? Valindra also drops some nice stuff, it's short, and even if the RNG is really making me mad at this dungeon i can't say the loots suck.
That's why I'm "always" in CN... cause I can profit from there. All my MC runs brought me... 0 (zero) profit.
All my VT runs brought me weapon set, some frags and some marks (very few, 2-3 or so) and I could also buy all tier, but it is so bad I cannot even bother to consider it. Much better overall.
Compared to CN (because we have to, newer dungeons must be at least as profitable)... CN brings me constant revenue. Basically all my enchant upgrades=CN. So we have sadly an issue with 2 almost useless dungeons which could have been so much more.
But in the end, you got the off hand, and this is all that matters, the grind is over for you
Really, it took so much time and nerves for me to farm DC's set that I don't even want to see or hear of that dungeon any more...
WTB Class Reroll please
You actually get 4x more seals when you kill it when you open the chest. Up to 4 from the dragon and 11-12 from the chest. A full MC set is about 24 runs. 12 days if you do it twice a day with two runs per DD event (3 is doable, just not with anyone). That's quite generous in a MMO.
All you'll get with such posts is CN weapons BoP (which should have been the case since day 1 anyway).
OK, so they make Ancients BoP.
How will I make decent AD then? Not interested in parallel methods of playing AH/leadership and so on.
I want to farm, make money, buy/upgrade gear - just like in that other MMO.
So please... tell me why should I stay in the game if I will be stuck on rank 8-9 forever, cause no AD to upgrade? Stuck with epic artifacts forever, no AD to upgrade.
You have to keep in mind, other MMOs allow you to make as much currency as you want, only by investing time. This game is different. We need to be able to farm, or F2P player base (which is basically game content) will disappear.
I don't disagree. I'm just saying that the dragon is fairly generous, that it devaluates ancient weaponry and new content. The ideal solution would be to add different loots to this boss, but the easiest one would be to make it BoP. And Cryptic doesn't always chose the best solution. This dungeon has been the only one not effected by loot rule changes, and if it makes players not playing the new content, a change on this one is inevitable.
I actually like BoP. I'm coming from an MMO where everything good was BoP. I use to say "You kill dragon, you get loot. No dragon kill, no loot for you." This is how I view things, kill things to deserve the loot.
Now... Neverwinter.
Neverwinter has a pretty different system in place. It is the refining system. In that other MMO, I would farm long time for my gear, and be gated by RNG/low drop rate/weekly lockdown on raid. That meant that I could get all the gear I needed from running dungeons&raids. Then, I needed to enchant it. While still costly, I could make good cash by just playing the game: doing my professions, dailies, winning BoE items, creating BoE items for sale and so on. The enchanting was a SINGLE step/item, so I could add Major Intellect for example on my staff and be done with it...
Neverwinter has players forever refining. Refining is AD intensive. Mats cost AD, and you need huge amounts. Marks cost AD, and you need lots of them.
If you take away CN farming, only T2s remain. They are even lower end dungeons, even more boring and unchallenging, and good loot drops like 30% of the times.
Basically, as a F2P player, I work on this game significantly more than I work for my real job as a graphic designer. If you take away farming, it will be the last drop, honestly.
And I cannot see this game adopting a reasonable enchanting system either, that would be a one-time pay that most players are able to do.
So making CN loot BoP will just contribute further to making this game a chore, and few will remain.
Also removing CN farming will significantly contribute to make the gap between paying players and F2P even larger. This will end up in frustration all the time for many, many players.
TLDR: you need to offer means to farm in an MMO. Players should be able to work their way, in time, to full BiS.
Aggravating and unnecessary.
Ancient Shadows: Mature. Sensible. Custard.
Recruitment info at: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?462591-Ancient-Shadows-Become-a-Lion-Tamer-without-learning-Chartered-Accountancy-first!&highlight=ancient+shadows
Well i've spent over 2-3M ADs (farmed) in the new refinement system, so I can't disagree. But the issues this update created aren't tied to how dungeons work. It's just that blue and purple marks of potency are either way too expensive for what it is, or don't drop enough, at least by a 5x factor. The fact that this refinement system should be directly sent to the trash bin doesn't mean new content is <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> or not profitable - it is, and not by a small margin, for me. This is, however, a quite important balance issue, but shouldn't been addressed by spamming the market with BiS gear.
If they would take this away, they would need to replace it with something just as efficient. CN can bring me 200K/relaxed day, more if I run it extensively. They would need to put something in place that would be just as profitable.
Somehow, I think this won't ever happen.
In that other MMO, I could make enchants and AH them for good profit. I could make flasks and potions, AH for good profit. Create BoE near-BiS gear, sell for good profit. All I needed to do was farm the mats, insta-create endproduct, sell. Even picking up herbs&selling them was good profit. Fishing was profitable. Cooking fish and selling - even more profitable.
But more importantly, these profits were made mostly by playing&enjoying the game.
CN farming happens for the sole reasons there's nothing else to farm for AD at an efficient rate. Most people I know are so bored, they feel like giving up on the game... cause all day, everyday... CN.
But the wheel is turning, and we're the hamsters running on it, cause you need to upgrade those artifacts&enchants somehow.
Proposed Solution: (while getting to keep refining... bleh).
- make Rank 7 enchants drop of all bosses, 1 random R7/kill
- increase mark drops from all bosses significantly
- put "refining tokens" worth 30-100K RP in the chests, depending on end boss
- allow artifacts to gain "experience" (RP) from boss kills
- introduce scalable, heroic content, with much better rewards but with much harder bosses
You may do this already in VT. The final boss drops black opals. It's not the most common item but i've seen it a fair amount of times (3-4 times, so for me it's one every 10 runs). The devs have been a bit cheapstake though, since it's only worth 10k RP. Of course it's one for 5 people, so you may just get peridots (lol).
If I remember correctly, this was talked about with Module 2 but ultimately held back? So, it should be on the horizon and will be a VERY welcome change in my eyes.