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virgienok
Posts: 5 Arc User
"But that's not all! We're pleased to announce that for a limited time the Lifetime Subscription is 33% off! This awesome sale lasts till 8:00 AM PST June 14, 2018. These subscriptions come with everything you need."
I am totally confused. LS is/has gone away, and, yet, as of June 14th, they were on sale. I had recently tried to reactivate an account and was told that I couldn't because subscriptions were going away. Which is it? How do I reactivate an account?
I am totally confused. LS is/has gone away, and, yet, as of June 14th, they were on sale. I had recently tried to reactivate an account and was told that I couldn't because subscriptions were going away. Which is it? How do I reactivate an account?
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My characters
If I remember correctly that didn't happen either so far, and was simply proposed as a change which would have occured
42 40s, LTSer.
Recently you requested personal assistance from our online support center. Below is a summary of your request and our response. We will assume your issue has been resolved if we do not hear from you within 48 hours. Thank you for allowing us to be of service to you.
To update your question with additional information, please respond directly to this email or click here to view your ticket on our support site.
Response By Email (Uzul) (06/28/2018 05:29 PM)
Hello,
Thanks for your reply.
The monthly subscriptions has been removed. However, you can purchase the lifetime subscription instead. I can confirm that the transaction was cancelled which led to your subscription being cancelled.
You can access the link to purchase the subscription in other browsers aside from Edge. This is the link: https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/champions-online/news/detail/9065413.
Let us know if you have any other questions.
Regards,
Uzul
Game Master
Perfect World Entertainment
http://support.arcgames.com/
Customer By CSS Email () (06/28/2018 09:53 AM)
Ticket # 180627-001197
Thank you for your quick response. You appear to be correct - the Champions Online account was billed 12-17-17 for $ 77.94. The in-game handle is fizzex3004 with the number being something the AI added - I doubt there have been 3,004 users ahead of me with the same name, but the game *has* been around for a while.
The initial question remains: Why was the subscription cancelled if Cryptic was pushing back the PWE mandate for "Gold to be gone?" Also, I am not finding a non-Edge link to change my subscription, as a Microsoft update months ago ended their support for Edge on my computer and I have not bothered to reinstall it manually.
As my credit card on file has not expired since the last billing, I would like to be billed for another 6 months.
Thank you for your attention to this issue.
Response By Email (Uzul) (06/27/2018 10:14 PM)
Hello,
Thanks for reaching out. I understand that you'd like to check what happened to your subscription.
We can see that the most purchase for subscription made on this account was last December 2017. If you've been charged last March, you might be referring to another account. Can you provide us the email address registered on the account? Providing the @handle name would help too.
We'll be waiting for your reply.
Regards,
Uzul
Game Master
Perfect World Entertainment
http://support.arcgames.com/
Customer By CSS Web () (06/27/2018 10:00 PM)
My Gold Subscription appears to have expired without warning. I think I was on the 3-Month option, as I remember being billed on my credit card in March.
Yes, you are confused. Removing LTS was never announced at any point.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Probably not and spinnytop is more right ? righter ? less wrong ? to wait for additional official information either way.
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Not mad, not really disappointed, just bumfuzzled by the "gold be gone" - "no, not yet" - "your gold be gone" ping-pong.
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> Not mad, not really disappointed, just bumfuzzled by the "gold be gone" - "no, not yet" - "your gold be gone" ping-pong.
Yeah, exactly. So, basically, I have to buy an LTS for my currently inactive account.
@kaizerin, has the ability to start a monthly sub been discontinued without us being told or is it just CS being wrong?
It's pretty important, in CO terms.
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
Eh, no? Subs aren't actually discontinued. What the CS rep said was wrong. That's what we just established in this thread.
Someone in discord started a sub today. With screenshots to prove it. That was the post that bumped this thread.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
LTS is still available both here and in STO. The only benefit that's being removed, apparently, is the monthly Gold Sub reward (usually a costume piece, sometimes something like the Tinfoil Hat Ray or the Cowboy Ray).
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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If they can't figure out a good conversion item, this is literally their only other option. It just amazes me that they discussed this for an entire year and didn't come to this obvious conclusion o3o what were they even talking about?
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
I don't think much thought was given to the dropping subs part at all. Most of the discussion was likely about what should be included in the premium pack rather than what to do about existing and former subs. Probably some was given to going back on the LTS feature. I doubt the existing sub system's problems ever crossed their minds, as it hasn't for seven years, so they probably never even realized what stopping subs would actually do to people.
Why was this stopped?, cuz I kown some people might be pretty pissed about this
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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diddly me, you responded quickly, what was you stalking the topic? XD.
Anywho onto topic, I'm amazed as well, but I am hopeing they bring it back, but if not, not tootly end of the world.
At the same time they're telling me the money I spent on slots was completely wasted, they're trying to convince me to buy an LTS.
Any faith I had in Cryptic or PWE to solve the sub problem has completely evaporated.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Your complaints are as valid as those of an apartment-dweller who complains about being locked out of his apartment, just because he stopped paying rent a while back. It's not really yours if you didn't buy it.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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No, you don't understand.
I bought a character slot. That slot did not show up. CS is telling me that no character slot I buy will be usable until I buy enough to match how many slots I had when subbed.
I BOUGHT the slot. It is not there. I PAID for the slot.
Once more, in as much detail as possible.
I subbed. I canceled my sub. I bought a character slot. The slot did not show up in my available slots. I contacted CS. They told me that I would need to purchase additional character slots in order to match up with the amount i had as a subscriber before I would be able to use any new slots.
Again, I PURCHASED a slot. Your analogy is ridiculous and completely not relevant.
Since I'm not trolling, I have no problem agreeing with this.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Hello,
Thanks for the update. We understand that you're missing a character slot(s).
If you were previously a Gold Subscriber, you would receive extra rewards such as premium archetypes, special costumes, power tinting, etc. You would also receive extra character slots for your account.
In this case, for the Character Slot (1) x 2, you may need to purchase more character slots to match up with your original amount.
Alternatively, you could become a Lifetime Subscriber to view the total amount of character slots. You can view the CO newspage post below for additional information on a lifetime subscription.
https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/champions-online/news/detail/3028173
Regards,
[Name redacted]
Senior Game Master
Perfect World Entertainment
http://support.arcgames.com/
Followed by
Hello,
Thanks for the update. We have reviewed your message. We can see the purchases being made on JUN 30. However, you have not lost any character slots. It doesn't show up because you still need to match up with your original amount. You can continue to acquire additional character slots from the Zen Store or become a Lifetime Subscriber to see the total amount of character slots.
Regards,
[Name redacted]
Senior Game Master
Perfect World Entertainment
http://support.arcgames.com/
Also note there is no mention in either email about renewing a Gold subscription, so either CS still thinks subs are a thing of the past when they as-yet are not or they've been silently turned off.
Either way, I spent Zen on a slot. I didn't get that slot. The reason given is ridiculous.
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My characters
Well see, he bought the slot so it's actually a legit complaint now. Wouldn't you be mad if you bought slots and were told you'd have to buy more before using the one slot(how is that even allowed to be a response, I mean wow this MMO has the most piece of **** CS i've ever seen).
42 40s, LTSer.
I wouldn't post in multiple threads about it. There's no point to doing that. If people read it in one thread, they already read it. Keeping the same conversation going in parallel in two threads is pointless and dumb.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
You're right, so many people are posting in the other thread it's just too hard to keep track of the conversation. So many people have chimed in in the other thread, giving valuable insight and opinions. The thread is absolutely packed with people talking, there's no way anyone could keep up with it. One whole post since mine, it's just too much.
That's a really good argument for why keeping it going in two threads is pointless. Nobody cares o3o so why are you putting in so much effort.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
> stealthrider wrote: »
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> You're right, so many people are posting in the other thread it's just too hard to keep track of the conversation. So many people have chimed in in the other thread, giving valuable insight and opinions. The thread is absolutely packed with people talking, there's no way anyone could keep up with it. One whole post since mine, it's just too much.
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> That's a really good argument for why keeping it going in two threads is pointless. Nobody cares o3o so why are you putting in so much effort.
Glad to finally confirm that Cryptic can literally take money and give nothing in return and you'll still be an **** to anyone complaining.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
I'm fortunate in that the slot I bought was only a normal one. I asked what would have happened if the slot was FF instead. We'll see what the answer is.
Edit: Apparently FF slots are completely separate. So that's good at least. Did finally get refunded the zen, too. Shouldn't have been this difficult.
And apparently nothing new this year for July. Only putting back those from past years. For a game that is not putting out story content on the regular, Champions sure doesn't supply a lot of wow factor to the LTS when they removed the new slot at 40. Why pay to play the same thing over again when you are LTS?
Because the game is fun. I don't need a constant supply of new scenery for it to continue being fun. Also I don't care about story.
As for wow factor regarding slots, I still get 5 free slots each month and I get permanent access to all my slots forever, so that's wow enough for me.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Edits for the Edit God! Words for the Word Throne!
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Perhaps not, but I mean it's not necessarily an invalid point actually. And perhaps why the whole, 'get it for $200 during a sale!' also gets met with reluctance. It can even apply to subbing in general, really. Not to say if you sub for a particular reason it's bad.
42 40s, LTSer.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
> I think what Jon is saying is that if you have to ask why you should sub then you probably don't enjoy the game enough for subbing to be worth it. A lower price wouldn't change that either.
Spoken like someone that's never had to use the word "budget" before.
I've tried to explain sticker shock before but apparently it didn't take. Once more, then.
People don't spend money if they don't perceive that they're getting value from the purchase. Especially average players who must budget their gaming expenditures, getting them to pay for your game is not judt about making the game good. It is incredibly difficult to get someone to pay even $0.01 for a game no matter what game it is. The more you ask of a player, the fewer the number of people that will pay, and it's not a linear progression.
Every player has their own limit on what is reasonable for them to pay, and it is a hard limit. A player who would be willing to pay $1 will not pay $1.01 for the same item unless they are absolutely convinced the extra cent is worth paying. The higher the sticker price, the more you need to work to convince those players to break their limits--most will never relent even then.
Things get even more difficult when continuing payments are involved. Not only are you asking a player to spend $15, which only a tiny fraction will do in the first place, but you're asking that they keep spending $15 every month. Commitment is even worse than a higher price, as you're forgoing the snap decision payments that make up a significant portion of revenue. The more a person thinks about his purchase, the less likely he is to part with his money.
This is all for amounts $15 and less, though. As mentioned, the progression is not linear. As the price shoots up, the number of people willing to pay it goes down exponentially, and the perceived value required to secure a purchase even from someone inclined to spend becomes almost impossible to satisfy. In the age of the Steam Sale, where percevied value from a purchase is at its absolute highest ad prices drop to all time lows, convincing someone to spend upwards of $20, $30 or even $50 on your game is futile if you can't guarantee they'll be getting more value from you than from purchasing several games on sale. And that's for a brand new game, let alone a 10 year old MMO.
This is where whales come in. Their business is all but guaranteed and their limit is so high that almost any price would produce results. Top end prices are thus set with an eye for the whales while still being "affordable" for the die-hard players whose limit can be tested if not broken. The other prices need to be set differently if you want to convince players to pay, especially if the game isn't being updated regularly with new content (recycled content and assets do not count, and in fact hurt the perceived value of a purchase).
Perceived value is the key, even after you've set a price that people will pay, if you want players to keep paying beyond that first purchase. Once you've gotten players to part with their money a first time it's easier to get more from them but it is by no means a guarantee. This is where loyalty programs and benefits come in, but even without those it is important to make sure the initial payment is worthwhile to secure that player as a customer in the first place. The big thing that separates successful models from unsuccessful ones is in the value of this initial purchase.
CO's biggest problem has always been that there isn't enough value in the smaller purchases, and the larger ones are far above the vast majority of players' sticker limit. Lifetime subs could come with a steak dinner and most players still wouldnt buy simply because of the price. FF slots are the same. Players were being asked to buy a single character slot for the price of a AAA game back when it wad introduced. Nowadays most players buy games on massive discounts, meanwhile the FF slot even on sale is more expensive than a high quality indie game. Vehicles and such being per-character is another example of very limited value from a purchase.
Subs are easily the worst offender though. The Silver/Gold model doesn't just hide the core mechanic of the game behind a paywall, severely limiting how much value can be perceived from it (how can a player be convinced to sub if they don't even have a reference for what it'd be like?), but it actively punishes players for committing to it. Players that sub find themselves locked out of their free characters, the characters that presumably they were enjoying enough to be convinced to spend on, until they convert those characters to Gold. If they do convert those characters, though, then whenever they unsub they lose access to those characters in addition any new ones made while subbed. So they are forced to choose between which characters they want to play, or to sub forever or never sub at all. One of those options is cheaper than the others; remember how hard it is to convince someone to part with his money?
CO's model is a perfect example of how not to monetize a game. I was really hoping the decision to end subs was signalling that they finally realized that fact and were going to change it, but thus far, judging by the still overpriced even discounted FF slot, that appears to not be the case.
Edit: forgot to mention, a player's limit is strictly per-purchase. The same player that would spend one dollar 300 times would balk at spending $30 once. Similarly in the case of subscriptions and commitment, a player that wouldn't commit to a monthly sub for $15 may spend more than $15 every month without that commitment, or may be more inclined to spend $45 one month and nothing the next two months depending on his budget. CO doesn't offer anything of value for any of these types of players.
Edit2: the TL:DR is that it's not about whether a person is enjoying the game enough to pay, it's about whether the payments are within that player's limit and if there's perceived value from those purchases. The payment options are the problem, not the players or the game itself.
I think something similar is happening with black ops 4 to be honest with their whole fiasco, and they're a AAA game whose fan base is generally as loyal to that game as fans are to this one. Sticker shock is pretty real. Oh! And Destiny 2 with their charging of another $80(or if you only have PC, $130 to for buy-in price) for the passes/expansion. If you were a previous player of destiny and had the yearly pass, it was $80(or actually I think $90). So, a grand total of $160-170. Quite the shock.
42 40s, LTSer.
I'd been playing CO for years before my last job ended, however, and had come to the conclusion that I enjoyed playing the game (yes, over and over) enough that I wanted to pay for Gold status. So I did a little math, figured that in about 2 1/2 years the sub would pay for itself and I'd be into the profit end, and began saving money toward the end of making a single payment to secure my future entertainment.
I'm hardly a "whale"; in the years previous to this event, I'd purchased a month or two of Gold at a time, and received occasional gift cards that I used to purchase character slots, but I wasn't exactly out there buying everything in the C-store.
What I had meant by my statement was that if you really can't enjoy seeing the same content more than once, albeit in a new context (as the game does play differently depending on the sort of character you play it with), then perhaps buying an LTS wouldn't be a good idea for you. I've tried to explain why I find it fun, and every time either the person I'm explaining it to already understands, or I can't get it across to them. And that's all right - not everyone has to enjoy what I enjoy. If you don't see any point in buying LTS, don't; I'm not buying LTS in STO, for instance, even though I do enjoy the game, because Gold status there doesn't offer me much beyond the stipend. It's worth it for some people, just not for me.
Heck, there are some who've been shelling out every single month since vanilla to play WoW. I did that myself for a while, but came to the conclusion that it no longer offered me fifteen bucks' worth of entertainment every month, so I stopped. CO has already given me more than $300 worth of entertainment, so I found a way to pay.
I REGRET NOTHING!!!
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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> Stealth, I have no money. Literally, at the moment, as I'm 54 years old with outdated skills and medical issues, and thus unemployable, yet Social Security doesn't feel I'm sufficiently disabled to get to claim the disability I paid for all those years. Were it not for kindly family and friends, I'd be on the street, not sitting in a comfortable home playing games.
>
> I'd been playing CO for years before my last job ended, however, and had come to the conclusion that I enjoyed playing the game (yes, over and over) enough that I wanted to pay for Gold status. So I did a little math, figured that in about 2 1/2 years the sub would pay for itself and I'd be into the profit end, and began saving money toward the end of making a single payment to secure my future entertainment.
>
> I'm hardly a "whale"; in the years previous to this event, I'd purchased a month or two of Gold at a time, and received occasional gift cards that I used to purchase character slots, but I wasn't exactly out there buying everything in the C-store.
>
> What I had meant by my statement was that if you really can't enjoy seeing the same content more than once, albeit in a new context (as the game does play differently depending on the sort of character you play it with), then perhaps buying an LTS wouldn't be a good idea for you. I've tried to explain why I find it fun, and every time either the person I'm explaining it to already understands, or I can't get it across to them. And that's all right - not everyone has to enjoy what I enjoy. If you don't see any point in buying LTS, don't; I'm not buying LTS in STO, for instance, even though I do enjoy the game, because Gold status there doesn't offer me much beyond the stipend. It's worth it for some people, just not for me.
>
> Heck, there are some who've been shelling out every single month since vanilla to play WoW. I did that myself for a while, but came to the conclusion that it no longer offered me fifteen bucks' worth of entertainment every month, so I stopped. CO has already given me more than $300 worth of entertainment, so I found a way to pay.
>
> I REGRET NOTHING!!!
And that's why you're the perfect example of the effect of sticker shock.
At some point in your life you found committing to $15 per month to be well within your budget and the value was sufficient to get you to pay. You then did the math and found that the lump sum purchase was of more value and still within your hard limit--as mentioned, monthly commitment is a harder sell than a larger sum single payment. That puts you on the higher end of players already.
That changed, though, and I imagine that if you were looking at the options from your current position you wouldn't be as inclined to either sub or buy the LTS, would you?
Now look at it from the average player's position. Remember that the average player has to be convinced to spend anything at all, let alone subscribe or spend $300 at once.
Edit: Remember, it's not about how much a player is enjoying the game. It's about that player's hard limit. Yours may have been (and may or may not still be) higher than $300, but someone else's might not be so high (which can be said for the vast majority of players of any game). A player can think that a game is pure ecstasy, but if their limit is $10 they aren't going to spend $300 no matter what you're offering. It could pay off their student loans and it'd still be a hard sell.
Sometimes peoples limits will change. Sometimes a person's budget isn't as high as their actual limit, and they're forced to be stingier. Unless a person has an actual disorder, there is zero chance of anyone exceeding their hard limit. If they're not willing to pay $500 for something they think is worth $100, they will never be willing to pay $501, ever.
I think this more than perfectly fine
42 40s, LTSer.
I have to think about my budget every time I go to buy food, and I had to buy quite a bit less the month I bought my LTS. Now since you made an assumption about me that was completely and utterly wrong, I'm gonna guess that the rest of your post was based on your assumption, and hence the entire thing is wrong and not worth reading.
THE MYTHICAL "AVERAGE PLAYER"!!!! Do you finally have a photograph of this mythical beast!?? They better not be all blurry like the last time, it looked like they just took a picture of a rabbit wearing a ball cap. People keep referencing it yet nobody can actually find one, all we have is individual players with individual circumstances, needs, and desires!
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
You stated that you spent $1000 on Champions in one month. Not much needs to be assumed, you're either making this up or you made that up. Either way you've lied, and therefore nothing you say has any value.
Also guessing you've never worked in sales, if you've ever worked a day in your life in the first place. That's an assumption, though likely an accurate one.
I'm gonna need a source on that, because you're mistaken or making it up. Either way you added a 0, cause the most I've spent on this game in a one month period has never been above $100.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Meanwhile, for $300, $200 on sale, you get access to this game that gets bugs addresses (some solved more quickly than others, but if the "never" got fixed we'd still have the nonworking Chat from the first Nighthawk event), occasional updates, and bits and pieces of expansions (queues, mostly). And the replayability is no worse than that of any other game, and superior to some.
You really should read my entire posts, rather than skimming for the bits you want - you might find I'm not saying what you think I'm saying. And who knows, you might even learn something if you're not careful!
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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The last time you went on this little "LOL average player there's no such thing!!! LOLOLOLOLOL" bit, you stated that you spent $1000 on Champions in the last month. If anyone added a zero it was you, though you made it quite clear that it was no mistake.
I read the entirety of your post but apparently you didn't read mine. You can go ahead and do that, then, because clearly you didn't read the bit about a person's hard limit. Saving up doesn't change that limit, but as you said you wouldn't be facing the choice today as your budget no longer allows for it. Your limit hasn't changed, your budget has (or would have) forced you to spend beneath that limit, meanwhile as you say you'd still be willing to pay the $300 if not able to do so. But thanks for being condescending. Hopefully you learned something about yourself.
Some people love cycling and will drop the price of an LTS on a new bike. You don't love cycling? Well then you won't do that. ( note, 200 bucks is actually cheap for a bike, real bike enthusiasts spend way more than that ).
My super cool CC build and how to use it.