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GF DPS and PvP
bkloes
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
I tend to ramble so I am going to try and keep this short. I feel that once I hit 60 GF started to suck in PvP.....I am assuming I am missing something, or just too many people are running with super enchantments? I went the conqueror pathway with my remaining 10 points picking up some defense skills. This means I have the standard DPS build (check).....I am a Str/Con Teifling for the damage bonus.....figuring it would be easier to finish people off.
So my questions....Now at L60 I feel I do very little damage? On the other hand TR and GWF cut me to pieces in seconds? What am I missing? I have full plate armor....I hit a rogue and you barely see their health drop they practically 1 hit me? I only have about 12% armor pen.....but I don't really see how to get it any higher. Gear wise I have 3/4 pieces of the Stalwart set.....need the helm. People say the Timeless is better for PvP.....but I don't see why it would explain my seemingly non existent damage ability. I was reading last night that those expensive charms (Tenes) go where my Armor Pen ones would go.....so if I had those I would have less Armor Pen.
I understand if people want to say that GF is not a damage class....TR is a damage class.....Ok, but I am a tank so why does it seem everyone cuts through my defense like butter? Even the little at will thrown daggers is something that I have to run from or die? So trying to answer questions although I am sure it sounds a bit like whining. Maybe I am missing something...Does everyone at L60 PvP already have end game enchantments? I look in AH and they are 2-5mill AD? I currently have L5's for HP and armor pen......
So my questions....Now at L60 I feel I do very little damage? On the other hand TR and GWF cut me to pieces in seconds? What am I missing? I have full plate armor....I hit a rogue and you barely see their health drop they practically 1 hit me? I only have about 12% armor pen.....but I don't really see how to get it any higher. Gear wise I have 3/4 pieces of the Stalwart set.....need the helm. People say the Timeless is better for PvP.....but I don't see why it would explain my seemingly non existent damage ability. I was reading last night that those expensive charms (Tenes) go where my Armor Pen ones would go.....so if I had those I would have less Armor Pen.
I understand if people want to say that GF is not a damage class....TR is a damage class.....Ok, but I am a tank so why does it seem everyone cuts through my defense like butter? Even the little at will thrown daggers is something that I have to run from or die? So trying to answer questions although I am sure it sounds a bit like whining. Maybe I am missing something...Does everyone at L60 PvP already have end game enchantments? I look in AH and they are 2-5mill AD? I currently have L5's for HP and armor pen......
Post edited by bkloes on
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Being a fresh 60 you will get destroyed and you need to pull your CC out and buy Zen and farm the AH. Otherwise you need to get into a guild and farm dungeons and grind out millions of AD to be competitive.
So what your saying is a few enchantments make everything else moot? I guess maybe this is why people complain about game balancing? I always hear the Paper/Rock/Scissors analogy.....but with enchantments paper beats the HAMSTER out of Scissors and everyone else? I have a CW and a GF and TR/GWF seem to 1 short both of them. I don't feel I get clobbered by GF or CW on either of my toons. It doesn't matter what type of armor or how many HP someone has.....I guess that is how "free to play works." Not whining or complaining....and I don't wanna sign a nerf petition...but it is kinda lame that daggers beats plate.
dont be surprised at TRs damage they have high arpen and with LA they can still do 2k+ damage per dagger throw
if you want to become tougher increase your deflect and add some regen
What's high priority for performing well:
1: Complete your stalwart set - will have a MASSIVE impact. Ignore the noobs that say timeless is good - I wasted mils of AD for it to try it and its utter garbage compared to stalwart. It's only purpose is for stomping completely un-equaled geared noobs that won't be able to even fight back, since yea stalwart requires you to get hit a bit to be able to kill fast.. Timeless you can just go knock down an all-greens rogue and take him out before he gets up. Though forget doing the same to any decent geared rogue - youll always lose against the best ones less your in stalwarts.
2: Tenebrous. These are really a massive portion of any serious pvp guardians dps. Even if you can only get lessers.. put them in eveyr offensive slot. A full set of greater isn't cheap, but it's at least cheaper then say a perfect vorpal.
3. rank7+ HP runes after you got the tenebrous - add a few more damage per proc, plus survivability.
4. Ancient set.
5. rests is pretty low priority. Stronger plague can add ~1-2% dps tops. Soulforged at higher levels only comes into play at the very highest levels of pvp, something atm it takes months to reach given how far the meta game has come.
-Epic Dread Vault Crushed.
Characters (Dragon): Axer (60 Guardian, Leader of Crush It!), Controller (60 Wizard), Warlocker (60 Warlock)
Sad thing is, dkcandy is right. A "few" enchantments...whether its rank 7's+ or greater tenebrus will make or break an entire build. Those expensive enchants will give you the edge you need to go from good dmg/defense to absurd dmg defense. Take Sent Gwf. With proper itemization your good. Nice suitability, ok damage, etc. Add rank 7s or better yet full tenebrus enchantments (greater), and your an unstoppable killing machine. Add a perfect vorpal and your GOD. Its sad how these espensive enchantments....mainly available to those you buy lots of zen, will make or break your character in terms of what goals your trying to achieve.
uh ranks 7s - no. In the real pvp game, its will result in barely 5% better performance in pvp vs dime a dozen rank 4s.
Tenebrous - yes - game changer.
-Epic Dread Vault Crushed.
Characters (Dragon): Axer (60 Guardian, Leader of Crush It!), Controller (60 Wizard), Warlocker (60 Warlock)
Timeless - Burst Glass Canon
If you want to run in and kill 1 maybe 2 players as a Glass Canon with huge CRTs than Timeless is your set.
If you want to fight like a GWF Sentinel and last vs. 2-3 players (given they are not CC chaining you to death) than STAL is your set.
Timeless - Burst one down and dead on the other hands of two..
Which one is more fun? you tell me..
Then went to town bouncing people around on cap points, almost outlasting Sent GWFs. It takes 3+ players to guarantee taking me down unless a pre-nerf geared TR gets a lucky Lurker's Assault that would otherwise one-shot me on my CW or DC, then it may only take two players.
In pugs, the only real danger are either overgeared Sent GWFs (rare) or CW's who are pro at using Ray of Frost + Repel (very rare) since most TR do not manage their CC-immunity well at all and I have too much HP for just perma-stealth ranged nonsense.
That said, k/d is either even or horrible with this setup, but at least you survive to make a difference.
In terms of sets, I can confirm I've had a lot more success with Stalwarts than with Timeless in pvp (neither with Tenes). The old MMO adage applies: you cannot dps if you're dead...
I only use R6 Radiants. Toughness heroic feat not only applies to your HP+CON but also to any gear you have. So, any HP on gear has a big impact, so I made sure to have it in every slot possible without sacrificing 10% Regen.
Note that is from the custom blue/purple set, not with Stalwarts.
TBH, it real easy to get bored playing your build. Your objective is to cling to your life and watch your teammate die and the last would be you..
Maybe. But imagine you are a fresh 60. What would be better? Never doing pvp at all because of being discouraged at being pwned in 5-10s every time you step onto a point (especially with certain expectations as a "tank" and from levelling pvp) or at least getting a feel for a fight and learning to support your team and Domination tactics?
At the very least it, the build supports solo backcapping, so you could be "that guy" who takes the furthest point regularly and holds it for a long while instead of relying on the too often lazy TR.
Of course, at some later point you can invest in the gear and playstyles that are a lot more refined and interesting.
Timeless is good in a team environment where you may not be the primary target, and you can burst down targets with crits without relying on getting hit first.
Do you want to be the impenetrable shield, or the tip of the spear? Stalwart's does a great job hitting back at people, but if you are being ignored and aren't getting stacks, you won't be hitting hard.
Timeless is 1.1 million AD, Stalwarts is maybe 600k (on Beholder). It depends on your playstyle, and finances, but either gearset pales in comparison to the prices of the enchants you will put in them, so I consider it almost moot.
Timeless with Ancient weapon/shield set is pretty balanced and good, and just requires a different approach and playstyle than a Stalwart's player. But each set has its limits.
Also, Stalwart's is good because it's set bonus is ridiculously overpowered and over the item budget compared to other 4 piece bonuses. That's why it has a lot of fanboys over Timeless set.