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I'm afraid this game is gonna end up as pure P2W.
balthezore
Member Posts: 12 Arc User
So after doing some research and stuff it seems that there are some really stupid "mechanics" involved when it comes to obtaining end game items.
Get NM boxes> buy Zen> Buy key> Open box> loot bars> buy items.
So basically it comes up to how deep your wallet is... Basing end game items around Item shop is just plain stupid. It's 2013 and one would expect that publishers would realise by now. Games that are affected by item shop when it comes to end game usually fail and have really HAMSTER community. Just take a look at most of PW games. Every single one of them is pure pay to win.
So tell me, why should I or any one else play end game when only way to get keys is to pay with Zen? Or spend 300 hours to get AD just to open few boxes and pray for bars to drop... Yeah ok you want longetivity in a game. But trust me 90% of us are casual players that simply can't spend alot of time to farm AD just to open a bloody box.
My tip to you is get rid of items from cash shop that affect your end game stuff because sooner or later people will drop off... and in this case sooner.
Excuse my grammar english is not my native.
Peace.
Get NM boxes> buy Zen> Buy key> Open box> loot bars> buy items.
So basically it comes up to how deep your wallet is... Basing end game items around Item shop is just plain stupid. It's 2013 and one would expect that publishers would realise by now. Games that are affected by item shop when it comes to end game usually fail and have really HAMSTER community. Just take a look at most of PW games. Every single one of them is pure pay to win.
So tell me, why should I or any one else play end game when only way to get keys is to pay with Zen? Or spend 300 hours to get AD just to open few boxes and pray for bars to drop... Yeah ok you want longetivity in a game. But trust me 90% of us are casual players that simply can't spend alot of time to farm AD just to open a bloody box.
My tip to you is get rid of items from cash shop that affect your end game stuff because sooner or later people will drop off... and in this case sooner.
Excuse my grammar english is not my native.
Peace.
Post edited by balthezore on
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Get NM Box. Obtain Zen either through Real Money Purchase or AD Conversion. Open Box. Loot item and bars. Buy stuff with trade bars. Sell stuff for AD or keep what you bought.
The flow chart gets REALLY complex at the AD Conversion point because there's a lot of ways to get AD. So I simplified it for you.
-Rachel-
Why are you here on the forum arguing if you cant handle it then?
Either way it probably best just to type up your "I quit" thread now. Can I have your stuff nightmare boxes when u go I need some end game gear.....
Boxes are one way to get items (via bars) but you can also earn them via drops and AD.
Now Pay 2 Win usually mean that you CAN'T reach top level without spending cash OR participate end game event without spending cash (usually that is what it use to mean)
Pay 2 win can also mean you can TOP gear (end game gear) via cash. I do believe you can get the best item still via dungeon (unless I'm totally wrong on NWN. In STO, the "top" gear usually come Fleet weapons which are earn from playing and getting fleet credit.)
Please review my campaign and I'll return the favor.
Haha, what are you talking about? I can handle it fine. Right now, this game is not Pay to Win...if I make the judgement that it's becoming P2W, then I'll move on down the road to the next game. Which is what I assume most people will do, and the problem corrects itself.
If you're talking about buying items from the AH with AD, how is this any different from other mmo's.
Stop whining about a free to play game that sells things so that a company can pay for the development costs and upgrades of the game.
If you don't like it, you don't have to play it.
You can buy any end game dungeon gear in NW with cash (Zen to AD). Making it P2W in a sense, because cryptic decided to leave ALL equipment Bind on Equip.
Smoke@stonedbill - Mindflayer - 60 Rogue
First this guy has obviously never played STO. You can literally fund all your gear and even new ships without a dime spent. I spent lotsa money because I liked the game but when I've had problems with cash I've gone out and farmed the currency I needed to buy the Zen I needed to get the items I want. It's no different here. In fact it's actually better. They have a total of 4 currencies all in game, Zen is not the main one, they have the means to turn AD to zen (when more players start playing when it's official launch, the prices will go down) and they upped the amount of AD you can transmute a day to use as pay. It's not that difficult really.
I don't understand why people have to keep spouting the lie that it's Pay to Win?
Where do you HAVE to have the Tier 3 mounts? What 80% run speed isn't fast enough for you?
Where is the gear that's only available from Zen?
Where are the items for crafting you can only buy with Zen?
Why are people lying about how many ID scrolls Pots they can get? I've got tons of the lesser heal pots I can't use anymore, and I have about 80 of the level I'm using now, I've got about 40 ID scrolls on me average because of how many drop from everything including gathering nodes (the things you need kits for).
Not sure what the problem is except they simply aren't playing the game.
I came from a game that limited loot and subsequently money. Trust me this is not it. Try playing GW2 as an open world PVE only player, where you literally loot pennies everything costs gobs of gold and the only places you can get any loot is in dungeons with gimped magic find gear on that puts the whole team at risk of failing the dungeon because it's got crappy stats, oh and the best part is they are still using diminished returns on loot they started a month after launch which harms legit farmer type players who go out and get their loot from farming nodes and exploring the land. You basically have to solely run dungeons, or be a pvp player (which not all of us are) to get any loot to make ends meet or progress for your toon or buy gems (their version of Zen) and convert it to gold to actually progress. THAT's pay to win!
Yeah and that level of apathy is why the industry is on a steady decline into the crapper. Some of us want this game to do well, and part of that is not sitting silently as the game hangs itself.
The Dire Crow - Tiefling TR
Alice L'ddell - Human GF
Ludovique - Tiefling DC
Uh, it's their job to make the game, it's my job to play it. It's not apathy to move on when a product isn't working for you. That's how you signal to the makers that it isn't working...by not giving them any more money.
Agree. That is what people call "voting with your wallet" it works wonder for business
Please review my campaign and I'll return the favor.
The store won't hang the game. Some people will get pissed about it. Most will either use it sparingly and play the game or ignore it entirely and play the game.
-Rachel-
No, I've got one kind of person arguing against me.
I can't, for the life of me, understand why you took the time to announce the obvious to me. You literally decided to post a comment toward me, that was simply some kind of strange narration of what is going on, as if that's an argument.
I've got people agreeing with me too, or at least arguing the same point. So what?
What exactly is your point Rachel? That on an official game board, there is an abundance of people who lack objectivity toward the games they play, and spend their time arguing with people who do?
If the cash shop is no big deal, why are you here, instead of off being happy in the game? Why are you even wasting your time in this thread?
You want to see a game hanged by its store?
Allods.
Will this game be destroyed by its shop? Probably not, but I'm not going to shut up if I take issue with something, for your benefit.
I'm hanging out in game and having a blast as well. But I also have problems with the zen shop ,and I'm going to voice them.
The Dire Crow - Tiefling TR
Alice L'ddell - Human GF
Ludovique - Tiefling DC
Its apathy to do nothing to try and change them. There isn't anything wrong with voting with your wallet, but to just give up and accept things right off the bat, is apathy.
The Dire Crow - Tiefling TR
Alice L'ddell - Human GF
Ludovique - Tiefling DC
And I was specifically referring to the part of your post where you commented that you wouldn't "Sit Silently while the game hung itself" (Paraphrasing only slightly).
Perhaps you could stop being quite so exaggeratory and confrontational while asking others to live up to some standard of discourse you do not hold yourself to?
-Rachel-
Sure, you can put them on the auction house and buy them for AD, but the prices are through the roof. You'd need to drop about 50$ just for a Tier 2 chest piece.
Don't stress so much about something that won't mean anything at level 60.
But I'm just going to ignore it, and enjoy the story leveling to 60 without paying for stuff at my own pace. In that sense, the game is absolutely F2P, because there arent highly difficult things that prevent progress without Zen.
So it depends what youre looking for. If you want a semblance of fairness for free players at the high end, forget it. Thats absolutely P2W. If you want to just progress through the 'normal' content and avoid religiously high end PvP, you will be fine.
Speaking for myself....because the cash shop is a big deal. PwE will not operate the game without being able to generate enough revenue to pay bills plus make a profit. People like me are on the boards trying to remind people it is easy to have an entitled attitude like yours where the only thing that should ever be in a cash shop is things people do not need, but real life economics does not work that way. Sadly when people like you spout off things about lockboxes making this game p2w it does need to be rebutted so the people who do not know any better realize you can get everything you need to be viable in game without spending cash.
Yeah I have told this story a couple times but two of my workmates are very well known complainers about LB keys on the STO forums, I mean they can get downright confrontational and rude in their hate over them and PWE.
Here's the kicker, both of them spend a couple hundred dollars on Zen a month for keys...I have a very strong feeling that despite all the hair pulling that is currently going on the exact same thing will happen here.