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Unbiased suggestion for skilled bis pvp guilds premades
vinceent1
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,264 Arc User
well, i will try to make it max unbiased as i can, i hope there are people around you able to think about things, please tell you will at least think about it. if its true or not and beyond
i will make a comparison between two games i actively play and really know. Neverwinter and Elder scrolls online
Neverwinter - as manys pointed before, this game was not made with strong focus on pvp, its heavily gear depended, if you consider yourself skilled (as you do) what are you trying achieve here? Cryptic think about pvp in this game as casual pvp, even dont bother with real testing. If you run premades, you are trollmade here, ruin the gamemode for thousands.
Now look at you - you have dedicated, skilled, experienced group of pvp liked players
Now lets look at ESO - eso has many problems but its open world pvp system with a lot more customization possibilities for your characters and your group. Open world pvp, where your group should be important part any of three aliances. If your group really show skill, you can get great results and reward. You can be feared by enemies because of your skill, you can be honored by your alliance members for your efforts during aliance war.
please tell me, do you see that huge difference i am talking about? If you are so premade focused, you can even get guilds armor there. think about it.
p.s. i dont want to rid you out of my eyes, as i actively play both games and continue to do so.
i will make a comparison between two games i actively play and really know. Neverwinter and Elder scrolls online
Neverwinter - as manys pointed before, this game was not made with strong focus on pvp, its heavily gear depended, if you consider yourself skilled (as you do) what are you trying achieve here? Cryptic think about pvp in this game as casual pvp, even dont bother with real testing. If you run premades, you are trollmade here, ruin the gamemode for thousands.
Now look at you - you have dedicated, skilled, experienced group of pvp liked players
Now lets look at ESO - eso has many problems but its open world pvp system with a lot more customization possibilities for your characters and your group. Open world pvp, where your group should be important part any of three aliances. If your group really show skill, you can get great results and reward. You can be feared by enemies because of your skill, you can be honored by your alliance members for your efforts during aliance war.
please tell me, do you see that huge difference i am talking about? If you are so premade focused, you can even get guilds armor there. think about it.
p.s. i dont want to rid you out of my eyes, as i actively play both games and continue to do so.
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Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
As far as I can gather, you're basically saying that the premade bis people should just up sticks and move en masse to ESO. Perhaps if I'd started at eso I'd never have come to neverwinter, but as it is, the majority of bis players in neverwinter atm. have a huge investment of either time or money, sometimes both, in the game. Even approaching bis in this game requires it.
And somehow this means we should stop playing, write off a year or so of play and hundreds of dollars spent, because people with less investment in the game... don't like getting beaten..?
Ok, I can empathize to a point, I remember getting roflstomped in pvp back when I was a noobie in mod 2. But tbh, that chance of meeting the real monsters of neverwinter whenever you q'ed for dom only added to the excitement. The difference between then and now..? The pvp q during mods 2 and 3... popped in seconds. Meaning that almost all of the playerbase, rookies and veterans, all pvp'ed. And so your chances of running into a premade were low, once in a bluemoon low, because the bis players and premades were buried under 100s of rookie and average gs/il toons.
For some reason recently, the forum has been putting pressure on the bis players and pvp guilds to alter their behaviour to accomodate the feelings of the lesser geared playerbase. However, the other side of the equation, where the lesser geared majority can help themselves have a better experience in gg and dom and I guess SHpvp too, is (and sry for capslock here) to
JUST Q FOR THEM.
The bis players have the guns, the average player has the numbers. If the average playerbase gets into the habit of queuing for pvp they will always vastly outnumber the bis players and premades, and therefore the chance of meeting a premade in pvp for tbe average player will drastically fall. The average playerbase will be happier, because you'll be mainly fighting among youselves on a level playing field, and the bis crowd will moan a bit at always having to play lowbies, and maybe decide to go fight in IWD I dunno.
In conclusion, asking the bis playerbase to gimp themselves, or change their habits, is a wee bit presumptuous, given the levels of investment in the game, and kinda, sorry, smels of entitlement. "I deserve a good time because... erm... I just do okay..?"
The other way to make a more forgiving enviroment in pvp, is simple. Everybody Q. We have zerg timers in tiamat, just create a newbie pvp channel, announce a time, the whole channel hits k and queues. 90% will get an instance with players of the same type, 10% might run into a premade. Your only problem will be one of advertising the new channel, amd getting the playerbase to subscribe.
i am talking about thinking about things overall.
In Neverwinter, you que as pvp guild group, majority of matches you stomp opponent, get a very few of AD and mostly useless glory, get the best gear a little bit sooner than others. Is it enough for you? If yes, i pity you.
why you dont think about game which catter to group pvp experience, where you can get great results as skilled group and great reward too?
???
in neverwinter you can t get great results, you have guaranteed them if you are absolute premade.
you cant get proper reward, only mostly useless garbage and HAMSTER
It's up to you.
i dont think many pvp guilds members know word charity, but they can do something for themselves, find new threats elsewhere or let newbies grow to be reasonable opponent, its up to them.
"BiS pvp players are skillless nubs carried by their gear"
I could be mean and reply: "And you are skillless people without gear and would get stomped anyway"
Vincent1 seems butthurt so bad…
Truth to be told: If you are a nub, you are so in every game you join, because beeing noobish, undergeared, inexpierienced is a choice.
Go to CS:GO and play players with ESL exp and 2 years on their back: you get stomped.
Go to LoL and play against players with years of expirience: you get stomped.
Go to… [insert what ever game] and play against longtime and expirienced players: you get stomped.
The issue this game has is not the BiS premades, that wreck everybody or the undergeared pugs who run around like chickens; the main issues this game has is
1. no proper matchmaking, just random crappy queue system
2. very small pvp population
3. huge balance issues
Maybe just stop whining like a baby and either gear up or stop queueing for pvp if you cant handle these three issues.
its not true and whole thread is about it, so need to reread everything, or dont waste your time reading a go stomp some pugs
The reason why CS:GO is so successful is precisely because the only thing that actually makes you a better player is experience. I mean sure, there are other limiting factors like reaction time but that's a given for any game that isn't turn based.
Neverwinter PvP should follow that sort of example but they don't because it's easier to make money off a game that is pay to win. That's also why the PvP population so small. You can go on and on about how people are "undergeared nubs" but when you do that you're just falling into Cryptic's trap. They purposely balance PvP poorly and don't scale item performance at all precisely so that players think that they're "good" at PvP. Games like this don't attract actually good players. They're all playing games like CSGO or LoL because there is actual competition for them there.
This game was never built for competitive pvp, it just doesnt have the framework nor does it have the playerbase to support it. It's not the these pvp guild's fault at all. If cryptic wanted it to be competitive pvp, they would have a strong focus on class balance, bug stomping and matchmaking. They just don't have the staff or focus for it, if you played this game for long you would know how long it takes to get a class change and those changes are never tested thoroughly.
If they didn't allow pug stomping then they would lose alot of revenue from the kind of player who enjoys it.
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
I feel like this suggestion is just trying to say "all you bis experienced players, go play another game coz pugs can't beat you". Well if you enjoy PvP'in in one of those games that you mentioned because you think it's fairer, then perhaps stick to those.
A lot of us have been playing since the start, have too much history, investment, like the game play here more, and don't really want to start all over again in another game yet.
Well my suggestion is to gear up, and find/create a guild so you'll be on equal foot. The only problem with that is, it takes a lot of time and money to be BiS. The broken mechanics and gear gap is probably what's making PvP not as popular as it used to be. If most people are like me, who like to be prepared before going into battle, then they'll probably spend more time gearing, refining, grinding ad.
So if people didn't feel the NEED to gear up, and just queue up, then PvP would be in such a better place.
As to your suggestion to ESO, if we can transfer our chars from NW over and you're paying the game for us, then maybe I don't mind giving it a go, but the last I heard, ESO is a very slow paced game, most likely won't be my cup of tea.
Have the gear and skills, but lack the friends to play with? Come and apply for Essence of Aggression. We have been here and strong since beta. (Immature, rude, and arrogant people will not be accepted)
Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
No offence but you are pretty much demanding neverwinter bis pvp folks change their ways, but when I ask you and the non-bis pvp players to change yours... that's off topic..?
C'mon.
I havent compared NW with CS:GO, but the principles of beeing a newbie and whiner applies to all of these games.
Neverwinter has no comptetive pvp. And will never have. I am still enjoying pvp because of th combat system and the diversity of classes and skills.
Actually thinking about NW like an esport and believing success expresses your skill level gameplay wise is just foolish. Ofc you have some pvp players who stick to their dogma of "beeing the best TR with best k/d ratio". I let them have their delusional ambitions.
Still, because you cant take NW pvp too serious for various reasons, why does this thread even exist? Nobody forces you to play pvp, nobody forces you to get out there and getting stomped, and if it happens, why do you care about it in a game where pvp is not serious?
If it takes longer than 5 minutes to get a fight, I know I'm in for a hard time.
1. i am not a newbie, i play for 2 years
2. i am not whining, i am posting the truth
3. i dont know game with balanced serious pvp, all are esports
4. the only sentences i agree with you is that i am still enjoying pvp because of th combat system and the diversity of classes and skills