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Trickster Stat Priority

indy20indy20 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 29 Arc User
edited August 2013 in The Thieves' Den
I know that Dex, Strength, Charisma are important for Tricksters. But what about the other stats? Deflection, Defense, Life Steal, Armor piercing, ect. The reason I ask is because I want to know because when a gear has the little recommended icon on the tool tip I think that's just based on what level the item is not how viable it is for your character. Thoughts, opinions? Share them here.
Post edited by indy20 on

Comments

  • securussecurus Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    It really depends on how you want to build the character, a character build around stealth will have completely different stat prioritys than a character build around Crits. For example If I want to build a character that does the near perma stealth I will be going after completely different skills and stats than a character that focuses on critting as much as possible.
  • arythorarythor Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 315 Bounty Hunter
    edited March 2013
    Firstly, I believe the item recommendation is, likely you said, based strictly on the item's level instead of on statistics valuable to your class. It is a decent guide as, in general, the recommendation will be better than what you have, but this is not always the case. For example, anything that increase maximum HP is nearly worthless because our HP pools are so large and the amount it gives is so small I find it unnoticeable. So, if I had a level 10 amulet that gave, say, +20 Power, and a level 11 amulet that gave +50 HP, I would stick with the first amulet.

    Secondly, Trickster Rogues are all about offense, so I would stick to statistics that focus on offense. Deflection, Defense, etc., are probably not going to help you out as much as Armor Penetration or an increased chance to crit.
  • indy20indy20 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    I take it that it is too soon to try and find any builds cookie cutter or not for the class.
  • indy20indy20 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    arythor wrote: »
    Firstly, I believe the item recommendation is, likely you said, based strictly on the item's level instead of on statistics valuable to your class. It is a decent guide as, in general, the recommendation will be better than what you have, but this is not always the case. For example, anything that increase maximum HP is nearly worthless because our HP pools are so large and the amount it gives is so small I find it unnoticeable. So, if I had a level 10 amulet that gave, say, +20 Power, and a level 11 amulet that gave +50 HP, I would stick with the first amulet.

    Secondly, Trickster Rogues are all about offense, so I would stick to statistics that focus on offense. Deflection, Defense, etc., are probably not going to help you out as much as Armor Penetration or an increased chance to crit.


    Yeah I agree.
  • securussecurus Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    indy20 wrote: »
    I take it that it is too soon to try and find any builds cookie cutter or not for the class.

    Well, so far I noticed two real build that are effective. The first is the perma stealth build and the second is the crit build.

    The perma stealth build is fairly fun and is great solo because you hardly ever take any damage and still puts out great dps, On this build I would focus a bit more on strength and power and armor penetration as you want to get your base hits up to take advantage of the bonus damage from stealth.

    The crit build needs to stack Dex and critical hit and power. Armor penetration seems to have less of an impact in that build than it did on the stealth build, mostly because you got more effect by just stacking crit and power. The other thing is you want a bit more defense as you will take more damage solo if your using the crit build compared to the steath build.

    I really never was able to make the third rogue option really compete with the other two, it just did not have the synergy of the others.
  • indy20indy20 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    securus wrote: »
    Well, so far I noticed two real build that are effective. The first is the perma stealth build and the second is the crit build.

    The perma stealth build is fairly fun and is great solo because you hardly ever take any damage and still puts out great dps, On this build I would focus a bit more on strength and power and armor penetration as you want to get your base hits up to take advantage of the bonus damage from stealth.

    The crit build needs to stack Dex and critical hit and power. Armor penetration seems to have less of an impact in that build than it did on the stealth build, mostly because you got more effect by just stacking crit and power. The other thing is you want a bit more defense as you will take more damage solo if your using the crit build compared to the steath build.

    I really never was able to make the third rogue option really compete with the other two, it just did not have the synergy of the others.

    Whats your @name in game?
  • triki911triki911 Member Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    hey guys am new here, wanted to know what does Charisma give? and with what stats did you start and what race? im not even sure what build is the crit and the stealth, could you give some more detailed info? thanks in advance.
  • epet1epet1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 4
    edited March 2013
    triki911 wrote: »
    hey guys am new here, wanted to know what does Charisma give? and with what stats did you start and what race? im not even sure what build is the crit and the stealth, could you give some more detailed info? thanks in advance.

    ya.. i also new.. and dont know.. can some one give more detail info .. dex for what .. charming and str for what.. pls help and thx
  • bruddajokkabruddajokka Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 447 Bounty Hunter
    edited March 2013
    Charisma is supposed to improve the effectiveness of your tricks. Does it?...not sure. My personal priority has always been Dex>Cha>sStr, and I want to apply that to a stealth build.
  • kinsaedakinsaeda Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Silverstars Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    Cha boosts companion stats, deflection and your combat advantage damage. CA happens when you're in stealth or attacking from behind.
  • triki911triki911 Member Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    kinsaeda wrote: »
    Cha boosts companion stats, deflection and your combat advantage damage. CA happens when you're in stealth or attacking from behind.

    so combat advantage damage works only when your behind or stealthed?
  • bruddajokkabruddajokka Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 447 Bounty Hunter
    edited March 2013
    Stun or dazed as well.
  • ethanloveethanlove Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    when in doubt
    stack crit + def
  • kellionbanekellionbane Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    Charisma only increases damage during combat advantage. Which may or not be available to you for whatever reason. Strength improves all damage. And Dexterity improves your crit chance.

    I basically stacked a lot of power and crit chance. Recovery might be worthwhile later on, but early on a 1-2% reduction to your cooldowns isn't worth it. And Armour Penetration really isn't needed when levelling.
  • kittledorfkittledorf Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 126 Bounty Hunter
    edited March 2013
    Im not sure really what to focus on either, went str and dex. Only got to lvl23 tho, but i focused mainly criticalstrike modify, after that rather even between ad and armorpen, however items got way higher ad. Anyway these modifiers shouldnt affect that much, but i did 3.2k crits and that felt kinda awsome :D.

    However dont wanna spoil much but in the seconddungon vs last boss i had a hardtime with all the aoe damage. Perhaps worth adding lifesteal or hp on some itemslots aswell.
  • papi032papi032 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    My understanding of combat advantage is if there are 2 people attacking from opposite sides. For example if a tank attacks straight from the front, and you attack from behind, then there is CA. As for stats, i haven't tested a lot, found crit/power to be most useful. Lifesteal adds very little for a ton of it used, but cripples your damage more than it adds survivability.
  • quorforgedquorforged Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    Based on what the stats actually do, if we had a point-buy system, I might actually go STR/WIS/DEX/CHA. STR seems to be the best for DPS, and WIS helps with the control effects the Rogue has. DEX doesn't look all that useful (although I don't know enough about how crits work to be sure). But as it is, we're forced to make DEX primary.
  • prunetracyprunetracy Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    papi032 wrote: »
    My understanding of combat advantage is if there are 2 people attacking from opposite sides. For example if a tank attacks straight from the front, and you attack from behind, then there is CA. As for stats, i haven't tested a lot, found crit/power to be most useful. Lifesteal adds very little for a ton of it used, but cripples your damage more than it adds survivability.

    You get combat advantage if you are behind your target, regardless if anything else is attacking from the front. If you look at the ring around your target's feet, you'll see an area that is purple. That's where you need to be to get combat advantage.

    You also get combat advantage when you are in stealth. If you look, you'll notice that all enemies have a full purple circle when you are in stealth. You also get combat advantage against enemies with certain status effects, such as daze. Just look for the purple in the rings to be sure, and I believe your damage numbers appear orange instead of yellow when you're getting the bonus damage as well.
  • thrynsystthrynsyst Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    indy20 wrote: »
    I know that Dex, Strength, Charisma are important for Tricksters. But what about the other stats? Deflection, Defense, Life Steal, Armor piercing, ect. The reason I ask is because I want to know because when a gear has the little recommended icon on the tool tip I think that's just based on what level the item is not how viable it is for your character. Thoughts, opinions? Share them here.

    That little recommended icon is a bit misleading, at present, and should not be relied on at this juncture. The only *real* apparent criteria it uses at present appears to be what the item would sell for to a vendor. Not how important such an item would be to a TR in general, nor how important the stats on the item would be for your particular build...
  • arathelyaarathelya Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    thrynsyst wrote: »
    That little recommended icon is a bit misleading, at present, and should not be relied on at this juncture. The only *real* apparent criteria it uses at present appears to be what the item would sell for to a vendor. Not how important such an item would be to a TR in general, nor how important the stats on the item would be for your particular build...

    I can confirm this. I had green belt with around 150 HP and 30 odd crit then found a blue belt that had 7 power. Even though it was clearly a downgrade it was marked as recommended so at this stage either some items are broken and not displaying their true stats or the recommended tag is broken and being applied to items based mostly, if not purely, on their rarity.
  • hopeless2hopeless2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 73
    edited March 2013
    prunetracy wrote: »
    You get combat advantage if you are behind your target, regardless if anything else is attacking from the front. If you look at the ring around your target's feet, you'll see an area that is purple. That's where you need to be to get combat advantage.

    You also get combat advantage when you are in stealth. If you look, you'll notice that all enemies have a full purple circle when you are in stealth. You also get combat advantage against enemies with certain status effects, such as daze. Just look for the purple in the rings to be sure, and I believe your damage numbers appear orange instead of yellow when you're getting the bonus damage as well.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VIMQ9kFcEs

    I made this video where you can see the purple around the enemies and different colours of damage.

    I will probably stick to DEX + CHA and stay behind the mobs OR, DO DEX/STR/CHA without a preferred stat.
  • piklenpiklen Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    So is charisma only useful if you are going for a stealth based build?
  • prunetracyprunetracy Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    The difference between CHA and STR is that CHA adds a damage bonus to combat advantage, and STR adds a damage bonus always.

    Unless the way those bonuses stack is weird, STR seems universally better for damage. Unfortunately, the other CHA bonuses don't seem to add much, so I went with STR. Maybe of CHA increased your stealth recharge rate? Or even ability recharge on CHA would make it competitive.
  • kellionbanekellionbane Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    CHA is useful when ever you can flank your enemy... So, tanky pet, tank with agro (haha), or while in stealth and they're ignoring you.
  • themangroththemangroth Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 104 Bounty Hunter
    edited March 2013
    Dex gives crit and deflection
    Str gives increased damage and stamina regen
    Cha gives pet power, combat advantage bonus, and deflection

    I rolled a half orc and my starting stats were 20, 15, 13, and I pumped up dex and str at every stat increase.

    As for stat priority, weapon damage was the highest priority, followed by power, and then crit/ArPen were equal, and recovery lastly. If I had to choose a defensive stat, go for AC first , then defense over deflection. Defense rating gives almost 4x more benefit point for point.

    I went for more of a perma stealth/combat advantage build, so action points were never lacking. In some cases, my daily would be ready long before finding a pack that I could justify using a daily on.
  • synamicsynamic Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Dex gives crit and deflection
    Str gives increased damage and stamina regen
    Cha gives pet power, combat advantage bonus, and deflection

    I rolled a half orc and my starting stats were 20, 15, 13, and I pumped up dex and str at every stat increase.

    As for stat priority, weapon damage was the highest priority, followed by power, and then crit/ArPen were equal, and recovery lastly. If I had to choose a defensive stat, go for AC first , then defense over deflection. Defense rating gives almost 4x more benefit point for point.

    I went for more of a perma stealth/combat advantage build, so action points were never lacking. In some cases, my daily would be ready long before finding a pack that I could justify using a daily on.


    i doubt Defense is better than Deflection... specially in PVP where everyone is stacking Armor Pen, so Deflection is more useful here
    the defense u have will be useless due to the Armor Pen other people have, you'll be killed instantly. Deflection will "Evade" or "Dodge" a whole attack completely, its chance based but its worth it cuz u might be able to Dodge a Power they throw at u.
    War Is Deception A Game Best Played In The Shadows
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