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Legitimate Q: How does CW beat stealth Rogue?
morbyn
Member Posts: 11 Arc User
So I've been running into more and more of these in pvp lately.
95% of the time, assuming the rogue is played by someone even semi-competent, I can't even touch these guys. I get burned down by cloud of steel/plaguefire/tenebrous from a rogue in stealth and I'm lucky to maybe connect with a single aoe or two, which is nowhere near enough damage to down one of these guys. Even if I catch him out of stealth for a split second or two during the engagement it doesn't matter, since Rogues seem to be able to shrug off every bit of CC in the game.
I've heard all the advice from rogues in game, but it seems like it's all bull**** advice they give out just to make it seem like stealth rogues are easymode to kill (and maybe they are for other rogues?). "Listen to where the knives come from" "Move towards the rogue" "learn2play".
So... please share any advice you may have on how to properly engage these guys as a CW.
95% of the time, assuming the rogue is played by someone even semi-competent, I can't even touch these guys. I get burned down by cloud of steel/plaguefire/tenebrous from a rogue in stealth and I'm lucky to maybe connect with a single aoe or two, which is nowhere near enough damage to down one of these guys. Even if I catch him out of stealth for a split second or two during the engagement it doesn't matter, since Rogues seem to be able to shrug off every bit of CC in the game.
I've heard all the advice from rogues in game, but it seems like it's all bull**** advice they give out just to make it seem like stealth rogues are easymode to kill (and maybe they are for other rogues?). "Listen to where the knives come from" "Move towards the rogue" "learn2play".
So... please share any advice you may have on how to properly engage these guys as a CW.
Post edited by morbyn on
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If you get close to a rogue you can still spot them in stealth, if you do mass aoe damage that will kill stealth. Just use your ice knife that does more damage than Shocking Execution and cant be dodged or block, then do what ever CC and nuke you have. There is some ability ( repel is it?) that seems to throw you on the other side of the world too. I am sure that could you get out of range of of them.
I have had many competent CW's nuke my rogue.
When you're fighting a stealth rogue, have a little patience and a lot of mobility. Use your teleport and don't fire off everything at once. Ice Knife is far more dangerous than Lashing Blade or Shocking Execution (since it was nerfed).
Our main defense is stealth. Once a player breaks through that defense, it's game over.
And I do understand how frustrating it is to deal with something one cannot see. As a stealth-based rogue, fighting another stealth rogue is so tiring that I just run to another undefended point away from that specific TR. But when I'm lucky, and I have my AP bar full, I can pop a Bloodbath on that TR, which essentially homes in on my opponent, provided they are near us.
1. Encounter: Shield
Form a persistent shield that is diminished by incoming damage. Shield absorbs a large amount of damage if not diminished, and recovers if undamaged for 6 seconds.
Can be recast to pulse the shield outwards, damaging and Pushing enemies away from you, but removing the shield's protection.
Push and cooldown improved based on stacks of Arcane Mastery.
Spell Mastery: Shield absorbs an even larger amount when not diminished at all. In addition, the pulse will Push enemies further away from you.
2. Dodging the CoS to stop the bonus continue damage
3. LoS behind pillars or your allies, this will also help stop the CoS damage. If you can spot a rough direction of the rogue by looking at the daggers on you, hide behind an ally of that direction.
4. I think it's called Steal Time, which does an AoE stun. If your defending a point or capturing it, you'll know if the rogue is on it as it will have the blue/red contested symbol, you'll have a better chance of stunning them when you see it contested.
5. If the rogue is on the capture point, circle around the outer edge of the capture point facing inwards. You'll have a better chance in finding him/her.
In regards to the Encounter skill Shield, when you have it up I recommend playing very aggressive against the rogue, teleporting towards the daggers to get a glimpse of their location then use any skill that has a quick animation speed.
Just kidding, I like that you don't just do that but ask for solutions.
Apart from what has been said, my suggestion would be to wait with dodging until you don't get hit by CoS anymore and then IMMEDIATELY start dodging as far away as possible. He'll now either come out of stealth as he just failed hitting you with shadow strike or you will see his dummy from Bait and Switch. (Note: If he has those fancy enchants you won't stand a chance anyways unless you get lucky as he'll down you in the first stealth bar. This is indeed totally broken and needs a fix)
For case one, you pretty much defeated him already as you'll be out of his SS range now. CC and profit.
For case two, you need to figure out quickly if it's the dummy or himself so you don't waste any skills. Now that you know that it's indeed the dummy standing around there it's gonna be a bit tougher of course. But don't resign yet, utilize the level design so that loses direct line of sight (you know his rough location now) and is forced to close in to AoE range. This should take him a sec or two meaning chances are high that he'll get knocked out of stealth once you AoE. Another idea is repel in the direction of the dummy as soon as he pops it.
This is just a rough sketch but I think you get the idea. It's funny how you can dominate people once you manage to utilize the map design to full benefit.
2) Singularity will easily grab & be enough to screw up their stealth rotation.
3) Don't hit the bait & switch dummy. That'll only make you stronger.
4) Unlike a PvE spec TR, you'll want to get in MELEE range of a true perma steath TR. (so you can detect & hit him) A true PS TR has taken severe nerfs to melee capabilities & will hurt less than a PvE spec & will hurt a lot less while you'll hurt a lot more to him.
5) Most if not all, PS TR's don't/cannot take the ability which allow us to escape your force choke. Use it (preferably grabbing them while they're in stealth so it'll break & they cannot stealth away) & perform your 1 hit kill Ice Knife combo.
If there's 2 perma stealth TR on the other team, just leave the match. CoS from stealth is totally broken and there's no point playing against 2 of these builds unless your team also has 2 perm steatlh rogues to somewhat "counter" them (read: cap and stop them from capping by standing on the bases.
Another QQ'er who needs to L2p
I play a non perma-stealth build and it's a joke... CW's own you, GWF own you... GF own you....
All thanks to the nerf junkies... Well... have a bit of your own medicine....
Enjoy been constantly screwed by perma-stealth.... That's my best advice...
I'd really love to be able to group up with a few different builds and practice how to deal with them in a more controlled setting. In PvP matches things tend to be too chaotic to be able to work on refining your skill against a particular skillset. Oh well!
And for the record, these guys are still wrecking me even after trying to put some of the advice given here into practice =P
Why would I need to L2P when I can just play my rogue, spam cloud of steel and conquer all of Faerun?
I personally don't see how this takes any more skill than any other class/build. I would say even imo it takes less skill, since you are in stealth providing yourself a fairly large tactical advantage, as well as great survivability since the enemy cannot see you nor target you. Most players also don't have a clue how to fight against a perm stealth rogue and will just be easy pickings for the rogue.
Spam shadow strike, when shadow strike is on cooldown use bait and switch. Dodge random AoE's (nearly optional if you are using tenacious concealment).
Nope.
It's quite easy.
& even more difficult for PvE spec TRs in PvP.
One wrong step & it's over.
Stealth TRs have several utilities advantages to get away. (Stacking movespeed, longer lasting stealth bar, etc.)
Luckily most players are monkeys & stand still while attempting a Perma Stealth build. (Making it very easy for me to simply smack them upside the head with my PvE TR.)
All you do is stealth> dazing strike, then lashing blade or duelist fury and they are dead.
If they jump you, you have to run unless they are not full hp, you can dept and try to finish him.