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GF- How can "Mark" pass as a decent class feature
penpenstar
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
1. It works against itself: By marking a target you generate threat, in GFs if you have enhanced marks, the longer it stays the bigger threat you generate- especially now that threat has been slightly fixed and that we are now getting decent aggro, they will eventually hit you as you mark them, removing the mark. Can be fixed by making it into a duration-based debuff.
2. Useless: We have an at-will that applies it on an aoe. Nuff said. I only really use this when taunting mob groups from a distance (which everyone can do with just 1 ranged at will attack).
3. Not Unique: GWFs apply marks also for god's sake, how can this be a "class feature"? Every single class' class feature differentiates it far from every other class. TRs can stealth, CWs have an encounter enhancing one, GWFs have an awesome short but spam-able villain's menace WITH a defense buff/hp/inc atk speed and slight at-will damage redux. DCs have divinity.
Honestly, GFs can do away with this tab skill, they can completely remove it for all i care and change it for something more useful.
2. Useless: We have an at-will that applies it on an aoe. Nuff said. I only really use this when taunting mob groups from a distance (which everyone can do with just 1 ranged at will attack).
3. Not Unique: GWFs apply marks also for god's sake, how can this be a "class feature"? Every single class' class feature differentiates it far from every other class. TRs can stealth, CWs have an encounter enhancing one, GWFs have an awesome short but spam-able villain's menace WITH a defense buff/hp/inc atk speed and slight at-will damage redux. DCs have divinity.
Honestly, GFs can do away with this tab skill, they can completely remove it for all i care and change it for something more useful.
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To be honest I can see their intention for it but for the life of me can't find a working solution to actually implement it. I really don't want an actual taunt on demand button.
I've heard that mark is part of fighters in general in the 4th edition of Dungeons and Dragons (like mhblis1 mentioned), so that's why GWF's have this capability as well. Cryptic followed the rules to some degree in that regard, but I can see why that annoys you as far as being class-unique.
I tend to see a lot of people complaining about Mark, and I never can understand why (especially after the balance patch). I hold aggro like a boss, simply with just marks and the Enhanced Mark passive. I can Mark ranged targets once (even if they hit me eventually and remove it) and they stay on me for as long as I need. Keep in mind I built defensively, so I imagine that offensive GF's are face-rolling and maintaining threat easily.
Edit: I forgot to mention, Mark also applies a damage mitigation reduction debuff on targets, which is really nice when you AoE mark with Threatening Rush. I'm sure it helps with the DPS for downing large groups while keeping them on you at the same time. I don't remember the mitigation reduction amount, but Mark feels more useful when I think about the utilities it provides like this.
It never was a fighter exclusive feature, it was a status like slow, stun. prone. Every defender classes pre-essential (fighter included of course) are using marks. Wardens are marking, paladins are marking, swordmages are marking, Battlemind are marking and even the bards, the brutal rogues and the battle clerics have marking power in d&d 4e... It's such an unique feature... plus, it doesn't do half of what a generic mark in tabletop is doing.
I only use the Tab Mark on Large targets (talking literal size, not level/strength).
the combo of Threatening Rush and Enforced Threat is vastly superior.
That's wrong, mark doesn't provide any other benefit than increase threat. The only exception would be the tactical feat that decrease marked target damage by 10% on your allies.
I'm talking about "lowered Damage Resistance" in the description for Mark, in particular.
In case the image ever goes down:
"Mark your target. The challenged foe will have lowered Damage Resistance and you build twice as much threat when striking them.
Guarded attacks will not remove your Mark."
My bad, never saw it before. Like you mentioned, it would be nice the tooltip give us the exact amount. So it could be tested.
EDIT: Seems to work, it's noticeable. Even a mark from threatening rush or Enforced threat seems to provide this damage reduction.
Enforced Threat seems to have a weird marking mechanic, can't really explain why I think it's different. On a useless side note, I really need to drop Enforced Threat. After the patch, it feels more like threat generation training wheels, since Threatening Rush and simple Marks are magnetizing enemies to me.
Really?
So a resistance decrease provides dmg reduction?
I'm not sure what you've been testing but that doesn't sound right.
Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
just goes to show how little-used the Tab Mark is.
Well just without actually doing a clear calculations of the average i was getting, i notice roughly 10% damage increase. I tried on mobs in mount Hotenow and the dummy, it was about the same, my cleave damage went from 1000-1100 to 1200-1300 (about 120 to 150 extra dmg in average) I've been really careful to let my plaguefire buff drops between each stikes. But i wouldn't be able to calculate the damage resistance reduction exactly, since it depends really on the initial amount of damage resistance the mob has.
Edit for clarity.
EDIT: Seems to work, it's noticeable. Even a mark from threatening rush or Enforced threat seems to provide this damage resistance reduction.
Since you are obviously the only one who didn't understand the subject we are speaking about.
The problem with group marking is they tend to position to flank so it can drop off on most of them pretty quick.
Sadly mark as a mechanic in Neverwinter just doesn't seem to have a place
Also far as I know is these damage resistance debuffs stack and go below 0, unlike resistance ignored from armor peenetration and others (wich plaguefire now is I think?)
but tab mark? hell no. XD u can also only use it in pvp in flanking, but vs cw for example, bec of the crappy animation, their MM barrage would've already hit you/on the way to you when it finishes, removing the mark. Vs. melee, only useful if you're using full lockdown encounters, altho not when you mark a GF for example then he lunges on you, removing the mark. YAY. Same with TRs, mark them, they stealth, pops 1 dagger at you, bye mark.
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Gods Glory to the Heroes.
TR:Anirul Corrino@Fimconte
GF:Irulan Corrino@Fimconte
I'd say remove the animation from the Tab Mark entirely, and allow you to use it WHILE doing other things and it might be useful.
As it is, I never use it. Rush has a faster animation, does damage, and is AoE.
The Seeker - 60 DC (11.5k GS)
Faithless - 60 CW (10k GS)
but still they should make "mark" a duration debuff
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I would see a power that makes something on marked target instead of one to mark them as a tab feature.
Please rethink that in something more useful.
lol so true, i can work normally without mark, i only ever use it when taunting bosses (to lure), other than that, i'd rather just keep my tide of iron on them instead of spamming that useless class feature on my GF.
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