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As bad as the balance in WoW was sometimes...

cautionfcautionf Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 10 Arc User
edited May 2013 in General Discussion (PC)
We never saw anything as underpowered as Great Weapon Fighters in comparison to other classes.
Post edited by cautionf on

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    imivoimivo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1,682 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    In T2 instances, GWFs can compete with rogues just fine. The only issue with the GWF is that it is underpowered until level 35. And it is not half as painful as leveling a WoW priest was in vanilla, until it got Shadowform. Classes in Neverwinter at max level seem all to do well in PvE. (Something that took WoW about two years after release to achieve.)

    As for PvP, there are many, many examples for extremely bad class balance in WoW PvP, but you were probably not talking about that since I doubt anyone would make that claim. :p
    Unsure about skills and feats? Check the Master List of Class Builds!
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    cautionfcautionf Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Theres a big difference between a bad class and one that just doesn't work well in a game. The benefit a GWF brings to a group is that it can do decent aoe damage but because adds are just knocked off a cliff or kited the GWF is far past bad in that its useless 99% of the time, i've never seen that happen to a class in WoW.
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    brollypopbrollypop Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Well talking about balance changes right now is pretty much pointless. Why u ask ? Just go to the class forums and look at the enormous amount of bugged powers/feats, wrong damage calculations, armor bonuses, and multiple other glitches. Until all bugs are fixed and everything works as intended, saying something is OP or UP is irrelevant because it might be just caused by some bugs...

    Seriously this game should still be in Alpha.
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    pboar2006pboar2006 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 421 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    Someone doesnt remember when 2 hand warriors were useless, you needed to be a tank or it was a no go
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    vatashavatasha Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Remember wow is just your mom on her back
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    imivoimivo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1,682 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    In the current content, little else but damage matters, though. As a mostly CW player, I also go for damage at the moment because there is no need for anything else. GWFs really do seem perfectly fine after 35, at least as dps (not as off-tanks).

    I'm not sure when you played WoW, but throughout vanilla WoW's PvE, on the end game rading level, plenty of classes/builds were useless: feral druids, retribution paladins, elemental shamans, enhancement shamans, shadow priests, balance druids, arms and fury warriors, protection paladins, to name some. Those were useless in the sense that they were absolutely not competitive. As a priest, shaman, paladin or druid, you had to play as a healer or stay in town. There was no dual spec option at the time, gear was not usable for other specs at all, and the roles were so different that they can be pretty much considered different classes. (If the GWF could only do dungeons as a healer, you would not feel it is all right if you rolled it as a dps class.)

    I was there with my priest and my druid. I wanted to play as feral and it took two years before I could. I would say no other MMO had such bad class balance for such a long time. I had leveled as shadow priest, but was forced to heal for two years too if I wanted to see any content, and I did not get raid drops for the dps spec, either. The sets were for healing and off-set pieces were inferior.
    Unsure about skills and feats? Check the Master List of Class Builds!
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    antedeluvian75antedeluvian75 Member Posts: 32
    edited May 2013
    cautionf wrote: »
    We never saw anything as underpowered as Great Weapon Fighters in comparison to other classes.

    You didnt play WoW in the first 2 years i see.
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    enderlin50enderlin50 Member Posts: 993 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    cautionf wrote: »
    We never saw anything as underpowered as Great Weapon Fighters in comparison to other classes.

    In the interview vid main dev stated a lot of people think the GWF is underpowered(me included) but data shows they use pots on par with other classes but the class still has an "odd" feel....

    Whatever that is supposed to mean they are indeed looking into the GWF. The problem is its a "Defender" so it walks the line between dps/tank.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    emorbidemorbid Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    They're not going to balance any of the classes against eachother. The goal is to balance each class within their role in a group. GWF = offtank; considerable damage in certain situations (that, thankfully, happen often enough), and sturdy enough to take a few swipes before eating turf.

    Look at it this way; if a GWF rivalled a TR in single-target damage, while retaining beefy AC, a higher hitpoint pool and arguably better mobility, why would anyone roll a TR?
    "There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened."
    -- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
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    thegodporingthegodporing Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Class balance isn't something Cryptic are looking into at the moment. Once they start rolling out changes to classes then you can make comments but for now they're focussing on things that have a longer term effect.
    If a class is imbalanced it takes one patch and it's fixed (although a lot of time goes into it the problem will not longer if it gets done right).
    A bug that allows players to farm 500m AD in an hour will obviously be of higher priority.
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    jamezwithazjamezwithaz Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 46
    edited May 2013
    enderlin50 wrote: »
    In the interview vid main dev stated a lot of people think the GWF is underpowered(me included) but data shows they use pots on par with other classes but the class still has an "odd" feel....

    Whatever that is supposed to mean they are indeed looking into the GWF. The problem is its a "Defender" so it walks the line between dps/tank.

    I'd prefer if they enhanced the tanking aspect as you rarely see an two hand tanking archetype class :o. Right now, the problem is GWF have a jack of all trades, master of none feel. The damage feels too low to justify calling it a DPS, though they seem to get a bit better endgame, and the damage mitigation/avoidance is too low to call it a tank. It just feels like the don't do anything really well and I think that lends to their odd feel.
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    allaerraallaerra Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 838 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    jamezwithaz wrote: »
    I'd prefer if they enhanced the tanking aspect as you rarely see an two hand tanking archetype class :o. Right now, the problem is GWF have a jack of all trades, master of none feel. The damage feels too low to justify calling it a DPS, though they seem to get a bit better endgame, and the damage mitigation/avoidance is too low to call it a tank. It just feels like the don't do anything really well and I think that lends to their odd feel.
    ^^This exactly.
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    norobladnoroblad Member Posts: 556 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    antedeluvian75 wrote: »
    You didnt play WoW in the first 2 years i see.

    This. Remember the vanilla wow warlock? If you were dumb enough to wear the molten core epics, your dps was like 1/3 of a mage or something. And the few who scorned the epics for the high dps (sometimes blue) gear were ridiculed by the statlocks until people finally began to figure it out (deep into the first expansion, and over a year and a half later).
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