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FC.31.20150408c.8 PTS Update
ladygadfly
Posts: 279 Cryptic Developer
FC.31.20150408c.8 PTS Update
This build is available on PTS now, 5/13/2015.
Release Notes for FC.31.20150408c.8:
- Adds the new Variable Robot Zen Store costume.
- Adds the Graduation Cap June Subscriber piece.
- Both items are available in the Debugger store.
- There were some additional backend changes that most likely won't have any immediate player facing effect.
Regarding Known Issues:
There is some costume clipping in with the Variable Robot that we plan to address and we are especially looking for feedback on any additional categories players would like to see the Variable Robot items appear in. We do not plan to add any more materials to the Variable Robot costume.
Please format any bugs you find in the following format:
Bug
Where it happens
What happens
Please stay on topic in this PTS thread. We use bug reports from this thread to decide whether a PTS build is ready to go live, and so we need to make sure we're seeing everything in it. Please do discuss the changes, but if you find yourself writing about something that isn't specific to what's on PTS, then that should probably go elsewhere.
In particular, do not report bugs from the live game in this thread, unless they are impacted by changes in the PTS build.
This build is available on PTS now, 5/13/2015.
Release Notes for FC.31.20150408c.8:
- Adds the new Variable Robot Zen Store costume.
- Adds the Graduation Cap June Subscriber piece.
- Both items are available in the Debugger store.
- There were some additional backend changes that most likely won't have any immediate player facing effect.
Regarding Known Issues:
There is some costume clipping in with the Variable Robot that we plan to address and we are especially looking for feedback on any additional categories players would like to see the Variable Robot items appear in. We do not plan to add any more materials to the Variable Robot costume.
Please format any bugs you find in the following format:
Bug
Where it happens
What happens
Please stay on topic in this PTS thread. We use bug reports from this thread to decide whether a PTS build is ready to go live, and so we need to make sure we're seeing everything in it. Please do discuss the changes, but if you find yourself writing about something that isn't specific to what's on PTS, then that should probably go elsewhere.
In particular, do not report bugs from the live game in this thread, unless they are impacted by changes in the PTS build.
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Making the actual in-game costume takes the bulk of our artist's time, not the concept art. I wouldn't rule out the possibility of another costume contest, but we don't have any current plans to do another one either.
Because I can say with absolute certainty that I do not remember anything quite this ugly winning any sort of contest.
And REALLY? No plans for other materials, after all the posts from the last thread? Well, at least we got the graduation cap in all headwear, right?
Bugs: I'm really hoping this set is just absolutely incomplete, because it just looks like a mess. The categories are hella weird, and you can't even USE some of the pieces with each other just because of the categories they're limited to. Examples: Can't use the tights (chest/pants) with the shoulders/feet, because they're limited to categories not everything is in. Not that it really matters, because they just look like mismatched versions of the banded textures. (Seriously, the seams don't even match up.)
The pieces are also set to left/right for a LOT of the parts - making people have to select the costume part sides to even find them, rather than being listed under "both". All in all, this set looks incredibly rushed, right down to the categories. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme nor reason to...well, any of this.
Edit: Haha, oh gosh, silly me. I was expecting the female model to come with ALL the pieces, rather than missing some the males get. Yeah, females are missing some stuff.
Whelp, time to get my money ready to throw at Cryptic.
Logically, a whole community creating costume parts would usually do better then a small team of artists. I vote player-designed costumes be a thing from now on.
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Like the rest of the shoulder pads, backpieces, chests and boots (and more important, the gloves and weapons)?
And yes, parts should not be missing for females. Female characters already got a short stick with heavy armor parts.
None of the left/right costumes have a mirrorgeo entry (meaning they won't appear under the 'both' option), and for some reason are named left and right individually. This is really awkward and goes against the norm. Please don't do this.
Materials - Cloth, Leather and Metal are baseline. It doesn't matter if some costumes in the past don't have these, we've been given these three materials for costume sets for the past couple years, it's expected at this point.
Categories...lots of inconsistencies.
Back
Current
Male: Chestwear, Misc
Female: Chestwear, Misc, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both
Suggested Categories: Tight, Full Shirts, Chestwear, Jackets, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R, Misc, Skeleton
Belt
Current
Male: Misc, Integrated Shoulders, Tight
Female: Misc, Integrated Shoulders, Tight
Suggested Categories: Tight, Full Shirts, Chestwear, Jackets, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R, Misc, Skeleton
Chestwear
Current
Male: Chestwear, Misc
Female: Chestwear, Misc, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R
Suggested Categories: Tight, Full Shirts, Chestwear, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R, Misc, Skeleton
Bugs: Setting chest depth to minimum on females causes the breasts to poke through
Head
Current
Male: Heads and Hairs, Face Masks and Armor
Female: Heads and Hairs
Suggested Categories: Heads and Hairs, Hats and helmets, Half Helmets, Full Helmets, Face Masks and Armor, Hoods, Huge Humanoid Helmets, Huge Alien Helmets, Collars and Short Hair
Helmet
Current
Male: Heads and Hairs, Fullhelmet, Halfhelmet, Helmet
Female: Heads and Hairs
Suggested Categories: Heads and Hairs, Hats and Helmets, Half Helmets, Full Helmets, Face Masks and Armor, Huge Humanoid Helmets, Huge Alien Helmets, Collars and Short Hair, Bestial, Monstrous, Insect
Feet
Current
Male: Robotic L, Robotic R
Female: Robotic L, Robotic R
Suggested Categories: Tights and Skin, Pants, baggy Pants, Hips Wear and Gear, Medium Skirts and Shorts, Medium Skirts with Pants, Long Robes, Beast, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R, Skeleton
Hands
Current
Male: Short Gloves
Female: Short Gloves
Suggested Categories: Short Gloves
Leg Accessories
Current
Male: Robotic L, Robotic R
Female: Robotic L, Robotic R
Suggested Categories: Tights and Skin, pants, baggy Pants, Hips Wear and Gear, Medium Skirts and Shorts, Medium Skirts with Pants, Long Robes, Beast, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R, Skeleton
Shoulders
Current
Male: Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Chestwear, Misc, Robotic R
Female: Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic Left, Misc
Suggested Categories: Tight, Full Shirts, Chestwear, Jackets, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic L, Robotic R, Misc, Skeleton
Bugs: Shoulders do not scale with the shoulder scale.
Robot Arms
Current
Male: Robotic Left/Right, Robotic Both, Chestwear, Integrated Shoulders, Misc
Female: Robotic Left/Right, Robotic Both, Chestwear, Integrated Shoulders, Misc
Suggested Categories: Tight, Full Shirts, Chestwear, Jackets, Integrated Shoulders, Robotic Both, Robotic L/R, Misc, Skeleton
Other Suggestion: Why are these even arms? They don't attach at the joint, they should be bracers or arm accessories.
Chest
Current
Male: Chestwear, Misc
Female: Tight
Suggested Categories: Tight, Chestwear, Jackets, Integrated Shoulders
Other Suggestion: Make a robotic version of this with the arms cut off so players can place robotic arms on it.
Bugs: Shoulder scale causes the male chest to scale.
Legs
Current
Male: Tight
Female: Tight
Suggested Categories: Tight, Hips Wear and Gear, Medium Skirts and Shorts, Medium Skirts and Shorts, Short Skirts
1) First issue is with the 'armholes' on the VR Chest Wear piece - parts of it need to be cut out or something so the arms can naturally 'go there'. Yes, I realize our CO bodies aren't meant for this but...it looks bad. Also, the VR CW piece is attached to the wrong points of the body - stances affect it, and the usual moving around from side to side cause the 'rigid robot body' to bend.
2) Variable Robot L Shoulder is missing the option to work in Chest Wear (like how the R Shoulder can be).
3) VR Belt is not available in Integrated Shoulders. Also VR Belt is available under Tights & Skin, which the entire rest of the set can not work with.
4) VR Wings is only available under Robotic Both Arms, and not just Robotic Left or Right arms. VR Wings is also not available under just Tights & Skin. Why not offer it for more options? Also the costume piece is too close to the back of the body - most stances (especially the dreaded Vixen Stance) clip badly into it.
5) VR R/L Leg clips badly with the Robotic Legs 'ball joint' at the knee. Or maybe it's designed that way. Either way, it looks off.
6) What exactly is the point of VR Tight Chest and Legs? They can only be used under Tights & Skins...which the entire rest of the set can not work under.
7) Uh...where are my material options? I know you're trying to make a robot here, but...like pretty much all of the costume pieces released via the Zen Store and Lockboxes have the basic 3 Materials as options. This set is only Metal. EDIT: Yes, I know that you said you won't be doing this - yet I think your choice is a bad one. This is a standard feature of CO's costumes.
8) While I understand what you're getting at, putting all the costume pieces under Left and Right options is confusing as all get out and makes it so you can't find costume pieces under the Both header. This is BAD design.
9) Bug not of this set: Choosing Robotic Both, Left, or Right Arms under the Tops category causes the arms themselves to outright vanish. Since the set is designed around people using the Robotic Arms.....
This set, honestly, needs work to stand up with the usual Cryptic quality. There's a great concept there, but so many little things need to be adjusted and such right now. I do hope this at least is not going Live tomorrow.
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Cryptic quietly abandoned the Robot Arms chest options sometime in 2013. Just about every top-level chest option released lately has either overlaid the arms from the chest piece over the robot arms (Holoforce, Robot(!) Samurai, Tactical Armor for example) or simply aren't available (Defender 2015, Cyberpunk(!), Glow Tights, Holo Hex Armor).
They're not there in the beginning, but when your story ends / Gonna last with you longer than your friends
I hope this isn't the standard on sets to come.
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4095891&postcount=88
-Sterga
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Thank you!
...Lol. Yeah, these pieces look more like Cardboard Armor 2.0 than the stuff in that art. Seriously, how did the process fail like this? You guys have put out some wonderful things lately, but...this honestly is not one of them.
It seems this one should go back to designing until it's actually prepped and ready. The only thing that looks remotely similar to anything in that picture is the shoulderpad. And maybe the arms.
2nd and 3rd color mix up atleast on Belt, Arms and Shoulders.
And playing by myself since Aug 2009
Godtier: Lifetime Subscriber
If there isn't a cloth, leather and metal option for every costume piece to ever come you've clearly gone insane. These basic materials are extremely important and without them pretty much ruin the importance of every piece. If you aren't going to have these materials, than don't bother making costumes.
This statement isn't about entitlement, but entirely about what your company is obligated to fulfill for your customers. If you boast quality and ignore consistency, you're all talk. If you have a problem with fulfilling that, take it up with your superiors.
Bug: unseemly seams
Where it happens: Variable Robot Tight Chest (both genders)
What happens: The banded seams along the side of the torso, as well as where the shoulder socket meets the torso, do not align.
Which Zen price tier will the Variable Robot set fall under?
And playing by myself since Aug 2009
Godtier: Lifetime Subscriber
I'm done reviewing PTS stuff.
If you're not going to listen to valid feedback, you're not worth talking to.
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But it needs to be said, so I'm sorry Cryptic, but...
@mutantmaids, you are right. Every word.
I don't want this set to be realeased at all in this shape. If can't be made right it should not be produced at all.
I can't endorse it.
It makes me ashamed that I've ever submitted it for contest.
If it's released I think I'll need a link to concept art kept in handy to paste it in chat to every person who's complaining how bad this set is and is surprised why it was chosen.
It's a mess.
It's rushed, it looks like someone was using it for his learning assignment in 3d.
No, seriously. If it can't be done better, then don't release it at all. There's no point, this set will flop, this is not what people were expecting.
This seriously looks like being built by someone who has absolutely no experience with CO costume system, has serious problems with reading concept sketches, and paid absolutely no attention to adnotations.
A few points:.
1 - Tights were suposed to be more like the Nighthawk tights, except more with more square armor plates. These elements on arms and legs weren't supposed to be attachments, but part of tights.
Something with a different geometry than just a character body with different texture.
It's drawn that way because to this day CO has no good base for placing heavy armor parts on it, so I wanted to give something as a base for placing heavy armor on it , so armored characters could not look like a people wearing random boxes over tights.
It was also made that way so player can use attachments like Cybernetic Elbow on, y'know, elbows. To look even more mechanical (to not take arm or leg attachment slots).
It's even mentioned in adnotations on art.
I know tights made that way would clip with anything but heavy armor parts, but it was also mentioned in concept art. It was supposed to go only with heavy armor parts. There are already TONS of banded tights with metal texture in game, so nobody would need yet another set of average banded tights.
2 - Base materials. There should be all of them, but there's another thing:
This set was also supposed to have an additional "default" material option giving it a semi-matte look on armor parts and regular metal texture look for banded parts (like on designed tights).
It was also made for purpose, because otherwise this set could work poorly with vehicles, because vehicle models in CO has all this semi-matte texture.
Obviously the same semi-matte texture would also go for all armor partslike chest layers or boots or shoulders.
So as it is now, you made the set useless for it's prime intended purpose - working with vehicles.
And don't tell me it's suddenly not possible. Nighthawk tights and Holoforce tights have different shinyness on different parts.
3 - Tech-based blade arm:
It was another thing people were telling me it would be cool to have because the only hand-blade we have in CO is very organic looking Roi'nesh hand which doesn't fit tech characters.
The same goes for handgun arm shown in concepts. They were supposed to go with bracers because they have nearly identical bracer base, so player could be transforming his arms from fists to blades to guns by simply hitting costume change button.
4 - Variable sword/pistol:
Stop avoiding building weapon models. This was another part about which I knew afterwards that people were looking for.
5 - Having a generic camouflage pattern as an option on armor parts:
It is needed. Even if you are going only with jet parts from art, it is needed. It doesn't matter that camouflage wariant will have less coloration options for other parts of the costume part because probably like 3 of 4 color channels will be spent on camouflage. That's okay.
A single color channel left for painting everything else will do anyway, it's not like camouflaged vehicles have other colors than steel or iron gray on unpainted parts.
Because if there's no camouflage option, then this set can't work with a lot of hover tank vehicles, which again defeats one of its intended purposes.
6 - Heavy armored turbines jetpack:
On a concept sketch, but not realised.
Again, it was needed because of some hover tank models. But also because of some bike models. Both have very prominent square jet thrusters.
7 - Heavy armored turbines jetpack:
Also, jet wings are supposed to be a jetpack, with a jetpack effect. They also have very weird proportions, central part is ok, but wings themselves needs to be sleeker, windshield part shouldn't be that square. Also windshield there is not that oversized on concept art. On model it ended being the most prominent, on the concept sketch it's actually slightly smaller than engine exhausts.
Wings were supposed to be sleeker, thinner and I though I've put enough shading and line variation to indicate that hey are folded and overlapping, something like this crude sketch with wings arrangement:
Overall, it looks very crude and basic and this set as it is now fits only with the least expensive pricing category. There's no way it's worth more than 500 Zen.
And it will flop, so it it will be better to not release it at all.
No, really. Let it rest. Let it die.
If it can't be made better, then don't build it at all, because I sense incoming ****storm that nobody really needs.
I did not want to sound that negative, but... I have to.
There was absolutely no point in rushing this set, it could take a few months more and you could sell it for max price then. But as it ends, you'll have a hard time trying to sell it at all, and that's with the lowest price point.
The quality gap between this and Holoforce, Psi-Armor and Cosmic Knight is plain scary.
Let this set already die. Move to the different project and let's all hope that the Steel Arachnid set ends in a better shape.
"Give us feedback, also, we're not changing any of these things."
then?
Ahwell. I did have a small glimmer of hope, deep down. It's gone now though.
Snark never dies.
Quoted for truth.
ALL the feedback given regarding material options when the last costume piece, the Aztec Head-dress was released a couple of weeks ago.
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
Please, devs. I know you can do it. Maybe a lot of others might not, but I do. Gotcha.
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Please spend the time to make something of real worth. If CO is going to have a high price-point for costumes, make this set properly, as envisioned by Meedacthunist, and plenty of people will buy it. If done well, this would be a must-have set, like Holoforce.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
Do not release this into the C-Store. Delete it, and start all over. This looks absolutely awful.
There are none of the variety options that Meeda suggested, making the final robot form match NONE of the vehicles that I can identify. Seriously, the idea was that there were supposed to be parts that matched up with the vehicles we've had shoved down our throats... now, it looks like someone went to a junkpile of discarded C-Store vehicles and cobbled together a junkbot for Mechanon.
All the parts are blocky- TOO blocky. It looks like something that some neckbeard would cosplay in, like he built it on a budget of 200 bucks. No matter what you do with the chest wear, you look fat.
There are no material options. Not everyone wants bling-metal.
There are no weapons, and we're hurting for those since we've had some actually removed from the game.
And the tights underneath those- are you serious? Have you looked at the tights we already have? Give me a break.
This is junk and if you think it's worth what we know you're going to sell it for, you're obviously out of touch with your players here.
Take it down, start all over, and release it when it isn't an embarrassment. Go work on Steel Arachnid and then come back.
READ THE FEEDBACK AND DO SOMETHING OR JUST TAKE DOWN THE PTS ALTOGETHER.
:'^)
Now i am happy this wasen't rushed out like many other costumes under Cryptic north. I am sure you know what your doing.
Also I tested a few bugs i knew of last night. The targeting system works like it should now. You no longer click the sky and get a random trash can that you diden't even click on. Also clicking on targets now when you click on the target with the mouse it works.
Also tab targeting works like it should now to. It targets those your camara sees. Go into first person view it targets those that are infront of you and not some random mob behind you.
I do understand the view of the other posters. But I feel the best way to help with this. Is to make sure constructive help is given. Now again thank you for this one. I find it impressive just needs a little more work. Thats why it's not even ready yet and you asked for feedback.
Best to give feedback and what folks want insted of rushing.
Good luck with this.. I shall go back later to test more when it comes out.
Now i do have a charecter that I would use this on. But I do agree there needs to be more to it. But I would say make sure you read all the feedback and then fix it.
"We want your feedback. We're not going to listen to it, or do anything, but we'd like it. Just so we can look at you and say 'no'."
"We admit that some of our things are below the standard of quality that you've seen, so we're just going to double the price of everything that wasn't garbage."
"We know you want good quality costumes, and you can have those! We'll be releasing them in lockboxes and lowering the chances for you to get them. Think of it as a challenging game! It's not like you've got any other content to be playing in CO!"
No, seriously, this costume is so bad the Go-Bots are laughing at it.
So you paid 600Zen for a jacket, glasses, head acc and gloves?
Cool story bro.
I especially like the inverted normals on the Anime set and how wonderful the textures and polys on the backpack are. Or how long it took to fix the UV on the tube top, kek kek kek. Oh, lets not forget those splodges on the scientist jacket, next-gen graphics over there. :'^)
Likely this set will be fixed later than sooner, especially with this kind of community feedback- things usually get fixed when a lot of people do not like what they're shown/given. Or maybe they'll do the same thing they did to the Scoundrel Jacket, who knows.
EDIT:
I love you
By the way, I think it's a bit early to be giving up all hope - this was apparently put on PTS just before 5:30 PM local time at the studio, and it's now 6:26 AM. At least give the artists time for a cup of coffee before accusing them of being incapable!
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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If we don't throw a fit now, nothing's gonna get changed. In fact, considering the Aztec headdress stuff, there's a good chance nothing will get changed anyway. (No, I don't consider slapping the headdress into a couple of poorly-chosen categories as "fixed".) All hope was pretty much lost after that mess, for me.
Seems to me that they knew there would be comments to add other materials (understandably, since cloth/leather/metal is now standard) and they have done a pre-emptive "no".
Seems very shortsighted to me.
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
This is an intriguingly valid point. Steel Arachnid seems like it would have been simpler to release and easier to plan for if this is a newer artist.
-Sterga
Bug report
Bug
Viper soldiers in the desert and canada are still using science rifles not their own.
Where it happens
Canada, desert
What happens
Viper soldiers use science rifles
Bug
Viper technicians (guys who toss nades) are using a standard gun for melee.
Where it happens
Everywhere
What happens
Viper tech slams you with standard mutions pistol
Bug
Summoned raptors still have different tail colors.
Where it happens
Everywhere the raptors are summoned
What happens
Their tails have different colors from the main body.
Bug
On demonflame after setting the first avatar free you won't be able to exit the zone and continue the adventure pack.
Where it happens
Demonflame first avatar
What happens
After freeing the avatar and being given the option to return you can't exit the zone, the option is there but it does nothing. Neither does using socrates exit method.
Okay now that I have that out of the way I guess I need to say something about the robot set huh?
Well looks like a decent start, needs a lot of work but the idea is there.
I am gonna be reasonable here, I don't believe this to be the final product.
So until it comes to live all you people here, screaming bloody murder ... calm down ... stay calm ... observe the title PTS .... for as long as its here it won't be a final product.
If it comes to live in this state, yes you have ground and merit to be angry and I will join you!
But right now can you people give feedback on whats needed, and not raise your pitchforks and torches to storm the castle of cryptic frankenstein?
And sure I will fully agree that cryptic has a bad rep, that we are used to such things going wrong and bad.
That our trust is gone .... but I am gonna be reasonable about it. Everything in PTS I will see as not the final product. UNTIL it hits live (UNTIL heh)
Dude, are you new here?
As I understand it, the difference between 'metal' and 'leather' and 'cloth' is a level of reflection, it's not really a difficult undertaking. It's something they can honestly do easily, we've seen it done a dozen times when they've forgotten.
They've already told us 'no', they aren't going to do that.
I highly, highly doubt they're going to go back and fix this heap of garbage if they aren't willing to add the reflection level to a 3d model.
And until it comes on live I will hold my statement, thank you very much.
If they go through with it yes it will harm severly, but right now they still hold the option.
As such I hold back my final judgment until they go to live and stuck with their choices.
The Variable Robot concept art was beautiful and very well thought out. I did have serious doubts about cryptic's ability to do the set justice, but I was hoping for a decent outcome.
Seems like the ball has been dropped on this one. I think this set could have been a money-maker. Hopefully, this critical feedback will give them pause, and they take the time to get this right.
Why? Because this needs more work. And, based on how previous costume sets with serious problems have gone live with minimal additional work, I don't think your bosses will let you take the time to fix this one if the price point is a single costume set, even a 1000z one. So break it up, take the time to do it right - see Meedacthunist's feedback for what that means - and then charge us more for the final product if that's what you have to do.
Oh and also, Im going to post this here that was from another post, that was mainly aimed at...little..gradii, I'll post it here, so maybe, not only SHE can get it into her skull but everyone else.
I just went in and searched for the pieces and put them on that way, but I like the bulky pieces, very G1 Transformers in my opinion.
Now of course the wings need to be angled and the textures added. But we also have not been given a release date yet, so they have PLENTY of time to fix everything.
Though it would be nice to hear back from the Devs, communication is a two way street and by not responding you are just going to drive more people away from evening trying to help on the PTS.
I wish we could get more of what was on the original art, I guess maybe multiple costume sets?
Also, where are the weapons, those were awesome and with the inclusion of the invisible weapon parts from Foxbatcon, adding more weapon costumes should be a big things. More Bracer weapons!
Anyway, I really hope you take the detailed feedback from those here into consideration Cryptic.
Perhaps bundle the parts up with existing Z-store vehicles.
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