Draconic Templar Armor Discussion

falkenblackhand · July 2015

Im having a hard time deciding what to do about my armor set. So i thought i would ask you all for opinions. First of all my class is Hunter Ranger. Before Tiamat i was wearing a combo of Royal Guard and Grand Warden armor. This brought my Armor Pen up to 2500+ however my GS was between 15 and 16k. I was super excited to get my complete set of Draconic Templar Armor becuase i noticed even without my enchants my GS went up nearly 1.2k, adding enchants i'm sitting at 17.2k GS. Now normaly this would be exciting. Especially since i think the DT armor look particularly awesome. If fact on a side note if i could afford maass Quantities of Black Dye i'm pretty sure the result would be a character that looked strikingly like Batman. Anyway the problem is this armor does NOT HAVE ARMOR PEN. I have no earthly clue why the developers decided that a MAJOR skill for HR's would be taken out of their supposed best Armor in the game. My Arm Pen literally is 1.3k now. If it was just about my look in game this would be an easy decision, I would meerly don an attractive fashion and be done with it. However the DT armor did increase my survivability. I can hardly be killed now. It takes so much to take me down when wearing that armor. However my Dmg output is DRASTICALLY reduced. So the trade off is my delema. Offence vs Deffence. Also i have slotted Arm Pen enchants so that wont help. Is there a way for me to equip certain artifacts or cloaks that might help?

bmean · July 2015

The DT set is new and will last you for a while. It's somewhat expensive, but there is armor kits that boost arm pen by 100 each.

drexci · July 2015

What is your strength ability score?

You need -24% ignored. So your Strenght (resistance ignored) plus your armor pen.

Check the link, hope it's useful

http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Combat

rockstargfu · July 2015

Check your abilty scores before boosting any armor pen

Strength adds resistance ignored,

Example
Goal-25% Resistance Ignored
Strength gives 10% RI
You only need to get 15% RI more, from armor pen

cyberguts · July 2015

Personally, as a SW; the DT set is a pile of <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> with the stats it brings.
I lose a lot of Crit and Recovery that I have on my AD set, and gain a lot more LS.
At present (until mod6 that is), I'm at 1500 LS without any enchants; which is hitting the DimR now BEFORE I change the set.

The only classes both Draconic and DT sets benefit are HR, DC and GF.

nem3sls · July 2015

My ARP is @2670 giving me -24,8% RI which is .8 over the optimal % but as close as I can get.

You need an Ioun stone with 3 offensive slots and stack those dark enchants there.

Also personalised jewellery does wonders on Ioun stones

rockstargfu · July 2015

nem3sls wrote: »

My ARP is @2670 giving me -24,8% RI which is .8 over the optimal % but as close as I can get.

You need an Ioun stone with 3 offensive slots and stack those dark enchants there.

Also personalised jewellery does wonders on Ioun stones

Certain class abilities (str,con,cha,wis) give resistence ignored, my GF gets 10% resistance ignored with Zero Arp. Meaning to hit the optimal number, i need aprox 1300 Arp.

RI doesnt add up anywhere on character sheet, you have to add it up yourself

nem3sls · July 2015

falkenblackhand wrote: »

Do you think it would work the same with a Cat?

A cat is an augment companion afaik and works the same as a stone. A stone cannot die, a cat can

you can grab both to get the cats active bonus if you're after that.

mightyeriksson · July 2015

nem3sls wrote: »

falkenblackhand wrote: »

Do you think it would work the same with a Cat?

A cat is an augment companion afaik and works the same as a stone. A stone cannot die, a cat can you can grab both to get the cats active bonus if you're after that.

Actually I'm fairly sure the Cat cannot die, at least on PC iirc?

nem3sls · July 2015

mightyeriksson wrote: »

nem3sls wrote: »

falkenblackhand wrote: »

Do you think it would work the same with a Cat?

A cat is an augment companion afaik and works the same as a stone. A stone cannot die, a cat can you can grab both to get the cats active bonus if you're after that.

Actually I'm fairly sure the Cat cannot die, at least on PC iirc?

Well, this is an assumption on my side, seeing the cat as a living companion, if I'm wrong please correct me. Logic says I'm right but nw has its own rules

ketthoover · July 2015

To be fair, logic would also say a stone will not orbit your head and give you powers. Or, that it could be knocked out of orbit.

mightyeriksson · July 2015

nem3sls wrote: »

mightyeriksson wrote: »

nem3sls wrote: »

falkenblackhand wrote: »

Do you think it would work the same with a Cat?

A cat is an augment companion afaik and works the same as a stone. A stone cannot die, a cat can you can grab both to get the cats active bonus if you're after that.

Actually I'm fairly sure the Cat cannot die, at least on PC iirc?

Well, this is an assumption on my side, seeing the cat as a living companion, if I'm wrong please correct me. Logic says I'm right but nw has its own rules

It counts as an augment, so therefore it needs to be invulnerable, same thing as with the Chicken (PC only).

axemthegreat · July 2015

Doesn't the cat run away when combat starts? I was always told it was unkillable. It doesn't attack like other companions do, so I'm sure it's treated like an augment.

patsfire · July 2015

In my case, I have a TR, my Draconic Templar Armor gives crazy Armor Pen stats. So I had to actually adjust my Enchants to adjust. Still not the best stats, but my sheet is something like: 6,300 Power, 3,000 Crit, 2,500 Armor Pen

Edit: My gs is only 16.6 as well.

xxxsfalxxx · July 2015

A great deal of the things that can greatly benefit you as a character or your group or both don't fully add to or add to GS at all. A number of companion benefits, armor set bonuses, last tier of boons, hit points, things at the flatter ends of the curve. And others that add to GS but have no effect or no practical effect like being over the caps or giving you damage assists when you're not doing damage that way to start with. Or like my current sword and matching shield I don't have yet give bonuses to powers/feats that aren't even in my tree so don't help. Plus either way if the spec is wrong for role being taken or the gear being worn or the situation (or some mix of that) those other things might not matter. But like they say, you can add about 400 of anything to a set of armor for around 150 to 600 KAD. If you're talking about armor, there's also changing out neck, ring, waist, main/offhand and enchants to get back whatever some set of armor may have lost.

Tomidius · July 2015

jdnutz wrote: »

i have a full DT set for my CW, i tried to like it but the fact is i perform much better with 2 shadow weaver set and 2 DT set, but lose 600 gs.

No dude No...

You're killing yourself by not using High Vizier.

rockstargfu · July 2015

Tomidius wrote: »

jdnutz wrote: »

i have a full DT set for my CW, i tried to like it but the fact is i perform much better with 2 shadow weaver set and 2 DT set, but lose 600 gs.

No dude No...

You're killing yourself by not using High Vizier.

Do not listen to guys like this, debuffs dont stack from other players ill take a CW in different gear sets for tiamat anyday!

Recharge bonus, 30%dmg bonus, crit severity, and whatever DT does, is my cw dream for tiamat.

Or everyone could listen to this guy and only have high viz bonus out of the 5-7 cws i see each tiamat

lordsarverious · July 2015

Tomidius wrote: »

No dude No...

You're killing yourself by not using High Vizier.

I've done the whole HV set thing from all the PC builds I've seen. Yes it is great, but it's not always BIS. All of that regen I found was more than I needed for dungeons, and used the other t2 sets to better my defense and armor pen. Right now, I am rocking the DT helmet and gauntlets, with Shadow Weaver armor and boots. I have the double slotted rings with the BI belt (Cloak is halfway to epic), and I find that HV is not logical for me. Anyway, if the Ranger can build up enough ArP with the DT to not just split sets, I'd say run the hell out of it.

boom782 · July 2015

HV is far and away the best for a CW and any CW that uses something else is just trying to stack GS for ego reasons. Yes, the debuff doesn't stack but it is impossible for 1 CW to keep the 3 stacks up 100% of the time(someone posted the math somewhere but I forget the post). Granted there is only a small window of maybe 2-3 seconds that the debuff is NOT at 3 stacks but still. Plus the extra DEF received keeps me alive through practically anything.

I am a 17k GS CW who has run both Renegade and Thaum and every armor combo imaginable and am 100% confident that currently the HV can't be beat. If you don't want to take my word for it just listen to all the PC players that have been playing for years and are able to parse the numbers for proof.

kriptical1 · July 2015

Well, part of it might be casting your spells in the right order, to take advantage of the HV. good rotation seems to be key. Honestly, I see why a lot of people went renegade with the HV. I LIKE MOF, but I'm tempted to respec for curiosity..feats and all.

mikeyflies · July 2015

High vizier doesn't stack with other high vizier (past 3 stacks that is...) BUT the more you have the the more the uptime will approach 100% in random applications. The (30%) high prophet, (30%) high vizier, and (9%) plague fire enchantment are the only defense debuffs (currently on xbox?) that will *multiply* with other damage boosts. Having all 3 gives a factor of 1.69 * the other damage buffs (not adjusting down high prophet, plague fire for enemy DR) which is huge for the dps phase.

Only having high vizier from the 5-7 CW would be more than OK in tiamat to keep up the damage buff near 100% for the heads. Not only that but the risk of having none of the CW running high vizier (and thus a big reduction in group DPS) would be a lot higher if a substantial portion of the CW population isn't running high vizier. This isn't to say that Shadow weaver is a bad set but rather that aside from a premade group with multiple control wizards it isn't the optimal set when trying to maximize dps boosting buffs for solo or random group play (like tiamat etc).

For a solo player :
What is better? 30% damage boost (all damage including but not limited to crits) for 6 seconds out of 12 or so (steal time cooldown for myself) vs 18% extra crit severity? Lets examine the numbers and try to figure that out.
With 75% base crit severity this 18 % increase is a 1.93 / 1.75 or ~10.3% damage increase on only crits for 10 seconds (which likely means near 100% uptime). Using an uptime of 40% on HV would be 12% damage boost (on average) but not just to crits ... If you have a higher crit severity then the ratio gets worse... with a vorpal (25%) the ratio is 2.18/2 or 9%. With a perfect (50%) the ratio is 2.43 /2.25 or 8%. With a 100% crit rate this would be comparing 10.3% (best case) shadow weaver to 12% high vizier. With a 50% crit rate it is a 5.15% to 4% damage increase (Shadow weaver) to 12% high vizier (on average).

Of course the *best* would be to have everything stacking and with 100% uptime but which would you choose if you have to pick one to run with not knowing what other players will have equipped?

rockstargfu · July 2015

mikeyflies wrote: »

High vizier doesn't stack with other high vizier (past 3 stacks that is...) BUT the more you have the the more the uptime will approach 100% in random applications. The (30%) high prophet, (30%) high vizier, and (9%) plague fire enchantment are the only defense debuffs (currently on xbox?) that will *multiply* with other damage boosts. Having all 3 gives a factor of 1.69 * the other damage buffs (not adjusting down high prophet, plague fire for enemy DR) which is huge for the dps phase.

Only having high vizier from the 5-7 CW would be more than OK in tiamat to keep up the damage buff near 100% for the heads. Not only that but the risk of having none of the CW running high vizier (and thus a big reduction in group DPS) would be a lot higher if a substantial portion of the CW population isn't running high vizier. This isn't to say that Shadow weaver is a bad set but rather that aside from a premade group with multiple control wizards it isn't the optimal set when trying to maximize dps boosting buffs for solo or random group play (like tiamat etc).

For a solo player :
What is better? 30% damage boost (all damage including but not limited to crits) for 6 seconds out of 12 or so (steal time cooldown for myself) vs 18% extra crit severity? Lets examine the numbers and try to figure that out.
With 75% base crit severity this 18 % increase is a 1.93 / 1.75 or ~10.3% damage increase on only crits for 10 seconds (which likely means near 100% uptime). Using an uptime of 40% on HV would be 12% damage boost (on average) but not just to crits ... If you have a higher crit severity then the ratio gets worse... with a vorpal (25%) the ratio is 2.18/2 or 9%. With a perfect (50%) the ratio is 2.43 /2.25 or 8%. With a 100% crit rate this would be comparing 10.3% (best case) shadow weaver to 12% high vizier. With a 50% crit rate it is a 5.15% to 4% damage increase (Shadow weaver) to 12% high vizier (on average).

Of course the *best* would be to have everything stacking and with 100% uptime but which would you choose if you have to pick one to run with not knowing what other players will have equipped?

Its easy to know what most cws are wearing, its HV so id encourage the logical minded people to help give the other buffs that the masses avoid, because dungeons gear sets dont matter. Stuff melts and fast. Gear sets matter in tiamat, and ppl should avoid using 2-2 sets, and help boost everyones dps by being diverse

boom782 · July 2015

rockstargfu wrote: »

mikeyflies wrote: »

High vizier doesn't stack with other high vizier (past 3 stacks that is...) BUT the more you have the the more the uptime will approach 100% in random applications. The (30%) high prophet, (30%) high vizier, and (9%) plague fire enchantment are the only defense debuffs (currently on xbox?) that will *multiply* with other damage boosts. Having all 3 gives a factor of 1.69 * the other damage buffs (not adjusting down high prophet, plague fire for enemy DR) which is huge for the dps phase.

Only having high vizier from the 5-7 CW would be more than OK in tiamat to keep up the damage buff near 100% for the heads. Not only that but the risk of having none of the CW running high vizier (and thus a big reduction in group DPS) would be a lot higher if a substantial portion of the CW population isn't running high vizier. This isn't to say that Shadow weaver is a bad set but rather that aside from a premade group with multiple control wizards it isn't the optimal set when trying to maximize dps boosting buffs for solo or random group play (like tiamat etc).

For a solo player :
What is better? 30% damage boost (all damage including but not limited to crits) for 6 seconds out of 12 or so (steal time cooldown for myself) vs 18% extra crit severity? Lets examine the numbers and try to figure that out.
With 75% base crit severity this 18 % increase is a 1.93 / 1.75 or ~10.3% damage increase on only crits for 10 seconds (which likely means near 100% uptime). Using an uptime of 40% on HV would be 12% damage boost (on average) but not just to crits ... If you have a higher crit severity then the ratio gets worse... with a vorpal (25%) the ratio is 2.18/2 or 9%. With a perfect (50%) the ratio is 2.43 /2.25 or 8%. With a 100% crit rate this would be comparing 10.3% (best case) shadow weaver to 12% high vizier. With a 50% crit rate it is a 5.15% to 4% damage increase (Shadow weaver) to 12% high vizier (on average).

Of course the *best* would be to have everything stacking and with 100% uptime but which would you choose if you have to pick one to run with not knowing what other players will have equipped?

Its easy to know what most cws are wearing, its HV so id encourage the logical minded people to help give the other buffs that the masses avoid, because dungeons gear sets dont matter. Stuff melts and fast. Gear sets matter in tiamat, and ppl should avoid using 2-2 sets, and help boost everyones dps by being diverse

You would be surprised but that is actually not the case. I play a CW and ALWAYS inspect other CW's I run across and I can tell you 8 out of 10 CW's I run into are NOT using 4 piece HV. It seems many CW's are selfish and just want to stack GS by using 2/2. I even have 2 in my guild with a 19k and 20k GS that do this and it is a shame.

Draconic Templar Armor Discussion

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