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I challenge the ARC developers!

I apologies in advance for this essay.

Let me start this off by telling you all a story about last night’s TO9G.

I am standing in the port in Chult. Being a 14,7K HR I already know the chance of getting in a TO9G run is slim to none. It's been several weeks since I last had a run, and seeing as the new Ultimate stones only drop from that dungeon, or lockboxes, it is the ONLY thing left to run to progress your character.

See the thing is, you ideally need a specific setup to run this dungeon. And most people prefer a composition like this: 1 OP tank, 1 ACDC cleric, 1 DODC, 1 GFDPS and 1 HDPS. Preferably a GWF or a HR. (read: vastly superior to other classes).

But after almost begging some of my friends, they agree to let me piggyback ride them for a run. So now, we have the group composition that people favor. And besides me, consists of 16k+ players, with the GF topping at 16,8K.

You stock up on potions, food, elixirs, etc. and finally, after weeks of praying to the MMO gods, you are here. The promised land of TO9G.

We get through the first bit fairly quickly and stand before the 1st boss. 5 secs after we started our DODC decides to leave, so we wipe, regroup with a DC from our alliance and down the boss next try, without any hassle.
I think the other DC faulted us for not "burning" down the boss within 20 secs, as the 17K groups his 12,5 DC normally runs with... We did fine, just took us 2 mins rather than 20 secs.

Anyway, we continue onward, and encounter our first problem at the dinosaur bridge. You can get very unlucky here, and have the RNG gods rain down wrath upon you, by giving you all of the dinosaurs able to spawn here. Which, apparently, we got... We had the whole lot, and it caused so much trouble due to them swarming us. Thus, getting combat advantage and killing us over and over. But that's okay, and we agree that this is just bad luck. We stand on top of the bridge and kills of a few from up high, thinning out the massive herd if you will.

After a few mins we arrive at the 2nd boss. We down him in the first try, even though we have to burn some scrolls of mass life. But that's also okay, because we, like most other groups, don't do the encounter as you are supposed to. We ignore the mechanics and just huddle up and burn him. We down him within 1-2 mins.

We continue towards the final boss, and oh joy here the fun begins...

We start him off, and it goes fine until suddenly 1 of our members is pushed off the platform. See, the Ras Nsi mechanic involving the hands, didn't show up on his screen. So, by the time he realized, it was too late. A known glitch that haven't been fixed since the release.
We wipe and start over.
This problem we encounter several times over the fight, but we talk over Xbox party chat, and call out quickly in case it glitches on someone’s screen.

There is also the issue with his AOE slash, where I as a HR is still in his range, even if I am standing all the way across the other side of the platform. And between the tries we had to remember to first dismiss, and then resummons our companions. Otherwise your bonding’s wouldn’t proc. on the next try.

Anyway, we have 2 members with T-rexes, who alternate between the soul waves, in order to make it a smoother run.
So, after a few tries we down him. At this time, we have used around 48 mins, including swapping clerics. So, in my view not a bad run. We also knew about THE CHEST GLITCH, so we stopped before he started talking, and I stopped even sooner than that, due to my root dot damage.

It still glitched.....

I was furious. We started over, but after the glitch he now seemed to be in a frenzy mode. Spawning waves of waves of souls upon souls back to back. This made it impossible to complete, and after 30 mins, we decided to call it quits.

I thanked them for trying, and left abruptly. My reasoning was that I was bubbling with frustration and rage in such magnitude that my entire body was shaking. At that time, had a developer stood in front of me, I don't know what I would have done.

We completed it, but got Hamster’ed in the Hamster…

ARC’s guidelines for this dungeon is 12k minimum itemlevel, and consists of 1 tank, 1 support and 3 dps.
And they say it should take around 30 mins for a run.
Nowhere does it say that you need to spend your tradebar fortune for mass scrolls of life. (Let’s be honest here, they love that we spend tradebars or AD on scrolls, rather than saving them up). That you need legendary t-rexes, to resummon companions, not dps the final boss when close to killing him, etc.

So, I challenge the developers of ARC to stream an event where you guys run TO9G. And the only requirement is to match the numbers and composition that you posted yourselves. 5 characters of around 12K itemlevel. 1 Tank, 1 support and 3 dps. Oh, and of cause, you must complete it somewhat within the 30 mins time frame that you gave us.
Should be a small task for you guys, seeing as when you lunched it, you announced that it was meant to be doable by casual players…

These glitches are extremely annoying, and a MAJOR part of the end game content. The same content that you, the developers, made us run, in order to upgrade ourselves back to where we were before the bonding nerf. (Yes, call it a fix if you want. But it is quite a coincidence that once we get our enchantments to 14, we are back to where we were before…).

The very least you could do at this point, is to figure out what causes the glitch, and give us a workaround.

Thank you for your time.

Patrick

Comments

  • heraldfayez#8520 heraldfayez Member Posts: 227 Arc User
    edited February 2018

    I apologies in advance for this essay.

    Let me start this off by telling you all a story about last night’s TO9G.

    I am standing in the port in Chult. Being a 14,7K HR I already know the chance of getting in a TO9G run is slim to none. It's been several weeks since I last had a run, and seeing as the new Ultimate stones only drop from that dungeon, or lockboxes, it is the ONLY thing left to run to progress your character.

    See the thing is, you ideally need a specific setup to run this dungeon. And most people prefer a composition like this: 1 OP tank, 1 ACDC cleric, 1 DODC, 1 GFDPS and 1 HDPS. Preferably a GWF or a HR. (read: vastly superior to other classes).

    But after almost begging some of my friends, they agree to let me piggyback ride them for a run. So now, we have the group composition that people favor. And besides me, consists of 16k+ players, with the GF topping at 16,8K.

    You stock up on potions, food, elixirs, etc. and finally, after weeks of praying to the MMO gods, you are here. The promised land of TO9G.

    We get through the first bit fairly quickly and stand before the 1st boss. 5 secs after we started our DODC decides to leave, so we wipe, regroup with a DC from our alliance and down the boss next try, without any hassle.
    I think the other DC faulted us for not "burning" down the boss within 20 secs, as the 17K groups his 12,5 DC normally runs with... We did fine, just took us 2 mins rather than 20 secs.

    Anyway, we continue onward, and encounter our first problem at the dinosaur bridge. You can get very unlucky here, and have the RNG gods rain down wrath upon you, by giving you all of the dinosaurs able to spawn here. Which, apparently, we got... We had the whole lot, and it caused so much trouble due to them swarming us. Thus, getting combat advantage and killing us over and over. But that's okay, and we agree that this is just bad luck. We stand on top of the bridge and kills of a few from up high, thinning out the massive herd if you will.

    After a few mins we arrive at the 2nd boss. We down him in the first try, even though we have to burn some scrolls of mass life. But that's also okay, because we, like most other groups, don't do the encounter as you are supposed to. We ignore the mechanics and just huddle up and burn him. We down him within 1-2 mins.

    We continue towards the final boss, and oh joy here the fun begins...

    We start him off, and it goes fine until suddenly 1 of our members is pushed off the platform. See, the Ras Nsi mechanic involving the hands, didn't show up on his screen. So, by the time he realized, it was too late. A known glitch that haven't been fixed since the release.
    We wipe and start over.
    This problem we encounter several times over the fight, but we talk over Xbox party chat, and call out quickly in case it glitches on someone’s screen.

    There is also the issue with his AOE slash, where I as a HR is still in his range, even if I am standing all the way across the other side of the platform. And between the tries we had to remember to first dismiss, and then resummons our companions. Otherwise your bonding’s wouldn’t proc. on the next try.

    Anyway, we have 2 members with T-rexes, who alternate between the soul waves, in order to make it a smoother run.
    So, after a few tries we down him. At this time, we have used around 48 mins, including swapping clerics. So, in my view not a bad run. We also knew about THE CHEST GLITCH, so we stopped before he started talking, and I stopped even sooner than that, due to my root dot damage.

    It still glitched.....

    I was furious. We started over, but after the glitch he now seemed to be in a frenzy mode. Spawning waves of waves of souls upon souls back to back. This made it impossible to complete, and after 30 mins, we decided to call it quits.

    I thanked them for trying, and left abruptly. My reasoning was that I was bubbling with frustration and rage in such magnitude that my entire body was shaking. At that time, had a developer stood in front of me, I don't know what I would have done.

    We completed it, but got Hamster’ed in the Hamster…

    ARC’s guidelines for this dungeon is 12k minimum itemlevel, and consists of 1 tank, 1 support and 3 dps.
    And they say it should take around 30 mins for a run.
    Nowhere does it say that you need to spend your tradebar fortune for mass scrolls of life. (Let’s be honest here, they love that we spend tradebars or AD on scrolls, rather than saving them up). That you need legendary t-rexes, to resummon companions, not dps the final boss when close to killing him, etc.

    So, I challenge the developers of ARC to stream an event where you guys run TO9G. And the only requirement is to match the numbers and composition that you posted yourselves. 5 characters of around 12K itemlevel. 1 Tank, 1 support and 3 dps. Oh, and of cause, you must complete it somewhat within the 30 mins time frame that you gave us.
    Should be a small task for you guys, seeing as when you lunched it, you announced that it was meant to be doable by casual players…

    These glitches are extremely annoying, and a MAJOR part of the end game content. The same content that you, the developers, made us run, in order to upgrade ourselves back to where we were before the bonding nerf. (Yes, call it a fix if you want. But it is quite a coincidence that once we get our enchantments to 14, we are back to where we were before…).

    The very least you could do at this point, is to figure out what causes the glitch, and give us a workaround.

    Thank you for your time.

    Patrick

    i read your story and understand your frustration and i agree the dungeon is not really for casuals but let me tell you this you do not need 17K or 16K or even 15K item level for this dungeon 14K is just fine and very doable with it if the party knows how to run thier class
    most of time you can carry yourself with 1 AC DC and pally tank (i might record a run with 3 people dunno)
    this is one of our daily tong runs https://prnt.sc/igx918 usually takes between 15 to 17 min tops for dung (not counting if someone dces or something happen to slow us down like bugs or sometime counting them) and the party isn't even 17k all between 12k and 14K

    so yeah while your rage and frustration and understood it's just not there and instead of waiting to get an invite how about you "Roll For initiative XD" and make a party yourself :) instead of relying on people to carry
    if you can't find a run as a DPS it jsut means you are not good enough for it as DPS yet so build up a support to farm the dungeon and evne if you are good still build a support it will make your life in the game easier :D

  • murphyvamurphyva Member Posts: 31 Arc User
    take a scourge with you while you're at it to provide major dps....
  • undepartedundeparted Member Posts: 88 Arc User
    > @kreatyve said:
    > First off, know your audience. "Arc Developers" are not the developers of the game. You are challenging the wrong company there. Arc is made by PWE, the company that publishes Neverwinter, but does nothing with the game development. That would be Cryptic. 2nd of all, there is a thread here regarding the chest issue. They can't replicate the issue in house, and can't fix the issue if they do not know what the issue is. 3rd of all, the devs do play. A lot. On all the platforms. Just because they don't wear a sign that says "I'm a dev" does not mean they don't play. You could have one in your guild right now and not even know it. They do not make themselves known on their personal accounts, nor do they have any special powers on their personal accounts. Please do your research before ranting. Thanks!



    Thank for taking your time to read my post. It became a little longer than I first intended. Guess it was something I had to get off my chest. And yes, I did rant and rage. But it doesn’t change the point I was trying to come across.

    Firstly, where do I write that they don’t play the game themselves? It’s great if they do, but it doesn’t change the fact that I don’t believe a successful run can be achieved with 5 characters of 12k item level, and only one cleric. All in 30 mins. I just don’t see it happening.

    Secondly, I apologize if I directed my anger towards the wrong party. But I still think it’s justified. I don’t believe I can edit my post and change the title so it’s directed at Cryptic.

    I don’t know why you are mentioning their personal accounts or what “powers” they have or don’t have on them. The fixes I’m asking for must obviously come from their respective function at their job at Cryptic.

    If they know the glitch exists that’s fantastic. It’s a great first step. But it doesn’t fix it. And they might say they don’t know the cause of it yet. But I’m guessing it has something to do with how many people they have assigned this issue.

    I guarantee you that had there been an issue where we always had legendary mounts if we stood in a specific location. Or if we could suddenly refine 54k diamonds on each toon per day. They would make an emergency maintenance and fix the issue immediately. If it’s something that benefits them, they act promptly. But as soon as it’s just something that’s an issue to their player base, they don’t give a flying Hamster about fixing it. And if they do it takes them forever. I mean, it’s been like this since mod12b.

    Trust me, they are going to wait, and not include a fix before mod13.
  • deldrachdeldrach Member Posts: 156 Arc User
    > @kreatyve said:
    > First off, know your audience. "Arc Developers" are not the developers of the game. You are challenging the wrong company there. Arc is made by PWE, the company that publishes Neverwinter, but does nothing with the game development. That would be Cryptic. 2nd of all, there is a thread here regarding the chest issue. They can't replicate the issue in house, and can't fix the issue if they do not know what the issue is. 3rd of all, the devs do play. A lot. On all the platforms. Just because they don't wear a sign that says "I'm a dev" does not mean they don't play. You could have one in your guild right now and not even know it. They do not make themselves known on their personal accounts, nor do they have any special powers on their personal accounts. Please do your research before ranting. Thanks!

    Wow! Can you say professional? NOT! Lol.
    So if @undeparted was ranting what do you call this rant...I mean reply?

    I agree with @heraldfayez#8520 regarding this issue. I’ve been on a number of runs with players that were 15k and less and completed Tong in a reasonable amount of time. When the group roles are filled and carried out the run typically, more times then not, is successful.

    Good luck with your future runs @undeparted.
  • kalina311kalina311 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,722 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    the devs dont need to post thier runs they need to post the play testers runs as proof ...those are the guys running stuff more often a hidden playtester team running stuff at exacly min item level in the recomended time would be fun to watch
  • jrdiiorio#8134 jrdiiorio Member Posts: 119 Arc User
    > @kreatyve said:
    > > @kreatyve said:
    >
    > > First off, know your audience. "Arc Developers" are not the developers of the game. You are challenging the wrong company there. Arc is made by PWE, the company that publishes Neverwinter, but does nothing with the game development. That would be Cryptic. 2nd of all, there is a thread here regarding the chest issue. They can't replicate the issue in house, and can't fix the issue if they do not know what the issue is. 3rd of all, the devs do play. A lot. On all the platforms. Just because they don't wear a sign that says "I'm a dev" does not mean they don't play. You could have one in your guild right now and not even know it. They do not make themselves known on their personal accounts, nor do they have any special powers on their personal accounts. Please do your research before ranting. Thanks!
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Thank for taking your time to read my post. It became a little longer than I first intended. Guess it was something I had to get off my chest. And yes, I did rant and rage. But it doesn’t change the point I was trying to come across.
    >
    >
    >
    > Firstly, where do I write that they don’t play the game themselves? It’s great if they do, but it doesn’t change the fact that I don’t believe a successful run can be achieved with 5 characters of 12k item level, and only one cleric. All in 30 mins. I just don’t see it happening.
    >
    >
    >
    > Secondly, I apologize if I directed my anger towards the wrong party. But I still think it’s justified. I don’t believe I can edit my post and change the title so it’s directed at Cryptic.
    >
    >
    >
    > I don’t know why you are mentioning their personal accounts or what “powers” they have or don’t have on them. The fixes I’m asking for must obviously come from their respective function at their job at Cryptic.
    >
    >
    >
    > If they know the glitch exists that’s fantastic. It’s a great first step. But it doesn’t fix it. And they might say they don’t know the cause of it yet. But I’m guessing it has something to do with how many people they have assigned this issue.
    >
    >
    >
    > I guarantee you that had there been an issue where we always had legendary mounts if we stood in a specific location. Or if we could suddenly refine 54k diamonds on each toon per day. They would make an emergency maintenance and fix the issue immediately. If it’s something that benefits them, they act promptly. But as soon as it’s just something that’s an issue to their player base, they don’t give a flying Hamster about fixing it. And if they do it takes them forever. I mean, it’s been like this since mod12b.
    >
    >
    >
    > Trust me, they are going to wait, and not include a fix before mod13.
    >
    > They can not fix an issue if they do not know what is causing it. And yeah, there is a very good chance that it won't be fixed for mod 13. They have included some stuff in mod 13 to TRY to fix it. But they aren't sure if it's going to fix it, as they still do not know what's causing it. Trust me, they are actively working on it. But they are a small studio with finite resources. You really should do your research and educate yourself on how things work with MMO development. It's not like they are ignoring it, on purpose or not, just to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> off the player base.

    How about they start with mod 12 before it was broken and look at what they changed. They did something which looks suspicious when suddenly mod 12.5 is broken when it’s required to run to progress your char causing a considerable cost to the players to cryptics benefit. Months later they still can’t replicate it? They must not be trying much. Perhaps cause they are to busy counting the profits from something that to me looks like it might have been intentional.
  • mightyerikssonmightyeriksson Member Posts: 786 Arc User
    kreatyve said:

    First off, know your audience. "Arc Developers" are not the developers of the game. You are challenging the wrong company there. Arc is made by PWE, the company that publishes Neverwinter, but does nothing with the game development. That would be Cryptic. 2nd of all, there is a thread here regarding the chest issue. They can't replicate the issue in house, and can't fix the issue if they do not know what the issue is. 3rd of all, the devs do play. A lot. On all the platforms. Just because they don't wear a sign that says "I'm a dev" does not mean they don't play. You could have one in your guild right now and not even know it. They do not make themselves known on their personal accounts, nor do they have any special powers on their personal accounts. Please do your research before ranting. Thanks!

    This is just deflection, the fact that he missed the Cryptic/ARC confusion shouldn'even be mentioned by a moderator..

    I would really like to see those that design, test, and sign off on the difficulty/recommended Item level, play those dungeons/trials on console where you can't toggle godmode whenever it suits you...

    And that the loot issue with Ras-Nsi still persist is just embarrassing.
  • undepartedundeparted Member Posts: 88 Arc User
    Thank you all for your replies, and making it through all that text. It became longer than original intended.

    The answers from @kreatyve did also seem like misdirection or deflection to me. And some of it was just plain random.
    But in any case, I once again apologies for mixing up the various companies involved.

    But @kreatyve , please try and read between the lines and recognize my frustration. I am not trying to "hate" on neither the game, nor its developers. But this chest issue is a major inconvenience to everyone in the end game playerbase. And while you have been very focused on this glitch alone, there are several glitches concerning the Ras Nsi boss fight.

    Companion bonding stones not activating.
    Chest glitch.
    Hand mechanic not showing up consistently.

    I will try and draw up my points more clear.

    1)

    When they introduced this dungeon, they said it was meant for casual players. I strongly disagree. You can get by with lower item level support players, but you can't slack on the dps.
    We have a policy in our alliance, being that we can't ignore players based on item level. So if we call out for a dps for TO9G in alliance chat, we have to take first come first serve. And this has been the cause of some grieve, because you just can't carry anyone in that dungeon. The players have unrealistic expectations, and why wouldn't they. They look at the queue group screen and see 12K item level, 30 mins run.

    So I would once again like to see a run completed by 5 12K item level people, in around 30 mins. 1 tank, 3 dps and 1 support. Regardless if its Cryptic, Arc, various testers etc.

    @heraldfayez#8520 I agree that it can be achieved by toons less than 17K, 16K, etc. But only until a certain point. And if you run this dungeon with those item levels, in that time, I'm betting you are bypassing the mechanics by rushing it, and hoping one person makes the campfire further ahead? :wink:

    In any case, I would love to see a 3 man TO9G run video. :)
    Please post it, if you guys ever decide to try it out.

    2)

    They have introduced Ultimate Enchanting Stones, which are only obtainable by running 1 dungeon, or spending loads of money on keys.
    When we then do run that dungeon, we can't rely on it going smoothly. Not by any fault of our own, but due to several wipe threatening glitches.

    I can understand them being tied up with a new mod coming up for PC. And I recognize that they might not have a large team. But these glitches have been present for some time now, and they still haven't been addressed.

    It just makes me start thinking that it might be intentional.

    As long as these glitches persists, we spend either AD or Tradebars on mass scrolls of life, and we see fewer Ultimate Stones. Something that benefits Cryptic financially, seeing as people are then buying more zen with real money.

    If anyone here recalls the Coal Ward / Tradebar Merchant incident. Or have heard what the developers gave members of high ranking guilds on PC, back in the day. Then you would quickly agree that they are a dubious bunch.

    And this... I wouldn't put it past them, I really wouldn't.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 3,807 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    A few points:

    * If the devs can't reproduce the chest issue on Preview, they should have no issue doing it on Live as that's where we all see it
    * Nobody questions why the GF is the desired primary dps..?
    * The guy posting a 15 min run doesn't show the item level of participants or shortcuts used (oh how they'd cry if Cryptic change all doors to require the full party in a circle)
    * A 5 man party at 12k comprising of 1xDC 1xOP/GF and 3xDPS completing in 30 mins (or at all)? I'd love to see a video of that - someone please post one.


    Xael De Armadeon: DC
    Xane De Armadeon: CW
    Zen De Armadeon: OP
    Zohar De Armadeon: TR
    Chrion De Armadeon: SW
    Gosti Big Belly: GWF
    Barney McRustbucket: GF
    Lt. Thackeray: HR


  • spidey#3367 spidey Member Posts: 399 Arc User
    edited February 2018


    most of time you can carry yourself with 1 AC DC and pally tank (i might record a run with 3 people dunno)
    this is one of our daily tong runs https://prnt.sc/igx918 usually takes between 15 to 17 min tops for dung (not counting if someone dces or something happen to slow us down like bugs or sometime counting them) and the party isn't even 17k all between 12k and 14K

    I know for sure how high Xiioxs iLevel is, bc he is in my guild. I will tell him that you made his 16+k iLevel Gf to an 12k -14k GF :)

    BTT:

    I understand your frustration. This Rasni Chest bug is anoying as hell. The "funny" thing about is:
    https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1237615/update-ras-nsi-loot-issues-community-assistance

    So they dont know why and ow this bug works...i think we have to live with it for a long time...
  • werdandi#8366 werdandi Member Posts: 280 Arc User


    most of time you can carry yourself with 1 AC DC and pally tank (i might record a run with 3 people dunno)
    this is one of our daily tong runs https://prnt.sc/igx918 usually takes between 15 to 17 min tops for dung (not counting if someone dces or something happen to slow us down like bugs or sometime counting them) and the party isn't even 17k all between 12k and 14K

    I know for sure how high Xiioxs iLevel is, bc he is in my guild. I will tell him that you made his 16+k iLevel Gf to an 12k -14k GF :)


    and Heralfayez himself is >15k without pet (inspecting from remote location), so probably 16k5-17k..
  • sundance777sundance777 Member Posts: 1,096 Arc User
    I think I was in that same run a couple times this weekend! LOL, probably not your run but some very similar ones. I don't use the public Q but go with random pickup groups fairly often and I would be happy to see a 30 minute run at 5x15K with 1 Healer, 1 Tank and 3 DPS, that 15 minute run posted from PC does not match that.

    Pretty much every run I have been in that has even 1 character under 15K is a fail or significantly longer than 30 minutes, usually 2-4x the recommended play time. When I see suggested play time, to me that means hey the first few runs might take 2x as long but once you get the mechanics down you should be good to go. In this case, it is usually only with a very specific grouping such as: 2 DC's, a power share OP, a 4th buff class or combo HPDS/Buff and 1 HDPS.

    I am all for having a challenging dungeon, this one is really good, but 12K IL is just not realistic, or the 30 minutes is not.

    And +1 on the GF being the top # on the board...The thing with the giant shield that is the fastest in game and one of the highest damage dealers, it just does not make sense.
    TR - Sun: 16000 IL
    OP - Sunshine: 16000 IL

    Casual Dailies
  • pompeyjohn#2818 pompeyjohn Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    Ok so here are a list of simple fixes for the issues surrounding tong and the chests not appearing.

    1. Take down the dungeon till you fix it and only then put it back in game.
    2. Make the enchanting stones available in other dungeons till tong is back up and running they should have been anyway instead of making the game 1 dungeon only.
    3. As a SORRY WE SCREWED UP here is 3 enchanting stones for every account that has run Tong since the bug appeared. Make them account bound so we can't profit from them or kill the value on he AH and in the end 3 stones = 1 x 14 enchantment not much to ask for considering all the pain we have suffered. It would be good customer service and show that you do value us players.

    This isn't rocket science if it is broke remove till fixed many other industries do it, it is called a recall and they also give their customers gifts to say sorry for the inconvenience. Remember a lot of players are burning trade bars for the scrolls they are a premium item obtained only through lockboxes and no where else so don't we deserve something in return.
  • heraldfayez#8520 heraldfayez Member Posts: 227 Arc User


    most of time you can carry yourself with 1 AC DC and pally tank (i might record a run with 3 people dunno)
    this is one of our daily tong runs https://prnt.sc/igx918 usually takes between 15 to 17 min tops for dung (not counting if someone dces or something happen to slow us down like bugs or sometime counting them) and the party isn't even 17k all between 12k and 14K

    I know for sure how high Xiioxs iLevel is, bc he is in my guild. I will tell him that you made his 16+k iLevel Gf to an 12k -14k GF :)


    and Heralfayez himself is >15k without pet (inspecting from remote location), so probably 16k5-17k..
    me and him were only 17K/16K in the run the Dcs ILs were 12K /14K and the pally was 14K too point still stand that Skill> Item level and if you want i can probably find many runs in my catalogue of running with charch under 15K and still completing it under 20 min
    people tend to ignore that classes do not function based on item level xD
  • ecrana#2080 ecrana Member Posts: 1,653 Arc User

    1. Take down the dungeon till you fix it and only then put it back in game.

    If they took down a dungeon/skirm/any content any time there was a bug/glitch AND left it out until it was fixed....we wouldn't have a game to play ;)

    Tiamat glitch lasted years. Shores had a glitch that was around for months (to my knowledge). FBI had/has glitches that are still being taken advantage of. The list goes on and on. Point being, you wouldn't see T9G return until 2025 if past experience is any indicator.
  • pompeyjohn#2818 pompeyjohn Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    > If they took down a dungeon/skirm/any content any time there was a bug/glitch AND left it out until it was fixed....we wouldn't have a game to play ;)

    Point in question in stead of a constant list of bugs and glitches perhaps more effort should be put into creating a stable glitch free game especially major bug/glitches rather than introducing more and more content aimed to grab money from the players. Yes all games have bugs etc I am well aware of that but the list in this game is almost never ending it is about time the dev's worried more about the game and less time worrying about how to drain the players wallet's and resources.

    The reason this bug in particular annoys me is that the fundamental reason for running dungeons is to complete and get rewards. If we can't even be confident in being able to do that then what is the point of running the dungeon in the 1st place.
  • spidey#3367 spidey Member Posts: 399 Arc User

    point still stand that Skill> Item level

    Nop...Point is: Group "design" > item level.
    This is not Skill > item level. 90% is group design > Item Level. 10% is skill> Item Level.
    And i dont wanna start talking about "skills" like shortcuts, artefact aborts, artefact stacking, orcus buffs stacking etc...

    people tend to ignore that classes do not function based on item level xD

    People tend to ignore the truth about Item Level in dungeon runs XD, but your right about ppl and the item level. Most ppl thinking "i just need enough ilevel to be a better player". Thats wrong. You have to learn to play your class and you have to learn your rotation/selfbuffs etc. So...generally?:...yes....skill> item level...but not in Tong with "designed groups" ^^
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 3,807 Arc User
    DC and OP abilities are less affected by item level as they are not there for dealing damage. This is especially the case for DCs where it's all about feats & powers - so yes, a skilled support class can fulfil their role with less overall stats.

    This really is not the case for DPS where they need 12+ bondings, >90% crit chance, full RI and a Trans+ weapon enchantment and at least one companion at legendary (preferably 3) or they won't get the full benefit of the buffs.

    As someone who mains a Pally (with DC as 2nd) I have to say this sucks for DPS players as not only are they lucky if they can find a group with 1 or 2 DPS slots but they have to be geared way better than anyone else. This is in a game where most people play DPS.

    There needs to be a serious rethink about balance (and I'm not talking about forcing people to run 2 support/3 dps via random queue dumbness - that's a lazy solution to a complex issue).


    Xael De Armadeon: DC
    Xane De Armadeon: CW
    Zen De Armadeon: OP
    Zohar De Armadeon: TR
    Chrion De Armadeon: SW
    Gosti Big Belly: GWF
    Barney McRustbucket: GF
    Lt. Thackeray: HR


  • spidey#3367 spidey Member Posts: 399 Arc User
    /sign @armadeonx
  • werdandi#8366 werdandi Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    armadeonx said:

    DC and OP abilities are less affected by item level as they are not there for dealing damage. This is especially the case for DCs where it's all about feats & powers - so yes, a skilled support class can fulfil their role with less overall stats.

    This really is not the case for DPS where they need 12+ bondings, >90% crit chance, full RI and a Trans+ weapon enchantment and at least one companion at legendary (preferably 3) or they won't get the full benefit of the buffs.

    As someone who mains a Pally (with DC as 2nd) I have to say this sucks for DPS players as not only are they lucky if they can find a group with 1 or 2 DPS slots but they have to be geared way better than anyone else. This is in a game where most people play DPS.

    There needs to be a serious rethink about balance (and I'm not talking about forcing people to run 2 support/3 dps via random queue dumbness - that's a lazy solution to a complex issue).

    I agree with you regarding the support classes needing less stats than dps classes, as long as they use the correct rotations and feats and insignias.
    As for the DPS, the upcoming gear will offer much more damage stats and damage %, so basically it should reduce the need of having stronger dps. I think the intention is to break the meta of having ONE dps and to allow more versatility in the group design.

    Also, I think that this damage boost planned at module 13 is the first step to level 80 characters.

    I also think that unfortunately, the devs don't want the caster classes to be full dps anymore in the future: they will be only hybrid dps/supports. Only classes with blades will be dps....


  • undepartedundeparted Member Posts: 88 Arc User

    armadeonx said:

    DC and OP abilities are less affected by item level as they are not there for dealing damage. This is especially the case for DCs where it's all about feats & powers - so yes, a skilled support class can fulfil their role with less overall stats.

    This really is not the case for DPS where they need 12+ bondings, >90% crit chance, full RI and a Trans+ weapon enchantment and at least one companion at legendary (preferably 3) or they won't get the full benefit of the buffs.

    As someone who mains a Pally (with DC as 2nd) I have to say this sucks for DPS players as not only are they lucky if they can find a group with 1 or 2 DPS slots but they have to be geared way better than anyone else. This is in a game where most people play DPS.

    There needs to be a serious rethink about balance (and I'm not talking about forcing people to run 2 support/3 dps via random queue dumbness - that's a lazy solution to a complex issue).

    I agree with you regarding the support classes needing less stats than dps classes, as long as they use the correct rotations and feats and insignias.
    As for the DPS, the upcoming gear will offer much more damage stats and damage %, so basically it should reduce the need of having stronger dps. I think the intention is to break the meta of having ONE dps and to allow more versatility in the group design.

    Also, I think that this damage boost planned at module 13 is the first step to level 80 characters.

    I also think that unfortunately, the devs don't want the caster classes to be full dps anymore in the future: they will be only hybrid dps/supports. Only classes with blades will be dps....


    See this brings up another issue that I find puzzling.

    They started mod12 by saying that the bonding stones were too powerful, and needed to be fixed. (Notice their word of choice). Apparently they have always been broken, but I guess Cryptic just got around to "fixing" them now...

    Anyway, they nerf... oh, sorry, fix the bondings. Reasoning that it is making us more powerful than intended.

    Alright, I can live with that.

    But while announcing the bonding changes, they also introduce new ranks of both weapon, armor, and gear enchantments. Saying, in a roundabout way, that it was time to give the end game players something new to do.

    But once you are fully upgraded to rank 14's, you have the same strength as before. So now we are too powerful yet again. And now they are also bringing in new stronger gear.

    It just doesn't add up.
  • mightyspire#6343 mightyspire Member Posts: 41 Arc User
    Every time i try to do TO9G I end up going through pretty much ok but then people leave (I don't do it with anyone from my guild just random), it is very frustrating as I have never finished this queue and would like to try and get some new stronger gear. I am what I feel is pretty strong for my character but even then I still die often in this queue (why did they have to make this one soooooo hard) but I normally revive myself to try and get through. It is frustrating when you start the queue then people leave, you feel like screaming.

    One day I will get to finish it :(
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