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How damage is applied in Neverwinter...
adamant
Member Posts: 5 Arc User
Can I first preface this discussion, more or less where you all click on this link and proceed to tell me how I am mistaken, by stating that I have really enjoyed playing Neverwinter, particularly the Devoted Cleric and now the Guardian Fighter, however there is one thing that seems really odd to me as a player of other MMORPGs in both the Tank and Healer rolls; and this is how damage is applied by enemies (PvE).
It is my perception that there is something particularly wonky with damage application by enemies, and furthermore in healing damage done by enemies to allies, when playing through the higher end content (dungeons, raids, challenge instances). It seems that damage is either so great that before a player (tank or healer) can react a large proportion of their HP, or that of an ally, is gone, if not the player or ally is outright killed instantly, rather than a slow build up of damage that eventually results in enemies exhausting the HP of the players. This is particularly notable against bosses like Demogorgon and Orthus, sometimes against certain other bosses (the final opponent from The Shores of Teurn) who have several attacks that do so much damage it either instantly kills a tank (or other character) or simply is mitigated to the point of doing no damage at all.
Would someone be able to explain why this is?
This isn't so much a complaint but a curiosity of mine having played a few other MMORPGs, my favourite being FFXIV: A Realm Reborn, where I spent the majority of my time tanking, and enjoying it. During that time I noticed that in combat HP rarely vanished in massive chunks (for example dropping from 100% to 50%) very often, of course there were certain mechanics in raids where bosses could inflict instant kills by knocking players off of the map if they were standing in the wrong area, or if your party did not kill enough of a specific kind of monster spawn, etc. Typically in fights HP would tricky down, visibly, giving healers a very real chance to react to it, split their healing abilities, manage cool downs, etc without needing emergency crisis management like I often find occurring in some of my dungeoneering (either while healing where a tank suddenly takes and extremely devastating hit before I am even aware that his HP is decreasing, or as a tank where the same is true and my healer cannot immediately react).
I feel like I perform both roles as well as I have seen any equally geared character be able to (3001 Devoted Cleric, and a 2200ish Guardian Fighter) however it simply feels really wonky to me not being given any real time to react in combat to fulfill my role as a support or as a tank where I am either tanking insane, barely manageable levels of damage, or none at all (to express that more clearly... I find that I either have a full HP bar and never see a change to that, or that I have a massive gouge taken from my HP or perhaps further still and instantly killed).
Any explanations, tips, alternate perspectives that anyone has for me?
It is my perception that there is something particularly wonky with damage application by enemies, and furthermore in healing damage done by enemies to allies, when playing through the higher end content (dungeons, raids, challenge instances). It seems that damage is either so great that before a player (tank or healer) can react a large proportion of their HP, or that of an ally, is gone, if not the player or ally is outright killed instantly, rather than a slow build up of damage that eventually results in enemies exhausting the HP of the players. This is particularly notable against bosses like Demogorgon and Orthus, sometimes against certain other bosses (the final opponent from The Shores of Teurn) who have several attacks that do so much damage it either instantly kills a tank (or other character) or simply is mitigated to the point of doing no damage at all.
Would someone be able to explain why this is?
This isn't so much a complaint but a curiosity of mine having played a few other MMORPGs, my favourite being FFXIV: A Realm Reborn, where I spent the majority of my time tanking, and enjoying it. During that time I noticed that in combat HP rarely vanished in massive chunks (for example dropping from 100% to 50%) very often, of course there were certain mechanics in raids where bosses could inflict instant kills by knocking players off of the map if they were standing in the wrong area, or if your party did not kill enough of a specific kind of monster spawn, etc. Typically in fights HP would tricky down, visibly, giving healers a very real chance to react to it, split their healing abilities, manage cool downs, etc without needing emergency crisis management like I often find occurring in some of my dungeoneering (either while healing where a tank suddenly takes and extremely devastating hit before I am even aware that his HP is decreasing, or as a tank where the same is true and my healer cannot immediately react).
I feel like I perform both roles as well as I have seen any equally geared character be able to (3001 Devoted Cleric, and a 2200ish Guardian Fighter) however it simply feels really wonky to me not being given any real time to react in combat to fulfill my role as a support or as a tank where I am either tanking insane, barely manageable levels of damage, or none at all (to express that more clearly... I find that I either have a full HP bar and never see a change to that, or that I have a massive gouge taken from my HP or perhaps further still and instantly killed).
Any explanations, tips, alternate perspectives that anyone has for me?
#Whowatchesthewatchers?!
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Comments
At most points in the game's history, there have been mechanics interactions that provided invulnerability or near-invulnerability, which exacerbated content design with an eye for ever increasing big hits. There are also many self-heals (incl. lifesteal stat, insignia bonuses, set bonuses, and various powers / feats) that make small damage pretty insignificant. Small hits are not a big deal if you can out-heal any damage you are taking by yourself.
It's not really a simple answer, nor is your complaint an uncommon one. But where we are now, the damage being dealt by enemies is either insignificant or overwhelming. Self-heals are very strong and a dedicated healer is only needed for lower-geared parties. Most support classes in the end-game focus on providing damage buffs, enemy debuffs, and various utilities like move speed and AP gain to the party.
Other MMOs have gone through the same thing and the only way to fix it is a full overall of the game. DCUO is an example of a game that is going through this right now. For instance in that game if my IL was equal to the enemy in the current state I can do 25K DPS at range and at melee do 35 DPS. The update the devs are doing is reducing that damage by roughly 66% and older content is no longer a cake walk as even the highest geared players are having issues in some of the best Tier 5 content that game has offered and content is currently Tier 8 for DCUO.
As a long time MMO player and someone who has enjoyed DCUO, seeing this type of update makes me happy but at the same time the majority of newer players are use to being over powered and doing massive amounts of damage. This will results in some players not enjoying the update and taking a leave.
I see the exact same thing here and this game is a good 1-2 years out roughly from a full revamp. Devs might not even finish up their current revamp and find that damage output by players and content difficulty is not there due to the massive amounts of buffs and debuffs we all can give each other.
Than again, this game is F2P and has a very well designed Pay 2 Advance model that if the devs did that they may impact some revenue and that might not be in the best interest of the company.
For me, I'm going to continue to play this game and enjoy it in its currents where I can do eLoL runs with 1 tank and 4 healers in around 10 minutes. Who said you need DPS to beat content.