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Ok--Playstyle Build Help
everwindgale
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 76
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I have respeced twice and I am still not happy with my build and power selections. I can't seem to match my desired playstyle, powers I like to use, and the feats to make them good.
Let me give you some background, I have been playing MMOs for a long time, since early EQ days. I am a father of three, and have pretty slow reactions. I am not a good twitch game player. My younger sons often own me when I play any type of FPS game. I enjoy strategy and roleplay. That being said I am competitive and want to do well.
My first attempt was renegade path and it was ok, but I really didn't see the benefit of it. Of course many of the feats were bugged and that made it frustrating. I have read the forums and thought I would try a Thaum build. I can't seem to utilize the chill mechanic to its best ability. I find it much easier to generate arcane mastery. With 4 or 5 stacks I really see a big difference in damage, even something as simple as magic missle. I hate the chill mechanic. The slows really don't seem to slow anything down. I feel if the chill had a more pronounced effect, in actual movement or slowed down recover or cooldowns in PvP it would be great, but it just doesn't seem to work for me at level 60. (I actualy do like Ray of Frost) It builds AP quickly, procs my lighting enchant and can freeze someone.
I am a half-elf, with max int and cha. I am still not convinced running a high wisdom is not viable as one of the things I find most annoying is long cool downs. I have played enough games to know the love of high burst damage that crits provide, and in general a big hit often is better than lots of little hits over time. When it comes down to it, all of these games are about damage first, and then damage avoidance (survival) second.
My hope was to make a "lightning themed" character. I have a normal lightning enhancement in my orb, and I am working on getting a normal thunderhead in my armor. (with my limited AD ability, this may take a while).
Ok playstyle.
Spells I really like and use all the time:
EF (this seems to be bread & butter). It seems to always be on my bar in mastery or regular. (I really hate during boss fights when it becomes worthless because of immune mobs). This is by far the best CW power IMHO.
I like Steal Time a lot. Its long casting time really sucks, but it does good damage and the control effect is great!
Chill Strike, I like the power, coming up the ranks it was godly on the mastery slot, and the stun is nice. (I use it in PvP sometimes, but it seems to have limited use.)
ROE (Even nerfed I like what this power does.) I wish there was a way to see how well the debuffs work.
Repel (I find this a pretty useful spell in PvP), I love the fast cool down, it does damage, and stuns. Obviously u can't use this willy nilly) in regular dungeons, shield seems to be a better choice.
Shield ( I neither like or dislike it, but in combo with Arcane Singularity it is wonderful). Wish it didn't take so long to re-cast.
Ice Rays (I see the value in it in PvP, but I find it hard to use.) PVE, I only use it when single target strategies on certain boss fights) I hate the ability to hit two targets. I never use it that way, does anyone????? It seems like just a waste of time and makes it more difficult to use.
Spells I want to like, but it never works out.
I like Icy Terrain in some ways. Fast cast!, works great with the lightning enchant! However as a PBOE puts me in the danger zone and takes too long to build chill to be an effective control spell IMHO. Certainly works well with Steal Time, and COI (tabbed) but control powers need to be not so dependent upon using with other powers to make it even close to effective. A power should be effective on its own merits. IT just isn't IMHO. I really want to like this power.
COI--I went all the way to the top of the Thaum build to take Assailing Force. One would think ROE and COI would do a lot, but it never seems to make a difference. (DOTs in general seem to be bad damage type powers in games that burst damage is better. They are only viable IMHO if they do something like interrupt or prevent healing. The damage seems to be too low, and the mitigation does not seem to make a big difference. I think Assailing Force is likely the best current top tier feat. Tabbed COI seems to be less than optimal and the chill aspect like I said doesn't seem to work really well at level 60 dungeons.
Sudden Storm--Woot a lightning power! Was wonderful as I leveled up. Did lots of damage, easily took out the trash. Level 60, it does not seem to be effective. I like its fast recovery. The cone is too restrictive/small. Seems bugged for feats and crits. If it did a stun (even for 1 sec) it would be better. I didn't even take it on my last respec. If it was just a straight cone attack without having to aim and double click it would be more viable.
Shard--wanna like it, too clunky and too slow. Fun to bowl after EF. What I found is in the time it take s to cast, I could have cast other encounters more often. Very limited use. I suppose it is nice to place on the nodes in PVP to keep lurking TRs away, but too difficult to use, too easy to miss.
Maelstrom of Chaos---I wanna like this daily. Lighntning power woot! Using it Oppressive Force seems to be a better oh HAMSTER power, and the stun is better than the prone. If I wanna place mobs AS is better and is a lot less dangerous to use. The immunity does not seem to work (well), and again it requires me to be in danger zone. It does work well in concert with Steal Time.
Ok--
Not working
The whole chilling cloud thing. Frozen Power transfer seems to less than effective. I am thinking the alternate feat that grants range would be better than Frozen Power on the way to Elemental Empowerment, which I think is a really great feat. Too bad it does not seem to trigger for Icy Rays, or Icy Terrain. I think maintaining Arcane Mastery generates a lot more damage. I also took chilling presence which did not seem to make a difference.
I usually run storm spell and eye, but have tried evocation, but didn't even take last time because it does not effect that many spells. Do I take Arcane Presence instead, since I favor arcane spells???
Question:
What are the powers do you run to rank 3 and and what the one you only take to rank 1 just to have. It seems to me it is better if your going to take a power/ability you run it to rank 3 unless your only taking the power because you have to (e.g. the control buff power).
What are the feats I should be taking? I usulay take 5 in Bitter Cold just because it is a nice damage boost and regardless of focus i am still going to add chill. I think I want to remain a thaum build.
Apprecaite the help and sorry for long post.
I guess I wan't clear by lack of responses, based upon my stated likes and playstyle, what would your recommend for tree/feats?
I have respeced twice and I am still not happy with my build and power selections. I can't seem to match my desired playstyle, powers I like to use, and the feats to make them good.
Let me give you some background, I have been playing MMOs for a long time, since early EQ days. I am a father of three, and have pretty slow reactions. I am not a good twitch game player. My younger sons often own me when I play any type of FPS game. I enjoy strategy and roleplay. That being said I am competitive and want to do well.
My first attempt was renegade path and it was ok, but I really didn't see the benefit of it. Of course many of the feats were bugged and that made it frustrating. I have read the forums and thought I would try a Thaum build. I can't seem to utilize the chill mechanic to its best ability. I find it much easier to generate arcane mastery. With 4 or 5 stacks I really see a big difference in damage, even something as simple as magic missle. I hate the chill mechanic. The slows really don't seem to slow anything down. I feel if the chill had a more pronounced effect, in actual movement or slowed down recover or cooldowns in PvP it would be great, but it just doesn't seem to work for me at level 60. (I actualy do like Ray of Frost) It builds AP quickly, procs my lighting enchant and can freeze someone.
I am a half-elf, with max int and cha. I am still not convinced running a high wisdom is not viable as one of the things I find most annoying is long cool downs. I have played enough games to know the love of high burst damage that crits provide, and in general a big hit often is better than lots of little hits over time. When it comes down to it, all of these games are about damage first, and then damage avoidance (survival) second.
My hope was to make a "lightning themed" character. I have a normal lightning enhancement in my orb, and I am working on getting a normal thunderhead in my armor. (with my limited AD ability, this may take a while).
Ok playstyle.
Spells I really like and use all the time:
EF (this seems to be bread & butter). It seems to always be on my bar in mastery or regular. (I really hate during boss fights when it becomes worthless because of immune mobs). This is by far the best CW power IMHO.
I like Steal Time a lot. Its long casting time really sucks, but it does good damage and the control effect is great!
Chill Strike, I like the power, coming up the ranks it was godly on the mastery slot, and the stun is nice. (I use it in PvP sometimes, but it seems to have limited use.)
ROE (Even nerfed I like what this power does.) I wish there was a way to see how well the debuffs work.
Repel (I find this a pretty useful spell in PvP), I love the fast cool down, it does damage, and stuns. Obviously u can't use this willy nilly) in regular dungeons, shield seems to be a better choice.
Shield ( I neither like or dislike it, but in combo with Arcane Singularity it is wonderful). Wish it didn't take so long to re-cast.
Ice Rays (I see the value in it in PvP, but I find it hard to use.) PVE, I only use it when single target strategies on certain boss fights) I hate the ability to hit two targets. I never use it that way, does anyone????? It seems like just a waste of time and makes it more difficult to use.
Spells I want to like, but it never works out.
I like Icy Terrain in some ways. Fast cast!, works great with the lightning enchant! However as a PBOE puts me in the danger zone and takes too long to build chill to be an effective control spell IMHO. Certainly works well with Steal Time, and COI (tabbed) but control powers need to be not so dependent upon using with other powers to make it even close to effective. A power should be effective on its own merits. IT just isn't IMHO. I really want to like this power.
COI--I went all the way to the top of the Thaum build to take Assailing Force. One would think ROE and COI would do a lot, but it never seems to make a difference. (DOTs in general seem to be bad damage type powers in games that burst damage is better. They are only viable IMHO if they do something like interrupt or prevent healing. The damage seems to be too low, and the mitigation does not seem to make a big difference. I think Assailing Force is likely the best current top tier feat. Tabbed COI seems to be less than optimal and the chill aspect like I said doesn't seem to work really well at level 60 dungeons.
Sudden Storm--Woot a lightning power! Was wonderful as I leveled up. Did lots of damage, easily took out the trash. Level 60, it does not seem to be effective. I like its fast recovery. The cone is too restrictive/small. Seems bugged for feats and crits. If it did a stun (even for 1 sec) it would be better. I didn't even take it on my last respec. If it was just a straight cone attack without having to aim and double click it would be more viable.
Shard--wanna like it, too clunky and too slow. Fun to bowl after EF. What I found is in the time it take s to cast, I could have cast other encounters more often. Very limited use. I suppose it is nice to place on the nodes in PVP to keep lurking TRs away, but too difficult to use, too easy to miss.
Maelstrom of Chaos---I wanna like this daily. Lighntning power woot! Using it Oppressive Force seems to be a better oh HAMSTER power, and the stun is better than the prone. If I wanna place mobs AS is better and is a lot less dangerous to use. The immunity does not seem to work (well), and again it requires me to be in danger zone. It does work well in concert with Steal Time.
Ok--
Not working
The whole chilling cloud thing. Frozen Power transfer seems to less than effective. I am thinking the alternate feat that grants range would be better than Frozen Power on the way to Elemental Empowerment, which I think is a really great feat. Too bad it does not seem to trigger for Icy Rays, or Icy Terrain. I think maintaining Arcane Mastery generates a lot more damage. I also took chilling presence which did not seem to make a difference.
I usually run storm spell and eye, but have tried evocation, but didn't even take last time because it does not effect that many spells. Do I take Arcane Presence instead, since I favor arcane spells???
Question:
What are the powers do you run to rank 3 and and what the one you only take to rank 1 just to have. It seems to me it is better if your going to take a power/ability you run it to rank 3 unless your only taking the power because you have to (e.g. the control buff power).
What are the feats I should be taking? I usulay take 5 in Bitter Cold just because it is a nice damage boost and regardless of focus i am still going to add chill. I think I want to remain a thaum build.
Apprecaite the help and sorry for long post.
I guess I wan't clear by lack of responses, based upon my stated likes and playstyle, what would your recommend for tree/feats?
Post edited by everwindgale on
0
Comments
Also it seems like you're trying to do things without considering synergy of feats/powers. Completely forget about Arcane Stacks if you are running a chill based thauma spec. It is not even something you should look for. Every tree has a different playstyle. Maybe it is just a matter of spending more time playing until things are clicking or you develop a clear vision of what playstyle is more enjoyable to you.
One thing I can assure you and maybe save you some time, there is no viable "lightning" spec. It's just not possible.
Your statement is correct in that much of this is my perception, and no I have not run a parser. Data would be nice, but I just don't have the time. You are also correct in that I am desperately trying to develop the synergy of feats and powers, and one reason for the post is that I don't feel like I have a good synergy. What I do know after playing around for a couple of hours against the dummies in the Trades of Blades is that as a game mechanic I personally find it easier to manage arcane than chill. Arcane does not care who I target once I have it going. Chill does. If I place chill on a target and have to switch because of the tactics or conditions of a fight to another target without chill than essentialy that chill ability is wasted in that 1 or 2 stacks of chill do not seem to effect the abilities of the mob in any noticeable or meaningful way. Arcane, once you have it the damage bonus applies regardless of targets.
I think that is the nature of my post. I am not a fan of the chill mechanic. I am not a fan of chilling cloud in that the third strike of chilling cloud AOE is wasted if there is not another mob around close enough. Unless you get to 6 chill stacks, I do not see a big difference in level 60 mobs performance because I don't see a big or noticeable difference in the mobs behavior or damage output. In pvp it seems inconsequential (the debuff). I am sure the chill is doing something, but it does not seem to make much difference. In other games I have played slow abilities had noticeable effects in the mobs performance when applied. They ran slower, they don't attack as quickly. It was soft control. In Neverwinter, it seems to be less than soft control. It seems like it is more of a slow build to a temporary hard control. I am sure that is why many feel the oppressor tree is not as viable.
I agree there does not seem to be a viable lightning spec
In practical terms, since there is no dueling option it is hard to see if the debuffs are even working as intended. How do you know the elemental empowerment arcane debuffs are working?
I will suggest my own guide since I truly believe it to be the most effective (Would I bother making it otherwise?)
I explain my background etc there if you were curious.
There's no need in much thinking, if you just follow the feats/powers in there and follow the given combo, you should see amazing results appear. It is specifically designed for a competitive PvP play too. It's not complete since I am not done writing it though.
Downside: it's not lightning based.
Upside: Effective and im still working on it. The feats and powers are set in stone (something which is already most effective simply wont change). But you will see more about simple strategies to more elaborate ways to deal with your opponents. If you want to perform in pvp I can't suggest it ennough.
But here again.... I suggest you read the preface and decide for yourself. Feel free to leave a comment if you got a question, i will answer those pretty quickly.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?410051-Jawarisin-s-Analytic-on-a-Renegade-PVP-build-View-from-an-End-Game-person
Here for the build+guide
It seems like in most T2 dungeons I use 3 main spells consistently. Shield, EF (tabbed), and Steal Time. My 4th slot is the only real variable. I have been cycling between CoI, Chill Strike, and RoE. This makes chosing Snap Freeze a great idea, since you can't get away from cold spells.
In order to make gold, I need to PvP. While PvP is painful for a CW I run Icey Rays, (sometimes EF), Repel, and ROE, Chill Strike, or CoI. ( I am thinking about trying tabbed Shard against GF and GWFs). RoF is a nice chill and AP builder so it stays.
I still like the Thaum build and with this playstyle I am going to try the Transcended Mastery feat in Thaum. This is one of my debates, is to take Transcended or Nightmare Wizardy (Hybrid spec). (Since I am not worrying about chill I have no need to take Frozen Power transfer) and I can get the range increase for magic missle and chill strike. This should help a little in PvP. Elemental Empowerment is still a good choice, and with 1 point remaining I might as well take the top choice in Thaum as COI debuff is good.
My only real question is Arcane Presence worth slotting up to 3? Normaly I run Storm Spell and Eye or now once they fix things Storm Spell and Evocation for T2 Dungeons. I wish I had a few more points as I think Storm Fury would be fun in PvP, but have no idea how much damage it really does. I doubt it is worth it, but it does sound like a fun surprise.
Sure would like some feedback on any similar experiences/builds. I really wanted to like Icy Terrain COI, and chilling cloud, but it was just not working for me. The stacks of chill went way to slow, and the damage was not all that great. Chill slows are just meaningless in PvP and in game. To many immune mobs and debuffs are at least helpful to the team. With the nerf/bug fix to the frozen power transfer coming in next patch, I think the good chill damage everyone was seeing was a bit artifical from what the designers intended.