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Looking for Tactical Advice on how a CW can handle TRs in PvP
nwknight5280
Member Posts: 39 Arc User
Skipping the conversation rehash from other threads on the game mechanics of CWs vs. TRs ( like here - http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?262381-TR-in-PvP ) I would like to ask if anyone has specific tactical advice on how a somewhat new CW PvPer can best deal with TRs. My current build is pretty similar to this - http://freetoplaymmorpgs.com/neverwinter/jawarisins-cw-pvp-renegade-build-guide/
I have heard that icy rays are a good opener forcing them to use their ITC. Also that DoTs like Ray of Enfeeblement and Cone of Ice can help keep them out of stealth. Also was advised to NOT use a teleport right off the bat and simply start moving away until they roll. All this is great (I think); but requires that one actually sees them. If you have any tactics that seem to work well; please do share them.
I use the lantern; but that has a long cooldown. occasionally I will also blow a daily Ice Storm; but that always seems such a waste.
Also what gear is best? I have heard High Vizier is good. Also was recommended to get some rings with regen / defense enchantments.
Many thanks in advance for your advice.
I have heard that icy rays are a good opener forcing them to use their ITC. Also that DoTs like Ray of Enfeeblement and Cone of Ice can help keep them out of stealth. Also was advised to NOT use a teleport right off the bat and simply start moving away until they roll. All this is great (I think); but requires that one actually sees them. If you have any tactics that seem to work well; please do share them.
I use the lantern; but that has a long cooldown. occasionally I will also blow a daily Ice Storm; but that always seems such a waste.
Also what gear is best? I have heard High Vizier is good. Also was recommended to get some rings with regen / defense enchantments.
Many thanks in advance for your advice.
"We cannna bring a troll to fire, but we can bring fire to the troll" - old dwarvish proverb
Post edited by nwknight5280 on
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Hyenas@zokir - Essence of Aggression
TRs are the natural predators to CWs, but once you are geared up defensively (aim for 1300ish Defense and 1300ish Regeneration), then the next step is to learn how to use tabbed Shard in order to stop the TR. For instance if you see him stealth dropping the Shard in front of you leads to a good prone+damage (provided that you hit him), while you can kite away and re-hit him with the Shard.
It takes a LOT of practice, and lots of homework...since you got to understand exactly what you are doing, but once you get used to it you'll have an easier time.
An alternative to the HV, is GG gear with Bloodraven Skull,Waters artifacts, rings+necks of Youth (Berserkers') and a regen belt in order to get to high 30k hp with 1300ish regen boosting your survivability by a lot...and making Shard's CD comedown to 30% less than it should (due to the set bonus).
The HP and defenses are key. Maybe just MAYBE for premades, HV set is best cause you help the team with another debuff. If you wanna be the best pug CW, get the GG set, and slot radiants and HP everywhere. One friend has a 38K HP CW with GG set and it performs excellent. Other stats to look after: regen, defense, deflect, armor penetration.
Basically, your offenses are secondary to you defenses, which should be consistent. Also that build you're using is dated. Oppressor is highly disruptive in PvP and there's never enough CC, so I'd say it is the way to go.
Even with 38K HP and tank build though, you might still fail against better TRs... all the time. As a new CW, you have 0 chances to deal with any half-decent TR, sorry to bring this to you
The Lantern is sadly quite useless - you need the PvP artifact or the waters for a heal, ideally together with a soulforge enchant as well.
Against average TRs, you will learn to always win because,
1. Lashing Blade, Dazing Strike and Smoke Bomb are all either extremely easy to dodge or escape from
2. It is just a matter of timing them to catch them with CC the second they fail to chain a survivability ability, i.e. Stealth with distance, Duelist's Flurry, ItC and dodge.
Against above average TRs (70-80% win rate),
3. Wait for and dodge the second you hear their Shadowstrike. It is quite easy to dodge when you know its coming
4. Be aware of your character's feet, to see where your hit register circle highlights the direction of strikes while watching the general area you heard the Shadowstrike and subsequent attacks come from (most likely Cloud of Steel little dagger spam). Also, some enchants or spell effects leave weapon/dagger trails.
5. This is where experience and judgement comes in. CLOSE to the TR (though do not waste a dodge doing it). Given the information above, this will mostly likely catch them out of their timing for any attacks they were setting up out of stealth. Use some form of CC when you find them and gg, one dead or close to dead TR.
6. If they start to run, chase them until their stealth runs out and put a DoT on them like Ray of Enfeeblement or Conduit of Ice.
Against strong TR (30-40% win rate),
7. Same as 3. Try to dodge their Shadowstrike. Problem is that to a good TR it does not matter if it misses.
8. Strong TR are masters of DF (Duelist's Flurry) and likely ItC. They will either spam it as they attack or they will perfectly time any approach. So using the above tactics to close to them is more or less suicidal. Instead you have to use your Search and Locate skills to help your kiting.
9. Kite them while making sure to leave one dodge. Try to ensure you have a pillar or some other way to get an extra escape. Bait them into using one of their survivability moves, preferably ItC. If they take the bait, kite just out of reach, but not their stealth and prepare to counter!
10. Use your fastest CC or prepare and attack ASAP the second you see the counter gap. The better the TR, the faster the CC required. For example, try Entangling Force first, if not use Icy Rays (especially with daily up) and if they are just too strong and you do not have Oppressive Force up, use Repel. Then unload on them. Repeat 7-10.
Impact Shot: in general, if you do not dodge the first one, it is not worth trying to dodge subsequent ones due to a stun and/or root it applies (not sure if Shadowmantle has fixed this issue for non-stealthed Impact Shots). Instead prepare to counter or kite the subsequent attack since you know almost certainly the TR will be approaching for a finisher.
Personally, I find aoe's of little use against good TRs and not needed against bad ones. The exception is Icy Terrain for really good permas, but of course, in a real match taking on 1v1 against a perma is normally a good way to waste a lot of time and lose both the 1v1 and match. So, don't bother.
I suspect, if you are a very strong and geared CW (i.e. equally geared) and likely Oppressor, you may be able to achieve 50% win rate against the strongest of TRs, but it will be far from easy and may require much more unusual tactics than those I posted here.
Jugger Conq GF
....
Gloom level 60 Control Wizard
Dusk level 60 Trickster Rogue
Dawn level 60 Devoted Cleric
Eclipse level 60 Hunter Ranger
Wrath level 60 Great Weapon Fighter
Jinx level 60 Scourge Warlock
I am still toying around with repel or icy rays in the tab slot. Haven’t decided if the extra distance is better than slowing them. I think in the end that I will wind up with IR tabbed. Sill using entangle and ray of enfeeblement in other slots.
Also switched to the bloodraven skull into my usable artifact slot; this has helped.
Even with the lantern it was always a bit difficult predicting where a stealthed rogue is. I used to try and run from the rogues 100% of the time; but am finding a better balance of fight or flight as needed. The tactics fondlez outlined seem solid. It will take me awhile to learn them though.
Thank you again everyone!