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Coming Soon: Lifetime Subscriber Veteran Rewards

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  • flamingbunnymanflamingbunnyman Posts: 2,035 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    mensar wrote: »
    Dunno, I'm all for the game attracting new blood, but they need to find ways to do it that doesn't spit in the face of the folks that have truly supported the game for the last 4+ years...

    Someone who bought a LTS at the beginning of the game, especially someone who bought it for the $200 sale price (no idea if that applies to you), has not "supported the game for the last 4+ years".

    Unless you are regularly buying Zen (I know many do, but there are also many LTSers that don't), then once you pass about 2 years, you are a drain on the game, because a regular subscription would have fed more money into the system in the same amount of time, but you cost Cryptic money (in the form of bandwidth and server resources) every time you log in.

    Regardless, Veteran Rewards - here or in any other game - are stupid. Unless you happen to be one of the people who joined the game when it first came out, they are frustrating for new players; they sit there and say to the new players "Look at these awesome things that you can't have? Why not? Because."

    As much as I appreciate the fact that I'll be getting all the rewards up to 700 days earlier than I expected, I can also see it as them slapping a $300 price tag on a costume set. Don't understand what I mean by that? Ask Avianos, or anyone else who has been eagerly eyeing the Avian Warrior set.

    Nothing like costume sets, travel powers, or the like should have ever been locked behind Vet Rewards. Instead, they should be free gifts of things that anyone can buy like the costume slots, character slots and retcons that are already there, the extra bag slot, and maybe the veteran bag and mod. Add 10% to the monthly stipend at each tier (up to a maximum of 100% at the final 1000 day tier), so that the vets get extra Zen to buy those costume sets and other things that are still available to everyone, but are progressively cheaper for vets, thanks to the increased stipend.

    But don't lock a $5 costume set behind a 3-year time gate or a $300 price tag. THAT is the insult to players. Not the horror of other people being given the chance to get the exact same thing you have.
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  • kenpojujitsu3kenpojujitsu3 Posts: 1,320 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    If someone bought the original LTS that was $200 with no veteran rewards advertised. It's not something anyone signed up for it was a free gift thought up much later.

    Fast forward to now. Someone pays $100 more than the "originals" with vet rewards being very much advertised as part of the insentive...and some of us actually complaining that despite the increased cost their fellow players won't have to wait nearly 3 years just for some items like retcon tokens, costume pieces and an XP boost for the first 15 levels (which generally takes me all 20 minutes or less these days)...on the basis that they inherently supported the game more...by paying $100 less for the same status.

    Really?

    Come on now. It almost comes across as being more comfortable feeling special and honored in a game that doesn't exist than wanting to see other people enjoy stuff in the game and hopefully stick around and invest to keep it going for a few more years.

    Let's all just sit back and think if comparing time spent subbed here or $$$ spent on the game really has much meaning at this point in the game's lifecycle.


    Edit: Annnnnnnd, Ninja'd by Bunny while I debated internally if this was even worth the keystrokes posting.
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  • ealford1985ealford1985 Posts: 3,582 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    mensar wrote: »
    Wow, you came from the future.. a full 3000 days before the game was even thought-up. Congrats on photoshop!

    *holds up a picture of bacon* Have you seen this strip?..

    You think I photopshoped this? This is a screenshot of my account, no photoshopping.
  • ealford1985ealford1985 Posts: 3,582 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    psytce0002 wrote: »
    Something wrong with your count, that is about 13 years (4755/365 = 13.0274 & 3 or 4 leap days) ....

    The game just had its 4th anniversary....(365 * 4 = 1460)

    No way you rightfully have 4755 days, something is screwy ... :)

    I'm not really sure what happen. My first character is dated [fixed] May 2011 I believe, I bought the game at a store (to discover it was a time card), then I would use my three
    Months and go back silver...wait a month or so buy three months. Then in 2012 I bought a month and then decided to go LT before my month was even up and then I got all the unlocks. Wasn't until later that I noticed I was subbed for 13years. It's actually says I'm 4800+ right now.
  • pion01pion01 Posts: 758 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Edit: Annnnnnnd, Ninja'd by Bunny while I debated internally if this was even worth the keystrokes posting.

    IMHO, anything having to do with silvers, golds or lifetimers is not worth posting about. Even this vet rewards for LTS thing is like a year late, showing that all the debating by players had almost no impact on the final decision to do it. Cryptic gonna do what Cryptic gonna do, players be damned.

    (more so if they actually ask player opinion)
  • klittyklitty Posts: 1,545 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Keyboard ink it's free :3


    =^ _ ^= Kitty Lives!
  • bwdaresbwdares Posts: 1,517 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    People who complain about this change make me laugh. So what is you had to wait, I did too. This is a good change that will hopefully drive in some new lifetime purchases. If you want to be able to brag, then you can always tell people how long you have been subscribed.

    Personally, until more is done to exspand this game, I could not suggest buying a lifetime sunscription to anyone, even with these changes.

    Most of the money would most likely go to NWO or STO anyway.
    #Mechanon!(completed) #New Zones! #Foundry!
  • malvoumalvou Posts: 488 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    But I already have everything ;-;

    Oh well. You all can enjoy in the festivities with us.
  • skcarkskcark Posts: 715 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    mensar wrote: »
    Subscribed For: 1584 Days
    Number of days/"veteran" rewards that now distinguish me from Player that becomes a LTS the first day they join the game... none.

    GG Cryptic...

    Way to take care of the folks that have actually been here for years... dilute the rewards.


    Yeah well.. why should someone have to wait 1000 days to get access to what their LTS paid for? Someone could literally start playing today, and go Lifetime, and after 999 days it shuts down. All because someone is self entitled to keeping what they had for longer out of the hands of others.


    Besides, has anyone noticed the articles wording sounded like it will only happen to CURRENT lifetimers at the time the update happens?
  • itsbrou#5396 itsbrou Posts: 1,770 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I preordered the game, played closed beta, subbed for up until Free for All, then went LTS, and I have zero problem with someone rolling up and grabbing all of the vet rewards with an LTS purchase. If they reach into their pockets that deep in one go, they deserve it.
    Brou in Cryptic games.
  • flyingfinnflyingfinn Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I'm fine 'costing Cryptic money and not buying Zen regulary'.
    I gave them bunch of cash.
    They just stopped delivering the goods for me to continue giving them more cash.
    But then again, i don't log in as much i use to be.
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  • flamingbunnymanflamingbunnyman Posts: 2,035 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    skcark wrote: »
    Besides, has anyone noticed the articles wording sounded like it will only happen to CURRENT lifetimers at the time the update happens?

    No, I can't say that it sounded that way to me.
    any Lifetime Subscriber to Champions Online will unlock all the Veteran Rewards items immediately. As soon as you become a Lifetime member, you?ll get exclusive items like the Avian Warrior and the Glowing Tights Costume sets (pictured below), along with extra costume and character slots. Any current lifetime subscribers will also receive all rewards that you have yet to unlock.

    Heck, the way they worded it, it sounds like current LTSers are an afterthought.
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  • flamingbunnymanflamingbunnyman Posts: 2,035 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I don't play STO, but I'm a member of a Facebook group run by a bunch of old CoH friends that moved in to that game.

    According to a post in that group, both keys abd Lifetime Subs are on sale right now. I can't find a way to check on keys (they don't seem to have a web store like we do), but I confirmed that their LTS is currently $199.99. I certainly hope that they're finally going to throw a LTS sale our way.

    Yes, even though that means that new LTSers will get the same amount I did, but for less. Oh, the horror!
    _________________________________________________
    @flamingbunnyman in game. Formerly @Roderick in City of Heroes.
  • chaelkchaelk Posts: 7,732 Arc User
    edited November 2013
  • thearkadythearkady Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    If the intent behind this is to attract more new LTS subscribers - to get more people really invested in thhe game - it's a very good move. And if it does get more people really invested, more poeple really active, it'll benefit others indirectly because more active customers should mean more support.
  • heroshima1heroshima1 Posts: 105 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I preordered the game, played closed beta, subbed for up until Free for All, then went LTS, and I have zero problem with someone rolling up and grabbing all of the vet rewards with an LTS purchase. If they reach into their pockets that deep in one go, they deserve it.

    This. Too many people feel they have a right to feel special by having costumes others don't. I don't much care for fashionistas. I'm all for giving incentives to encourage people to open their wallets, and by the sound of some posters that's exactly what is happening. Heck, I wouldn't care if they sold the vet rewards in the C Store! Money into the game = the game thriving and the lights stay on.
  • kenpojujitsu3kenpojujitsu3 Posts: 1,320 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I preordered the game, played closed beta, subbed for up until Free for All, then went LTS, and I have zero problem with someone rolling up and grabbing all of the vet rewards with an LTS purchase. If they reach into their pockets that deep in one go, they deserve it.
    heroshima1 wrote: »
    This. Too many people feel they have a right to feel special by having costumes others don't. I don't much care for fashionistas. I'm all for giving incentives to encourage people to open their wallets, and by the sound of some posters that's exactly what is happening. Heck, I wouldn't care if they sold the vet rewards in the C Store! Money into the game = the game thriving and the lights stay on.

    Pretty much.
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  • theravenforcetheravenforce Posts: 6,950 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Gonna go ahead and say this:

    I played the game when it was Pay 2 Play for a while, then played during F2P from the start of F2P till September 2012, all the while I was buying every single AT (with Void, Fist and Scourge as exceptions) as a Silver Player. I then went LTS in September 2012 and so far I am enjoying it.

    I have ZERO complaints about allowing new LTSers to gain rewards instantly. I mean, it's not as if my rewards from LTS, if gained immediately, I could then cancel the LTS and get my money back is it?

    My LTS will be just that. This logic also applies to new LTSers, if they gain rewards immediately, they will not be any more able to cancel the LTS after gaining rewards than any current LTSer or myself.

    Personally I think this is a good move from Cryptic, coupled with the soon to be changes to Shared Banks and the way we can switch characters, I'd say CO was on the pathway to better days.
  • mensarmensar Posts: 294 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    *holds up a picture of bacon* Have you seen this strip?..

    You think I photopshoped this? This is a screenshot of my account, no photoshopping.

    Oh, I genuinely thought you were messing with us. Weird that your account says that then :)

    my bad.

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  • mensarmensar Posts: 294 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Look... I know folks think I complain about things from time to time.

    Especially nerfs and what-not. But I always have a pretty darn good reason for feeling the way I feel.

    That being said... I don't want folks to think I condone having something that others can't get AT ALL. It's just something that I'm used to from various games in the past. Things phase in and out. If you happened to get them, that was a feather in your cap. But, in THOSE games, the devs created new content.. so the new things that came out were better anyway.. the old things were just cosmetic and superfluous. Basically conversation pieces.

    You truly have that feeling that, hey.. I've been here awhile. And when you get to the point I am, you get all this stuff too!

    If you feel that thinking that way is, in some way, separatist and exclusionary.. think about the leveling system and perks. Nothing is just handed to people.

    People don't start the game with level 40.. they have to earn it. They don't get the 5,000 kill perk rewards, they have to earn them. Same thing to me when you consider sticking around for 1,000 days is truly an accomplishment and TRULY makes you a veteran. Hence.. "veteran" rewards.

    Put a little effort into the game.. wait awhile to get those things that we had to wait for. Is it a status symbol? Sure it is. Some people REALLY get vested in the fact that others shouldn't have those things. Those folks might want to consider getting outside every so often... No offense.

    What I'm saying is they shouldn't just be handed over.

    They are, after all, "veteran" rewards. I feel like they should leave them as-is and come up with some new set of things to give lifetimers if they want to attract people to buy into that subscription level. I think a special AF (beyond foxbat), new costume unlocks, a new travel power.. or giving them FREE several of the pay-to-unlock travel powers.. etc. This just seems uninspired and lazy.

    I just feel like, not only is it lazy programming, it's yet another situation where something people worked hard to get is being just given away for free again. Just like the prototype jets being nerfed, the nerfs to electricity, the legacy items coming in a grab-box that we spent MONTHS (in some cases) trying to farm back in the day, Just like the broad-stroke nerfs to the legacy devices after a year of them sitting in the game as they were and then nerfed across the board instead of just addressing the core issues with eruption and pheremones, just like the hope that the R9s were being fixed since they were +90 on the PTS (and people worked hard to make them since they knew they were FINALLY going to be fixed) and they never flowed it to live.. but, instead, broke PTS to reflect live being broken... +2 over R8 which is +2 over R7... and R7s come right out of a box.... c'mon.. people can have ZERO in fusion and run around with R7s they get from a box and be just about as effective as someone that is 400 in fusion and made all R9s. That's crazy.

    I'm all for people getting things for going LTS, believe me. But, if that is the focus now, then they should actually put some effort into it and create some new stuff rather than diluting what those of us that had to wait for and took a leap of faith for were given.

    Anyway.. that's my whine for the day :) If it happens, it happens. Just another example of where we are as a game.

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  • gaarafrednorrispgaarafrednorrisp Posts: 504 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the PWE Community Rules and Policies -Smackwell
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  • themightyzeniththemightyzenith Posts: 4,599 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    mensar wrote: »
    People don't start the game with level 40.. they have to earn it. They don't get the 5,000 kill perk rewards, they have to earn them.

    That's true.
    mensar wrote: »
    Same thing to me when you consider sticking around for 1,000 days is truly an accomplishment and TRULY makes you a veteran. Hence.. "veteran" rewards.

    However, this is not at all the same thing. In the past, if people bought LTS then they had already paid for the vet rewards....they just had to wait to get them. Now they don't have to wait.

    Players work to get to level 40 and work to get perks and titles, they don't work to get vet rewards. Waiting is not working.
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  • crypticbuxomcrypticbuxom Posts: 4,443 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    chaelk wrote: »

    I think when the STO devs saw that CO was getting LTS rewards up front now, they absolutely had to one up us. Its not like they'd miss a dev's time put into adding the new reward.

    If anything I'm all for them adding more rewards to LTS as time goes on. I'm just tired of seeing STO one up us in every turn (except for combat and customization because STO is light years behind us and will always be).
  • shadowzero66shadowzero66 Posts: 331 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    mensar wrote: »
    People don't start the game with level 40.. they have to earn it. They don't get the 5,000 kill perk rewards, they have to earn them. Same thing to me when you consider sticking around for 1,000 days is truly an accomplishment and TRULY makes you a veteran. Hence.. "veteran" rewards.

    Put a little effort into the game.. wait awhile to get those things that we had to wait for. Is it a status symbol? Sure it is. Some people REALLY get vested in the fact that others shouldn't have those things. Those folks might want to consider getting outside every so often... No offense.

    What I'm saying is they shouldn't just be handed over.

    They are, after all, "veteran" rewards. I feel like they should leave them as-is and come up with some new set of things to give lifetimers if they want to attract people to buy into that subscription level. I think a special AF (beyond foxbat), new costume unlocks, a new travel power.. or giving them FREE several of the pay-to-unlock travel powers.. etc. This just seems uninspired and lazy.

    Anniversary and Head Start perks are still there for old-timers to flaunt.

    This is a game that's strongly rooted in cosmetic items. If they had simply given out a free retcon every X days or something like that, then there wouldn't be much issue. The VIP Lounge is open to non-LTS'ers who have 400+ days subbed. Do people have strong feelings on that? Either way, the thing with a LTS is that you're permanently subscribed so all your veteran rewards are guaranteed. This is in contrast to the monthly subscribers where the vet rewards function as a "carrot-on-a-stick".
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  • bwdaresbwdares Posts: 1,517 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Anniversary and Head Start perks are still there for old-timers to flaunt.

    This is a game that's strongly rooted in cosmetic items. If they had simply given out a free retcon every X days or something like that, then there wouldn't be much issue. The VIP Lounge is open to non-LTS'ers who have 400+ days subbed. Do people have strong feelings on that? Either way, the thing with a LTS is that you're permanently subscribed so all your veteran rewards are guaranteed. This is in contrast to the monthly subscribers where the vet rewards function as a "carrot-on-a-stick".

    Course we dont have an issue with that, no one uses the VIP lounge :D
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  • gaarafrednorrispgaarafrednorrisp Posts: 504 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    bwdares wrote: »
    Course we dont have an issue with that, no one uses the VIP lounge :D

    >.> I use the VIP Lounge
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  • flyingfinnflyingfinn Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    >.> I use the VIP Lounge

    It's the best place to hang out for the Nemesis XP Smashes, so you get your Nemesis every time!!
    .....
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  • cybersoldier1981cybersoldier1981 Posts: 2,501 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    mensar wrote: »

    You truly have that feeling that, hey.. I've been here awhile. And when you get to the point I am, you get all this stuff too!

    If you feel that thinking that way is, in some way, separatist and exclusionary.. think about the leveling system and perks. Nothing is just handed to people.

    I'd say if I spend $200.00 on a game that isn't adding new content at this point, I'm not asking for something to be 'just handed over to me'.
    mensar wrote: »
    People don't start the game with level 40.. they have to earn it. They don't get the 5,000 kill perk rewards, they have to earn them. Same thing to me when you consider sticking around for 1,000 days is truly an accomplishment and TRULY makes you a veteran. Hence.. "veteran" rewards.

    Veteran. One who has experience in the game. Most people aren't stupid enough to Google this game, and at face value just lifetime the hell up. Most lifetime subbers have played this game enough to feel comfortable investing in it, and that gesture of faith in my opinion shows just as much dedication as someone who subscribed at day 1.

    mensar wrote: »
    What I'm saying is they shouldn't just be handed over.

    By your logic, my motorcycle was just 'handed over' and I didn't do a damned thing to 'earn' it. In the adult world, $200 isn't just laying around, that kind of cash is hard to justify spending on a video game. That's a lot of money to spend on any one intangible thing. So, if someone's willing to put that kind of money into CO, I say they deserve a few costumes and shouldn't have to wait 1000 days for them.
    mensar wrote: »
    They are, after all, "veteran" rewards. I feel like they should leave them as-is and come up with some new set of things to give lifetimers if they want to attract people to buy into that subscription level. I think a special AF (beyond foxbat), new costume unlocks, a new travel power.. or giving them FREE several of the pay-to-unlock travel powers.. etc. This just seems uninspired and lazy.

    I think the opposite. Give those guys who were there from the beginning something new and extra for sticking it out this whole time.
  • bwdaresbwdares Posts: 1,517 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    If you ask me, if someone is willing to pony up for a Lifetime membership now...then they should get more. When those of us who bought it the first time around got one, we didn't know what to expect.

    You do now.

    If you fine with getting minor updates and nothing big, then enjoy your investiment. If you wanted things like Zones, this is not the game for you.

    On the bright side, there have been very good improvements recently, so things are turning around at least. We are getting some of the smaller things we have been asking for.
    #Mechanon!(completed) #New Zones! #Foundry!
  • ashensnowashensnow Posts: 2,048 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Veteran rewards generally exist to give an incentive to keep people paying into a game.

    In a sub based game that comes through tying a vet reward to time spent subscribed. Since time spent subbed equals money the vet reward is designed to generate revenue. Essentially the studio is saying, "if you spend at least X you will get bonus Y."

    In a FtP or otherwise micro-transaction based game time spent playing equates to time spent exposed to the various marketing/monetization tricks designed to encourage cash shop purchases.

    In either case time spent in game equates to revenue for the studio. A tactic, such as veteran rewards, designed to encourage time spent in game exists to generate revenue.

    A LTS purchase is paying for that in game time up front and so meets the purpose of veteran rewards.

    Personally I think that vet rewards should be available to silver players who have spent an amount in the z-store equivalent to the current subscription requirements for various rewards.

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  • mensarmensar Posts: 294 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    People make a good point about the money they spend. The problem is.. $300 to some people is a drop in the bucket. They make that overnight while they sleep. To other people that's a paycheck I guess.

    So I'm not looking at the weight of money vs. something that everyone earns equally.. which is time. Veteran rewards were the ONE thing (there might be a very few things you can still earn through 5K perks that you can't buy.... yet) in this game that you couldn't buy until now.

    So, I can see why people would think they should get more when you weigh money against time. Folks that think $300 is a chuck of cash probably believe they deserve those rewards. And, hey, that's what they are going to get.

    I guess we're in a timeframe in the world of gaming where money equates to effort in a game somehow. But that's what F2P has taught us. Paying for things somehow means you have earned them.

    So.. no, no matter how you slice it. The results are the same. "Veteran" rewards are meant for veterans of the game. Not for people that just want to buy them. It doesn't matter if you won't pay another dime for 3 years, the fact of the matter is.. you had to wait those 3 years to get those rewards.. hence the term "veteran".

    At any rate, I can see I'm not going to make my point here. So I'll just bow out.

    Peace.

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    Complete all 5K perk points, stay tuned!

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