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Elder Worms: evil threat from beyond space and time or NASA dudes?

captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User
Something that always gets me is the look of Elder Worms.

They are supposed to be a huge threat to humanity -an ancient and thoroughly evil alien race that came to Earth eons ago and were barely defeated. They have slumbered for millennia and are now reawakening...MANKIND BEWARE!

Yet they look like NASA astronaut wannabes.

I understand why from a game perspective - the 'humidity' suits they wear allow them to operate just about anywhere they wish. And from a game design viewpoint, it was a smart move using a humanoid chassis for them because it saved having to go to lengthy means to properly animate worms moving, attacking, jumping, etc.

But I still think 'Astronaut!' every time I encounter them.

How about one simple tweak that would change this whole perspective.... change their basic white color palette to black. At least they would look more evil that way.

What do you all think? Would a simple color change from white suits to black make them feel more menacing?
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  • championshewolfchampionshewolf Posts: 4,375 Arc User
    The worms in suits are actually humans that have been changed into elder worm servants, a good portion of them actually. Could they use a color update and just a general look update. You bet. A lot of mobs in this game could use a look and attire make over. VIPER could ditch the green and yellow HYDRA look they got for something more sinister black and reddish but eh. That's probably something for another time.​​
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,447 Arc User
    I don't really see wearing black as making someone look more evil... probably because of all the super heroes that are switching to black attire.

    You wanna make the elder worms look more evil? Give them goatees.
  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator

    The worms in suits are actually humans that have been changed into elder worm servants, a good portion of them actually. Could they use a color update and just a general look update. You bet. A lot of mobs in this game could use a look and attire make over. VIPER could ditch the green and yellow HYDRA look they got for something more sinister black and reddish but eh. That's probably something for another time.​​

    Yeah VIPER could go black and red, then maybe the New Purple Gang can switch to Newer Black and Red Gang, Mechanon minions can switch to black and red...

    Oh wait, nah... BLACK AND RED IS A TERRIBLE IDEA!
    biffsig.jpg
  • championshewolfchampionshewolf Posts: 4,375 Arc User
    Yeah VIPER could go black and red, then maybe the New Purple Gang can switch to Newer Black and Red Gang, Mechanon minions can switch to black and red...

    Oh wait, nah... BLACK AND RED IS A TERRIBLE IDEA!

    Well, nice very straw man if there ever was one.​​
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  • jonsillsjonsills Posts: 6,314 Arc User
    "Black and red" does not of itself connote "evil", despite the number of players who think that it does. Black and red and covered with spikes and blades, a popular look for the "kicked out of hell demon-hero" types, mostly looks like "disgruntled former Hot Topic employee who's trying too hard".

    Also, the primary effect of making the humidity suits black wouldn't be to make the worms look more "evil" - it would be to make them much harder to see in poorly-lit underground environments.
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  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User

    The worms in suits are actually humans that have been changed into elder worm servants, a good portion of them actually. Could they use a color update and just a general look update. You bet. A lot of mobs in this game could use a look and attire make over. VIPER could ditch the green and yellow HYDRA look they got for something more sinister black and reddish but eh. That's probably something for another time.​​

    Some are converted humans, and some aren't (the ones with clearly robot legs and arms).

    Honestly, I'd love to see the Elder Worms in their true full worm form and human converts with worm heads in the game (ditch the suits). But because of the limitations outlined in my OP, it won't happen.

    I'm not asking for a game-wide mob revamp (I actually like the VIPER colors :tongue: ). All I'm asking for is to make the Elder Worms basic color black instead of white. I think this is a easy, simple, quick solution (something our small dev team can tackle even with everything else they do) to stop Elder Worms from looking like NASA dudes - and not really being all that scary.
  • nacito#6758 nacito Posts: 905 Arc User
    edited April 2016
    thinking in black and red just put this image in my mind

    wich is still evil?

    *EDIT: holy cow its a big image*
    Post edited by nacito#6758 on
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  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator
    edited April 2016


    Well, nice very straw man if there ever was one.​​

    Isn't he? I thought you'd like him because he's black and red.
    biffsig.jpg
  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,447 Arc User
    edited April 2016
  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User
    spinnytop said:

    Black wearing super villain #1

    You can also tell by the eeeeeevvvvviiiillllllll look on his face. :p

    (say, what ever happened to Sups being the pinnacle of good superheroes (the true boy scout)? Now, everything is all dark, and gritty, and mean, and...well just look above.... :'( )
  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator

    You can also tell by the eeeeeevvvvviiiillllllll look on his face. :p

    (say, what ever happened to Sups being the pinnacle of good superheroes (the true boy scout)? Now, everything is all dark, and gritty, and mean, and...well just look above.... :'( )

    That's what the whole DC cinematic universe is going to be. Get used to it!
    biffsig.jpg
  • bulgarexbulgarex Posts: 2,159 Arc User

    The worms in suits are actually humans that have been changed into elder worm servants, a good portion of them actually. Could they use a color update and just a general look update. You bet. A lot of mobs in this game could use a look and attire make over.

    Some are converted humans, and some aren't (the ones with clearly robot legs and arms).

    Honestly, I'd love to see the Elder Worms in their true full worm form and human converts with worm heads in the game (ditch the suits). But because of the limitations outlined in my OP, it won't happen.
    The look of the Elder Worm race is one of the things Cryptic changed from the PnP game. I guess they thought fang-mouthed and limbless looked cooler. The PnP Worms actually have limbs, and their humidity suits look less astronaut-ish than what Cryptic put up. Like this illo of them from Champions Beyond:


  • decorumfriendsdecorumfriends Posts: 2,798 Arc User



    That's what the whole DC cinematic universe is going to be. Get used to it!

    Ugh, Snyder is the poster boy for "read early '90s comics and thinks that's the way things were supposed to be".

    'Dec out

    QDSxNpT.png
  • chaelkchaelk Posts: 7,732 Arc User
    bulgarex wrote: »
    The worms in suits are actually humans that have been changed into elder worm servants, a good portion of them actually. Could they use a color update and just a general look update. You bet. A lot of mobs in this game could use a look and attire make over.

    Some are converted humans, and some aren't (the ones with clearly robot legs and arms).

    Honestly, I'd love to see the Elder Worms in their true full worm form and human converts with worm heads in the game (ditch the suits). But because of the limitations outlined in my OP, it won't happen.

    The look of the Elder Worm race is one of the things Cryptic changed from the PnP game. I guess they thought fang-mouthed and limbless looked cooler. The PnP Worms actually have limbs, and their humidity suits look less astronaut-ish than what Cryptic put up. Like this illo of them from Champions Beyond:


    um, ok, those just look....like muppets.​​
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  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator



    That's what the whole DC cinematic universe is going to be. Get used to it!

    Ugh, Snyder is the poster boy for "read early '90s comics and thinks that's the way things were supposed to be".

    Basically. Or DC is just like "Batman is the only movie we've done that was successful, must be because it's so daaaaaaaaaaaark. MAKE ALL MOVIES LIKE THAT!"

    Meanwhile, Marvel enjoys cinematic success with movies that have joy in them.
    biffsig.jpg
  • decorumfriendsdecorumfriends Posts: 2,798 Arc User
    A friend of mine explains that Warners just has this problem that they're TOTALLY embarrassed by super-heroes and think they have to be made "adult" to work, not having a clue that emphasizing what they ARE instead of making them into something else is what's working for other companies.
    'Dec out

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  • avianosavianos Posts: 5,567 Arc User
    bulgarex wrote: »
    The look of the Elder Worm race is one of the things Cryptic changed from the PnP game. I guess they thought fang-mouthed and limbless looked cooler. The PnP Worms actually have limbs, and their humidity suits look less astronaut-ish than what Cryptic put up. Like this illo of them from Champions Beyond:
    cb-ew.jpg

    Thats actually a better design! I wish Cryptic kept the original source material

    Eh! I can only hope we get those costume parts

    Thats a really nice Robe​​
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  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User
    edited April 2016
    avianos said:



    bulgarex wrote: »

    The look of the Elder Worm race is one of the things Cryptic changed from the PnP game. I guess they thought fang-mouthed and limbless looked cooler. The PnP Worms actually have limbs, and their humidity suits look less astronaut-ish than what Cryptic put up. Like this illo of them from Champions Beyond:

    cb-ew.jpg



    Thats actually a better design! I wish Cryptic kept the original source material


    Eh! I can only hope we get those costume parts


    Thats a really nice Robe​​
    I agree. This design at least portrays an kind of ancient, mystic (and evil) quality.

    For some reason I didn't think there were any hard designs for the Elder Worms and that's why Cryptic made them the way they are in-game...they only had a description to go by.

    But that's water under the bridge. I seriously doubt the Elder Worms will get a full redesign at this point (one can still hope though :)). But, to keep harping on the point, a simple color change (accomplishable even with our small dev team) would do wonders to keep them from at least looking like NASA astronauts.
  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User
    edited December 2017
    Edit: removed double post
    Post edited by captainhunter1 on
  • bulgarexbulgarex Posts: 2,159 Arc User
    I agree, but I wouldn't go with black myself. Maybe something to make the suits look less mechanical, more repulsively biological. Like ocher, or slime-green. Which not coincidentally, are the colors for the PnP rendition of the Slug.
  • kaosarcannakaosarcanna Posts: 124 Arc User
    I'm actually more of a fan of the CO look. The Elder Worms in the PNP illustration look kind of like an anorexic Patrick from "Spongebob Squarepants."
  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User
    Okay, this literally took me 10 minutes in the character creator.



    All robot parts, pointed bubble helmet (which shockingly looks really close to Bulgarex's illustration - lol) and a few spikey parts (mostly the first ones I ran across on the lists) with all colors set to black - except for the worm head which I used ochre and slime green per Bulgarex's suggestion above.

    Now imagine if this was done by someone who knew what they were doing, who spent more than 10 minutes and used specific cool looking parts, and added a few small evil color highlights...

    *ZING* No more NASA astronaut.... and a pretty good menacing look. :p
  • squirrelloidsquirrelloid Posts: 868 Arc User

    I'm actually more of a fan of the CO look. The Elder Worms in the PNP illustration look kind of like an anorexic Patrick from "Spongebob Squarepants."

    agreed. I much prefer the more vermiform look. The illustration looks like 'rejects from 60s B movie', which is not a look anyone should be wanting to emulate.

    Admittedly, I'd probably die to that. I'd be laughing too hard to be able to competently hit buttons for powers.
  • avianosavianos Posts: 5,567 Arc User
    I'm actually more of a fan of the CO look. The Elder Worms in the PNP illustration look kind of like an anorexic Patrick from "Spongebob Squarepants."

    DARN IT! I was holding myself to not make any Spongebob comparison onion-34.gif​​
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,447 Arc User
  • beezeezebeezeeze Posts: 927 Arc User
    Dark purple with a bit o black detailing, now that's what all bad guys ought to wear.

    I do like the pnp designs though, also I am a fan of 60s B movie rejects.

  • vonqballvonqball Posts: 853 Arc User
    edited April 2016
    I agree that them worms look pretty silly as is. Too bad, as they were one of the villains groups I was looking forward to (slug was a fave of mine in the pen n paper game.)

    Mystic/biotech would be the way to go with them IMO. They are a blatant ripoff of Brian Lumley's Chthonians... so they should have a more Lovecrafty vibe.
  • chuckwolfchuckwolf Posts: 272 Arc User
    I always thought the Elder Worms were evil Expy's of Earthworm Jim
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  • squirrelloidsquirrelloid Posts: 868 Arc User
    chuckwolf said:

    I always thought the Elder Worms were evil Expy's of Earthworm Jim

    Given those illustrations look like classic 80s rpg illustrations, i'm guessing they're older than Earthworm Jim by at least a few years.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,910 Arc User
    edited April 2016
    beezeeze said:

    Dark purple with a bit o black detailing, now that's what all bad guys ought to wear.

    I do like the pnp designs though, also I am a fan of 60s B movie rejects.

    It's how you know Apocalypse is evil. He wears pink and purple. People's reaction is basically "either this guy is nuts or he's the kind of guy who kicks the butt of anyone who dares mock him".
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  • chaelkchaelk Posts: 7,732 Arc User
    that's the cartoon scheme. In the comics , he's dark blue and black.
    _1442362033.jpg​​
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  • meedacthunistmeedacthunist Posts: 2,961 Arc User1
    edited April 2016
    The most common way was that that most often heroes wore primary colors while villains used secondary colors. Deviations from this scheme weren't very common till late eighties, and even then mostly when it was required by the theme, like Green Lantern had to be green, and Cpt Cold had to be blue-ish.
    Apocalypse and Magneto are pretty standard fare. If you look at modern edgelordism, then even Dr Doom or Megatron look pretty heroic compared to some actual heroes. Little red and black if any at all.
    Except one is clad in a dark brushed steel and a second one has a BFG strapped to his arm. Still pretty softcore compared to characters covered in spikes and chains.



    That's what the whole DC cinematic universe is going to be. Get used to it!

    Ugh, Snyder is the poster boy for "read early '90s comics and thinks that's the way things were supposed to be".

    Snyder got a one BIG achievement under his belt.

    BvS managed to convice a part of disgruntled Transformers fanbase that Michael Bay breaking your childhood may not be the worst thing possible...

    ...because it could be worse. tiger-2.gif​​
    Post edited by meedacthunist on
  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator
    Yup, lot of villains sported blues, purples and greens. Those colors are usually darker (value) and cooler against heroes' reds, yellows, and oranges, which are brighter and warmer. It's not a must but it does well to spark an emotional response to the colors.
    biffsig.jpg
  • meedacthunistmeedacthunist Posts: 2,961 Arc User1
    edited April 2016
    Yeah, back when it started it was a must until somewhere mid-eighties.
    I can't recall an exact date it changed and a number of colors CMYK palette allowed before, when color masters were made by hand on films, but it was extremely limited until computers started appearing in print.

    Villains had to be separated from heroes at a first glance and then both parties had to be separated from the background. Hence so many repetitive backgrounds in colors barely used for anything else.

    Nowadays it's a spoiled luxury, pretty much every color flies as long as it separates into four channels.

    ... actually, trying to work with old limited palette makes for a pretty good exercise .​​
  • guyhumualguyhumual Posts: 2,307 Arc User
    Hey, what's so evil about red and black?
  • guyhumualguyhumual Posts: 2,307 Arc User
    Also, here's my toon Dr Worm (he not a real doctor but he is a real worm).

  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,910 Arc User
    guyhumual said:

    Hey, what's so evil about red and black?


    I know right? :p
    And then you have evil guys like this:

    Yeah I'm pretty sure this is the version of Apocalypse that got adapted for the cartoon.
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  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator
    guyhumual said:

    Hey, what's so evil about red and black?

    Black, darkest color you can think of, absence of light. Red, color of blood, violence. I guess if you wanna make a character called Darkblood. Oh crap I just made a Liefeld character.
    biffsig.jpg
  • guyhumualguyhumual Posts: 2,307 Arc User

    guyhumual said:

    Hey, what's so evil about red and black?

    Black, darkest color you can think of, absence of light. Red, color of blood, violence. I guess if you wanna make a character called Darkblood. Oh crap I just made a Liefeld character.
    Darkblud you mean
  • canadascottcanadascott Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    guyhumual said:

    guyhumual said:

    Hey, what's so evil about red and black?

    Black, darkest color you can think of, absence of light. Red, color of blood, violence. I guess if you wanna make a character called Darkblood. Oh crap I just made a Liefeld character.
    Darkblud you mean
    Needs more umlauts.
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  • bulgarexbulgarex Posts: 2,159 Arc User
    Gotta love those Elder Worm starships, though.


  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,447 Arc User
    The hero and villain of Castlevania Symphony of the Night. Both wear primarily black.

    They're even both filthy vampires.
  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator
    Gasp, orange is my favorite color. Orange and black is my favorite ensemble.




    biffsig.jpg
  • guyhumualguyhumual Posts: 2,307 Arc User

    guyhumual said:

    guyhumual said:

    Hey, what's so evil about red and black?

    Black, darkest color you can think of, absence of light. Red, color of blood, violence. I guess if you wanna make a character called Darkblood. Oh crap I just made a Liefeld character.
    Darkblud you mean
    Needs more umlauts.
    ḊäṙċḃÏüḋ
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,910 Arc User
    technically these are not umlauts: Ḋṙċḃḋ

    umlauts are the double dot: äÏü

    Why yes, I do speak German. Well, a little. :p
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  • guyhumualguyhumual Posts: 2,307 Arc User

    technically these are not umlauts: Ḋṙċḃḋ

    umlauts are the double dot: äÏü

    Why yes, I do speak German. Well, a little. :p

    They're also generally only over vowels but for comedy's sake I attempted to add as many dots as possible.
  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Posts: 408 Arc User
    guyhumual said:



    ḊäṙċḃÏüḋ

    lol!

    But shouldn't the font color be black and red too?
  • beezeezebeezeeze Posts: 927 Arc User
    When did this become a thread making fun of my new main:

    Derek DarkBlud.

  • biffsmackwellbiffsmackwell Posts: 4,739 Community Moderator
    Blud isn't Liefeld enough, he never spelled it like that. Can't sully the name of BLOOD.
    biffsig.jpg
  • guyhumualguyhumual Posts: 2,307 Arc User

    Blud isn't Liefeld enough, he never spelled it like that. Can't sully the name of BLOOD.

    Didn't he make a character called Bloodwulf?
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