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The whole need/greed looting thing...
artuvas
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 30 Arc User
I read somewhere that in the future you were going to not allow a player to need something if his class cannot use the item.
However I think a simpler and better solution would be to make it so that anyone can need on anything still, but if two people hit need on an item that only one class can use, the item is automatically awarded and given priority to the person who's class it is usable by. Therefore disqualifying the need roll of the player who cannot use the item. Problem fixed.
Just because some groups might want to say, need on whatever you want...or someone might want to start a group and put together a group for something he needs on let's say his alt, or needs to help a friend get, or needs for whatever reason. It's still a viable option.
This way it's completely fair, but still the option is there for whatever individual situation arises in which someone may want to need something outside of class, because if there is a person in class who can use it, he would have priority no matter what.
Should also put the master looter option, for raiding, it's going to be needed. But also make it a vote in party so people can't abuse it.
However I think a simpler and better solution would be to make it so that anyone can need on anything still, but if two people hit need on an item that only one class can use, the item is automatically awarded and given priority to the person who's class it is usable by. Therefore disqualifying the need roll of the player who cannot use the item. Problem fixed.
Just because some groups might want to say, need on whatever you want...or someone might want to start a group and put together a group for something he needs on let's say his alt, or needs to help a friend get, or needs for whatever reason. It's still a viable option.
This way it's completely fair, but still the option is there for whatever individual situation arises in which someone may want to need something outside of class, because if there is a person in class who can use it, he would have priority no matter what.
Should also put the master looter option, for raiding, it's going to be needed. But also make it a vote in party so people can't abuse it.
Post edited by artuvas on
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Simple.
--Part 1: Spells and Coin (NW-DHM3XQVQK)
--Part 2: A Blind Eye (NW-DI3QTHZGJ)
--Part 3: Dodo's Dinner (NW-DHPA8O253)
-One Shots
--The Wizard of Eldeur (NW-DRKQNE4S7)
The only thing simple here is your mind. There's absolutely no flaw in my method. But plenty of situations in which, having options can be useful. For example let's say right now, I'm wanting to go to castle neverwinter with my GWF to get the endgame weapon, but nobody wants to take him... a bunch of people say hey sign onto your cleric and heal for us, and my cleric is already fully geared. There's no other GWF in the group. I would like to be able to need on that, rather than have someone sell it. Things aren't so black and white, you "simple" minded bleep... :P
Like I said, if class gets priority over any other need roll, there is no problem.
It stands that if you want certain items on your alternate character, then you should play that character to get those items. Changing the entire loot-roll system because you want to take the easy path is just ludicrous at best.
newbie rogue extraordinaire
If everyone hits need it turns into a random assignment. I'd much rather have a random assignment than having a greed button I always push and then get pissed at when I see everyone else press need or me feeling guilty pressing need because everyone else presses need.
Need/greed is an annoying game mechanic that has always lead to player contention. Many newer games realized this and got rid of it in favor of instanced loot (which Neverwinter already does for every other bit of loot keep in mind).
In a perfect world full of honest, caring, compassionate people the need/greed/pass system is great. In that perfect world every party member pauses to consider without any bias whether their character truly would benefit more from an item than the rest of the group and then chooses need/greed/pass accordingly. We don't live in a perfect world. We live in a world full of selfish people, honest people that realize they're among selfish people and are sick of losing out, and honest people that are sick of losing out but aren't willing to compromise on their values and are bitter because of it.
In our world need/greed/pass system only benefits selfish people, and punishes and torments honest people. Get rid of it!
It's not even an argument just a suggestion. There's no logic there either just an opinion. The loot rules as it is now, is what is being changed. And I addressed the reason as to why it was being changed. I said there was a way to satisfy the people rolling need outside of class and beating someone in class who rolls need. Rather than to change the looting system, just give classes who can use priority. There's no arguement, that's just a fact.
Your pseudo intellectual BS comment, doesn't even make any sense..."Your arguement falls apart once you start calling people names" In what world is that true? lol, I read. You're as idiotic as you sound in your other selfish, one sided view crybaby post about the nerfs...stating that the whole game is going to hell, like every other mmo...because you are trying to balance games in which lots of numbers and evidence shows it's unbalanced. I've just wasted my time typing to you, because after reading your other posts, I see you're the type of person who can't see past his own narrow minded self serving views, ie your nerf post...not gonna get into it .
No needing on red items is being implemented for pretty much exactly why you don't want it to be. Selfish people needing for alts, and friends and just to sell it.
- JailBreak (in development)
The other crappy thing is what if the a GWF weapon drops, but he already has the weapon, it prevents everyone else from getting an equal chance to sell it or use it for an alt, or any other purpose. Brute forcing is totally the wrong way to go.
use your best character for dungeons
sell the i tems you got to auction
buy items for your alt problem solved
What makes it ok, is that if there is a class that needs it, he will have priority no matter what. If nobody could use the item anyway, everyone has just as fair a chance to hit need as well. It just comes down to manners really. Guess only in a perfect world could we count on those...
Umm...This is silly and makes no sense. If you allow people of the wrong class to hit the need roll but auto give it to the person who belongs to the class its for anyways then why let them hit it at all? The greed button can be hit by everyone no matter what so greying it out for other classes does exactly what your idea is for the most part since the person who can use will get it anyway. Also, just greying it out for other classes is far less coding then making it so that the game doesnt need to check classes after the fact, it has allready done then while greying out the need button.
Edit: Also, if you need to make sure people arent ninja'ing gears in a raid(im assuming your raiding with your guild) then you should find a better guild.
I'm failing to see any way where your method (class needs supersede other needs) would work better than the method that will be introduced (i.e. only useable items can be needed).
Isn’t that how the greed button works? You hit greed (because you can’t hit need, it’s not for your class.) and if no one else needs on it then you get it or at least compete evenly with other greeders. But if someone (who is the correct class) hits need then they automatically trump all the greeders (and you).
If there is no one in the group of the correct (lets say GWF) class to need on it, everyone greeds and its an even competition.
How is that different from what you described? That system is slated to be implemented.
You’re a prophet!
This argument is exactly why they made "need" class specific. Wanting something to sell is not NEED it is GREED. And before you come at me with all that"but i NEED AD to buy things" HAMSTER let me say this. You do not NEED that AD more then the person that can actually use it that was there when it dropped NEEDS the gear. Needing something away from someone that can actually use it just cause you wanna sell it for monies is the epitimy of self entitlement.
The gorilla formerly known as Kolikos
If, as you say the class doesn't choose need, then everyone gets to roll on it with greed anyway. Thats fair. If the OP system is in place and the class doesn't need on the item, but Johnny HAMSTER does, then he wins while everyone else who choose greed gets shafted. So this proposed system just means everyone rolls need all the time. Big change...awesome solution.
- JailBreak (in development)
And according to the logic of the people who cried for this change, Johnny HAMSTER isn't actually doing anything wrong. If people playing a specific class get first dibs on items for that specific class (which is what people wanted), who cares what happens to the item if those players pass on it? If anything, the Johnny HAMSTER example just shows how dumb the whole system is, and further makes me question why people try to "fix" the system rather than replace it altogether.
The gorilla formerly known as Kolikos
Again, the only way it would be different, is if they expect to be HAMSTER over people who actually are decent individuals. Since if everyone Needs for the same reasons (selling, alt, friends, guild members), it would be the same exact results; whether OP method or the new one. No idea why people think putting forth an idea to screw over the people who aren't selfish jerks is a good idea, but history shows there'll be more threads like this one.
The gorilla formerly known as Kolikos
The gorilla formerly known as Kolikos
Im speaking of the new system with class specific need/greed and the reason for the change so my point is most definately not moot. And my "interpretation" of the system is exactly how it was designed actually. Its the community the ruined the method.
The gorilla formerly known as Kolikos
Or even better yet....team leaders start setting loot drop rules to "round robin". Omigod, a solution that's already built into the game, and doesn't need developer time or resource to fix.
Occam's Razor makes the cutting clean.
This is what my friends and I do when we play. It keeps us from having to pause constantly to look at the n/g/p pop-up and making a decision of whether we think we need it more than one of our other friends. Just randomly assign and be done with it.
When there's a natural pause point in our adventure we divvy stuff out to people we think needs it more. Much quicker, less annoying pop-ups, less headaches, more fair.