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Control Wizard PvP
xxhumorxx
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 0
Yes, it's probably yet another QQ thread about this class during PvP, or if you want to look at it that way.
I'm tired of seeing nothing but Control Wizards in PvP, one is fine, but anything more, and the team who has no time wizards literally gets sh_t rolled. Yes, they maybe have gear and all that, but I'm talking about gameplay mechanics in general. It's a little ridiculous being held up in the air for 5 seconds, only to come down, and have it re-used on you by the next Control Wizard. The cooldown on the one ability literally let's them almost spam the move so you can't move during PvP. Half of the time the skills that are supposed to negate, or release you from Control effects don't even work, for example, the skill the rogue has where he breaks free from the holds, and NEGATES control effects for a duration of time. I'm curious if this "Negate" in the description was just made up or something, because I can't wrap my head around the fact after I use it, I'm STILL able to be stunlocked.
I've nothing against the Control Wizard class in general, but usually when I hear "Crowd Control", it doesn't mean they're able to smash you into the ground and instantly kill you before you're able to even move one step. Many times this has happened already, not to me, but quite a few people who don't use Control Wizards find that this class is pretty "Over Powered" in PvP. If even the tankiest of all classes can't touch them, something is definitely wrong with the class.
The class is by no means supposed to be "Damage Dealing", so, why have you decided to give them massive power? In my personal opinion, I think some nerfing definitely needs to be done, I don't care how you do it, as long as all classes can take one single step without being instantly killed it's fine.
Personally, I think you should remove the amount of time their able to hold in PvP. It's literally like a 5 second stun, where the rouge class gets screwed over, when you using Dazing Strike, and other classes are still able to move. Not to mention trying to use the actual skill itself without someone taking a couple feet back is difficult enough as it is. Then you throw in a Control Wizard being able to teleport 10ft back, and start spamming Control Skills, plus major damage skills as well? Everytime I see a control wizard I'm literally tempted just to forfeit the match. If I have no means of getting close even while in stealth, and still being able to get CC'd, definitely something wrong.
Well, that ends this rant I suppose. Feel free to bash, and flame away if it makes you feel better. Just giving my thoughts on this.
I'm tired of seeing nothing but Control Wizards in PvP, one is fine, but anything more, and the team who has no time wizards literally gets sh_t rolled. Yes, they maybe have gear and all that, but I'm talking about gameplay mechanics in general. It's a little ridiculous being held up in the air for 5 seconds, only to come down, and have it re-used on you by the next Control Wizard. The cooldown on the one ability literally let's them almost spam the move so you can't move during PvP. Half of the time the skills that are supposed to negate, or release you from Control effects don't even work, for example, the skill the rogue has where he breaks free from the holds, and NEGATES control effects for a duration of time. I'm curious if this "Negate" in the description was just made up or something, because I can't wrap my head around the fact after I use it, I'm STILL able to be stunlocked.
I've nothing against the Control Wizard class in general, but usually when I hear "Crowd Control", it doesn't mean they're able to smash you into the ground and instantly kill you before you're able to even move one step. Many times this has happened already, not to me, but quite a few people who don't use Control Wizards find that this class is pretty "Over Powered" in PvP. If even the tankiest of all classes can't touch them, something is definitely wrong with the class.
The class is by no means supposed to be "Damage Dealing", so, why have you decided to give them massive power? In my personal opinion, I think some nerfing definitely needs to be done, I don't care how you do it, as long as all classes can take one single step without being instantly killed it's fine.
Personally, I think you should remove the amount of time their able to hold in PvP. It's literally like a 5 second stun, where the rouge class gets screwed over, when you using Dazing Strike, and other classes are still able to move. Not to mention trying to use the actual skill itself without someone taking a couple feet back is difficult enough as it is. Then you throw in a Control Wizard being able to teleport 10ft back, and start spamming Control Skills, plus major damage skills as well? Everytime I see a control wizard I'm literally tempted just to forfeit the match. If I have no means of getting close even while in stealth, and still being able to get CC'd, definitely something wrong.
Well, that ends this rant I suppose. Feel free to bash, and flame away if it makes you feel better. Just giving my thoughts on this.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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err?
I'd love some pics of people one shotting anyone on a CW lol.
Only one skill I can think of that could do it, and it's a daily, damage on that one is good.
Unless my build is bad, I could never one shot anyone, granted I'm not talking level 60 pvp with full gear, I find it odd if CW's are suddenly one shotting people as they hit 60.
Correct me if I'm wrong of course.
Also, all I see are rogues in PvP, not sure how many matches I've been in with 4 rogues on my/enemy team lol. xD
Want to know why Neverwinter is so laggy? Check out the "Latency" section in this thread.
Even with plenty of CDR and max ranked Entangling only has like a 10 second cooldown with like 2 second duration tops in pvp.
If you're getting stun locked it's because you have 3 people attacking you, that's the nature of a game with no diminishing returns.
What lvl are you playing at. People are learning that in the Sub 39 lvls rogues can do okay. But around that bracket and above, CW's are a far better class due to their ability to control other classes.
You make light about what the OP says. But there is some truth in his statements. Some of it may be exaggerated abit, but the CW control effects in PvP appear to be abit unbalanced.
I'm not going to say that CW should be nerfed. But I do beleive that Some of control the abilities/effects need to be balanced against the other classes capability to mitigate those effects.
Something else I noticed. I cant close on a CW with basic dodge. A Control Wizard can Dodge 3x before running out of stamina. A TRogue can only dodge 2x. Why is that? I've tried closing but that is almost impossible when they can dodge back one more time than I can and push me back.
And this is One-v-One. So maybe I'm doing something wrong. If so I cannot figure out what it is.
TR's Impossible to Catch skill only breaks free from some cc when you activate it. Once you activate it you are immune to all cc except daze but that's a silence, not really a hard cc.
If long range skills didn't auto lock, then pvp would be fine with a few minor tweaks on gwf damage and cleric heals, but since it isn't and crytics probably won't code the ranged skills to be skill shots, there just needs to be a hard nerf on stunlocks like 75% damage reduction when you get choked in the air or stunlocked by guardian etc. Double cleric heals need to be fixed in both pve and pvp.
Now on the other hand, if a Rogue pops you, your going to be his hump partner for 5 seconds and if you have two rogues on you then that's ten seconds. Let's be real here, just because you got *** owned by a controller does not make them over powered.
Once ranged strikers are ingame things will even out and you can complain about Rangers and Warlocks bringing you to 1% health before you even get to them (only to be dotted and kited around until dead).
-Kymos
Pretty much if you don't dodge the choke you will want to keep your eye on the wizard while you're dangling in the air. Chances are he is gonna green beam you and when you come out of choke he is going to hit you with chill strike.
This is the moment that you turn the tide on him. Chill Strike is very easy to dodge, you will see him do his little dance before the cast is done. Right at the end of his little dance dodge/block depending what class you are.
Steal time is the easiest to dodge if you are watching the CW. He throws both hands in the air and then pushes them down and out. You dont have to dodge away from him and get away from the aoe, just dodge right when the spell goes off and it will miss you.
On the other hand he might open with RoE(green beam) right after the green beams he is going to try and choke you(EF) this is the hardest spell to dodge in the game. The window you have to dodge is 1sec or a fraction of 1 sec. He raises his hand, thats the animation to watch for, keep practicing on them to get the timing right. The only issue is some times you will have some latency issues and even though your character dodges half way through your dodge you will still go up in the air. Which is just annoying lol.
It's delicate to balance for pvp with out ruining pve. They really need to just have different cooldowns/damage/durations in pvp. (CW CC durations are already lessened in pvp)But I dont see this kind of reworking happening for a good while. Most likely after the 20v20 comes out they will focus a little more on pvp balance. (again the skills change only if used on players, if used on mobs they should work just like they do now)
I have just under 2600 recovery
Choke is still a 10.2 second cooldown.
Chill Strike is 8.3 seconds
Steal Time is 14 seconds.
Those are the main hard locking CC we have. (I consider Chill Strike hard locking because im oppressor build and i can get people from chill strike to frozen before the stun wears off)
I hope this helps you out in some way. Pretty much it all hinges off of dodging/blocking that choke. If you do that you are goin to have the wizard playing very defensively and using his teleports very fast.
PVPer rocking it Solo queue style since the dawn of Neverwinter
You say it doesn't take skill to play a CW, I beg to differ. Being that 99.9% of the people in PvP are looking to kill you first as a CW makes it hard to survive. I literally have a whole team follow and focus me based on my class, they don't do that to Rogues, tanks or any other class in the game. It take more skill to play a Control Wizard and survive than it does any other class in the game (We are squishy as hell).
-Kymos
He has been unlucky enough to be hit by someone's "Ice knife". More than likely if you are being one shotted by "Ice Knife" and die with that hit you have **** gear on.
Oh and by the way, I still haven't hit 25k (Highest with crit has been 22k) on anyone with my "Ice Knife" like the Rogues have with their daily ability.
-Kymos
This is 100% true. I get chased around and focused by the entire enemy team whenever I play pvp. Sometimes I get lucky and they go for the other control wizard if there is one on my team. But yea CWs are number 1 on the must kill list in PvP. This sucks not because I care that I get focused and killed a lot, it sucks because I am always in PUGs and they never ever push forward and fight on the actual control point. I run in open with a black hole, icy terrain at the right moment so people cant dodge, then start up steal time to hit everyone as they drop out and Sudden storm all of them. After I get this off once, I get aggro from everyone on their team for the rest of the match, I become primary target and the other CW is 2nd target.
I cant tell you how many times Ive had to kite 2 or 3 people at once trying to hold control points by myself as a wizard. Its the main reason I use all AoE spells now. Now maybe I can kill one of them but reall yI am just trying to stand my ground until my team shows up and hinder the enemies in every way possible during big group combat.
It is a lot more challenging than people think. Just 1v1 with a CW can be difficult if you aren't sure how to counter them, I use the first encounter to see what spells the enemy CWs are using and pay attention to their rotation. usually they have a set rotation in mind knowing when Choke is in that rotation will help you out immensely when it comes to beating them.
PVPer rocking it Solo queue style since the dawn of Neverwinter
Same my highest crit on Ice Knife has been about 20k and I assume the person was either enfeebled and weakened or was a fresh 60 in mostly greens.
Ice Knife is one of the easiest spells to dodge. The CW does some ninja hand signals and you will hear clink clink clink then you dodge and laugh at him.
PVPer rocking it Solo queue style since the dawn of Neverwinter
If the game ever adds DR (diminishing return) for pvp and it tones down the damage of CW and TR dailies, it'd solve a whole lot of the problems with pvp.
Who is always the biggest threat on the battlefield? The guy playing the most OP class.
imo Fix Execute, Don't let astral shield stack in pvp, and remove TENE's from the **** game. YOU HEARD ME!
Two points:
1) CW's have "okay" CC ability in pvp. They have a couple spells that are good for incapacitating people for a few seconds but to say that they are over the top on control effects is asinine. I'd trade every CC ability CW's have for that obnoxious aoe smoke screen/bomb whatever it is rogues have that blocks all skill use for everyone in range for what feels like an eternity. Nevermind the rogue ability to immediately turn around and skill block again with that jump attack. Still though, if you really want to complain about CC, fight a GF. Once they have their daily up all they need is one knockdown to connect and the next time you stand up will be in the respawn area. Granted, a rogue would just pop his daily and one shot a squishy instead, but still, GF single target CC is unparalleled. No, CW CC is not the problem.
2) CW damage output...again, it's good, but rogues do just as much damage as is evidenced by their usual kill/death score in most pvp matches. The problem is the damage combined with the CC...they have just enough CC to string you up, drop a couple enfeebles on, then nuke you into oblivion, and that is where they might be due for a small nerf. Not a lot, unless the rogue is taken down with it (and cleric Astral Shield is taken down several notches as well).
CW's are a little over the top, but nowhere near as much as you claim them to be.
Hmmmm??? A TR calling another class OP in PVP??? :rolleyes:
Regards...