Level 46 and been using the same powers forever?

baranthus · July 2013

Hello sticky-fingered tea-leaves.

I seem to have been using the same powers for as long as I can remember. My current set-up is as follows:

At wills:

Sly Flourish
Duellist's Flurry

Encounters:

Dazing Strike
Deft Strike
Lashing Blade

Now don't get me wrong - there is nothing bad about these - I do a ton of damage! But it would be nice to change. The problem is is that when i do, I seem to be a lot less effective. Another TR told me I won't need to change again until level 60 - that lack of variety makes the class/spec seem a bit repetitive?

lichlament · July 2013

For starters, what you use all depends on your build or the build route you are taking.

If your going for a stealth build, Gloaming Cut would be the obvious choice with Cloud of Steel.

For a DPS build, Flourish / Flurry + Cloud of Steel would be the choices.

For a Versatile ( Hybrid ) Build , you could run a number of options.

Try experimenting with some stuff to keep your options open...

Some things you will need to keep in mind as you progress is how some abilities work and how you can optimize these under certain circumstances.

Things like Shadow Strike, Wicked Reminder, Bait and Switch and Impossible to Catch.

Best to learn how every ability works because at 60 you will be needing some of these for very specific fights.

I have a original build , so I usually run with Flourish + Steel during PvP and Flurry + Steel or Gloaming + Steel...depends what I am up against in PvE.

Encounters can vary wildly depending on fights.

Same with Class Features

healhamsta · July 2013

baranthus you'll want to stop using deft & dazing strike soon.

cryzocore · July 2013

Try and swap Deft Strike with Bait and Switch. then you could pop stealth run to the mobs hit BaS while stealthed ( mobs automatically aggro the decoy ) they go behind a mob and hit Lashing Blade.
Believe me, you'll like the decoy in higher levels where mobs 1 shot you.

baranthus · July 2013

Thank you for the advice guys. I should have mentioned that, yes, I've gone the DPS route with executioner. I'll definitely try Bait and Switch very soon.
Also, is there a masiive/significant difference between the DPS that each of the three specs can put out? (I'm not talking about hybrids, just the 3 individual paths). I read somewhere that one of the non-executioner paths could put out really good damage and almost stay perma-stealthed? Is that true or nonsense?

l0th4ri0 · July 2013

baranthus wrote: »

I read somewhere that one of the non-executioner paths could put out really good damage and almost stay perma-stealthed? Is that true or nonsense?

It's true, from a certain point of view.

The Saboteur with Gloaming + 5/5 sneaky stabber stays in stealth much longer than other rogues with all other factors being equal. While you do not do as much burst damage as pure Damage Per Second, you do more "Damage Per Stealth" due to the stealth lasting longer.

In a solo PVE setting where time is not the most crucial factor, all damage done during a stealth wherein the mobs cannot fight back can be considered as instant AoE burst damage, if one stops to think about what that actually means. For example, if I use 5 hits to cause 100 damage each strike during a time when the mob I am attacking is unable to move or do anything about it, that is very similar in many respects to doing 500 points of instant damage to it, and not ever turning off its aggro. The "burst damage" caused this way has as wide of an AoE as the rogue wants or can manage, and depends upon who he chooses to attack during his stealth time and where they are when he uses his stealth power.

I know its weird to think about damage like this.

EDIT: to clarify -- in a solo PVE setting, using stealth can be better described as stopping time, rather than turning invisible. This is due to the fact that the mobs will stop attacking and just stand still and get wailed on when the only target they could have been attacking removes himself from being a valid target.

baranthus · July 2013

l0th4ri0 wrote: »

It's true, from a certain point of view.

The Saboteur with Gloaming + 5/5 sneaky stabber stays in stealth much longer than other rogues with all other factors being equal. While you do not do as much burst damage as pure Damage Per Second, you do more "Damage Per Stealth" due to the stealth lasting longer.

In a solo PVE setting where time is not the most crucial factor, all damage done during a stealth wherein the mobs cannot fight back can be considered as instant AoE burst damage, if one stops to think about what that actually means. For example, if I use 5 hits to cause 100 damage each strike during a time when the mob I am attacking is unable to move or do anything about it, that is very similar in many respects to doing 500 points of instant damage to it, and not ever turning off its aggro. The "burst damage" caused this way has as wide of an AoE as the rogue wants or can manage, and depends upon who he chooses to attack during his stealth time and where they are when he uses his stealth power.

I know its weird to think about damage like this.

EDIT: to clarify -- in a solo PVE setting, using stealth can be better described as stopping time, rather than turning invisible. This is due to the fact that the mobs will stop attacking and just stand still and get wailed on when the only target they could have been attacking removes himself from being a valid target.

That sounds very interesting. I won't lie - I've been completely besotted by the TR class. Saying that, I'd like to make another and go a completely different route and Saboteur sounds perfect. Thanks for taking time to reply and explain the mechanics l0th4ri0 - MUCH appreciated!

l0th4ri0 · July 2013

baranthus -- you can see the build I'm using in Banelorne's build thread. It's not on the first page -- Bane and I concocted our soloist sab build quite a few pages back.

http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?295232-Banelorne-s-Stealth-Based-Executioner-TR-Build&p=4778192&viewfull=1#post4778192

Follow that link above and you'll see the feats laid out by Bane's post. The page before describes what the build is best at, and how I planned on starting it from level 1, etc. Further into the thread you can see some of my feedback concerning how i was doing with it. It's pretty much a specialist build designed to take on the 5-man dungeons solo. It could also have some use for PVP but it hasn't been tested yet.

healhamsta · July 2013

baranthus wrote: »

Thank you for the advice guys. I should have mentioned that, yes, I've gone the DPS route with executioner. I'll definitely try Bait and Switch very soon.
Also, is there a masiive/significant difference between the DPS that each of the three specs can put out? (I'm not talking about hybrids, just the 3 individual paths). I read somewhere that one of the non-executioner paths could put out really good damage and almost stay perma-stealthed? Is that true or nonsense?

In terms of PvE, you'll be putting out significantly less damage than a pure executioner build as that's more of a sustained DPS type of build.
In PvP, things are more about burst & survivability so not having high sustained DPS is okie.

kgrizzle22 · July 2013

baranthus wrote: »

That sounds very interesting. I won't lie - I've been completely besotted by the TR class. Saying that, I'd like to make another and go a completely different route and Saboteur sounds perfect. Thanks for taking time to reply and explain the mechanics l0th4ri0 - MUCH appreciated!

I dropped Dazing Strike a long time ago for Bait and Switch. Deft Strike is pretty sweet though, still using it at lvl 40. If you think about the time you save each time you use Deft Strike it probably adds up to a decent amount, heh

lichlament · July 2013

These guys speak from a Stealth build perspective.

I run a hybrid and in PvP I eat stealth rogues for lunch, and in PvE i double their damage.

It's all in what you want to do. Go to the preview shard and test out many different builds and find what you like and are comfortable with.

yeppers · July 2013

well with my rogue i used these all the way to 60 never replacing them. i only did about 15 PVP battles up to lvl 59 and was always in first place. That and with my rank 15 cleric i never used a Potion until 55 either. so yea Rogue only needs the Very basic skills to advance

At wills
Cloud of Steel
Sky flourish

Encounters
Dazing Strike
Deft Strike
Lashing Blade

Daily
Lurkers assault

noroblad · July 2013

you have enough points to use a variety of skills as suit the area you are in or whatever.

I like blitz. At 60 it clears the weak mobs out fast, 2 hits will do most anything weak and most foundry or soloable stuff has groups with tons of weaklings and just a few toughs.

Most of the other good stuff was mentioned... but try some of the others too. Perhaps refilling your stealth bar is nice? Or being immune to damge?
I love bloodbath, being immune to damage makes it often useful. Lurkers of course.

magsondare · July 2013

I run an executioner build and did while leveling also, and I found that at about level 40-45. . somewhere in the low 40's anyway that using stealth more often while using life-steal gear and the Ioun Stone companion made my soloing a lot nicer. At 45 you can get Shadow Strike as well, and between it, B&S, and Lurker's Assault you're pretty much invulnerable. A couple of the instances in Hotenow were a bit "interesting" but overall I was in stealth for 100% of all trash fights and about 60-ish% of the time in boss/mini-boss fights and it was a vast improvement to the Deft/Dazing/LB combo I'd been running up until then.

terrycloth · July 2013

I swapped out deft strike for impossible to catch, then eventually for blitz against most pve mobs. I sometimes use path of blades instead of lashing blade for pure aoe, but that's in dungeons against trash mobs that like to stand in giant packs (not all dungeons have these). Against bosses I'll put ITC back in sometimes. And of course duelist's flurry.

Shadow strike is decent too, but ITC is more reliable IMO. Using stealth as mostly a defense.

Dazing strike is really nice, though. I tried smoke grenade which has a better aoe but it just didn't work as well. Dazing strike is the only power that never leaves my loadout aside from Lurker's Assault.

Gloaming Cut... wow. Such a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> power. Maybe if you have all the feats it magically becomes worth it, but I was really disappointed.

fimconte · July 2013

Path of Blades is terrible, it only hits one random target in the area per pulse.
Not sure if that's bugged, but if intended, it makes PoB very bad for PVE.

Wicked Reminder should be on every TRs bar in PVE, Stacking debuff for up to +20% damage and a 3' AoE that has no target cap.

xpertzxxx · July 2013

fimconte wrote: »

Path of Blades is terrible, it only hits one random target in the area per pulse.
Not sure if that's bugged, but if intended, it makes PoB very bad for PVE.

Wicked Reminder should be on every TRs bar in PVE, Stacking debuff for up to +20% damage and a 3' AoE that has no target cap.

Agreed. Wicked Reminder is great for trash and for boss - must have for PvE~

Level 46 and been using the same powers forever?

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