Secret of the Mere of Dead Men NW-DPJY9AQRP

melinden · December 2013

The semester is finally winding down so I had a chance to finish my 3rd quest. This is another stand-alone episode although you can have one conversation to make up with Doomguide Orran if you felt he was unfair to you in the 2nd episode.

Here's the official blurb:

The Academicals have been asked to do some research for the Doomguides. Unfortunately their students don't seem to be up to the task. So they have asked you to return to help them once again. Can you learn the secret of the Mere of Dead Men and keep Valindra from collecting more allies?

************************************
Plain English: A lore-driven quest that features puzzles, an honest to goodness search (with no quest path), few required combats, many optional ones, difficulty setting, and NPC help for the final fight.

The main puzzle right at the beginning is a tough one. I've been trying to keep coming up with original things with the toolset. Let me know how you find it. There are no hints at the moment but I could add them. The last fight is more complicated than my usual fights, I'm trying to improve those. You can pick up a tank to help you out if you would like.

I think I've found all the corrections I can find at the moment so I'll need your help with the rest. As always I am happy to trade reviews and should have a block of time in the near future to get quite a few done.

It should be about the 30 minute mark depending on how many undead you feel like (re)killing.

melinden · December 2013

Based on feedback I added two clues to the first puzzle and an additional one to the search.

melinden · December 2013

I added Area waypoints to the search at low tide. The play time was getting too long and frustrating players is not what I'm after.

kellnaforian · December 2013

This was a great quest. Well thought out. So much detail right from the start. The starting map sucked me right in. Someone likes their cats!

shenwar · December 2013

I played your campaign and it was an interesting story with very well storytelling. Most maps are excelent build.

melinden · December 2013

Thank you!

rac45 · December 2013

Stuck. Picked up all the bits in the first room before I found the clues, and now the only things I can interact with are the two clues. It's something to do with the shield on the statue - but I have nothing that I 'picked up' in my inventory to interact with. Abandoning the quest and restarting didn't help - it reset to where I left it.

Edit - OK, I missed the one non-sparkly thing to pick up, and now it flows again....

melinden · December 2013

Glad it worked out! I was worried that not having items go into the inventory would confuse players but it seems downright cruel to ask someone to have 12 inventory slots available.

So was one of the interactables not sparkling? Some of them are small (the dagger) but let me know and I can replace the item interactable with a larger clicky sphere.

casmelak · January 2014

Secret of the Mere of Dead Men by @melinden
NW-DPJY9AQRP

You've been kind enough to run both of mine already.

I've played this and left a starred review and tip. I'll update with my notes in the morning once I have time to go back through them and clean them up a bit.

casmelak · January 2014

Secret of the Mere of Dead Men by @DoctorBadger
NW-DPJY9AQRP

Played, reviewed, starred, and tipped.

Overall: I very much enjoyed this quest. From the hand-crafted Academic Commons and old-town Neverwinter, to the "huge tracks of land" of the Mere. I have a couple of general notes that I'd like to share, and my detailed notes are below.

First, general notes: I could see the Mere section of the quest being a bit...tedious for people without fast mounts. Like me. Cause... I'm a lowbie - and cheap. In any case, with a slow mount, or on foot (my GOD on foot...), there's a WHOLE lot of land to cover and not a whole lot going on in it. For the record, I do like the Mere setting, but the slog to the dracolich the first time, then the runes...it adds up. Also, you might clue the player in on the fact that, no, they're not going to find the missing Doomguide out in the Mere somewhere. I tried doing a grid-search, on foot, through the tractless swamp...kobayashi-maru. The only things I can think of...maybe throw a couple speed volumns around? Throw us slow-pokes a bone?

This is just kind of and odd observation, but, it seems that the only characters with lines in this production are men. I think that you might see if you could throw in a speaking part for a female NPC. Makes the Doomguides look like a bunch of good-old-boys.

You're welcome to take the notes I've included below with a grain of salt. I include these as I think someone might benefit from my observations and suggestions. If you do, great, I've served a purpose! If not, no biggie, I enjoy making them anyway.

============================

SETTING - Academic Commons

++++++++++++++++
Details
++++++++++++++++

+Very nice! Decorating for the holidays is awesome.

=Looks like a Cryptic bug with the kitchen counter. There's no collision.

-Woodstove in the kitchen is just a touch too close to the wooden support beam. Looks like it
could move a couple feet to the right and be angled a bit more parallel to the
wall.

-Recommend throwing some shelves up in the kitchen, or an empty bookshelf or
something, the East and South walls seems bare by comparison with the rest of the
building.

-Guy's room, the bookshelf looks like it's floating ~6 inches off the floor.

-The floor doesn't quite meet the south wall in the southern classroom. Looks like

a ~3-4 inch gap.

-Don't know if the 'interactable' is meant to be floating 6' up and ~15' out from

the door in the alley. AH..it's a portal...that explains things.

+Nice custom night sky! You might see if you can raise the 'star field' and
'depth-fade' up a couple dozen feet. The stars move and it looks like they're going
through the upper floors of the buildings...unless that's the desired effect, in
which case, awesome!

-I can't really speak for shorter characters as my shortest is an average height
tiefling..but I could see a dwarf or halfling having trouble with some of the

portal placements.

+Very nice job with the busted up old library. NOTE: I looked, and begged the
editor to give me busted bookshelves. And here they are, you stole them!

+Floaty rocks!

=Conan, The Librarian! "Don't you know the Dewey decimal system!?"

+I really like the puzzle (very Skyrimesque), though, I don't understand why it's backwards. Just
gonna have to accept it and move on.

-I don't know that there's much merit in leaving the first portal IN to the library
there. Seems like it could only lead to confusion. There's not much point in going
back out into the street at this point.

++++++++++++++++
Dialogue
++++++++++++++++

The Chancellor:

"So the message from Doomguide Priest Volahk didn't have a lot of information to go
on, but what we've gathered is that A Very Bad Thing is happening in the Mere of
Dead Men."

Consider:

"So... The message from Doomguide Priest Volahk didn't have a lot of information to
go on; but, what we've gathered is that 'A Very Bad Thing' is happening in the Mere
of Dead Men."

Prompt:

"Do good things happen in places called The Mere of Dead Men?"

"A lich named Iniarv 'saved' the day by flooding the battlefield and drowning both
armies in the sea. The Sea of Swords never receded completely and its been a tidal
marsh ever since. Or in an more old fashioned term, a mere.

...

Most of it is gone but there are some pieces of the building above ground. The
Doomguides think that some of the underlying chambers are intact but haven't been
able to find any."

Consider:

"A lich named Iniarv 'saved' the day by flooding the battlefield and drowning both
armies in the sea. The Sea of Swords has never completely receded, and it's been a
tidal marsh ever since. Or, to use a more old fashioned term, a mere.

...

Most of it is gone, but there are some pieces of the building above ground. The
Doomguides believe that some of the underlying chambers are still intact, but
haven't been able to find any."

Prompt:

"So you need someone to read book? Aren't you a school?"

"We actually found a great lead, an old library here in the city that was buried in
the eruption but it had magical wards which kept the material intact.

...

I am sure they concocted some harebrained lock mechanism."

Consider:

"We actually found a great lead; an old library in the city, which was buried in
the eruption, had magical wards which should have kept the materials intact.

...

I'm sure they concocted some harebrained lock mechanism."

Prompt:

"Go to the library, get the book, go to the Mere of Dead Men, got it."

"There is a way to cut across the alley behind the school to get to the old section
of the city without having to cross half of Protector's Enclave. You can get to the
alley from the back door in the northern classroom."

Consider:

"There's a way to get to the old section of the city, without having to cross half
of Protector's Enclave; cut across the alley behind the school. You can reach the
alley through the back door in the northern classroom."

Rather large looking tome

"You page through the rather large tome looking for any reference to Iniarv
specifically or just liches in general. After about fifteen minutes of tedious
reading you find what you were looking for."

Consider:

"You page through the, rather large, tome, looking for any reference to Iniarv
specifically; or just liches in general. After about fifteen minutes of tedious
reading, you find what you were looking for."

"The undead wizard kept his most jealously guarded secrets in these chambers and so
hid them well. He placed three warding stones in the mere. These stones could only
be found at the lowest tides of the year, the Spring Tides. Only when these stones
were exposed would the uninitiated be able to find the entrance."

Consider:

"The undead wizard kept his most jealously guarded secrets in these chambers, and
so hid them well. He placed three warding stones in the mere; stones which could
only be seen during the lowest of tides, the Spring Tides. Only when these stones
were exposed would the uninitiated be able to find the entrance."

Prompt:

"Read on to learn more about the Mere."

"Then in 1358 Myrkul, the god of Death, was destroyed in the Godswar. He met his
end over the Sea of Swords and with time the ashes of his remains washed into the
Mere."

Consider:

"Then in 1358 Myrkul, the god of Death, was destroyed during the Time of Troubles.
He met his end over the Sea of Swords, in a duel with the Goddess of Magic, and,
in time, some of the ashes of his remains washed into the Mere."

SETTING - Mere of Dead Men

++++++++++++++++
Details
++++++++++++++++

+I like the wall here, and the ruins surrounding.
+Good choice for backdrop and music.
+Impressive and unconventional use of a skylight!!
+(Well, sir, evidently you DID NOT pack it!)

-I think that the mere could use some touches to the east and west of the spawn point. Low fog, alone,

would help quite a bit.

-I also think that it might be good to have a portal-looking thing behind the

player when they reach the mere. The "illusion of having come from somewhere" as

I've heard said before.

-Crate and sack north of Jehan's tent are overlapping and a bit more sunken than

they probably need to be.

====I don't know if you do that on purpose somehow...but the stack of crates on the

dock change position slightly when you walk north-west/south-east past the lamp on

the west side. Purposeful, or not, it creates the illusion that there are

creaky/bent boards that move when you're walking over them. Pretty funny.

-I kind of expect to hear frogs. Nothing. No frogs. I has a sad.

==Wow, Doomguide Acolyte Marek looks like he's gotten his a%% kicked up one side

and down the other! And I think he just flirted with me!

+ VERY nice use of the dracolich skeleton. I like the repose, and the little

mushrooms around it.

=Poor restless Orc...let me help you...

=Bad Torath! No! My blood!

=Not just ANY tent...the sparkly one! I'm typecast I tell ye! That glitter thing

was just a phase!

=Seriously though, some of the zombies look in better condition than the

Doomguides!

+Nice! Ghast FTW!

=They warned me not to build a castle on a swamp, but I did it anyway!

+Like the flare effect.

==NOTE: When asked about the missing Doomguide I was given the 'white' option to
say 'I hope you're prepared to hear bad news...', but I don't know if that means
that I already found the guy and didn't notice, or it's just a random thing to say.
I don't see any other dialogue options aside from, 'I'll try' and 'bad news'

++++++++++++++++
Dialogue
++++++++++++++++

Doomguide Priest Orran

Prompt:

"Yes. But I would like to point out that a graverobber would not be likely
to come save Doomguides."

"[Missiontext]Orran looks somewhat chagrinned.[/Missiontext]"

Consider:

"[Missiontext]Orran looks, somewhat, chagrined.[/Missiontext]"

Prompt:

"Now on to the other task."

"We don't think the old mage's tower is intact, but it is likely that there is a
sizable section of it in the Mere. We think that is where the Blackguard is
hiding."

Consider: (the 'old mage' part made it unclear whether you were describing the old [mage's tower] or the tower of the [old mage]. as the owner was previously described as a lich, would be odd to refer to him as an 'old mage'...in any case, I
could logic this to death...but I don't think it needs to be there at all.)

"We don't think that the tower is still intact, but it's quite likely that there's
a sizable section of it in the Mere. We think that that is where the Blackguard is
hiding."

Prompt:

"Blackguard? That doesn't sound good. They are evil paladins aren't they?"

"For some time now there have been rumors of a Blackguard of Myrkul who has been
searching for a way to serve his dead master for centuries. Recently we had
information from the Harpers that a Blackguard had joined with Valindra. According
to them, the two struck some sort of deal in which she would help him if he got her
another dracolich."

Consider:

"There have been, for some time now, rumors of a Blackguard of Myrkul seeking a way
to serve his dead master for centuries. We recently obtained information, from the
Harpers, that a Blackguard had allied with Valindra. According to our informants,
the two came to an agreement in which she would help him, if he got her another
dracolich."

Prompt:

"Seriously? How many dracoliches does this woman need?"

"Well if you ask any sane person, zero. In this case, one less might be the best we
can do. So that means we need to prevent Valindra from getting the remains of the
dragon and we need to destroy the Blackguard."

Consider:

"Well, if you ask any sane person, zero. In this case, one fewer might be the best
we can do. So, that means we need to prevent Valindra from getting the remains of
the dragon, and we need to destroy the Blackguard."

Prompt:

"What dragon remains are you referring to?"

"Years and years ago a black dragon named Ebondeath came to the Mere to claim it as
his own. The legends say that even he couldn't stand up to the hordes of undead in
Mere. Others say the Spellplague killed him. Or maybe his own cultists killed him."

Consider: (at minimum, missing the 'the' "hordes of undead in Mere.")

"Years and years ago, a black dragon named Ebondeath came to the Mere to claim it
as his own. The legends say that even he couldn't stand up to the hordes of undead
in this place. Others say the Spellplague killed him, or maybe his own cultists."

Prompt:

"Yes I did."

"That's good news, but unfortunately we have other problems first. Doomguide Volahk
and several others were searching the ruins of the Weeping Willow Inn to see if
they could find more information about the tower there."

Consider:

"That's good news, but, unfortunately, we have other problems to deal with first.
Doomguide Volahk, and several others, were searching the ruins of the Weeping
Willow Inn to see if they could uncover more information about the tower there."

Prompt:

"Any bright ideas?"

"I was thinking if we could threaten the skeleton of the dragon then the Blackguard
would probably leave the Doomguides alone."

Consider:

"I was thinking that if we could threaten that Ebondeath's skeleton, then the
Blackguard would probably leave the Doomguides alone."

Prompt:

"I can do that."

"Thankfully it is pretty badly decayed so that should be enough."

Consider:

"Thankfully, it is pretty badly decayed. So that should be enough."

Doomguide Priest Volahk | uno

"[Nickname], I should stop wondering where you will turn up next because it seems
it just might be anywhere."

Consider:

"[Nickname], I should stop wondering where you will turn up next, because it seems
it just might be anywhere."

Doomguide Priest Volahk | boogalooo

"So Orran tells me you know how to find the underground remains of Iniarv's tower?"

Consider:

"So, Orran tells me you know how to find what's left of Iniarv's tower?"

Prompt:

"I do. The trick is to wait until the spring low tide and then the stones
that serve as the markers will be revealed. Once those stones have been uncovered
then the entrance will be unlocked."

Consider: (You can really go two ways here. The way you've already done it, and the
other way which is #You tell him what you learned from the book in the library.#)

"I do. The trick is to wait until the spring low tide, at which time, the stones
that serve as the markers will be revealed. Once those stones are uncovered, the
entrance can be unlocked."

Prompt:

"I do. The trick is to wait until the spring low tide and then the stones
that serve as the markers will be revealed. Once those stones have been uncovered
then the entrance will be unlocked."

"That's surprising, tonight just happens to be the spring low tide. What an amazing
coincidence, isn't it?"

Consider:

"That's surprising, for tonight just happens to be the spring low tide! Isn't that
an amazing coincidence?"

---

"When you go out to find these stones take this flare with you. You can light it
when you find the entrance and we'll come meet you. We'll come as quickly as we can
but you might have to go in to stop the Blackguard before we can get there.
We don't know if this Blackguard has more undead with him, but I think it would be
safe to assume he does."

Consider:

"Take this flare with you when you go searching for those stones; you can light it
at the entrance, when you find it, and we'll come to meet you. We'll make our way
there as quickly as we can, but you may well have to go after the Blackguard before
we arrive.
We don't know if this Blackguard has more undead with him, but I think that it
would be safe to assume that he does."

SETTING - Tower Ruins

++++++++++++++++
Details
++++++++++++++++

+Very, very nicely detailed. The glowing crystals and mushrooms are nice touches.

+Wooow, that's a big green, glowy skull.

+Nice crack projection on the alter...haven't gotten those things to work for me

yet.

melinden · January 2014

Thanks for the review! I'm going to raise the teleporter that gets you into the library when I take down the holiday decorations this week. As you probably well know we can't make teleporters appear or disappear. I didn't want to move it high enough to damage anyone going in but another player reported trying to go back to the commons and getting stuck in the wall (despite the fact I already have it WAY away from the wall as you noted.).

It is true that the men have most of the talking parts in this one. Neyman has a "cheesecake" factor I don't care for (fyi I am a woman) so I didn't use her. I built Sutter as a custom costume but it is true she has no speaking lines. I do like to use NPCs players have met before to tie the short stories into the main adventure. More specifically one inspiration for this adventure was that one reviewer of Return to Clock Maker's Tomb wanted to make peace with Oran so he had to have a pretty big role.

You'll find women with a considerable number of speaking lines in my other quests, this one just didn't work out that way.

I think we are in two different grammar schools regarding comma use, that's ok!

casmelak · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

Thanks for the review! I'm going to raise the teleporter that gets you into the library when I take down the holiday decorations this week. As you probably well know we can't make teleporters appear or disappear. I didn't want to move it high enough to damage anyone going in but another player reported trying to go back to the commons and getting stuck in the wall (despite the fact I already have it WAY away from the wall as you noted.).

Yeah, what I noticed was that, once you've read the book, the exit to the Mere opens below the portal back to the Commons. The positions of them were close enough that I felt it might be confusing.

melinden wrote: »

It is true that the men have most of the talking parts in this one. Neyman has a "cheesecake" factor I don't care for (fyi I am a woman) so I didn't use her. I built Sutter as a custom costume but it is true she has no speaking lines. I do like to use NPCs players have met before to tie the short stories into the main adventure. More specifically one inspiration for this adventure was that one reviewer of Return to Clock Maker's Tomb wanted to make peace with Oran so he had to have a pretty big role.

You'll find women with a considerable number of speaking lines in my other quests, this one just didn't work out that way.

Yeah, (fyi I'm a guy) I just happen to be sensitive to the balance. I try my level best to represent male and female characters with equal justice. Without the proper perspective, of course, I can't really be expected to judge how that plays out, but I try to consider those kinds of things when I'm framing out a story.

It wasn't intended as a criticism so much as an idle observation.

melinden wrote: »

I think we are in two different grammar schools regarding comma use, that's ok!

Yeah, I do take a certain amount of 'artistic license' with the use of comma's; particularly in character dialogue. Most of my suggestions were geared toward the flow or construction of the sentence, without any considerations for a particular character's pattern of speech or syntax. Again, if the suggestions conflict with your authorial vision, please feel free to disregard them.

melinden · January 2014

casmelak wrote: »

Yeah, (fyi I'm a guy) I just happen to be sensitive to the balance. I try my level best to represent male and female characters with equal justice. Without the proper perspective, of course, I can't really be expected to judge how that plays out, but I try to consider those kinds of things when I'm framing out a story.

It wasn't intended as a criticism so much as an idle observation.

Oh I didn't take it as anything more than an observation and it was ok as a critique too. If grad school didn't toughen me up to baldly stated critique then I don't think anything on this planet could. I just thought a little background into the writing process that resulted in the imbalance might interest you.

On the topic of for writing: since I use Cryptic's NPCs I do go back and re-read all their quest dialogue on the Wiki so I can try and get a sense of how they "sound". Sometimes I don't like it! For example Volahk comes off as a complete fan-boy of the player that I don't think makes a lot of sense for a middle aged commander and a priest of Kelemvor to boot. I stuck with it though, since that's "who he is" in the game.

casmelak · January 2014

melinden wrote: »

I just thought a little background into the writing process that resulted in the imbalance might interest you.

Oh, it did! I always enjoy hearing about other people's processes. Helps me improve my own. I just tend to throw in the "I'm not criticizing, just observing" since it's hard to tell, sometimes, how the written word -- over the internet, no less -- will be interpreted.

melinden wrote: »

On the topic of for writing: since I use Cryptic's NPCs I do go back and re-read all their quest dialogue on the Wiki so I can try and get a sense of how they "sound". Sometimes I don't like it! For example Volahk comes off as a complete fan-boy of the player that I don't think makes a lot of sense for a middle aged commander and a priest of Kelemvor to boot. I stuck with it though, since that's "who he is" in the game.

Oooh, I could totally see the value in that. Maintaining a consistent "voice" is definitely important. I hadn't even thought to use existing NPC's in a story. I don't think I've made it far enough IN the story to have a real handle on who the NPC's are yet.

I've only made it to the mid-thirties on my PC. Saw the Foundry and haven't been playing the actual game much.

melinden · December 2014

This is back up too. I mostly just played through to make sure nothing was broken. I may go back and add more encounters for the "hard" setting. If you have any suggestions about additions I am happy to hear them.

Previously I had removed the wall that keeps you locked into the room with the end fight. It was accidentally locking out players who died in that fight. Hopefully that didn't happen to too many people.

Secret of the Mere of Dead Men NW-DPJY9AQRP

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