There's more ways to implement melee AoE than the usual PBAoEs or cones.
There's also column dashes, weapon throws, weapon extensions or straight up whips and whip-likes and razor wind.
sword blur:
w/ lightning speed (and the help of smoke bombs), ur character disappears and reappears next to each nearby target, giving them a quick slice. # of 'teleports' depends on charge time.
the 'clone' multi-strike style attack has been done in many games before, mine as well add something like it here.
w/ lightning speed (and the help of smoke bombs), ur character disappears and reappears next to each nearby target, giving them a quick slice. # of 'teleports' depends on charge time.
the 'clone' multi-strike style attack has been done in many games before, mine as well add something like it here.
That should be something Smokebomb Lunge does. A decoy advantage like that would really help characterize it as a neat ninja/illusionist lunge, rather than... Weird smoky void shift punch.
Scything Blade and Lightwave Slash already spin the character around; mine as well just turn them into sphere AoEs- it wouldn't really be out of place w/ the current anim.
I am fine w/ Cleave and Blade Tempest staying as melee cones, cause they are cheap, basic combos that can be made decent single-target and work well w/ Warden and/or Setup.
Comparing those powers to the better performing aoe like LT or epidemic makes them looks worthless. And cleave does not work well with setup, it is much to slow for that.
So I disagree, as far as I am concerned every single melee cone attack needs to do both high damage and have medium to low cost, to offset the troubles they have. Neither of those powers does anywhere near high damage.
Cleave was good when aggression was still a toggle, now it is a medium to low damage, hard to use, slow, buggy (the first hit misses a lot on secondary targets) attack. I'd expect much more out of an attack with such a small attack surface and having a 3 target limit.
Comparing those powers to the better performing aoe like LT or epidemic makes them looks worthless. And cleave does not work well with setup, it is much to slow for that.
So I disagree, as far as I am concerned every single melee cone attack needs to do both high damage and have medium to low cost, to offset the troubles they have. Neither of those powers does anywhere near high damage.
Cleave was good when aggression was still a toggle, now it is a medium to low damage, hard to use, slow, buggy (the first hit misses a lot on secondary targets) attack. I'd expect much more out of an attack with such a small attack surface and having a 3 target limit.
Wide range AoEs like LT and Epidemic set a high bar for AoEs- prob too high. I dun want melee AoE be to be comparable to that in reach and lack in need of any finesse. That doesn't mean some more melee AoE's couldn't be bumped to 12-15ft reach by default, though.
I use Cleave for Setup on my HW FF cause otherwise its tough to make any non-combo HW power hit hard. It works well enough, but its problem is more HW's general issue of not delivering on single-target dmg overall (ie. it could use a dmg buff, as could some of the powerset). Blade Tempest is fine as is, imo- its a t0 cleave aoe that has around the same or better single-target dps vs. the non-AoE combos, due to its activation time not being far off from the tooltip value (not true for the other combos, as I've seen).
I imagine that simply changing all melee cones from 10' 120 degrees to, say, 15' 180 degrees (that is, hits anything in front of character) will make a drastic QoL difference without even touching the DPS. Am I right? That way, melee sphere PBAoEs can stay at 10', and we get more powerset diversity too.
More controversially, remove all target limits for melee AoEs... tradeoff for range vs # targets hit, anyhow.
Again, no damage/cost changes needed. Just mechanics.
I use the Thunder Clap > Roomsweeper combo all the time. It only fails to knock up if I get interrupted during Roomsweeper's charge or if the stun lags till after the Roomsweeper, that happens occaisionally. I still think the spinny punch should be there just because it's an iconic attack that can't be done in CO currently.
But about the Cone AoE, I've never really had much of a problem with them, but increasing them to 15' 150° would solve what few problems that I have had with them. Oh, and removing the silly three target limit on Cleave.
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That Dork In The Suspenders, signing out.
Making new ultimates (for like every single powerset) is outside the jurisdiction of this thread. This will mostly just be tweaks.
Tweaks:
Energy Storm - Default damage is determined by your Energy Form (if none is taken, it does particle damage). Weather the Storm will also refresh the length of all elementalist debuffs. Does not affect shields in any way. The secondary effect of each debuff is upgraded:
Clinging Flames: Lowers all defense temporarily, procs a sphere effect on target.
Chill: Buffs your crit chance after use, and slows the target.
Protection Field: Shot ignores defense and knocks target away.
Negative Ions: Target gets held. In this hold, they radiate a maintained sphere of electrical damage.
Disorient (Absorb wind power): Targets nearby the main target are vertically knocked, and have their fallspeed slowed.
Stagger (Absorb earth power): Creates a cylinder effect for this attack rather than a single-target hit. All enemies get rooted, then knocked vertically, and are dealt a severe offense debuff.
Debilitating Poison (Absorbed infernal power): Targets become infected, taking high, but slow toxic damage over time. Upon death, they will create bile that does a small amount of toxic damage at their location.
Implosion Engine - Inverse polarization field does super-high crushing damage, including its knock. The damage on this attack is further boosted with stacks of Concentration.
Fury of the Dragon - Damage is slightly boosted.
Mind Link - Grants its 20% defense bonus from Aggression Inhibitor automatically. Its new advantage, "Enthralling Pain", causes Mind Link to generate very high threat instead of none at all.
Planar Fracture - No charge necessary - It's a click that acts a whole lot like Unleashed Rage. Each tick can now stack any debuff possible, instead of just one debuff. The advantage is replaced with "Eldritch Secrets", which spawns a random horror once the duration of Planar Fracture ends. They usually entail qliphothic beasts, but sometimes also can bring through dark tentacles that will inflict psychotic breaks upon enemies.
Concentration - Can stack also if Melee attacks are charged/maintained halfway. Has advantage "Fierce Fire", where fully-charged Blasts will have a chance to negate the charge period of the next blast you use.
Compassion - Has advantage "Morale", which causes Compassion Stacks to provide its damage boost to your allies.
Manipulator - Holds can now actually affect bosses for a split second, effectively acting as an interrupt. Interrupts can also stack Manipulator. Has its stacks reduced to a standard length (~30 seconds). Has the advantage "Crippling Cage", which causes maintained holds to not end if the target breaks out, and causes them to do increased damage if maintained beyond hold.
New Powers
Empowerment (Elementalists) - This toggle will grant you extra ranged damage, with a small buff to melee damage. Empowerment automatically stacks over time, though the stacks do not grant energy. When attacking targets with moves other than Energy Builders, Empowerment stacks are used up to boost the damage, with maintains using stacks up one at a time, and charges using them all up at once for a huge boost. Using up these stacks grants a small boost of energy. Scales best with EGO and END.
Advantage: Full power! - Having 8 stacks of Empowerment activates a special "Full Power!" Buff, which grants an extra damage boost on top of existing stacks, and counts as an energy form. If not used up, it can persist for a few seconds after stacks of Empowerment are removed.
Bravery (Brick) - Increases the user's defense, with a minor boost to attack power. It does not stack, but it will generate some energy when attacks are directly aimed at you. Its bonuses scale with STR and CON.
Advantage: Magnificent Presence - Your attacks now generate increased threat, and allies nearby you gain extra resistance to AoE attacks. 3 points.
Protege (Tech) - When nearby any allied targets (pets, team members, other heroes, etc) the user gains a decent boost to Attack, Defense, Healing power, and Energy Efficiency. It does not stack, does not generate energy, and has a diminished effect while soloing, but its effects scale with any superstats.
Advantage: Unity - For each person on your team that's using Protege with this advantage, you gain further buffs.
Come to think of it, I'm contemplating changing Targeting Computer into a toggle form, and swapping out the TC passive for something like "Weapon Upgrade" that gives the same core buff that TC had (but better), with TC spawning debuffing crosshairs over enemies that raise your chance to crit/defense/whatever. Thoughts?
That should be something Smokebomb Lunge does. A decoy advantage like that would really help characterize it as a neat ninja/illusionist lunge, rather than... Weird smoky void shift punch.
Personally, I think that effect would be best put on a new active defense to make it more interesting/unique. When clicked, you become invulnerable/untargetable and rapidly swoop to every enemy within a large radius and deal substantial damage (to make up for the fact that you can be mobile during other active defenses), at the end you recieve a heal based on targets hit.
That'd be way overpowered for an AD. I'd also classify that as an Ultimate - maybe some potential thing Fury of the Dragon could end up being. There's some other issues on how I'd imagine it'd be possible to implement the player character jumping automatically from one target to the next, but regardless AD's really should just be kept to defenses.
I fully agree that more lunges in general should have some kind of mechanic that damages all enemies between your starting location and end location, but so far I haven't seen any evidence that that's even something the engine can handle. Heck, enemies like Gigaton have 'cylinder' lunges, and both Vicious Descent and Seismic Smash have AoE effects, but they all occur after the lunge has been completed. If I had had confidence it could be done, one of those weapon martial arts lunges would most certainly have it.
Concentration - Can stack also if Melee attacks are charged/maintained halfway. Has advantage "Fierce Fire", where fully-charged Blasts will have a chance to negate the charge period of the next blast you use.
Compassion - Has advantage "Morale", which causes Compassion Stacks to provide its damage boost to your allies.
Manipulator - Holds can now actually affect bosses for a split second, effectively acting as an interrupt. Interrupts can also stack Manipulator. Has its stacks reduced to a standard length (~30 seconds). Has the advantage "Crippling Cage", which causes maintained holds to not end if the target breaks out, and causes them to do increased damage if maintained beyond hold.
[snip]
Come to think of it, I'm contemplating changing Targeting Computer into a toggle form, and swapping out the TC passive for something like "Weapon Upgrade" that gives the same core buff that TC had (but better), with TC spawning debuffing crosshairs over enemies that raise your chance to crit/defense/whatever. Thoughts?
I'm not sure what to think about the new forms you want to add, so I'll just address the tweaks to the old ones:
Concentration - Having it stack stacking from melee attacks is an odd choice, although I can almost see why you would do that. Slight problem though, the half-maintain clause makes it better for melee powers than for ranged ones because with ranged powers it requires exactly four ticks after the initial attack. Could you change it so that even ranged attacks only require a half maintain? Also, I love the advantage.
Compassion - I love the advantage. It's AoED the toggle form!
Manipulator - These sound wonderful and I like the advantage. Not having rolled a crowed control toon myself, I have to ask: does the advantage obviate the need for Manipulator to grant hold HP?
Also, I am a bit surprised that you didn't make an Enrage form that stacks from half charges and full combos. Especially since your Concentration can now stack with any attack power in the game.
I don't think it's worth it to turn Targeting Computer into a form...
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That Dork In The Suspenders, signing out.
The concentration change is mainly to compensate elemental/melee builds that might want to mix things up with extreme close-up spike damage. To put it into a bit of perspective, Form of the Tempest would be its mirror form: It can stack on any attack type, but favors melee damage over ranged, while Concentration can stack on any attack, but favors ranged over melee. And then there's Vengeance which stacks on any attack and favors neither.
In any case, Manipulator or no, Hold HP's stupid and useless. But to accurately answer the question I'd definitely say yes, as it grants very substantial hold/stun buffs. You haven't steamrolled an alert until you've charged in with a Thunderclap that stuns enemies for upwards of 6 seconds.
The charge/combo enrage form was, predictably, buried under a huge pile of other stuff.
but I heard that Earth was one of the few sets where charging has higher DPS than taps.
This should be the formula for All Charges, not tap spam to Out DPS Charges(thanks Cryptic), defies the point of Charge powers purpose in the first place, It's relatively simply, Faster firing rate for less damage while Charge = Spike, simple.
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
This should be the formula for All Charges, not tap spam to Out DPS Charges(thanks Cryptic), defies the point of Charge powers purpose in the first place, It's relatively simply, Faster firing rate for less damage while Charge = Spike, simple.
Except if you do that, then you remove any reason for people to use taps. If full charges have both best dps and best spike... why would you ever not charge your attack as full as possible? Especially important when you consider that there are some attacks who also already have other effects (knocks) that increase as you charge the power. Throw on top of that that charges are generally more efficient in regards to energy than taps are.
The way it is right now is better because it provides a choice to the player; which is better given the target, dps or burst? DPS or efficiency? Targeting Versatility or Burst? How important is it to maximize the non-damage effect of the power? and more.. these are all choices the player must make when using one of these chargeable powers, nearly all of which disappear if you push best dps and burst to the full charge end (the only one that remains is targeting versatility, but it becomes "Targeting Versatility or Burst+DPS?").
Due to the hidden delay that lengthens activation time beyond what tooltips indicate for most powers, its likely that most powers are better when charged than when tapped atm anyways. It takes silly extremes like Hard Frost or Mind Opener to make taps really stand out, or time-based mechanics like find the mark, AM, and expose weakness to make them better. Otherwise, if the dps is comparable (as it likely will be w/ the activation time delay), its better to just use charges for higher numbers and much better efficiency.
There really should be a more dedicated test done on those charge powers to truly determine which ones are better tap/charge. Stuff like Haymaker, Earth Attacks, and Reaper's Embrace definitely seem to do more when full-charged, but on the other hand, I'm much better at pissing enemies off when I tap-spam Burning Chi Fist instead of charging it repeatedly (I experienced this. Fighting Viper-X with it-since his armor makes him resilient to fast weak attacks-I was only able to grab aggro on him one out of three times, and that one time was when I was spamming BCF instead of charging it.)
There really should be a more dedicated test done on those charge powers to truly determine which ones are better tap/charge. Stuff like Haymaker, Earth Attacks, and Reaper's Embrace definitely seem to do more when full-charged, but on the other hand, I'm much better at pissing enemies off when I tap-spam Burning Chi Fist instead of charging it repeatedly (I experienced this. Fighting Viper-X with it-since his armor makes him resilient to fast weak attacks-I was only able to grab aggro on him one out of three times, and that one time was when I was spamming BCF instead of charging it.)
well, I'm working on it ><
If ya follow the general guidelines here and apply them to the raw #s in my base dps sheet, ya can kinda see for urself how it may end up.
Like now, going just by the tooltip info, for ex:
Eldritch Blast tap = 129dmg / 0.5sec = 258 base dps
EB charge = 507 / (0.5+1.5) = 253 base dps
tap is slightly better dps at base, assuming tooltips are correct.. which they aren't, really.
Assuming the activation delays and minor compensations on charges (<- latter not extensively tested yet):
That'd be way overpowered for an AD. I'd also classify that as an Ultimate - maybe some potential thing Fury of the Dragon could end up being. There's some other issues on how I'd imagine it'd be possible to implement the player character jumping automatically from one target to the next, but regardless AD's really should just be kept to defenses.
Ah yeah, it would make a much more suitable ultimate for MA. In any case, the character doesn't need to move anywhere, they could simply disappear for the duration while an animation plays that show them swooping everywhere (damage being dealt in a large sphere and perhaps a 25% chance to miss to make it behave and seem more like quick barrage of singular strikes).
Not sure if it's been mentioned, but I feel Parry's damage return effect should only apply to the primary target. Having to predict the timing of one attack versus the timing of other attacks is ridiculously clunky.
There really should be a more dedicated test done on those charge powers to truly determine which ones are better tap/charge. Stuff like Haymaker, Earth Attacks, and Reaper's Embrace definitely seem to do more when full-charged, but on the other hand, I'm much better at pissing enemies off when I tap-spam Burning Chi Fist instead of charging it repeatedly (I experienced this. Fighting Viper-X with it-since his armor makes him resilient to fast weak attacks-I was only able to grab aggro on him one out of three times, and that one time was when I was spamming BCF instead of charging it.)
Right now it's pretty safe to assume that powers will do more DPS on charge than on tap, unless the power does something special on tap - e.g. as Flow mentioned, Hard Frost or Mind Opener.
As a general rule of thumb you can add 0.15 seconds to the tooltip activation time of most tapped powers, including combos, to account for the delay and 0.1 seconds to the tooltip time for charged powers (there's some weird compensation taking place when queueing charges). That should be a good approximation for the most part with some exceptions like Blade Tempest and Breakaway Shot.
Apart from Hard Frost and Mind Opener, taps are still good for a few applications.
For one, it's good for getting some damage out before being interrupted - I do this in Warlord since that alert is knock city.
For another, animation cancel allows you to skip the delay and is a big reason why some kind of "more dedicated test" is impractical.
And of course if you have CripC or CStrikes, the fixed amount of +threat will proc on every tap, even if the taunt doesn't.
The main problem with many charges right now isn't so much tap vs charge but that many Blast powers and charged AoEs just plain suck. Avenger Mastery helps to offset that somewhat but requires very specific builds and no amount of build magic is going to make a base 2xx power like Straight Shot or Condemn outdps Base 4xx powers like 2GM and UA'd Conflagration. And then there's Chain Lightning which I have no idea what to do with. On the melee side, most charges are pretty good though, like the Dragon's series, Annihilate, Haymaker and Ego Blade Breach.
Mauler - Enrage form that stacks whenever landing melee attacks above half charge, or completing combos.
Advantage: Controlled Combat - Attacks no longer inflict knock. Knock is instead transformed into a small burst of extra damage.
Ooh. Yeah, somehow I missed this the first time you posted it. I like the advantage, but I feel like we should also remove all built in knock immune damage (that isn't from Controlled Combat) and maybe buff all the effected powers by ten to twenty percent.
Also, you still didn't answer this question: would concentration stack on half-maintains just for melee powers, or also for ranged powers? Because it would be a nice improvement if it worked that way for ranged maintains.
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That Dork In The Suspenders, signing out.
The maintain clause in Concentration's based off of number of ticks. If you get 4 out, you stack. And most maintains trigger once every 0.5 seconds, and go for at least 4 seconds.
But then we got crushing wave, which lasts 4 seconds and only triggers once every second. So sometimes when you full maintain you'll get a stack, but most of the time you just end up pushing people out of range and not getting anything out of it except crap damage. Not to mention that you're already taking twice as long to stack Concentration anyway.
On the animation cancel thing, I'm... not sure if that really counts because for a fact I know that Ebon Ruin has a very strange animation where the attack comes out instantly but has an extremely long after-attack lag. Unless it's supposed to be showing how other attacks can be prepared/used while another attack animation is finishing up, in which case that happens pretty much every single time someone uses Unleashed Rage, and then follows it up with a charged haymaker: You end up charging that attack while UR's animation's finishing up!
Basically it might be the case we're not giving charges enough credit, all things considered. Which might also support the idea that maintains are god, charges are crap (considering how many maintains heartily outdo charges in terms of DPS and efficiency).
Now this makes me want to see what happens when you combine Ebon Ruin with a /powerscancelallactivations bind - whether that would cancel out the after-attack lag Ebon Ruin has or not...
The maintain clause in Concentration's based off of number of ticks. If you get 4 out, you stack. And most maintains trigger once every 0.5 seconds, and go for at least 4 seconds.
But then we got crushing wave, which lasts 4 seconds and only triggers once every second. So sometimes when you full maintain you'll get a stack, but most of the time you just end up pushing people out of range and not getting anything out of it except crap damage. Not to mention that you're already taking twice as long to stack Concentration anyway.
Just to clarify some things about Concentration to help explain its interactions w/ CW a bit more:
-All maintains get an extra tick at the start of the maintain (after the activation+delay) as long as they are held down at least briefly (not just tapped). This extra tick is why CW hits upto 4 times instead of 3 (since its channel time is only 3 sec).
-This extra tick does NOT count towards Concentration's 4-tick proc. Try any other ranged maintain when up-close and count the ticks - you'll notice you get the Conc stack at the 5th damage tick, not the 4th. Since CW is technically limited to 3 ticks that count towards Conc, it can never proc it that way.
-When using ranged AoEs, only your current (focus) target will be the counted toward the 25ft range check. This means that even if there's an enemy at max (50ft) range getting hit by the AoE, Conc won't proc if your current target was still <25ft in. It is possible to start the AoE on a <25ft target, tab/click on a further out target while maintaining, and get Conc to stack that way as long as more ticks happen. Oddly, this tabbing trick also works for tabbing to enemies not caught in the AoE, and even for single-target spells (at least in the PH it does; try it if ya dun believe me :x ). It seems the game uses ur current target for the 25ft range check, and not simply whichever one it was at the spell's activation.
-Thus, the only way of getting CW to work w/ Conc atm is to using it while having a target on focus that's >25ft out. If the repel pushes ur focus target past the 25ft range, it can proc the stack that way too.
On the animation cancel thing, I'm... not sure if that really counts because for a fact I know that Ebon Ruin has a very strange animation where the attack comes out instantly but has an extremely long after-attack lag. Unless it's supposed to be showing how other attacks can be prepared/used while another attack animation is finishing up, in which case that happens pretty much every single time someone uses Unleashed Rage, and then follows it up with a charged haymaker: You end up charging that attack while UR's animation's finishing up!
Basically it might be the case we're not giving charges enough credit, all things considered. Which might also support the idea that maintains are god, charges are crap (considering how many maintains heartily outdo charges in terms of DPS and efficiency).
Now this makes me want to see what happens when you combine Ebon Ruin with a /powerscancelallactivations bind - whether that would cancel out the after-attack lag Ebon Ruin has or not...
Flow clarified Concentration so for animation cancel, pretty much the idea is yes, some attacks like UR Haymaker, PF MR and Shadow Blast Ebon Ruin can make the second attack trigger right after or even during the animation of the first attack.
What happens in the case of say, Shadow Blast followed by Shadow Blast, is that you get this:
1.5 sec charge Shadow Blast
0.5 sec fire Shadow Blast
0.1 sec mystery delay
Shadow Blast again
But in the case of Shadow Blast followed by tapped Ruin:
1.5 sec charge Shadow Blast
0.5 sec fire Shadow Blast 0.0 sec no mystery delay
0.67 sec fire Ebon Ruin
0.1 sec mystery delay
Shadow Blast again
So the mystery delay that happens when chaining other attacks or the same attacks doesn't happen between Shadow Blast and Ebon Ruin.
And yes, many common attack combinations do exhibit this property although there hasn't really been a detailed look into it.
hey I added some new tweaks to those new Power Armor abilities that were released, as well as an extra feature on some muni abilities:
Rocket Punch: Want it wider, and does higher damage the fewer enemies it hits. Having it be an exploding fist missile might also be nice, but then again Tac Missiles kind of do that already.
Aspect of the Machine: Now, instead of stacking whenever you kill, you stack and get energy by fully charging or fully maintaining attacks. This makes it more restrictive than Concentration (i.e. slower) but similarly flexible, and ensures full combat prowess, even when up against a big boss. Actually, in light of this, I might have to erase the suggestion for the Vengeance form...
Binding shot: now adapted for the general charge-hold overhaul I've been doing, where taps are a normal, decent-strength hold, and charges have an extra effect. It no longer does damage, to differentiate it from Bolas. Instead, it serves as an effective defense debuff!
Sniper Rifle: It can be tapped/partially charged, but doing this incurs a high chance to miss your shot. This gives it the potential for very high, but also extremely erratic DPS. And it can also still be interrupted by damage incoming. Focused Shot also works similarly.
Aimed Shot: Single pistol blast. Aimed shot has you hold up a single pistol, take aim as you charge, and then fire. As you charge, crit chance and severity shoot up. However, the base damage does not.
Grenade Launcher: Similar to rocket launcher, but does less damage, has lower range, does only crushing damage, and knocks. Also can be used twice as much as rockets before getting a recharge.
Sorry for the Sudden Bump, I had been away for Two Months!
I Support ALL suggestions and Teaks on this Thread! 100%
There are some things that I would to Highlight
I recently learned that the current incarnation of Minimines is actually a complete accident. It used to be a Crushing/Fire type attack, but somewhere along the line of debuffs, the Crushing aspect was just entirely dropped and never compensated. This was after Minimines also got a previous damage debuff, and I think also an energy-up. Keep in mind, most of this I learned from people who've played the game longer than me.
I believe that I have read about this incident on forums
Apparently they accidently Overnerfed Mini Mines, they were supposed to fix them/balanced them but instead forget about them and left them to die...?
Not sure what's wrong with the Night Warrior change... Thing about it, I kind of hold the opinion that Shadow Strike shouldn't have existed - on top of doing way too much damage, it thematically doesn't fit all characters (like I say, not all characters stab people with their fists). On the flipside, this change makes it so that you can sneak-attack with whatever cool precision strike you want (Dragon's Bite? Focused Shot? Sniper Rifle?), AND the end damage output most likely will be a bit lower (i.e. more balanced).
Nevermind, I just misunderstood the change
Your Suggestion is Awesome, it can turn any power into Alpha Strike move I like it
Reaper's Lunge - Single Blade Lunge. When done far away enough, it will stun the target.
Advantage - Coup de Grace : Reaper's Lunge also ruptures bleeds.
Riposte - Click power. When activated, you will be disabled for 3 seconds. You are immune to the first hit you take, and you will counter at the first enemy who hit you. However, being hit with enough damage will end up knocking you back, disabling your counterattack.
Reaper's Whirlwind - A skilled, maintained maneuver of the blade is capable of hitting all enemies around you. Deals moderate-to-low slashing damage; each tick has a chance to apply, stack and refresh bleed on all targets hit.
Advantage: Veil of Steel - When active, user is granted a major extra defense bonus. This is applied to all damage, but taking hits now will drain energy and reduce Reaper's Whirwind's damage.
New Powers:
Falcon's Dive - Lunge with claws. Falcon's Dive knocks the target down if done from far away enough.
Advantage - Falcon Talon: All hits now apply/refresh shredded
Mantis' Frenzy - Cone maintain. This deals out a rapid flurry of claw swipes in front of you, doing high slashing damage and randomly applying shred to your targets. The primary target has a 10% chance to get shredded per tick, while the rest have only 5%.
Advantage - Reaping Slash: Changes the move into a charge.
New Powers:
Steel Hurricane - Dual Blade Lunge. Has no on-hit bonus, but hits in a cone in its location of impact. Same recharge as normal.
Advantage: Blades of Woe - If a target is defeated by Steel Hurricane, they will erupt in a small spherical burst of Slashing damage.
/Quoting this for Future reference
HEY!
HEY DEVS
HEY CRYPTIC NORTH!
YOU SEE THOSE 3 POWERS LUNGES
THOSE SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN GAME FROM DAY 1
THIS GAME IS 5 YEARS OLD AND WE STILL DON'T HAVE 3 BASIC LUNGES FOR OUR WEAPONS!
:mad:
Why exactly there is Single/Dual Blade Lunge animation only available for Laser Swords and TK Blades is beyont me!
Also to add Salt to the Injury the Mooks in the Hi-Pan: Fury of the Dragon alert ACTUALLY use SINGLE-BLADE Lunges against you
Come on Cryptic. Why? is it SO EXPENSIVE to program those powers ingame?
/Sorry for that, but it REALLY bothers me being a Fan of Sword-Themed characters and all...
Fluidity - Works waaaay different. Blocking animation changed to position you assume when charging up Acrobatics. When you press a direction to move, you use up some energy to make a diving roll in that direction, further boosting your dodge and avoidance, and allowing you to quickly and responsively escape AoEs. If done without enough energy, the roll is still performed, but at a slower speed.
Basically what Sterga was suggesting I presume(?) (Ala Guild Wars style where you make your characters use Dodging Maneuvers)
I ADORE THIS! i have a character who Heavily Devil May Cry/Bayonetta inspired and I don't want to block neither waiting for the RNG GODs to give me Dodge chance!
I want to DODGE in STYLE~! like that
New Powers:
[*]Riposte - Click power. When activated, you will be disabled for 3 seconds. You are immune to the first hit you take, and you will counter at the first enemy who hit you. However, being hit with enough damage will end up knocking you back, disabling your counterattack.
This sounds familiar
The Fire Eblem characters in Super Smash Bros. Games (Marth, Roy, Ike, Lucina) have a Down Special Move: called Counter with Similar effect, whick require PERFECT timing
If that's the case I AM FULLY APROVE OF THIS!
Also we could get MANY Expies/Reskins of One Hundred Hands into Cone Attacks Sword Rain comes in mind, Single Blade | 120 AoE Cone Attack: Rapidly Stab with your sword your enemies, Change to apply Bleed/Aplly Bleed on all targets on FULL CHarge
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
Thanks for the feedback, dudes. My only regret is that there isn't really anything left to tweak.
Considering how the cryptic engine has some really solid dodge-roll animations now, thanks to Neverwinter, there's definitely some possibility that Fluidity could be tweaked to work as such. The big difficulty is changing the control scheme around properly to get things rolling properly while you're holding shift.
Also amusingly, my mental image of a zero-energy fluidity roll? The Dark Souls Fat Roll.
I'm generally sort of opposed to reskins of other powers. IIRC Reaper's whirlwind is meant to be sort of like that, though also distinct in how it can be used to deflect bullets and stuff while it's active (via advantage). Similar story with Mantis' Fury.
A rapidfire kick could be useful, though. After trying to design a kick-themed hero, it seems sort of odd that all of the kick attacks are comparatively low-power compared to all the awesome punches we get. Might add a couple things. Check back on page 2.
That's exactly my main Complain with Kick-Based Martial Arts ingame as well!
Too Few, most are AoE/CC/BUFF/DEBUFF but none is Pure Alpha Strike damage
I ever made a Suggestion Thread for more More offensive Unarmed KICK attacks since the current available are really Lackluster in Offensive Aspect
As for the One Hundred Hands Attacks Expies I suggest that because 1. It would be awesome 2. Melee NEEDS more Maintain Attacks 3. It will be easier and faster for DEVs to design them (Reskins are Lazy but "Apparently" CO doesn't have enough resources for new animation... ಠ_ಠ
I like your suggestions for Typhoon Kick and Lance Kick, I forgot to mention them (Sorry you made so many Appealing Suggestions that I don't know what to mention first O__o)
Really loving the Lunges, Melee-Elemental attacks, The Expansion of current powerframes!
Too many to mention!
Primal Elementalist - Offense Passive, Primal Elementalist gives the user boosts to fire, ice, and electrical damage types, and will place 'curse' effects on its targets. Curse will automatically empower any stack of Negative Ions, Clinging Flames, or Chill, into Bristling Aura (hits nearby targets with very light electrical damage once every second, lowers resistance to Electrical damage), Agonizing Inferno (targets take more fire damage, and will get interrupted once every 8 seconds), and Frigid Miasma (target takes higher cold damage, and can get held if hit with further cold attacks).
Empowerment (Elementalists) - This toggle will grant you extra ranged damage, with a small buff to melee damage. Empowerment automatically stacks over time, though the stacks do not grant energy. When attacking targets with moves other than Energy Builders, Empowerment stacks are used up to boost the damage, with maintains using stacks up one at a time, and charges using them all up at once for a huge boost. Using up these stacks grants a small boost of energy. Scales best with EGO and END.
Advantage: Full power! - Having 8 stacks of Empowerment activates a special "Full Power!" Buff, which grants an extra damage boost on top of existing stacks, and counts as an energy form. If not used up, it can persist for a few seconds after stacks of Empowerment are removed.
Those two powers right here, PERFECT for my Elemental Mages! :biggrin:
Also, how come and you didn't added the two addition Enraged Stacking Toggles (Rumbler and Brawling Stance) you suggested on other Thread?
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
Reason you didn't see Typhoon and Lance kick is because I just edited them in yesterday!
Rumbler and Brawler - Or some incarnation of them - are included in the Heavy Weapons and Earth sections. One's non-knock based, and the other's Stagger-based.
EDIT: I snuck in a directory on the OP for ease of access.
how about another Lunge for Ice mirroring Seismic Smash from Earth (its the one that Madstone likes using in her (it is a her right?) Alerts)...summons a chunk of Rock and then smashes the target through it, but of course this time being a chunk of Ice...and call it: Cold Shoulder...
Did not read anyone else's posts beyond yours Bluhman. So I'm not sure if this is already addressed or not. But I think its a bad idea to link certain stats to certain powers. For that limits builds and makes those stats more desirable over other stats when making a build. If anything energy unlocking powers should instead scale based off of secondary super stats. And anything else that is not an energy unlock should use the primary super stat. Same could be said of specialization choices to (this is why stats like con and int are "op").
I think its a bad idea to link certain stats to certain powers. For that limits builds and makes those stats more desirable over other stats when making a build. If anything energy unlocking powers should instead scale based off of secondary super stats. And anything else that is not an energy unlock should use the primary super stat. Same could be said of specialization choices to (this is why stats like con and int are "op").
I'm probably going to need some ideas for where this specifically occurs, but from what I can remember, I mostly am tying stat requirements to powers and abilities where that's usually the norm (i.e. toggles, energy unlocks, and specific pets).
More importantly than that, though, as a principle, I was assigning many of the stat-tie-ins to stats that, at the moment, are actually treated as underpowered. I'm well-aware that Con/Int are super powerful at the moment; the former due to how much it just flat out grants extra suitability and the latter due to the number of abilities that are tied to it. Most of the adjustments aim to dampen that impact by assigning extra scalings with things like Ego, Endurance, and Recovery.
Sorry to say this but it seems that the devs do not take a look at this thread and labeled it as a hot topic.
Since I am here, what if PFF is scaled to PSS. But this would be a problem if someone's PSS is CON. Any thoughts on this.
Accelerated Metabolism - Has a 100% chance of triggering if usage of the move reduces energy to below 10% max. energy, but still retains its cooldown of 15 seconds.
Energy Builders - Ranking up EB's raises their damage by 50% per rank instead of 20%. This way, you can get your EB to be a reliable, decent DPS attack with ranks - however, in practice, it shouldn't outperform other builds at all, due to DPS still being lower despite a lack of energy cost, as well as the lost advantage points.
Pretty short, but they were random thoughts I had a while back and I thought I'd just throw them out there.
I find it interesting that what you suggest for Shatter is more or less opposite of what I would propose. I think that instead of making it a better damage dealer, I rather it gain a recharge, lower the base cost, and return more energy per structure destroyed. I like that it's a more active energy return mechanic than an Energy Unlock passive. Just wish it were better at returning energy.
"Interesting builds are born from limitations not by letting players put everything into one build."
I find it interesting that what you suggest for Shatter is more or less opposite of what I would propose. I think that instead of making it a better damage dealer, I rather it gain a recharge, lower the base cost, and return more energy per structure destroyed. I like that it's a more active energy return mechanic than an Energy Unlock passive. Just wish it were better at returning energy.
That's an interesting perspective on Shatter, but what I fear will happen with that implementation (and what has already happened pretty widely) is that it'll just be entirely skipped in favor of a more generic Energy Return ability. High burst damage would justify it as an option between the more consistent Avalanche move, and the more technical and hopefully much more devastating burst of Shatter.
Then again, that mindset doesn't really preclude the player from just taking both and laying powerful ice smack-downs, but on the other hand, that sort of setup would put it on par with the other elemental AoE nukers (Fire? Extreme stacking of defense down. Electricity? Balls of lightning hitting while negative ions chain, all under a lightning storm. Ice? Avalanches that lead into a sudden Shatter burst).
I was bored, and thought up of a series of advantages that could be added to all passives in the game, giving each a bit of character. All are 1 point, so they do supply a little extra bonus, while not being precluded by rank limitations.
Fiery Form: Raging Fire - PBAoE burn pulse is strengthened further. In addition, all fire patches and pets within 25 feet of you gain extra strength.
Electric Form: Maximum Charge - Gain up to 10% bonus damage depending on current percentage of energy available. The higher, the better.
Ice Form: Thin Ice - Cold Snap will automatically activate once every 8 seconds in combat, and Ice Form can now chill any targets that attempt to hit you.
Personal Force Field: Deflector - Each hit you take has a small chance to hit the enemy in retaliation for a proportionate amount of crushing damage.
Kinetic Manipulation: Gravity-Root - Grants stacks of Gravity-Root to you while you're standing still, up to 5. Each stack increases your knock resist, but all stacks are instantly lost if you move.
Stormbringer: Stormy Disposition - As you get lower on health, you will gradually generate stronger pulses of repel passively.
Equipped (munitions): Covert - You generate less threat with your ranged attacks.
Quarry: Fleet-footed - Become slightly resistant to snares and slowing effects, and passively move faster.
Medical Nanites: Nanomachines - Allies who take damage while in range of your nanites gain a small amount of defense.
Invulnerability: Armored Mind - Immune to Fear and Placate effects, and gain a fairly substantial boost to hold resistance as well.
Targeting Computer: Search Algorithm - Grants a bonus to stealth sight. You also will instantly lock-on to the primary target of any attack you use.
Lightning Reflexes: Ukemi - Recover instantly from knockback: You are not disabled from using your abilities when knocked anymore, and are only forced backwards.
Way of the Warrior: Practiced Brawler - Gain substantial bonuses to knock and hold resistance.
Night Warrior: already has Silent Running.
Congress of Selves: Conditioning's now only 1 point in cost.
Ego Form: Mindreader - Enemies under the effects of an ego DoT, or any other mental status (fear, etc) has a defense penalty to your attacks.
Id Mastery: Maniacal - Gain greater resistance to root, snare, and hold as your health goes lower.
Defiance: Force of Will is now only one point, and also is buffed.
Unstoppable: Massive - Grants bonus damage to ranged attacks, and all attacks against knock-resistant enemies.
Earth Form: Shifty Footing - When using or charging attacks that normally root you in place, you can move around at a reduced speed.
Seraphim: Balance is now only one point, and is buffed: The passive heal/hurt effects are greatly boosted if the given targets are afflicted with illumination.
Shadow Form: Past Shadows - When you kill targets, or when you apply a Psychotic Break effect, there is a chance that you will summon a single Shadow temporarily to fight for you. When killing targets, this chance is 50%, whereas applying the psychotic break is only 5%.
Aura of Arcane Clarity: Divination - Allies who fall low on health gain boosts to crit chance and dodge chance.
Aura of Primal Majesty: Immaculate Form - Boosts the bonuses you get from superstats by 30%
Aura of Ebon Destruction: Dark Covenant - Critical hits you land have a bonus chance to remove the energy cost of your next attack.
Aura of Radiant Protection: Martyrdom - When you are defeated, you leave behind a protection sigil that radiates a 30 foot radius defense boost that is as strong as your Aura of Radiant Protection. This sigil is undefeatable, and lasts for 15 seconds.
Arcane Wizard: Magical Armor - Attacks you sustain will be mitigated based on how much energy you have available.
Primal Elementalist: Absolute Elements - Grants bonus damage to Crushing (Earth and Wind) and Magical Damage types. Curse's effects do not extend to any new debuffs, however.
Ebon Necromancer: Harvester - Instead of summoning ghosts when enemies are killed, they grant the user stacks of Harvested Souls, up to 20. This advantage also grants the user the ability to 'summon ghost', which uses up all the harvested souls to summon an empowered ghost - the more souls you had, the stronger the ghost is.
Radiant Paladin: Bane of Evil - When defeating an enemy, inflicting crippling challenge, or using an active defense, you radiate a 15 foot PBAoE that inflicts fear in all targets within range.
Regeneration: Reactive Hide - When taking damage, the amount of damage resistance you get increases instead of decreases.
Pestilence: Venomous - Grants the user a minor boost to melee piercing and slashing damage.
Sorry to say this but it seems that the devs do not take a look at this thread and labeled it as a hot topic.
Well it's a big thread... but for all we know it's filled with suggestions that a professional would look at and say "all these are terrible". So, you know, keep that in mind before condemning the devs for not singing its praises ^_^
I find it interesting that what you suggest for Shatter is more or less opposite of what I would propose. I think that instead of making it a better damage dealer, I rather it gain a recharge, lower the base cost, and return more energy per structure destroyed. I like that it's a more active energy return mechanic than an Energy Unlock passive. Just wish it were better at returning energy.
This for me as well. I think Shatter is creative and interesting, which the game could use more of.
Since we seem to be on this roll of ultimates recently, here's silly suggestions for other cool T4s:
Electricity: Electrobeam - Maintained cylinder attack, it works quite similarly to a 100 ft. version of Plasma Beam, but has a few key differences: It suffers from a somewhat slow activation time, and snares the user while in use, but also has only an energy cost on the first pulse of damage, and hits very hard and consistently, with Negative Ion stacks jumping rapidly between targets.
Fire: Firestorm - A charged PBAoE blast that creates a massive explosion of fire, sending enemies nearby flying away from you swathed in several stacks of clinging flames. In usual fire fashion, it leaves numerous patches of fire, all of which do higher than average damage and will snare enemies within.
Ice: Blizzard - With one click, you conjure up a giant snowstorm about yourself, blinding enemies stuck within and dealing continuous cold damage, all while repeatedly chilling enemies in ice cages and threatening to stun them if they get near the center of the storm. This move also debuffs resistance to cold damage.
Wind: Tornado - With a charge, you summon up a huge tornado pet, which randomly gravitates towards targets on the battlefield and rapidly pulls enemies in. When they hit the tornado, they then get knocked up and often around the tornado repeatedly for crushing damage, with the knock sometimes ignoring enemy rank or resistances.
Archery: Phalanx Buster - Charged cylinder attack. During the charge, the user rapidly fires arrows up into the air. After it's released, a curtain of arrows descends in front of the user, with range increasing depending on charge period. Enemies caught in the Phalanx Buster have severely reduced resistance to piercing damage, are rooted for an extended period, and take extreme damage.
Munitions: Brothers In Arms - Acting as a team-wide active offense, Brothers In Arms will provide you and your allies with resistance to all snares and roots, increased movement speed, and massively improved recharges and damage output for 30 seconds. Its usage, much like an AO, also breaks you out of control effects.
Gadgeteering: Railgun - You whip out a massive railgun, charging up a beam that hits all enemies in a wide line with a multiple-tick laser, trapping them in a stun while taking particle damage.
Power Armor: Power Drones - Another Active ability, Power Drones deploys a pair of orbiting drones around you, which provide moderate constant healing, a sizable defense boost, and doubled-damage ticks on every Power Armor attack you do, as the drones themselves mirror the same PA attacks you use. It has a standard 15 second duration.
Dual Blade: Blade Barrage - Maintained attack; when used, you constantly move forward while dealing out highly-damaging slashing damage in all directions around you. Enemies hit will become pushed back, potentially being knocked into your next damage tick. The crit rate on this attack is extremely high and can build focus very quickly if using Form of the Tempest.
Single Blade: Sailing Sword - A mighty conical-charged lunge, this hits all targets within 25 feet of your arriving destination on use with a wide Iaido-like slash, instantly afflicting all enemies hit with stacks of bleed. Depending on distance from the hit, it will apply 1-5 stacks, with the most being given to the closest targets.
Fighting Claw: Tiger's Fang - A charged, sword-cyclone like attack that will hit all enemies within a wide berth around you (30ish feet) for melee slashing damage. The longer you charge, the longer a lingering slashing effect will maintain around you, continuously slicing at nearby enemies. The damage it deals out also is notably boosted by Shred, moreso than usual.
Unarmed: Master Technique - A maintained super-combo that hits a single target for concentrated damage, while also not skimping on collateral damage. This attack will hit your target from all angles as you warp around them with rapid punches and kicks, while also stunlocking them and removing their ability to fall in case they're airbone and being knocked away. Other nearby enemies will also take half damage, but are not stunned. While using the master technique, you also have a very high dodge and avoidance rate.
Telekinesis: Ego Bomb - A charged PBAoE that slams a gargantuan orb of Ego energy into the ground, knocking every target nearby down and rooting them. The attack also deals out a stun, which has a duration that scales with stacks of Ego Leech on you.
Telepathy: Mindreader - A unique ultimate that changes function whether targeting an enemy or not. When an enemy is targeted, the selected target (any rank except player/legendary) and nearby others (below master villain rank) become enthralled to you (not unlike Endbringer Grasp) and gain a small damage buff - after the duration is complete, or if they resist, they then take strong Ego damage. If nobody is targeted, Mindreader instead heals all allies nearby by 25% of their health, reviving defeated allies, and grants them 3 seconds of damage immunity.
Heavy Weapon: Colossal Swing - A charged PBAoE attack with a massive 60 foot range, you burrow your weapon into the ground, building up strength, and subsequently uproot a huge chunk of land onto your weapon - which you then subsequently swing like a gigantic sword. This deals massive crushing damage, disorients all targets, and has an irresistible knockdown effect, paired with a sizable knockback.
Earth: Volcano - A charged summon, this creates a rather large volcano pet that appears beneath your target, knocking them and nearby enemies away. After it's up, it then spews fiery lava in random directions (think like those stupid Monster Island meteors) and will attempt to repeatedly knock nearby targets down with quakes, all while doing rather high crushing damage to enemies within 50 feet (damage scaling up the closer they are).
Might: Meteor Smash - You lunge into the stratosphere, temporarily becoming untargetable and immune to all damage. During this period, you can still move freely, but after a few seconds, you slam back down to earth with a chunk of space rock, and create a massive knockback-explosion of crushing damage, hurting enemies within 25 feet of your landing destination. The more enrage you have, the larger and more violent your meteor becomes.
Celestial: Sanctification - Lays down a sanctified area beneath you, which will constantly heal allies within and boost their defenses. Enemies within here also become very vulnerable to damage, with an extra debuff against dimensional. The sanctification also has a lingering 5-min buff that will cause allies to self-resurrect if killed, with 1HP and temporary invincibility.
Sorcery: Chronomancy - Every enemy within 50 feet of you is dealt an entirely irresistible 15 second stun. While in this state, they also are counted as flying, become resistant to all knockback, and gain slight defense. They also just freeze in the current animation they're doing.
Bestial: Mauling - A lunge that will knock nearby targets down, after which you climb on top of your main target and begin tearing the crap out of them for extreme slashing damage. If the target is defeated, you begin to regenerate health at a fast rate.
Infernal: Plague - With a charge, you unleash a plague on top of your target, leaving a patch of terrible miasma upon them. While inside, they are severely debuffed, with a horrible snare, lowered recharge and attack power, and a severe weakness to toxic damage.
Depending on how close I am to the char limit, I might give the sorcery classes their own unique ones. Some of these (melee) might need some way to be scaled up.
I'm amazed you didn't tweak Sub-Machine Gun. Here how I would do it:
Sub-Machine Gun:- Aggression Advantage reduce to 1 point. New Advantage "Dual Wield" 2 points:- Allows the player to dual wield SMG dealing double damage per tick.
SMG to me seems quite weak since its damage drops with more target it hits. This is just one way to bring it up.
Regeneration: Reactive Hide - When taking damage, the amount of damage resistance you get increases instead of decreases.
I feel that this should increase resistance to the last damage type you are struck by and provide a stackable buff (maybe 3-5 stacks of that resistance type) that are dropped if the damage type changes.
"There is only one way to support a PFF tank: Send Cyrone lots of money weekly... because he's the only one to successfully be a true PFF Tank." - chuckwolf
Comments
sword blur:
w/ lightning speed (and the help of smoke bombs), ur character disappears and reappears next to each nearby target, giving them a quick slice. # of 'teleports' depends on charge time.
the 'clone' multi-strike style attack has been done in many games before, mine as well add something like it here.
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
That should be something Smokebomb Lunge does. A decoy advantage like that would really help characterize it as a neat ninja/illusionist lunge, rather than... Weird smoky void shift punch.
Comparing those powers to the better performing aoe like LT or epidemic makes them looks worthless. And cleave does not work well with setup, it is much to slow for that.
So I disagree, as far as I am concerned every single melee cone attack needs to do both high damage and have medium to low cost, to offset the troubles they have. Neither of those powers does anywhere near high damage.
Cleave was good when aggression was still a toggle, now it is a medium to low damage, hard to use, slow, buggy (the first hit misses a lot on secondary targets) attack. I'd expect much more out of an attack with such a small attack surface and having a 3 target limit.
Wide range AoEs like LT and Epidemic set a high bar for AoEs- prob too high. I dun want melee AoE be to be comparable to that in reach and lack in need of any finesse. That doesn't mean some more melee AoE's couldn't be bumped to 12-15ft reach by default, though.
I use Cleave for Setup on my HW FF cause otherwise its tough to make any non-combo HW power hit hard. It works well enough, but its problem is more HW's general issue of not delivering on single-target dmg overall (ie. it could use a dmg buff, as could some of the powerset). Blade Tempest is fine as is, imo- its a t0 cleave aoe that has around the same or better single-target dps vs. the non-AoE combos, due to its activation time not being far off from the tooltip value (not true for the other combos, as I've seen).
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
More controversially, remove all target limits for melee AoEs... tradeoff for range vs # targets hit, anyhow.
Again, no damage/cost changes needed. Just mechanics.
But about the Cone AoE, I've never really had much of a problem with them, but increasing them to 15' 150° would solve what few problems that I have had with them. Oh, and removing the silly three target limit on Cleave.
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Making new ultimates (for like every single powerset) is outside the jurisdiction of this thread. This will mostly just be tweaks.
Tweaks:
Powers Tweaked
New Powers
Come to think of it, I'm contemplating changing Targeting Computer into a toggle form, and swapping out the TC passive for something like "Weapon Upgrade" that gives the same core buff that TC had (but better), with TC spawning debuffing crosshairs over enemies that raise your chance to crit/defense/whatever. Thoughts?
Personally, I think that effect would be best put on a new active defense to make it more interesting/unique. When clicked, you become invulnerable/untargetable and rapidly swoop to every enemy within a large radius and deal substantial damage (to make up for the fact that you can be mobile during other active defenses), at the end you recieve a heal based on targets hit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ly5sTZdqG4k#t=85
As for Smokebomb Lunge, the advantage could transform it into a "ninpo" dash that damages enemies between you and your target.
I fully agree that more lunges in general should have some kind of mechanic that damages all enemies between your starting location and end location, but so far I haven't seen any evidence that that's even something the engine can handle. Heck, enemies like Gigaton have 'cylinder' lunges, and both Vicious Descent and Seismic Smash have AoE effects, but they all occur after the lunge has been completed. If I had had confidence it could be done, one of those weapon martial arts lunges would most certainly have it.
I'm not sure what to think about the new forms you want to add, so I'll just address the tweaks to the old ones:
Also, I am a bit surprised that you didn't make an Enrage form that stacks from half charges and full combos. Especially since your Concentration can now stack with any attack power in the game.
I don't think it's worth it to turn Targeting Computer into a form...
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In any case, Manipulator or no, Hold HP's stupid and useless. But to accurately answer the question I'd definitely say yes, as it grants very substantial hold/stun buffs. You haven't steamrolled an alert until you've charged in with a Thunderclap that stuns enemies for upwards of 6 seconds.
The charge/combo enrage form was, predictably, buried under a huge pile of other stuff.
This should be the formula for All Charges, not tap spam to Out DPS Charges(thanks Cryptic), defies the point of Charge powers purpose in the first place, It's relatively simply, Faster firing rate for less damage while Charge = Spike, simple.
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
Except if you do that, then you remove any reason for people to use taps. If full charges have both best dps and best spike... why would you ever not charge your attack as full as possible? Especially important when you consider that there are some attacks who also already have other effects (knocks) that increase as you charge the power. Throw on top of that that charges are generally more efficient in regards to energy than taps are.
The way it is right now is better because it provides a choice to the player; which is better given the target, dps or burst? DPS or efficiency? Targeting Versatility or Burst? How important is it to maximize the non-damage effect of the power? and more.. these are all choices the player must make when using one of these chargeable powers, nearly all of which disappear if you push best dps and burst to the full charge end (the only one that remains is targeting versatility, but it becomes "Targeting Versatility or Burst+DPS?").
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
well, I'm working on it ><
If ya follow the general guidelines here and apply them to the raw #s in my base dps sheet, ya can kinda see for urself how it may end up.
Like now, going just by the tooltip info, for ex:
Eldritch Blast tap = 129dmg / 0.5sec = 258 base dps
EB charge = 507 / (0.5+1.5) = 253 base dps
tap is slightly better dps at base, assuming tooltips are correct.. which they aren't, really.
Assuming the activation delays and minor compensations on charges (<- latter not extensively tested yet):
EB tap = 129 / 0.655 = 196.9 dps
EB charge = 507 / 2.09 = 242.6 dps
activation delays can really hurt tap-spamming atm
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
Ah yeah, it would make a much more suitable ultimate for MA. In any case, the character doesn't need to move anywhere, they could simply disappear for the duration while an animation plays that show them swooping everywhere (damage being dealt in a large sphere and perhaps a 25% chance to miss to make it behave and seem more like quick barrage of singular strikes).
Not sure if it's been mentioned, but I feel Parry's damage return effect should only apply to the primary target. Having to predict the timing of one attack versus the timing of other attacks is ridiculously clunky.
Right now it's pretty safe to assume that powers will do more DPS on charge than on tap, unless the power does something special on tap - e.g. as Flow mentioned, Hard Frost or Mind Opener.
As a general rule of thumb you can add 0.15 seconds to the tooltip activation time of most tapped powers, including combos, to account for the delay and 0.1 seconds to the tooltip time for charged powers (there's some weird compensation taking place when queueing charges). That should be a good approximation for the most part with some exceptions like Blade Tempest and Breakaway Shot.
Apart from Hard Frost and Mind Opener, taps are still good for a few applications.
For one, it's good for getting some damage out before being interrupted - I do this in Warlord since that alert is knock city.
For another, animation cancel allows you to skip the delay and is a big reason why some kind of "more dedicated test" is impractical.
And of course if you have CripC or CStrikes, the fixed amount of +threat will proc on every tap, even if the taunt doesn't.
The main problem with many charges right now isn't so much tap vs charge but that many Blast powers and charged AoEs just plain suck. Avenger Mastery helps to offset that somewhat but requires very specific builds and no amount of build magic is going to make a base 2xx power like Straight Shot or Condemn outdps Base 4xx powers like 2GM and UA'd Conflagration. And then there's Chain Lightning which I have no idea what to do with. On the melee side, most charges are pretty good though, like the Dragon's series, Annihilate, Haymaker and Ego Blade Breach.
Ooh. Yeah, somehow I missed this the first time you posted it. I like the advantage, but I feel like we should also remove all built in knock immune damage (that isn't from Controlled Combat) and maybe buff all the effected powers by ten to twenty percent.
Also, you still didn't answer this question: would concentration stack on half-maintains just for melee powers, or also for ranged powers? Because it would be a nice improvement if it worked that way for ranged maintains.
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But then we got crushing wave, which lasts 4 seconds and only triggers once every second. So sometimes when you full maintain you'll get a stack, but most of the time you just end up pushing people out of range and not getting anything out of it except crap damage. Not to mention that you're already taking twice as long to stack Concentration anyway.
On the animation cancel thing, I'm... not sure if that really counts because for a fact I know that Ebon Ruin has a very strange animation where the attack comes out instantly but has an extremely long after-attack lag. Unless it's supposed to be showing how other attacks can be prepared/used while another attack animation is finishing up, in which case that happens pretty much every single time someone uses Unleashed Rage, and then follows it up with a charged haymaker: You end up charging that attack while UR's animation's finishing up!
Basically it might be the case we're not giving charges enough credit, all things considered. Which might also support the idea that maintains are god, charges are crap (considering how many maintains heartily outdo charges in terms of DPS and efficiency).
Now this makes me want to see what happens when you combine Ebon Ruin with a /powerscancelallactivations bind - whether that would cancel out the after-attack lag Ebon Ruin has or not...
Just to clarify some things about Concentration to help explain its interactions w/ CW a bit more:
-All maintains get an extra tick at the start of the maintain (after the activation+delay) as long as they are held down at least briefly (not just tapped). This extra tick is why CW hits upto 4 times instead of 3 (since its channel time is only 3 sec).
-This extra tick does NOT count towards Concentration's 4-tick proc. Try any other ranged maintain when up-close and count the ticks - you'll notice you get the Conc stack at the 5th damage tick, not the 4th. Since CW is technically limited to 3 ticks that count towards Conc, it can never proc it that way.
-When using ranged AoEs, only your current (focus) target will be the counted toward the 25ft range check. This means that even if there's an enemy at max (50ft) range getting hit by the AoE, Conc won't proc if your current target was still <25ft in. It is possible to start the AoE on a <25ft target, tab/click on a further out target while maintaining, and get Conc to stack that way as long as more ticks happen. Oddly, this tabbing trick also works for tabbing to enemies not caught in the AoE, and even for single-target spells (at least in the PH it does; try it if ya dun believe me :x ). It seems the game uses ur current target for the 25ft range check, and not simply whichever one it was at the spell's activation.
-Thus, the only way of getting CW to work w/ Conc atm is to using it while having a target on focus that's >25ft out. If the repel pushes ur focus target past the 25ft range, it can proc the stack that way too.
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
Flow clarified Concentration so for animation cancel, pretty much the idea is yes, some attacks like UR Haymaker, PF MR and Shadow Blast Ebon Ruin can make the second attack trigger right after or even during the animation of the first attack.
What happens in the case of say, Shadow Blast followed by Shadow Blast, is that you get this:
1.5 sec charge Shadow Blast
0.5 sec fire Shadow Blast
0.1 sec mystery delay
Shadow Blast again
But in the case of Shadow Blast followed by tapped Ruin:
1.5 sec charge Shadow Blast
0.5 sec fire Shadow Blast
0.0 sec no mystery delay
0.67 sec fire Ebon Ruin
0.1 sec mystery delay
Shadow Blast again
So the mystery delay that happens when chaining other attacks or the same attacks doesn't happen between Shadow Blast and Ebon Ruin.
And yes, many common attack combinations do exhibit this property although there hasn't really been a detailed look into it.
I Support ALL suggestions and Teaks on this Thread! 100%
There are some things that I would to Highlight
I believe that I have read about this incident on forums
Apparently they accidently Overnerfed Mini Mines, they were supposed to fix them/balanced them but instead forget about them and left them to die...?
Nevermind, I just misunderstood the change
Your Suggestion is Awesome, it can turn any power into Alpha Strike move I like it
/Quoting this for Future reference
HEY!
HEY DEVS
HEY CRYPTIC NORTH!
YOU SEE THOSE 3 POWERS LUNGES
THOSE SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN GAME FROM DAY 1
THIS GAME IS 5 YEARS OLD AND WE STILL DON'T HAVE 3 BASIC LUNGES FOR OUR WEAPONS!
:mad:
Why exactly there is Single/Dual Blade Lunge animation only available for Laser Swords and TK Blades is beyont me!
Also to add Salt to the Injury the Mooks in the Hi-Pan: Fury of the Dragon alert ACTUALLY use SINGLE-BLADE Lunges against you
Come on Cryptic. Why? is it SO EXPENSIVE to program those powers ingame?
/Sorry for that, but it REALLY bothers me being a Fan of Sword-Themed characters and all...
Basically what Sterga was suggesting I presume(?) (Ala Guild Wars style where you make your characters use Dodging Maneuvers)
I ADORE THIS! i have a character who Heavily Devil May Cry/Bayonetta inspired and I don't want to block neither waiting for the RNG GODs to give me Dodge chance!
I want to DODGE in STYLE~! like that
This sounds familiar
The Fire Eblem characters in Super Smash Bros. Games (Marth, Roy, Ike, Lucina) have a Down Special Move: called Counter with Similar effect, whick require PERFECT timing
If that's the case I AM FULLY APROVE OF THIS!
Also we could get MANY Expies/Reskins of One Hundred Hands into Cone Attacks
Sword Rain comes in mind, Single Blade | 120 AoE Cone Attack: Rapidly Stab with your sword your enemies, Change to apply Bleed/Aplly Bleed on all targets on FULL CHarge
or Hyakuretsukyaku from KICKS
>_> read the title, and this came to mind
Considering how the cryptic engine has some really solid dodge-roll animations now, thanks to Neverwinter, there's definitely some possibility that Fluidity could be tweaked to work as such. The big difficulty is changing the control scheme around properly to get things rolling properly while you're holding shift.
Also amusingly, my mental image of a zero-energy fluidity roll? The Dark Souls Fat Roll.
I'm generally sort of opposed to reskins of other powers. IIRC Reaper's whirlwind is meant to be sort of like that, though also distinct in how it can be used to deflect bullets and stuff while it's active (via advantage). Similar story with Mantis' Fury.
A rapidfire kick could be useful, though. After trying to design a kick-themed hero, it seems sort of odd that all of the kick attacks are comparatively low-power compared to all the awesome punches we get. Might add a couple things. Check back on page 2.
Too Few, most are AoE/CC/BUFF/DEBUFF but none is Pure Alpha Strike damage
I ever made a Suggestion Thread for more More offensive Unarmed KICK attacks since the current available are really Lackluster in Offensive Aspect
As for the One Hundred Hands Attacks Expies I suggest that because
1. It would be awesome
2. Melee NEEDS more Maintain Attacks
3. It will be easier and faster for DEVs to design them (Reskins are Lazy but "Apparently" CO doesn't have enough resources for new animation... ಠ_ಠ
I like your suggestions for Typhoon Kick and Lance Kick, I forgot to mention them (Sorry you made so many Appealing Suggestions that I don't know what to mention first O__o)
Really loving the Lunges, Melee-Elemental attacks, The Expansion of current powerframes!
Too many to mention!
Those two powers right here, PERFECT for my Elemental Mages! :biggrin:
Also, how come and you didn't added the two addition Enraged Stacking Toggles (Rumbler and Brawling Stance) you suggested on other Thread?
Rumbler and Brawler - Or some incarnation of them - are included in the Heavy Weapons and Earth sections. One's non-knock based, and the other's Stagger-based.
EDIT: I snuck in a directory on the OP for ease of access.
I'm probably going to need some ideas for where this specifically occurs, but from what I can remember, I mostly am tying stat requirements to powers and abilities where that's usually the norm (i.e. toggles, energy unlocks, and specific pets).
More importantly than that, though, as a principle, I was assigning many of the stat-tie-ins to stats that, at the moment, are actually treated as underpowered. I'm well-aware that Con/Int are super powerful at the moment; the former due to how much it just flat out grants extra suitability and the latter due to the number of abilities that are tied to it. Most of the adjustments aim to dampen that impact by assigning extra scalings with things like Ego, Endurance, and Recovery.
Since I am here, what if PFF is scaled to PSS. But this would be a problem if someone's PSS is CON. Any thoughts on this.
Pretty short, but they were random thoughts I had a while back and I thought I'd just throw them out there.
-Sterga
That's an interesting perspective on Shatter, but what I fear will happen with that implementation (and what has already happened pretty widely) is that it'll just be entirely skipped in favor of a more generic Energy Return ability. High burst damage would justify it as an option between the more consistent Avalanche move, and the more technical and hopefully much more devastating burst of Shatter.
Then again, that mindset doesn't really preclude the player from just taking both and laying powerful ice smack-downs, but on the other hand, that sort of setup would put it on par with the other elemental AoE nukers (Fire? Extreme stacking of defense down. Electricity? Balls of lightning hitting while negative ions chain, all under a lightning storm. Ice? Avalanches that lead into a sudden Shatter burst).
I was bored, and thought up of a series of advantages that could be added to all passives in the game, giving each a bit of character. All are 1 point, so they do supply a little extra bonus, while not being precluded by rank limitations.
Well it's a big thread... but for all we know it's filled with suggestions that a professional would look at and say "all these are terrible". So, you know, keep that in mind before condemning the devs for not singing its praises ^_^
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
This for me as well. I think Shatter is creative and interesting, which the game could use more of.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Depending on how close I am to the char limit, I might give the sorcery classes their own unique ones. Some of these (melee) might need some way to be scaled up.
Sub-Machine Gun:- Aggression Advantage reduce to 1 point.
New Advantage "Dual Wield" 2 points:- Allows the player to dual wield SMG dealing double damage per tick.
SMG to me seems quite weak since its damage drops with more target it hits. This is just one way to bring it up.
"There is only one way to support a PFF tank: Send Cyrone lots of money weekly... because he's the only one to successfully be a true PFF Tank." - chuckwolf