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I don't want it to take longer to level alts, please
kiyoko4
Posts: 25 Arc User
Hi all. I am pretty nervous about switching XP to grab alerts and lowering the XP reward at the end.
I do not want it to take longer to level alts.
I do not want to take several times as long to complete a grab mission, to get *less* XP at the end. Slightly increasing the XP buff is pale compensation for this.
I do not want to be "given incentive" to go do missions. If I wanted to be doing missions, I would already be doing them.
Jury rigging people into doing missions by slashing the XP reward from alerts is *not* a good thing. It is not clever. People in favor of this seem very smug about it. But they do not actually gain anything by trying to manipulate how other people play and level alts. Why are you so happy about this and wanting to force others to do missions? Can't you just go play them yourself?
I have done the missions over and over. I do not want to do them again. I just want to level my alts so I can enjoy making more characters. If the XP from alerts is slashed in this fashion, I'll have two basic choices:
1. Switch to the new best method of leveling (get the XP buff and then do the darn missions yet again, ugh).
2. Just not bother and play something else
And 2 is much more likely. That is not some silly forum threat; it does not matter to Cryptic or anyone else *at all* whether I play. I am just saying that if it becomes more tedious and time consuming to level, it becomes not worth it at some point. Killing alert leveling like this sounds like it hits that point, for me at least.
So, to sum up, I do not want it to take longer to level alts. If anything, I'd like it to be quicker. I do not like the sounds of these changes at all. I'll throw in my 2 cents to plea not to do this.
Thanks for reading
I do not want it to take longer to level alts.
I do not want to take several times as long to complete a grab mission, to get *less* XP at the end. Slightly increasing the XP buff is pale compensation for this.
I do not want to be "given incentive" to go do missions. If I wanted to be doing missions, I would already be doing them.
Jury rigging people into doing missions by slashing the XP reward from alerts is *not* a good thing. It is not clever. People in favor of this seem very smug about it. But they do not actually gain anything by trying to manipulate how other people play and level alts. Why are you so happy about this and wanting to force others to do missions? Can't you just go play them yourself?
I have done the missions over and over. I do not want to do them again. I just want to level my alts so I can enjoy making more characters. If the XP from alerts is slashed in this fashion, I'll have two basic choices:
1. Switch to the new best method of leveling (get the XP buff and then do the darn missions yet again, ugh).
2. Just not bother and play something else
And 2 is much more likely. That is not some silly forum threat; it does not matter to Cryptic or anyone else *at all* whether I play. I am just saying that if it becomes more tedious and time consuming to level, it becomes not worth it at some point. Killing alert leveling like this sounds like it hits that point, for me at least.
So, to sum up, I do not want it to take longer to level alts. If anything, I'd like it to be quicker. I do not like the sounds of these changes at all. I'll throw in my 2 cents to plea not to do this.
Thanks for reading
Post edited by kiyoko4 on
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Well, I have some more bad news for you I'm afraid. They recently went back on changing to XP buff from 15% to 20. So it's back at 15% now.
I hear ya here. This is change is going to hurt how I like to play also.
Currently I CAN NOT purchase any more Character Slots, I have apparently maxed out there. So the ONLY way I can create NEW characters is by reaching level 40 with an old character. I am a major altaholic, I like to make new characters every week. Making the leveling process take longer will negatively effect the way I like to enjoy the game.
What they could do is allow me to once again PURCHASE character slots. I have no idea why there is even a limit on this as it only keeps them from making money.
I really don't know. If I find it takes to long to reach 40 with the new setup and I'm not able to enjoy making new characters to have fun with as frequently as I'm used to I might just end up leaving with ya. *shrug*
That doesn't sound like intended behavior. Have you reported this as a bug, or PMed Trailturtle, Lordgar or Radioscience about it?
@flamingbunnyman in game. Formerly @Roderick in City of Heroes.
Known issue.
It's a similar thing with costume slots it seems.
You can buy something like, 20-30 before it caps out, oddly.
Topic : Good god, are you seriously complaining that it'll take a whole 24 hours instead of 20 hours to get a toon to max level?
I don't know ANY game where it is easier then here. The game is easy, leveling is easy, concepts are easy.
The only place I know which hands out XP more is GW2, and they give you XP for finding the bloody bathrooms in a citadel. What's next, you guys just want to skip the entire leveling process because it's not done for you and make toons at level 40?
This is ridiculous...
Deliciously nutritious!
Costumes are capping out? Since when? I haven't purchased any on a couple months, but last I checked there's no limit for account shared costume slots. I do know there's a limit for single character slots I reached mine on Bunni at like 60 or 70.
And as far as the topic at hand, I couldn't agree with you more... no one is forcing anyone to run missions if you choose not to, you still can level just fine with alerts only, just have to run a few more. And if that amount difference is gonna break a game for you, then I'm sorry, but maybe you are taking your gaming a little too seriously for a MMO that's meant to be casual.
@Aleatha1011 in CO | Keeper of the Cheesecake since Nov. 2011| Bunni BOT is on PRIMUS! | Come check out my deviantart page!
I only get the account ones myself because, hey, if I got two characters it's more cost effective then singular ones.
And I got like, thirty. Easily better to grab the account ones.
Deliciously nutritious!
Why do you think that this change is giving you an incentive to do missions? Alerts will still be the fastest way to level, and they will still lack all that "runnin' 'round" that missions have. Nothing about these changes makes missions a required activity. Nothing about these changes makes missions more rewarding than they are now.
Aren't you looking forward to not having to build a certain way to be useful in timed dps races? You can level healers and tanks again, and not worry that you're causing the team to fail... in fact, you'll be guaranteeing success. And of course, you'll still be able to play dps characters.
After these changes go live, you will still be able to level your way to 40 using just alerts. How has anyone convinced themselves that that is changing?
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
If they fix this issue with being able to purchase more character slots from the Store then I am a happy camper. I don't mind having to pay to enjoy certain aspects of the game that I like.
Because that is when I can have the most fun with my characters theme.
I've never had problems with playing a healer or tank in a smash. In fact more often then not people are glad I kept them alive or kept the threat off of them. Also grabs are not guaranteed to succeed.
This topic, and anyone who claims it "hurt" their playstyle, has the perceptions totally skewed backwards.
You see, taking longer to level is a good thing and here's the short reason as to why:
Answer?
Not much, mostly farming stuff for more stuff, in a nutshell.
End-game stuff for level 40's includes: getting level down to 30 do common/regular alerts, Gravitar, Therakiel with a team, Adventure Packs and Comic series with a team (best if done on Elite with a full team so you get those huge spawn sizes and more challenging foes), Vikorin the Blind, Bronze King, UNITY missions, and PvP. Team-based PvP could be a major endgame with endless variety, except that this game isn't balanced for, encouraging of, or even rewarding for PvP, particularly of the team variety (where duel-specific Flavor-of-the-Month builds often fail).
Or you could roleplay, and fantasize about locations that don't actually exist to roleplay with and type out emotions and actions that you can't actually express visually because they're not coded in the game's animations.
Or if you're like me you can do a lot with theme-building (making strong builds that are competitve yet also keep in a visual theme to appropriately match the character's lore/story/design, researching power synergies, helping teach others how to make powerful theme builds, etc.)
Or maybe PvP, if you don't mind spending a lot of money & time to gear up properly (expensive), use the latest flavor of the month min/max build (which when it's antiquated you'll have to then RetCon, which get espensive), and get insulted or have to deal with arrogant people (or be the one who talks **** yourself I guess... some people like to preen themselves publicly or grief others).
And... that's really it for things to do at level 40.
Then you could level another alt. Wait for Cryptic to release something new or a major event with a rare drop that you want to farm for shows up (and then get frustrated when you don't get the drop after trying over and over for it).
But that's all very negative thinking...
So here's another way of thinking about this, to the people whining about it being "harder" to get XP as fast. A positive/optimistic way:
Meaning? You are given an opportunity to experience more of the game's content leveling up, and that level 40 character really means something more. Having a max-level character, if take more effort, means it's a greater achievement.
Frankly, it should mean something, IMHO.
This could even be helped by Cryptic by having them give you something more substantial for actually hitting level 40. Fancy level-up fireworks that are more impressive than normal, Zone-wide announcement, and maybe something handy like an extra 40g just to celebrate all that time & effort invested.
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
I don't want fireworks erupting from my characters body when they level, and i certainly don't need to know when some random player reaches max level, and globals are easy enough to get.
All this, with bacon, cheddar, and sour cream.
Racing to level 40 in our sorry state of end-game is like Crash falling for Acid Burn's old "pool on the roof" gag in Hackers. At least he had the excuse of lack of blood flow to the brain because Angelina Jolie.
They're not there in the beginning, but when your story ends / Gonna last with you longer than your friends
"The point of the journey
Is not to arrive..."
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Good news, you'll still be able to hit max level ten times faster than any other MMO
Good news then! Nothing is going to change for you
Who said grabs were guaranteed to succeed?
Hey me too
I don't like the fireworks either. Why does my character suddenly explode when they get more powerful? ..I mean sure, some of my characters might do that.. but most wouldn't.
And as for globals being easy to get... sure. But they're also really easy to spend, and then I need more :O
Actually, I know what Draogn is talking about here. I like my characters being level 40, because that's when I can retcon them over and over and over, and it's generally faster to just farm the resources for a full retcon than it would be to level a character over again (especially when you factor in replacing gear and mods). It's fun to do a full retcon and then mess around with the whole level 40 worth of powers. Granted... that only gives me less reason to care how fast I can level to 40, since the character is already level 40.
As for stuff to do at 40.. I'll admit, I like being level 40 a lot more than I like being 6-39. Sure, there are all those missions and lairs to do when you're not 40... but I can still do all of them when i'm level 40 if I feel like it, plus there's Nemcon! Yay Nemcon!
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
This same drivel again?
In a brief sense, you're being shortsighted. This isn't against you personally, your post history seems to indicate you can reason. But in this case you're well... the evidence is to the contrary, rather strongly. I'm sorry.
Perhaps if you can put your prejudgements of your dislike of Cryptic and the lack of content aside, you can take the time to see why this creates an issue especially for new players.
Think about it: what would happen if there was a double XP weekend every weekend?
I can give you a parallel. People actually complained over time when Blood Moon was done every month, it lost it's novelty and the special items from it were no longer special. Now that it's only annual (or semi-annual), it's much more special knowing it's coming up soon.
To see my point you have to stop thinking like an individual player, and start thinking more like a game designer. Less self, more community. Less immediate gratification, more long term feeling of achievement.
And yes, for people like you or I it's even harder to see because we have done everything in the game, and then some. For newcomers? Not the same situation, and making it too easy to get to max level is going to lead to burnout that much faster for your normal player (note I said normal, statistical average or median, not individual cases, as individuals are unique).
.
Well duh, but stating an extrapolated axiom doesn't mean what I said earlier isn't truthful.
Unless:
A) Done with a team
They were rudimentary, brainstorming suggestions only; you're overreacting.
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
There's been a lot of that happening in the last few days. People are apparently letting their imaginations run away with them.... most of us see positive change, and some people have convinced themselves that it's the darkest doom yet.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Really? You are just now addressing something I wrote several months ago? In some lame attempt at a logical fallacy, and where did I say anything about Double XP weekend happening every week? Perhaps you need to read what I said a bit closer, or is this a lifetime subscribers option matter more kind of thing again?
Doing the storylines/missions as a team doesn't change the fact that the storylines are linear. The results and methods for doing the missions are the same. Things taking longer in CO won't do what you think it will.
That is nothing new. People have been declaring this game's doom since 2009 right on these very forums. 4 years later, not dead yet.
Yes, welcome to the forums where anything you write is potentially searchable.
Not a lame attempt. It is what it is.
I quoted your posts. Anyone can use the search button. And I did read what you said, did you read what I said after the quote? I proposed a hypothetical, and your response is "where did I say anything". Duh you didn't say that, I'm trying to get you to think. It seems like you didn't get my point at all, or rather I feel you're refusing to hear me out because you're being defensive and closed-minded now... This too is typical. (and btw, there is record of me saying that I've been mistaken or somebody has persuaded me to change my mind on these forums; because if the argument is solid enough then I'm open-minded to admitting I'm incorrect. In this case? Observations on making XP too easy obtain are to the contrary, they do damage to the game over time that I've observed in the forum of boredom and complaints about lack of end-game content for level 40's to do)
Experience counts for something, lifetime status doesn't. That is a very odd thing to stay, why do you think Lifetime has anything to do with this discussion? Again, that seems like yet another red herring fallacy, to garner sympathy I guess? Because you feel you're under attack personally?
I'm not being counter to you personally, but your argument is flawed in the big picture of things (thinking long-term, observed effects over time, and what's best for everyone not just you or I) Please re-read what I said about what would happen if the XP double boost thing was a regular occurence and how in the long-run that would have an effect on the game.
Then, I suggest you read on to see feedback on Smash Alerts and their observed effects from other players. There's been a ton of debate on this already in past topics:
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=236691
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=234861
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=141334
And of course the big thread that started much of the debate on the forums:
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=207001
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
I have a similar problem, too many ideas. Not enough time. resulting in 31 x 40's on 71 characters.
On the other hand due to the last dbl xp weekend I have still got 8 extra slots. I did the 35+'s at MI
Your Ghoulia is already tanking well. she was Level 10 in the Recruitment drive where we had everyone under 15. She had aggro the longest.
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If you wanna keep repeatedly and mindlessly running the same alerts over and over again, more power to you. Nothing's stopping you from doing it, however you're not going to get an unfair reward compared to what I'll get for actually playing the game. Because note: This isn't "we're changing the way you play". That's a bit of a selfish viewpoint. It's "we're rewarding everyone equally for choosing their own style of play". Because right now, alerts hold all of the cards, wield all of the power. If you want fast xp, you *have* to alert. The change will make it so alerts are still viable (we're seeing a decrease in alert xp, but you're still getting some), but playing real content is also a leveling option. Because right now, it's not even nearly a fair comparison. I do a 2 minute alert pre-30, I get a third to half a level. I do a quest? 1 box maximum, WITH the alert xp boost. Guess which one takes more time.
It has been this way since on alert hit, and I've been against it the entire time. People do alerts, and then get bored of the game because alerts are all they have to do. So, they quit. I've quit because I was bored with alerts. Twice. Once for about 6 months. I almost did so again a few weeks ago, until I decided to start my own sg. Alerts are freaking boring, and like I said: If that's what you're into, mindlessly grinding the same thing over and over again with no challenge whatsoever? Fine, have at. I'm finally gonna have XP worth mentioning for playing the way I want. This is good, we're on an equal playing field again.
If this is bothersome to you, consider that I as well have a right to play as I want. What you're campaigning for is that your way of playing should be the only way you get any reasonable amount of rewards. So, call it as it is, and don't pretend you're being persecuted. If you wanna see unfair changes that destroy someone's preferred method of play, go read the pvp forum. Perspective helps.
RIP Caine
Did we win that Alert? LoL. But yeah, I'm pretty happy with how her build has turned out. She's pretty solid. Running Dex/Con/Pre in Hybrid, with WotW/Compassion/Bite and Devour as the meat of the build. Granted I didn't have most of that stuff during that Alert.
Also, only 19 x40's on 90 characters here. As y'all can see I wasn't exaggerating, I'm a HUGE altaholic LoL. Would love to be able to purchase more slots again, as creating new things is what keeps me playing.
...so that 5% made you decide that you're going to start doing missions instead of alerts? o.o
...I mean.. you do realize that the buff being lower is actually hurting the mission runners more than the alert runners. After all, as Jonsilis likes to point out, the mission people are the ones that will run a XP alert now and then just for that buff...
So if anything, they removed 5% of the incentive for people to run missions. If they left the buff at 20%, then THAT would be them trying to incentivize you to run missions.
After all, that's 5% less XP you can get from running missions.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Doing missions...
If truly dedicated or with enough time, in a week or so you should be level 40 and if you try and do all missions from every area... you will still have at least Lemuria and Vibora Bay to do... Really... leveling doing missions is pretty pretty fast
Biggest drawback... once you have done ALL the missions, there is nothing new for you to do, and then leveling this way becomes just as much of a chore as waiting for alerts.
The real issue is not how fast you can reach 40, the problem is that there is no point doing so... "end game" content is thin at best. The game needs more missions and content, not artificially gating the leveling.
In my opinion, at least for instanced missions, they should have a minimum level but no max level, so they will always be available to you, no matter what level you are, and offering you a moderate challenge.
Make a regular group to play your alts, all start together and play them together and while you are at it, time how fast you do it by measuring the actual gameplay time.
I am not very interested in the "journey". I myself like creating characters, stories, builds, and costumes. And I like having them at 40 so I can realize and complete the build, and then enjoy playing on that.
The journey, even when it is written in large fancy font!, is either missions or alerts.
I have done the missions many many times.
I have done the alerts many many times.
Either journey no longer holds any real joy for me, personally.
I'd rather skip both journeys myself and get to half of the fun part (for me).
So that is why I ask to not make leveling alts take longer.
A couple posts say alerts will only be a little slower. Maybe I do not understand then, please? If grabs become the XP alert, and they take maybe three or four times as long as a smash, AND the XP reward at the end is smaller, it seems like it will be *much* slower, not just a little?
fudgemonsta, if it only takes a little longer, then it is not too bad. It seems like it will be much longer though (maybe I'm wrong). So yes, good god, I posted. Sorry to offend.
jerax, same thing. If it is only a little longer, that is a shame but oh well.
spinny, I addressed why I'd rather just be 40. I have leveled healers and tanks in alerts ok, though I do usually just dps until 40, when I can make the build I want. I'd love to skip that middle part.
agentx, At 40 I typically do the custom alerts and that let's me play my various 40s. I've been pretty pleased with that, and not feeling like they disappear at 40. Sure, I'd like more content too, but realistically we won't get any. Like some other games, the main content is to create another alt. Which is precisely why I don't want it to take longer.
chalupa, your post confuses me. Is there a buff to mission XP in the changes? If so, I am for it. If not, I do not understand your post calling me selfish at all. I did not ask for mission XP to be reduced. If they were buffing missions (instead of nerfing alerts), I'd be for it. I did not say anything at all about hurting missions.
Thanks for reading and replying. It is ok to disagree about something like an MMO without insulting the other person.
Everyone is allowed to voice opinions, however relatively silly they may seem in each others eyes. I just find it odd where people complain about a slight change, ina system where it is already ludicrously easy to max out a character.
You could probably think of an entire character concept in the short time it takes to level a new character, and just constantly cycle through them, it's seriously not that long. I don't get the sudden cry of disbelief when an extra hour is added.
Oh, and grabs taking slightly longer is usually rectified by the abhorrent teams of level 6's you can get in smashes that cause repeated failures. Fail six times? Probably burned half an hour right there.
Deliciously nutritious!
Oh okay, sorry bout that. This part confused me
Doesn't make sense to me since they don't give me any incentive to keep mindlessly running the same old alerts, but I do it anway
I guess you could say that my incentive... is fun s( u w u )z /coolmoose
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
I can't agree with this more. This way alert runners can still get good xp off em, but if you wanna do quests, that's fine as well. I support more options for leveling. Period.
RIP Caine
You sure you didn't mean to quote this Rush?
"That those who know what's best for us
Must rise and save us from ourselves.
Quick to judge,
Quick to anger,
Slow to understand
Ignorance and prejudice
And fear walk hand in hand."
Really, until you've leveled 20 or so characters via missions rather than NONE you really should just STFU, your qualifications are nil.
If you CHOOSE to level using only missions, fine. Choice is always good, never stymie it. Running smashes was no more mind-numbing boring than the same old missions over and over and over again and it was quick.
Now... if you thought lowbies causing smashes to fail was frustrating, wait until 3/5s of your "team" is sitting back at the starting point waiting for you to mooch-level them.
Oy.
People are broken. - Lum the Mad
Yes, I know whereof I speak. Do you?
Edit: Wait a mo, do you mean all the way to 40? Because if so, then perhaps you aren't really paying attention to what I'm saying. You're still concentrating on the destination, not the journey.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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..I wouldn't mind seeing this happen.
have to agree with this....
But OT: the main thrust of this thread to me, should be "Please make character slots NOT cap out when purchasing"
Maybe this has been answered already and I didn't see it, but is there a reason for that cap? like limited server space or something?
The current upcoming changes are only going to vex the majority of the community.
But *IS* it a slight change? I don't see how it can be. Grabs take much longer than smashes, and the reward at the end will be less.
Can anyone definitively answer this please? Because it is important. Will the new system be *much* slower than the current one, or not? And if not, how is that possible given that grabs take much longer and the reward is less?
fudgemonsta, you have a great point about failing teams slowing you down. Though the new level gate is only 10, not much higher than now.
Thank you!
Also, thank you finalslaps!
I agree 100%!
Two points here:
1. Alerts are part of the game now, so doing alerts IS actually playing the game.
2. What makes you feel that there is some sort of competition between alert players vs. mission players? If it is faster to level through one or the other, it doesn't really matter...because it isn't like there is a static XP pool that is being drawn from. You might have a valid argument if somehow players doing alerts were keeping you from getting XP from missions, but as things are, your objection seems rather silly. So...the real reason you want XP from alerts nerfed is because you are, for lack of a better term, jealous of the reward that alert players get?? There is a better solution than changing the XP that alerts give...and that is, change the XP that missions give.
Easy solution.
Yes, the gate is only 10... but the XP alert was also changed to a grab, which isn't timed. That right there by itself kicked the majority of potential fails right in the balls already.
Now, throw in the fact that new players will have 4 actual levels to get to know at least a teeny tiny bit about their characters, and maybe even throw some decent gear together. Those failure balls are looking pretty swollen.
Now, throw in the fact that that those low level tank and healer characters (and especially low level tank and healer archetypes) are no longer as useless as they were in a timed dps race and in fact are now greatly helping to contribute to success, and those balls are pretty much falling off.
Yes, grab alerts will still manage to fail somehow when the entire team is so ill prepared that they can't even make it past the trash mobs and everyone quits, or they get to the boss and nobody can tank, heal, kite, or rotate respawns effectively.... and I can also technically throw a quarter into the air five times and get tails each time. That doesn't mean it will be happening a lot.
Will grab alert leveling be significantly slower? I doubt it. Will it be more fun? Hell yes. Some people care more about one than the other. Then again, some people think it's more fun to stand still and spam powers at a stationary "boss" npc... so there's no accounting for taste .-.
Actually... the majority of the community seems either excited or neutral about the changes. It's only a small minority that has convinced themselves that this is going to drastically slow down leveling that's against it.
Also... Smash XP alert would be easier for lowbies? ...not sure I get your reasoning on that... since that isn't the case now. Smash alerts are a lot easier the higher your level is.
At this point you would have to start a new thread for the topic of character slots, cause this late in a thread it's already been lost to the back'n'forth.
...wait... are you accusing Jonsilis of trying to tell you what to do? ...that's about as silly as accusing a pig of having table manners. Jonsilis likes to level through missions, and he will talk about his love for doing so all day long, but he's never once tried to say that anyone should be forced to do so. He's pro-choice too... so... yeah...awkward
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
But I say - "Why stop there?"
Why aren't the lowbies complaining about not running Nemcom? Or Gravitar?
I can hear them now: "Why do we have to wait? We're tired of this discrimination!"
The very nature of game designers trying to balance the game leads to complaints, no matter how good the changes are. Some people will be happy knowing that Alerts give less XP, others will be upset. Some folks just don't like change.
Some people get upset when a change is made that makes things a bit more challenging, others complain when it becomes too easy.
One says "Too hot!" Another says: "Too cold" You hardly ever see Baby Bear saying "Just right". And that's not just Champions Online, I've never seen a game forum that lacked complaints.
The important thing is for those in charge to handle the complaints correctly, and do what's best for the game, instead of making a change every time someone complains.
If that happens too much, then you have another Rush song.
"The Trees"
There is unrest in the forest
There is trouble with the trees
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their pleas
The trouble with the maples
(And they're quite convinced they're right)
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade
There is trouble in the forest
And the creatures all have fled
As the maples scream 'Oppression!'
And the oaks just shake their heads
So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights
'The oaks are just too greedy
We will make them give us light'
Now there's no more oak oppression
For they passed a noble law
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe and saw
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
I would happily shove my cat-e-rangs into their various orifices
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Stop being old! Both of you! Right now! You're upsetting everyone! >:(
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
I don't really mind that they're changing up the way alerts work. I play alerts ostensibly to earn questionite, but it's actually to play with other people. I particularly like playing the more involved alerts, like Red Winter or the Pyramid Burst alerts.
I would like to run regular missions on teams, but unfortunately this game is awful when it comes to teaming with that content. The mechanics for sharing missions are inconsistent, clumsy and confusing (some missions can't even be shared) and sidekicking is a pain. Many outdoor missions are hunts for dropped items or glowies, and items your team mates find don't count against your total, which means you're competing against your own team and your team can't help you by giving you items they find. Most annoyingly, if you're too far away from team mates on a defeat mission (like those in Monster Island and Lemuria in the Unity missions) you don't get credit for the kills.
Most regular missions are so short that there's no point in having a team. The XP rewards from defeating mobs are so small that defeating them is basically pointless -- you get XP almost solely from finishing missions, so people just whip through missions as fast as possible. That's easily done when you're solo, but when you're on a team the mechanic is terrible. So I avoid teaming like the plague when I'm running regular missions, with one exception: the teaming mechanics work okay for Unity missions at level 40 because most of the bad parts of sharing missions and sidekicking aren't an issue.
However, I really like being on a team in the large lairs (like Necrull, White Rhino, etc.): they take more time, have tougher mobs, etc. There's an actual reason for being on a team. Most of them are also are about the right length for a team mission -- ten to twenty minutes. The comic series are theoretically good for teaming, but they take far too long to complete, so they're really only appropriate for soloing (because you can restart), or for running with SG mates who can commit the time or reconvene at a later time if need be.
Basically, I want teaming and sidekicking to work the way it did in City of Heroes at its end. This isn't just nostalgia talking. I've adapted to all the other facets of this game -- I get blocking, I get tap and charge powers (and like the mechanic), I like that most powers have no cooldown, I don't care that control powers are worthless (they were overpowered in CoH), and so on. But the teaming mechanics for regular missions in Champions are abominable.
Missions too high level for that character can only be shared once in some unknown cool down period, but if you play long enough it barely counts, and as long as someone has a mission every one in the team can enter the instance once they find the door, for most of the game except mission locked zones, however team teleport devices defeat those locks for a small fee.
I was against forceful sidekicking back in the day but this has to be done, let the team leader set side kicking status for everyone, give a menu with number a range from lowest in team to highest. That'd be awesome.
I was having a pretty good time Vibora Bay with a level eleven and some twenties and thirties and got some guy to forty. I got there at level 28 mashed the mobs I could between alerts and teams to sidekick and take on the meaner monsters and plow through stockpiles of missions shared and shared again.
Sidekicking is awesome, now just let me not have to hassle players to do things.
Seems like a simple thing to ask "Hey sidekick down or we don't get xp", but nothing ever is.
This is designed so you can't log in with five accounts and level them all on these missions with a single active account.
Same deal, you can't spawn five characters at the safe respawn point, send one to do all the dirty work.
Yeah I dislike these missions as well to some degree. I wish they weren't missions but just part of the perk system, just break it down into more tiers of numbers of kills and splash bonus xp and a costume drop every time you reach the tier.
This is almost true(*see below) and short missions are a good thing.
This is what happens to me almost every time with an Adventure Pack or Comic
Team up, get inside, clear part one in maybe five minutes, someone disconnects, has to go and logs out. Maybe we get to part two of the thing, same story, midway people lag out while changing zones or mid fight. My first time in Aftershock, to help some guy, the dude logged in and out about six times in twenty minutes because of network failures.
This is what used to happen for me daily for three years with 2 minutes missions:
Team up, go to mission, run it, teach them how to turn in the mission with Socrates , give them the next mission, exit the mission we were in by using Socrates, get another team mate, share a and go to a nearby mission, turn it in with Socrates, share and travel to mission, turn it in with Socrates, go to the next mission, someone disconnects, reconnects, finish the mission, turns itself in because its a Help a Citizen mission, pick up another team mate, go to another Help a Citizen mission, get another mission from Socrates and move to NPC contact, get mission from NPC, run outdoor mission for "kill x, or collect x things", at that point fatigue might set in on one or more players but the show usually goes on for someone.
There's a big difference between running five scenarios with various people instead of being stuck in one scenario with the first guy for ten or twenty minutes or two hours, or however long they stick around before unexpectedly quitting.
What do you mean? That the missions are 15 seconds to find, 7 seconds to share, 30 seconds to travel to and 15 seconds to zone into and one minute in a team to run and 15 seconds to scan Socrates to turn in the mission and 15 seconds to zone out of the mission?
Yeah that's kind of complicated.
I would rather just auto zone through them only exiting to use zone chat or the local map to find other players when the team thins. Maybe have a next map vote at the end of the missions/alerts instead of "Go back and loiter ren cen just like the mobs." Map lists could pool from the teams levels, and ideally show the levels.
You play the whole game solo and then play when everyone is maxed out.
That's easy mode.
You have no clue about teaming.
* How to take make mobs multiple, increase the XP of missions, and make things take longer:
Its very easy to make any mission at any level take ten to twenty minutes.
1. get 3 or more in a team
2. sidekick to lowest level suited for mission.
3. share mission that scales (purple reign, poe-wnd for instance start scaling with two team)
4. set difficulty to "Difficult" or higher
5. enter mission
6. run to first room and attack everything in the room
7. die
8. spam "I'm fallen and can't get up" for a minute, teams love that
9. recover
10. rush the first room again and again until everything is dead
11. repeat the rushing through rooms for 20 minutes
If its too easy you are playing missions too low level and should get some better ones.
These are terrible for teaming. Nobody ever wants to finish them.
I honestly can't get through Whiteout #1 without needing a nap, its so boring.
No game, no server, no players.That doesn't sound good.
Having teamed thousands of players in three years, I'd say they are some of the best in the business. A few quirks could be fixed, but compared to say TSW, CO's team mechanics are amazing. I couldn't even get a team in some other MMOs.
If you know another game with superior team mechanics I'd like to see it.
This game could use a lobby system and teams could be treated like a server node where their mission journals pool make up a "choose next map" list at the end of each run.
http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/forests_types/oldgrowth/types_detail.html
Think this is the most interesting part.
Oak forest is made up of species that do not tolerate deep shade, and consequently oak forest is called a "seral" forest community?one that gives way to more shade-tolerant species over time. For over 100 years, fires have been suppressed in the oak regions of Minnesota. This has made oak forest an increasingly rare type, especially on moister soils where maples and other shade-tolerant species easily invade.
If I understand it correctly, a Maple will do just fine in partial shade as it grows, in full sun it thrives all the better. But if/when the maple grow taller than the oak and cause the oak to lie in partial or almost full shade, the oak will suffer, perhaps even die since it needs a lot more sun to grow properly.
Like I said, it's not an in depth study of oaks vs maples, just a cursory look, so there's plenty of room for me to be wrong. Also, this report was written specifically for Minnesota. So... { shrug }
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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