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Some CoX refugees should stop constantly comparing
jasinblaze
Posts: 1,360 Arc User
I felt really bad for the CoX players when i heard the news. I have done a lot to help with the transition of many refugees that i meet. but this constant whining, by some not all, about how our game isn't as good as theirs is getting hard to take.
edit for clarification
We chose this game and made it our home, i know you're hurt, but stop with the comparing. we don't want our game to be exactly like yours. most of the statements i hear are broad generalizations made with little knowledge or understanding of this game. this game has a high learning curve to figure out all of it's features. Keep in mind we didn't end your game, in fact we welcome you and still do.
If your house burned down and a neighbor let you move in, would you complain about their house saying it's not as nice as yours? If your answer is yes , don't bother reading this thread, i won't make any impact on you.
Sure make suggestions but don't say that we suck compared to your game. you are just going to build a bad reputation for other CoX refugees. Keep in mind we came to this game because we liked this game better. This is our home and we love it as much as you loved yours.
Welcome to our home, I hope you can make it yours as well.
edit for clarification
jasinblaze wrote: »but the posts i see say. (in zone)
- "this game sucks it's not as good as CoX"
- "This game has hardly any customization"
- "this game will never be as good as CoH"
We chose this game and made it our home, i know you're hurt, but stop with the comparing. we don't want our game to be exactly like yours. most of the statements i hear are broad generalizations made with little knowledge or understanding of this game. this game has a high learning curve to figure out all of it's features. Keep in mind we didn't end your game, in fact we welcome you and still do.
If your house burned down and a neighbor let you move in, would you complain about their house saying it's not as nice as yours? If your answer is yes , don't bother reading this thread, i won't make any impact on you.
Sure make suggestions but don't say that we suck compared to your game. you are just going to build a bad reputation for other CoX refugees. Keep in mind we came to this game because we liked this game better. This is our home and we love it as much as you loved yours.
Welcome to our home, I hope you can make it yours as well.
Post edited by jasinblaze on
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Brick_McDuggins in game.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
I think try to convince themselves not to like it so they can deny that are addicted.
Maybe its a cry for help.
There are things it needed in Alpha that it still needs.
It's not only ex-COH players that see that.
If there had never been a COH there would never have been a CO. :cool:
I've always accepted CO and DCUO on their own terms as games and felt it was unfair to make comparisons. They are what they are.
CO's problems I feel are completely a result of the neglect of this game by Cryptic and PWE. A neglect that recently has come to light as a result of conscious business design.
It makes me angry and sad because as someone who accepted CO on it's own terms and someone who used to play the Pen & Paper game (actually I still would if there were a group nearby doing it) I see this game having so much potential. What it is already is good. What it COULD BE is amazing.
But I don't see any commitment by Cryptic or especially their masters PWE to put forth the effort. Instead CO has become a cash cow to support the newer shiny.
I'm not optimistic about the future of this game right now. I had the hope that when Neverwinter Nights came out that they would rotate some of the Devs from that game to this one.
Based on the above linked reports I don't see that happening anymore. I think they'll acquire or put into production ANOTHER new game about the time that Neverwinter is ready for release, and then THAT will become the new shiny that sucks away all the development.
I'll enjoy the game while it's here for however long that may be. But I've basically cut off any emotional investment in it. I'm no longer boosting it or actively recommending it as the COH alternative. I'll be here because my friends are. And not much more than that.
Maybe I'm wrong. Believe me, I'd like nothing better and crow would taste wonderful compared to the alternative.
I guess we'll see.
this post was about being polite and not comparing. what ever problems we have with PWE seem to be less than what paragon had with ncsoft.
if you want to make references to an out of context post not directly related to this post go ahead , somewhere else. having lived in both china and korea i can tell you that attitude is par for course over there. the division that runs this game is based in the Netherlands to the us division in Delaware to cryptic in LA.
(edit: i realized this might just be where they incorporated, its standard practice to incorporate in states and countries that give you the largest benefit, legal protection and tax cuts. the top PWI is incorporated in cayman islands btw
the only thing they probably get from PWE is you better make some money. but most of you haven't bothered to read the whole document. btw do you think any other major game out there is any better.from where i stand Cryptic isn't doing worse than facebook games
second , do you think you are helping the situation, maybe you just want everyone to quit playing and have this game disappear as well
it's about being more polite and not spamming zone and forums with comparisons all the time. other CoX players have noticed this too and think it's rude as well.
complaining wont get anything fixed, better suggestions are our best hope for improving this game
If that's the case then I apologize for mis-interpreting the situation. It seemed from the context at the time to apply to here as well. If it doesn't, that changes things.
No. It's very much on-topic. I was trying to explain how I felt about the game and how it was NOT a comparison. Thank YOU for overreacting to my overreaction.
That has not been my intent. Go look at my post history. I haven't done that in the past and in fact I've tried to be as helpful as I can be.
See above about me not comparing.
Since NCsoft cancelled City of Heroes and PWE hasn't cancelled CO I'll grant you that.
Since it seemed to be related, I didn't see it as out of context. Given the clarification you gave above, I stand corrected on that point.
That's interesting. And I'll grant you I didn't read the entire document. That's a rather convoluted chain of command. (The Netherlands? I wouldn't have called that one.) Odd that you say the US division is in Delaware. When I looked up PWE I could've sworn I saw an office on the West Coast. I'll have to check again. Maybe I have my memories confused with something else.
What does facebook games have to do with MMOs? And I thought we weren't making comparisons? I'll say what I said above. I always accepted CO and DCUO as good on their own merits. I preferred COH of course and always went back to it. But I thought CO did things better (and worse) and DCUO did things better (and worse). Each game has a particular "Feel" to it. CO is probably closer to COH than DCUO of course.
No. What I want people to do is make some NOISE and get the developers attention back on this game!
Sometimes - you just have to be, you know - THAT GUY.
Yeah. THAT GUY. The one making a scene over at the customer service desk? The one making the store rep look really nervous and embarrassed? That other customers might be edging a little away from because of the vague implication of immanent violence?
Yeah. THAT GUY.
In most cases, as unpleasant as it is to be THAT GUY, doing so often gets results where nothing else will!
Sometimes a company just won't take you seriously until you start blasting their ears off. I do try and limit my anger to the guy in Tier 1 tech support or the first guy I encounter at the service desk. But as soon as I get somebody with authority to make a decision in front of me or on the phone, and if I'm not satisfied with what they offer? If they are even the least bit condescending?
Oh yeah. It's time to become...
THAT GUY.
And THAT GUY - he gets results!
That's what I'm trying to do.
But yeah - I'm going to be THAT GUY with the squeaky wheel around here (or maybe just the annoying squeak toy). I see something I don't like, I'm gonna b-itch and moan and complain.
And sometimes I'll get it wrong.
I do try not to take offense when that's pointed out.
Though I'm annoyed at your tone, I also have to thank you for pointing out the full context. That does help restore a good portion of my optimism.
i understand your frustration. there are things that definitely need fixing.
but if this game sucks like they say, why would we want to fix it? we want to fix it because it is good and we want to make it better
but the posts i see say. (in zone)
- "this game sucks it's not as good as CoX"
- "This game has hardly any customization"
- "this game will never be as good as CoH"
and thats the rudeness i am reacting to.i am not "kicking them when they are down"
in fact i try to help when ever asked if reasonable.
but when you extend niceness and are slapped back with insults as above, i find it rude.
After all, NCSoft killed CoH with Issue 24 almost ready for prime time and a new powerset released a week and a half earlier.
And then they come here, and there's a lot of concern that CO is going to be ignored by the powers that be. And no real communication or reassurance that they're going to pull CO off the back burner and give it some real attention. Give it the care and resources it needs to really bloom, and not just treat it as disposable.
- in china as long as it still makes money they will keep it
- koreans not as much so. in korea having the best and being the best is important.
this is my understanding having lived in Asia for 6 years and being married to a Korean. because of this i expect PWE will keep this game around as long as it makes money, by money i mean profit.the lucky things are
- CO has no liscense costs , in fact they make $1 a year from hero games so this game has low overhead(same can not be said for STO)
- CO has been profitable, and despite rumors has not lost any money
so as long as the game is profitable they will keep it plugged inHere's the problem. You're being THAT GUY, sure... but when that guy went to the customer service desk at CO-Mart to complain, there was no employee at the desk, so that guy started complaining to other customers who just looked at him like "... what do you want us to do?".
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Ahhhh yes. Now THAT I don't want to see. And I'm totally with you there.
i see where your coming from, i aslo see where they are coming from. city of was a great game. however some city of vets came over here and dcu thinking it was another city of. when it is not. i think it robbed them of a great experience with this game.
that is not saying they cant complain. i complain as well. if we dont complain in a constructive way the devs wont listen.
Personally, I think it's a bit rude to go to another game and start going on about how it'll never be as good as the one you were playing before so, let me be the first CoHer to say I'm sorry that some of our former community seem to lack manners and I really hope it doesn't get any further out of hand than it already has.
My post was about this game and had nothing to do with comparing or what goes on in zone.
There is no point for further suggestions until some resources are freed up. It's clear that won't happen until NWO is launched.
If there had never been a COH there would never have been a CO. :cool:
While that's true, it also doesn't give them an excuse to come over here and pee in our cornflakes.
I understand that people will compare something to something they already knew, that's human nature. Considering how close CO is to CoX, it's a given people will do that.
It's also human nature to want things to be how you like them. Even though CO is similar to CoX it's not the same. So it's expected CoX players might like to see things changed to be more like the game they knew.
It's also human nature to defend something you like or enjoy. This is especially true of MMO's it seems. When someone badmouths a MMO someone is playing they are often offended at it and even take it personally.
So while I understand CoX players being upset, and even wanting CO to change. This is not CoX and never will be CoX, CoX systems may or may not work here. We as CO players have every right to expect some sense of civility and respect for our opinions.
The fact that they had their game shut down doesn't mean we have to put up with them being rude to us. As someone else said, if someone's home burned down and they moved in with the neighbors, you'd not expect them to critize the neighbors house.
I by no means think that CO is a perfect game. It has issues, but most of those issues are in the form of lack of content and end game systems. The basic stuff in CO, such as the combat and powers all work fairly well IMO.
CoX did have numerous things it did better than CO, without a doubt, but often times the complaints are ridiculous, or based on subjective opinion, like saying CoX had better graphics because CO is too cartoony, or complaining there's no content when all you've done is alerts.
And I'll be the second.
However, you're comparing Hookers and Strippers. Sure, they're both women you throw money at, but there are a lot of differences and common things as well.
I admit coming into CO with some generally mixed second-hand impressions, but actually playing has changed my outlook on it. I found new things to enjoy here that I couldn't even do before, which is driving my interest (and emptying by bank account? :O) further.
I think it'll be difficult to avoid saying "I'm going to miss my old game because of xyz", but there really isn't any point comparing to the point of exuding negativity, at least the way I see it.
Heroic Roleplayer @epelesker | PRIMUS Database Moderator | Brigade Advocate
So which of us is which?
For the record while I still think CoX is a better game CO has a lot going on in it that. It's not Cox. It's it's own game much like WoW, and others with it's on style that one has to get use to. And one that after (still) going thru it's learning curve I now find it just as fun. One that I see constructive crits can only make it better.
However there's a difference between constructive crits and constant carping. And the later is also starting to grate on my nerves a bit (and is starting the poison the constructive crits to make this game better).
In short while both camps have valid points this it (IMO) is starting to create two hostile camps. Something that this game doesn't need.
So at the risk of PO'ing both camps maybe it's about everyone start to 'check' themselves a bit before it all blows up into something ugly.
Again, just my 2 cents here.
F2P (here known as Silver) players visit the stripper. They get the show for free, but to see more they gotta pay a little. And to see even more, they gotta pay a little more. But they never reach what the hooker offers; full contact with all the bells and whistles...
Now subscribers (Gold here) skip the nickel and dime and pay upfront for the whole wad (pun intended). But then they find that that's for the "standard" and if you want something special, it'll cost ya extra...
It's probably more appropriate to compare the argument to who has a better pimp..
Oh, and Lock Boxes? Chastity belts...
:cool:
M-O-O-N, that spells @Rhyatt
Originally Posted by mijjestic: Ultimately, though, MMO players throwing stones at each other in this fashion is basically one nerd pointing and laughing at another nerd whose glasses are thicker.
Laws yes!
Count me as another dual-gamer of both games. As a member of both, I feel just as much right to speak out in representative of either as I see fit. But the analogy of the house burning down is as appropriate as any that could be offered. We lost our home, and no matter how nice it was, or how much better it was perceived to be, It now is just ash that has no resemblance to what it once was.
Was the house nicer? Eye of the Beholder. Is the house currently better? Only to those that can appreciate a pile of soot and char. Don't like the options you have available? go sleep on your rubble, I won't keep you away.
Honestly, all I believe is happening is that we here are receiving an influx of CoX; the good and the bad. We are gaining a ton of superb, loyal, friendly, and appreciative players, but in order to welcome them in, we also have to allow a few odd ducks and rabble-rousers to tag along.
Think of it like this- Our Neighbors house burned down, and since we love each other so much, we offered up our home to get them through this trying time. Unfortunately, they have this kid who has always teased your dog, tore up your flower garden, and broke planks off of your fence to use as a sword. Now he is running around your house, insulting your wife's cooking, leaving a mess, constantly fighting with your kids, and griping about everything around him. Your friends do what they can to keep him under control, but they can't quell it 100%. He is not dangerous, just a jerk.
Trolls just be trollin.
"Captains log: I can take up a holding pattern while engineering locates the source of this malfunction, but this area is known to be a frequent destination of pirates. If we are detected by enemy ships, we won't be able to defend ourselves."
...that was the best metaphor ever. Give this man an award.
The Doctor on the PDB
Fahrenheit on the PDB
What people need to remember and this fact is out there in the googlewebs the game that inspired Cryptic to make CO was not its previous game but Hulk ultimate Destruction/ Free roaming Spiderman games as odd as it seems
Thats the gamestyle they aimed for and they have achieved that.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
This is what I especially don't get mind you. We didn't get either the ultimate destruction, nor the free roaming wall crawling.....
It's weird.
I would have loved to see what RavenSoft could have done with Systems, while Cryptic did Art, FX and character creation. And someone else entirely for lore.
Now onto CO, CO is not a wow type MMO, this game if I may say can be seen as a experimental hybrid, its fighting game mixed with old beat them ups like strreets of rage with a super hero theme, CO is something unique so is DCUO to a degree.
So my word of caution to COh folks, the play style here is dfferent, this is not a classic style MMo its a hybrid while I agree with the lack of content for sure, bare CO's hybrid model in mind.
Hope that makes sense.
I believe in the context of the metaphor, CO is a friend-with-benefits.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Yeah. Yeah, that's pretty much on the money.
The metaphor made my day considerably less crumby even though it ended up somehow reminding me about my tour in Korea, which was pretty crumby. The correlation: drinky girls.
Both CoH and CO are decent little row houses in the Western MMO neighborhood. Comfortable but not large or fancy. Both are rented by their tenants, though they're owned by different landlords.
The CoH house was somewhat older, but the landlord's maintenance guys were top-notch and always making renovations... a new bay window for the kitchen, a better bathtub/shower, a replacement picket fence, new carpeting in the living room... nothing really jaw-dropping but nice nonetheless. But recently, the landlord decided to refocus his business. He fired his local maintenance crew, then told the tenants to get out by Nov. 30, after which the house will be razed, since the landlord wants to use the property for a new development called "B&S" rather than sell it as-is.
The CO house, while nice enough by virtue of being newer, never really got the same level of local maintenance support as the other one. It gets a new paint job here, a bit of new trim there, but very little to actually improve the quality of life for the tenants. The landlord seems to be willing to keep the house available to the tenants for the indefinite future... but frankly, it's only a matter of time before a fire or flood causes some major damage. Then, sadly, the house will likely be condemned, because the landlord is reluctant to spend any real money for repairs.
Then, too, there's the DCUO house, whose landlord is somewhat more supportive than the CO one. But the DCUO house, while flashy, is somewhat cramped and oddly designed, not really a good fit for the former CoH residents.
And let's not even consider the MUO house, still being built. It will come fully furnished and decorated. But the landlord plans to actually enforce a dress code and dictate the tenants' clothing (and even their behavior) rather than letting them live their lives as they see fit... :rolleyes:
Target1one
"ENOUGH!!! You are ALL of you BENEATH me! I am a GOD, you dull creature, and I will NOT be BULLIED by--" -- Loki
*SMASH* *SMASH* *SMASH* <pause> *SMASHSMASH* "... puny god..." -- Hulk
If I may interject.
This is close, but not quite accurate.
Champions Online's inspiration was actually the Marvel Ultimate Alliance game, with the following modifications.
Designed to play on Xbox 360, and still has a wonderful controller scheme built right in for that even though that deal fell through, Cryptic absolutely hit all the marks they aimed for, and surpassed many of the most important ones in terms of compelling gameplay and character design. They unfortunately let things slide on the continuing development side of the equation.
* Too much instancing and not enough open world objectives was a very common complaint leveled at Cryptic in early exit surveys and so on for the first three years, before Cryptic left NCsoft to focus on CO.
That pretty much describes every f2p mmo though, CO isn't special in that regard.
If we're using girlfriend metaphors CO is the geeky awkward girl that you kind of have to meet half way to do anything with her because she doesn't have any money and never wants to go anywhere
and she has herpes so there's certain areas you can't touch.
The thing is, you would be right that each game had its own strengths and merits and you cant compare them because theyre different games
but CoH no longer exists, so youre going to get CoH players here, and theyre going to compare
its just going to happen
deal with it
CO is like that MMO that you play that you invested in so you keep hanging around waiting for it to get better and partake of the momentary distractions that crop up from time to time then b*tch about what its not doing for lack of else to be interested in. Then you maybe play something else.
And it smokes in bed after sex.
Gotta stop you right there. If CO was a house, it would probably be a crack house; everyone lives there for free, some people buy product to enjoy their time there a bit more.
Re-metaphor: I rode that ***** till she was wore out.. then when I realized she didn't have anything more to give I kicked her out of bed started having sex with Nero.
Wait... I mean, started playing Devil May Cry... tho he is very pretty...
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.