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Forums > Home› Class Forums› The Library

brief overview on paragon of flame vs storm

grimahgrimah Member Posts: 1,658 Arc User
edited December 2013 in The Library
I know this is not final, since it has not been released yet but i thought i would give a heads up to wizards so they get a fair idea how the new paragon performs.

It basically comes down to, eye of the storm/storm spell for smoulder damage.

I tested out both paragons on single target and aoe, using the exact same spec (no thaum capstone) on dummies using some generic spec that did not favor one or the other without a weapon enchant.

single target loadout was: icy rays - mastery, chill strike, ray of enfeeblement, Conduit of ice/fanning the flames
Aoe: conduit of ice - mastery, shard, steal time, sudden storm/icy terrain

features: storm spell/eye of the storm, swath of destruction/critical conflag.

In both aoe and single target storm mage did around 7% more damage. This was vs dummies so does not account for sudden storm missing/singularity, etc etcs. so aoe is hard to judge.

From what i've played around with (tried thaum too) flame seems pretty solid.

The only issue you would have is triggering high vizier in single target scenarios (if you want to use the new encounter and thaum specced).


Also shadow weaver set is still bugged (we will have to wait and see on patch day).

Hope this helps
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Post edited by grimah on

Comments

  • angrymanagementangrymanagement Member Posts: 487 Arc User
    edited December 2013
    The new flame paragon has a nice daily that looked superior to Singularity. Other than that, it seems to have inferior encounters & class abilities.
  • focusmanfocusman Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2013
    On a CN run with the Flame path I did 32m dmg with just some feats token without thinking of it. The other CW was at 38m with an already proven build (thaum). I didnt had a specific order to launch encounters etc..

    What I noticed, that when mobs are packed constantly and you have a high crit chance (no eots), It made me come equal to the CW with thaum build at the boss fights. I think a good well thought build will eventually be just as good as Spellstorm, though the mobs need to packed together and not scattered (to make smolder work in combination with coi on tab and fanning the flame on high hp target).
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  • borken69borken69 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 56
    edited December 2013
    The new flame daily also has a target cap of 8, which is why it's terrible.

    The big hit for me is the loss of burst damage from EotS. What I found while testing is that fire may indeed be relatively close to lightning in terms of sustained/overall damage but the lack of reliable burst dps significantly slowed trash clearing. Also, losing EotS means that we're building more heavily for crit now, which wizards currently rank a bit lower on the list of priority stats.
  • ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    edited December 2013
    Is EotS really reliable burst damage? Granted, EotS procs pretty reliably, but you still can't "force" an EotS proc. When it procs is still random.

    If the overall DPS is the same, it wouldn't have any net effect on the speed at which you can clear trash. Damage Per Second is still Damage Per Second, regardless of how bursty it is.
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  • borken69borken69 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 56
    edited December 2013
    You're right, I forgot to detail that I meant Shard crits specifically. I hold shard until I see EotS proc so it's always a guaranteed crit, and it makes a huge damage difference between lightning and fire when you can't have shard critting reliably.
  • daemonstheredaemonsthere Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 111 Bounty Hunter
    edited December 2013
    Nevertheless if you build more Crit stat and get about ~40% crit chance the +15%crit sev and smolder on all criticall hits can make it up. You may have less reality, but on the other hand, more power.
    As a renegate build if I get a critical hit on Steal Time and manage to apply Nightmare Wizardy (another +15% crit sev) it gives me as you can see passive +30%dmg.
    From what I can tell I think that Flame is a far better option for Renegades than Thaumaturges.
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  • gildriadorgildriador Member Posts: 231 Arc User
    edited December 2013
    daemonsthere wrote: »
    Nevertheless if you build more Crit stat and get about ~40% crit chance the +15%crit sev and smolder on all criticall hits can make it up. You may have less reality, but on the other hand, more power.
    As a renegate build if I get a critical hit on Steal Time and manage to apply Nightmare Wizardy (another +15% crit sev) it gives me as you can see passive +30%dmg.
    From what I can tell I think that Flame is a far better option for Renegades than Thaumaturges.

    You can have ~40% crit chance, Critical Conflagration power and Nightmare Wizardry feat with a Thaumaturge Build too...

    It's why I think a Thaumaturge build can be effective too...
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  • daemonstheredaemonsthere Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 111 Bounty Hunter
    edited December 2013
    I am not saying it isn't, but as Renegate you are quite forced to have more Charisma and increase your Combat Advantage bonuses which add to you when Nightmare Wizardy is active (Phantasmal Destruction). As Thauma, you are less.. opportunistic, more steady and flat +x% bonuses that do not depend on the situation, because Phanstasmal is I think too deep in the tree to take it as a Thauma.
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  • gildriadorgildriador Member Posts: 231 Arc User
    edited December 2013
    daemonsthere wrote: »
    I am not saying it isn't, but as Renegate you are quite forced to have more Charisma and increase your Combat Advantage bonuses which add to you when Nightmare Wizardy is active (Phantasmal Destruction). As Thauma, you are less.. opportunistic, more steady and flat +x% bonuses that do not depend on the situation, because Phanstasmal is I think too deep in the tree to take it as a Thauma.

    You're right, Thaumaturge can't have Phantasmal Destruction, but they have other good feat that increase damage.

    I only want to say that a Thaumaturge Master of the flamme build can be effective too because a lot of Thaumaturge wizard increase int/cha and have a good critical % chance and it's good for the Class feature power Critical Conflagration.

    I tested a Thaumaturge Master of the flamme build (with high charisma and good critical % chance) on the test server and I had the same feeling as you about Critical Conflagration.

    Critical Conflagration is a Key Power for a Master of the flamme build.
    “He raised his staff. There was a roll of thunder. The sunlight was blotted out from the eastern windows; the whole hall became suddenly dark as night. The fire faded to sullen embers. Only Gandalf could be seen, standing white and tall before the blackened hearth.”
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  • freedumb4evafreedumb4eva Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 342
    edited December 2013
    I will probably try out the new path as a Thaumaturge. I will play it just as I do now but drop Storm Pillar for the new At-will.

    CoI mastery, Steal Time, Icy Terrain, SotEA, Chilling Cloud, dat new At-will.

    Same gameplay as before but with moar DoT.

    I don't think that I would bother to slot Fanning the Flames. I'm still on the fence about it.
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