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Lamest PVP in any MMO I have tried
pvthudson
Member Posts: 39 Arc User
I generally hate PVP. Its a waste of time and causes all sorts of nerfs and whiners.
But this game is the worst.
Zone in. Have mismatched teams
Can stand on spawn point and autoheal all day.
enemy can heal on your spawn point
cannot kick AFK'ers
the list goes on and on. If you are going to include something at least include standard MMO conventions that every other MMO has in their games
But this game is the worst.
Zone in. Have mismatched teams
Can stand on spawn point and autoheal all day.
enemy can heal on your spawn point
cannot kick AFK'ers
the list goes on and on. If you are going to include something at least include standard MMO conventions that every other MMO has in their games
Post edited by pvthudson on
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Anyways, I'm certain the devs are aware of these issue and not all MMORPGs come out with these features, a lot of them patched them in. Heck some MMORPGs didn't even release with PvP to begin like the aforementioned Final Fantasy 11 and I'm pretty certain World of Warcraft did not release with PvP either.
wizards can spawn grief you easily. This problem has existed in billions of fps and mmos and corrected in all of them. any company that cares about their players and has even an iota of attention on their game and community rather than on their wallets would not allow this
this or mechanics like one class having stealth 2 forms of cc insane executes burst clone mechanics the list goes on. whats most annoying are the dumb dodge mechanics. spammable cc/ability immunity on low cooldowns on a class that already has too much. they need to have themselves checked in to a psych ward and their brains corrected...
the pvp in mmo is trash. no ques for premade this problem has been huge and corrected in most other mmorpgs as well. waste of time if you up against a premade with a pug
voice chat on again off again every ****ing day
give me a break this is a money laundering scheme
Quote Originally Posted by roents
It's an "open beta" that can't be wiped even in the midst of multiple economy destroying exploits. FUN
Who is we? Don't go assuming you're in the maturity. I'm guessing the majority of players of this game have never played DnD in their lives, and PvP is an extremely important aspect to having a successful MMO. You're crippling the game's success by suggesting that it shouldn't get attention from the developers. I really don't understand this attitude that just because you don't personally like something, it doesn't matter.
Name one instance where a company started to use pvp as a measure of class balance ,that did not outright ruin the game.
We honestly have plenty of pvp focused games..It is to the point now where the pve becomes the secondary method of playing..To me that has become redundant to the point where player show up to a new game expecting everything to be exactly like their last game, so everything feels "fair" on the pvp front...
Frankly I'm over it, and I hope Cryptic is also.
Quote Originally Posted by roents
It's an "open beta" that can't be wiped even in the midst of multiple economy destroying exploits. FUN
No, it's really not. On top of that, Cryptic never does PvP well. This game won't be an exception.
The big spenders are the PvE guys and the PvP guys who want an advantage. It's completely impractical to balance around PvP in a cash shop game, it would just hurt revenue.
Take a look at how Cryptic has handled the Jem'hadar bug ship in STO if you want proof. It's a clearly OP item that costs massive amounts to obtain, and it dominates the PvP scenario. How has Cryptic handled it? They've featured that thing in a sale every chance they get because they make tons of money off it.
If you're here for balanced PvP, you're absolutely kidding yourself.
This may come as a surprise, but D&D was never really good at balancing classes and Player vs Player combat. If you want a first hand experience, try DDO where the PVP is basically unranked bar fights for the lulz. D&D4.0 is apparently the most balanced version so far and even it doesn't get fully balanced when it comes to PVP since some classes are flat out better against player classes than others. Also, this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=D_Uzka-2Mz8#t=1s
Please link where this video advertises PVP as a key feature.
That being said, they chose to include PVP as part of the game, and more power to them should they ever get it right, but should they sacrifice anything for the sake of PVP that would harm the PVE community, they would have a lot more to lose.
Conclusion. Yes, it is tacked on.
If there is one thing Cryptic doesn't have a clue towards that's PvP just ask any of the hoards of PvP'ers that left Star Trek Online.
Don't get me wrong they can tell a good story PvE wise but when it comes to PvP they don't have a clue and probabally never will....
A Proud Member Of THE 300 Guild - Tene's are nothing but P2W, Nerf or Remove please!
PvP fans should look for a game that is based on the system,this ain't one of those games. =P
On a side note I've always wanted a game where people could create pvp maps. Not sure if the map editor can do that yet but it would be very nice to see.
^This exactly. I cannot for the life of me figure out why people go to gear-driven MMOs in hope for a balanced PvP environment. This holds true for subscription based games as well as B2P and F2P models that do not use 100% equalized PvP systems where gear and items that are not immediately accessible to 100% of the player base make no difference. Games where one must purchase or grind items in order to remain competitive are inherently broken in terms of balance. If items can be purchased for an advantage then the game is P2W (pay-to-win) but if items instead take countless hours of grinding/raiding it becomes a G2W (grind-to-win).
Also, people need to stop trying to make the claim of "I can win in PvP in X MMO and my gear is not the best therefore gear does not matter." This is wrong and people that believe this should feel bad (again, unless the game is indeed equalized and the gear literally makes no difference). Gear triumphs in non-equalized MMOs, and just because bad players can achieve gear does not make this any less true. Competitive gaming has to consider balance with the impression that all players will be around the same skill level. If two actual good players of even remotely similar skill levels compete using the same class and build then the character with full epic endgame gear and with Rank 9 enhancements is going to curb stomp the other player if they're sporting nothing more than full greens and Rank 3-4 enhancements.
I myself am a competitive gamer so I'm not saying I have any issue with people that would rather test their skills against another player than an AI. I merely have an issue with PvPers that think MMORPGs are a good form of competitive gaming and/or that MMORPGs should be judged on their PvP, especially if they're F2P models that flaunt a cash shop. Even if an MMO does not have a cash shop but instead has gear that you can grind for then guess what? There are still people paying to win as long as an advantage can be gained, only difference being that they do so illegally through leveling and grinding services and/or by purchasing in-game currency through illegal gold sellers. Money rules any facet of life where unfair advantages can be gained and video games where unfair advantages can be obtained are no exception. If you're a PvPer and do not like this then stay away from gear driven MMOs and maybe try some Street Fighter, Starcraft, or as much as I hate to suggest these, League of Legends or Call of Duty.
I like playing fighting games against other players. I will pretty much never play a fighting game against the CPU. I know that fighting games are made for the PvP and to bash a fighting game for its PvE content would be silly. I've extensively played games like Street Fighter, Guilty Gear, Blazblue, and Smash Bros. Melee on a highly competitive level and just because I can stomp on bads playing as Fox while I play as Mewtwo does not mean that the balance between said characters is not terribad. The fact remains that Fox can own in top level competition and that Mewtwo will never stand at that position. Now character balance in such a game may seem similar to class balance in an MMO but there are some vital differences: whether it be because their current favorite is not competitively viable or because they have just grown bored of a single character, players do not have to pay excessive amounts of money nor grind for countless hours every time they want to try a new or different character. On top of this, playing with gear differences that both players do not currently have access to is akin to playing with a handicap setting on for only one of the players.
Now I'm not saying that competing against somebody while using a handicap setting cannot be fun. I see no problem with somebody wanting to take their character that they have invested much time and/or money into and see how much said character can dominate other player's characters, nor is there a problem with enjoying the challenge of trying to defeat a fully decked out character while using an inferior gear setup. The issue I have arises when people look at such MMOs that are blatantly designed to give people that invest more time/money an advantage in power and complain that they are not perfectly balanced with what everyone else has. While handicaps may be amusing to use in friendly casual matches, nobody in their right mind is ever going to take said matches seriously in a competitive setting. Nobody would take League of Legends seriously as a competitive game if players that invest $5,000 or who have played the game over 5,000 hours always started matches with 5,000 more gold than players that have not made such investments. I have no idea why people try to pretend that such blatant handicaps (although maybe not always as exaggerated) do not exist in non-equalized MMOs.
The longer you play your character or the more money you put into your character the stronger it becomes; PvP in games designed with this idea in mind will never be balanced. These handicaps and advantages/disadvantages are not a flaw to non-equalized gear-based MMOs; these things are an inherent, intentional gameplay mechanic to such games. If these things were not intentional in most MMORPGs then they could disable or equalize gear stats and items in PvP zones or make the only usable items in PvP 100% free to all users while in PvP zones. This is not the case, making it blatantly obvious that this game is not intended as a balanced PvP environment.
This game, like nearly every MMORPG in existence, was not designed to be based around 100% balanced PvP. There are plenty of games out there to choose from that are built with balanced PvP in mind, with only a minimal selection of them being MMOs. People need to just move on and play actual PvP games and not complain that every game needs to be built around PvP simply because they only want PvP games. There is nothing wrong with posting constructive criticism on what you would like to see happen as far as PvP or other variant gameplay options are concerned, especially during a beta where developers are likely looking for community feedback, but to openly bash/insult a PvE game as a whole simply because it is not released into open beta with high quality balanced PvP is just silly. WoW went like an entire year after launch before it even had Battlegrounds, duels were so imbalanced that level 20ish naked Mages could defeat fully geared Warriors without getting touched. Dual-wielding Warriors were so bugged they could go large periods of time seeing nothing but 'Miss' above an enemies head, yet people continued playing the game for a $50 purchase fee with a $15 monthly subscription fee and eventually forgot/got over its bugs and balance issues that persisted for pretty much a whole year+. Nowadays people expect every MMO that releases, even if from smaller/lower budget developers, to have both perfected PvP and PvE from the moment it launches into beta, even if PvP or PvE is in no way the developer's intention. I've never heard anyone complain that chessboards are too PvP oriented and need more PvE content, nor that solitaire for Windows needs better PvP. I don't know why people cannot apply this mindset to online games.
Wall of text logging out.
I remember Nordock persistant worlds where u would have to separate casters and melee because casters cast bigbys and gameover
It is one thing i dont like about the way magic users are handled. They are supposed to own all ie Elminster etc but in mmos they are glass with ussually a nerfed cannon. Not saying there is an easy way to make it work but it always seems to not match the orginal intent.
This makes me wonder then why even waste resources on implementing PVP in first place? if this isn't one of those games.
Games like WoW did not launch as they are today. The argument of "Well WoW is a nearly 10 year old game" does not grant it pity - this merely tells us that WoW has had nearly 10 years of development to reach the content point that it has today. Comparing it to a game that just hit OB a little over a week ago is not really a fair comparison by any stretch, especially when comparing it to a game aspect that was not intended as the primary selling point of the game in question.
^This. It's not a flaw in the game that there are some unbalancing factors as much as it is an intended gameplay mechanic. Games with this mechanic will never have 100% truly balanced PvP. Gear and balance can never be maintained unless the PvP gear is equalized or handed out for free to all players.
Because 100% equal and balanced PvP is not the only form of PvP that there is a market for. Some people want an advantage in PvP. Some players want to invest time into a character to make it more powerful than everyone else. Some people want this unfair advantage but have more money than time so would rather play games that have an item shop as opposed to a price tag that then requires grinding to achieve what they could just buy. Offering the option to gain these advantages while providing PvP modes gives players a means to go in and test their character's strength, whereas equalized PvP allows players to enter to test their skill. A market exists for both of these PvP models so there are games that target one, the other, or both.
This game does not currently target balanced PvP, but that is not to say that they do not have the intention of doing so in the future. The introduction of PvP into the game could be more of a "We know you guys want to PvP so we're letting you know that we plan to implement it for you. This is what we have done so far." This is essentially where the PvE currently is seeing as how this is still considered beta. The problem is that people are so spoiled on games that have thrived through a decade or more of constant updates that they refuse to support any game that is not perfected at launch, which is pretty much impossible as a large playerbase is needed to test many issues that exist within the game. This is why open betas like what this game is currently in exist. Fighting games are usually designed with balanced competition in mind, but this doesn't change the fact that an inherent tier system is always going to be developed once millions of players get their hands on it.
Games take a lot of time to develop, especially when dealing with an overall player base that wants everything to be perfected immediately and do not have the patience that players once had. Saying that a game has been around for 5-10 years should not lower expectations on the amount of or balance of content provided. If anything, older games that still receive support should be held to a higher standard in terms of content and balance. Just because this is 2013 does not mean programmers should be expected to reach in a years time what took other developers 10+ years to create.
EQ1 was quite successful with only minimal PvP. I daresay it would be much easier to code a quality MMO without PvP, than to do one with it.
Let your life proceed by its own designs
Nothing to tell
Let the words be yours, I'm done with mine ...
Yeah... Isn't it annoying that we're FORCED to do PvP in an MMORPG?
If only the devs implemented a system whereby we could actually CHOOSE how we spent our time but no... PvP is mandatory for everyone.
I guess we'll just have to keep making threads like this to complain about this aspect of the game that we don't like because we're obligated to take part in it anyway.