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Life Steal or Regeneration ?
zekzt87
Member Posts: 25 Arc User
Hi all.
I was doing some google research but i didnt find anything about the stats mentioned above.
so - wich one would be better for a CW and what amout of the stat would be considered an efficient one ?
Or maybe LS and REG is usless for a CW ?
I was doing some google research but i didnt find anything about the stats mentioned above.
so - wich one would be better for a CW and what amout of the stat would be considered an efficient one ?
Or maybe LS and REG is usless for a CW ?
Post edited by zekzt87 on
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FOR PVP, neither since they cant save me fast enough
So far i have 3k power, 2k recovery, 1k def, 900 crit, 950 deflect, 500 regen, 500 life steal, 24k hp.
Still im a pure f2p player, all the things i got i have i got by doing dailies.
I asume to hit 1.4k regen or 1.5k life steal i would need tier 2 gear and some hardcore rings + neck and belt ?
I mean hitting it without suffering other stats [like reco, def etc]
How i could reach 1-1.5k life steal and still maintain 3k power, 1kdef, 2k reco, 1k crit ?
Would it be possible with high vizier set [4 parts of it] ? What jewelery/oh/mh etc you would recommend ?
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
It depends a lot on your playstyle though. If you already play super aggressively yet almost always lowest deaths and lowest Healing in groups, then adding to your survivability is at best reducing a couple of potions. But if the opposite is the case, then extra survivability can be a very big deal.
A little bit of extra Regen seems to go a long way most in PvP though, if you want to play just as aggressively there.
I have yet to try a Lifesteal build, but at the moment I do not see the need for either stat in PvE. Maybe if we get WoW-esque incoming burst damage in the next Module, I would reconsider.
Get the HV set + some jewelery that if possible [without sacrificing other stats] gives some aditional regen or life steal and just maintain the high power, crit, reco, def, deflect or armor penetration ?
Well thanks to all the people for opinions, it helped me alot in plannig what i try go get next.
The disadvantage of Regen is that it needs other stats stacked for it to shine. You need high Defense and High HP. If you are getting aggro from a ton of mobs, some that teleport, other that do range attacks, Regen would really help. But with lifesteal a chain rotation Of Singularity + Steal Time + Shield Pulse on 0 CD, will keep you up in the middle of 10+ mobs. When you are doing 25k-100k+ AoE damage bursts, that's a ton of HP gain through LifeSteal.
You first need to get a Cat or Ion Stone, then you will see it is not difficult to get all the stats you need.
Btw, if lifedrinker procs like lightning with every hit, than it will valuable for tanky oppressors.
"You deal an x% of weapon damage as necrotic damage with your powers, then heal yourself for that amount."
It's a bit vague but i think it should work with all spells. I'll make a test tomorrow on the preview servers if no one else has an answer.
I've only done controlled tests with Holy Avenger (and most of my testing has focused on At-Will powers), but I've spent the better part of the last two weeks playing with Lifedrinker slotted on live. So far, I've seen no reason not to assume that what holds true with Holy Avenger wouldn't hold true for Lifedrinker.
Anyway, it depends on the power. Some powers have hidden (or if you prefer, simply unintuitive) proc mechanics. For example, and like certain other chill powers, Icy Terrain appears to proc weapon enchants more often than it attacks. I'm still not 100% positive that you'll get heal credit for every Icy Terrain proc (because the game seems to consider the Terrain patch a separate entity). The damage procs work just fine, though.
But yeah, generally an AoE or a DoT should give you a proc for every tick of damage. Steal Time appears to proc weapon enchants roughly 5 times per target, so Lesser Lifedrinker would give you ~750 HP (5 * 5 * 30ish) from a single full cast of Steal Time (on 5 targets). Perfect Lifedrinker would give you ~1500 HP. Given that the Steal Time heal from Lifesteal alone is gonna top out at around 3,000 points, those Lifedrinker numbers are pretty impressive.
On the other hand, and by the same token, Lifedrinker will look fairly insignificant in comparison to Lifesteal when you use Shield Pulse. Shield Pulse is just one giant tick of damage per target.
Lifedrinker helps, certainly, though it's not gonna make or break you. It's sorta like the Lifesteal equivalent of diversifying your investment portfolio: in Lifesteal, you have a defensive reward that scales with the amount of damage you deal. In Lifedrinker, you have a (smaller) defensive reward that scales (more-or-less) with how fast you attack. Certain powers, certain situations, certain builds might favor one of those over the other.
So of the 2,478 ticks of damage my character delivered, 1,222 of them were from the Lifedrinker effect (a proc rate of 1222 / (2478 total - 210 Storm Spell - 357 Elemental Empowerment - 1222 Lifedrinker - 20 Severe Reaction) = 1.826, 182.6% of a proc per attack). Overall, Lifedrinker accounts for about 4% of my character's direct damage output. Not great, but not terrible.
Here are the healing results (again, for my character, directly):
We end up with a Health Steal total (from my ~10% Life Steal stat) of 65,610 (in 1,645 activations), and a Lifedrinker total of 27,316 HP (in 877 activations). Presumably the activations number for Lifedrinker is smaller here because I wasn't always hurt. Not sure.
In any case, Lifedrinker accounts for roughly a third of all of my lifesteal-flavored HP regen. Granted, this isn't a perfect simulation of what you'd find in an epic dungeon: the comparison will likely skew more towards the Life Steal stat when you're faced with craptons of high-HP enemies hitting for craptons of damage.
Now if we look under the "Unknown" category, we'll find all of the miscellaneous non-direct effects like Icy Terrain. First on the damage side:
As you can see, Lifedrinker accounts for a little less than half of all damage ticks -- but more than half if we disregard Storm Spell, which is itself a proc, and therefore shouldn't count for the purpose of determining our Lifedrinker proc rate. 377 Lifedrinker procs / (704 - 377 attacks) = 1.15, or a rate of about 115% of a proc per attack.
On the healing side, Icy Terrain (and Oppressive Force, which I was messing around with because of its many damage ticks) recorded the following in outgoing healing:
Anyway, we can (tentatively) conclude the following from all of that rambling observation:
Always a pleasure reading your test posts. Thanks for the above.
That's actually pretty interesting. I can see a Greater/perfect Lifedrinker being very useful.
But when I started to make runs in the dungeons (I dont like runs but its the only way to make a team on DD), I feel like lifesteal is useless, because you need more HP and def. (im currently at 1700 def and 22k HP).
I am seriously thinking on change the orb for the GG one (HP and better stats) and buy some level 7 radiant enchantments for defensive slots.
Tried regeneration and was totally a waste like deflect. I hate that the High Vizier set gives those
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Very kind
Agreed, though I think survivability tools like Lifedrinker will always play second fiddle to pure-damage tools like Plague Fire and Vorpal in the min/max conversation, because so much of the min/max conversation assumes the perfect situation (best possible team and so on). As a frequent PuG player, though, and the sort of person who prefers trying to make lemons into lemonade, I'm pretty pleased with Lifedrinker so far. Will probably make that my first Greater weapon enchant.
Life Steal's not a panacea. Nor is regen; nor is high HP or Defense. Ideally, you should have all of the above, but obviously there are only so many points in your stat budget. And even if you made the tankiest possible CW, totally gimping your offensive stats in favor of defensive ones, you'd still need potions and a decent cleric in high-end dungeons. Most of all, you'd still need to dodge a lot, which is the main reason that Lifesteal isn't as effective on a CW as it might be on, say, a Great Weapon Fighter.
I do think Lifesteal's the most efficient singular defensive stat investment you can make, though, because it gives you a defensive reward for dealing damage. It synergizes with offensive stats: the more you pump ArPen and crit and to a lesser extent Power, and to an extent even Recovery -- and the more you and your teammates debuff targets' mitigation -- the more you'll heal with Lifesteal. By contrast, Regen only synergizes with other defensive stats (HP, Defense, Deflection).
And on occasion, Lifesteal might the difference between surviving and not. It might even be the difference without your noticing.
In any case, I understand your frustration, and I think pumping HP might be a good idea. I'm in the (seemingly never-ending) process of tweaking my gear loadout for more HP myself. The key is not to give up too much in the exchange.
Your analysis (great btw) was with lesser lifedrinker? or normal? Did you try all the versions? How much % do each version in practice? (feel free to answer, I am not asking to make the work for me, just If you did it already)
If lifedrinker can replace the lifesteal slots, maybe an option to get a well rounded stats, but plague fire is so good...
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Yeah, that 33 extra weapon damage is sexy, but I'm in the same boat: buying (or simply failing to sell) a ~500k Orb that isn't unreservedly superior to the one I'm currently wielding (Orb of the Spirit Cave) gives me pause. Will probably end up with the Ancient Court Magister's Orb eventually, but it'll probably require retooling my entire gear/enchant loadout.
I used Lesser Lifedrinker in the parse above. The tooltip value is 4.4% of weapon damage, which in my case works out to about 0.044 * 712 average weapon damage (if I recall correctly) = 31.3 average proc damage. If I recall correctly, Perfect Lifedrinker is 8.8%, so double all of the numbers above.
I don't think Lifedrinker is exactly a replacement for Lifesteal, but it sure seems to be a great supplement for it, at least for Thaumaturgists.
Aaah so this is what the x% of weapon damage means. Now, that's obvious. Thanks!
Lifedrinker should be even better for oppressors with the Alacrity feat, if it makes the enchantment proc so often.
In PVE u never wanna be that low and rely your regen to get your health back, u might just die on next hit.
Lifesteal on the other hand is more useful since CW has great AOE so it multiply ur lifesteal effect.
PVP wise, I still prefer life steal, lots of dmg are burst, u would not get much time to regen health if u are being meeled or hit.
And if u are hitting from safe distance, life steal could help u boost up health safly.
But honestly both stat are quite useless in PVP since we can't really stack them to the point that it makes a difference.
I finally get the last part of vizier set and managed to loot some wards. I created lifedrinker ench, and i have to say even thou its lesser one with just 4.4% it works great.
Im sitting on 10.9k gear score atm. My current stats are 3.3k power, 1.4k def, 1.3k crit, 2.3k reco, 600 life steal, 600 regen, 950 deflect, 200 armor pen.
Im still to poor to afford augument companion, non the less im doing quite fine, my dmg output is quite fine [i even ended up 1st in dps few times on dungs, considering the fact im more tanky and crowd control oriented - its quite good i think] i almost never drop below 60% hp.
Thanks once more for all the tips and feedback guys.