Might and Force, can they work together?

kamenridersasword

So I've been thinking of a might/force hybrid build though im not sure if it can even work. If t's possible can someone steer e in the right direction build wise?

xcaligax

Both powersets have strong directions into the knock mechanic. As a rule, usually I design a build around the form and the passive.

So if you want to use a Might/Force hybrid that is pretty feasible in playing, then you should look into "Enrage" as a form if most of your attacks are going to be primarily focused on melee, with some range variants just to help out in certain situations.

In my opinion, this all depends on which of the 2 powersets you would be using more than the other if you put them both in a single build. And you can't say you'll use both equally, because trust me, you wont haha.

Just experiment.

flowcyto

Can pick up MSA + Force Geyser as a cheap and easy way to keep that rolling (also works w/ Unstoppable's energy return if you use that passive), Force Sheath as the block + small energy return, and Energy Bolts (end builder) w/ energy refraction adv + Force Cascade. FC can also be used as ur big AoE alpha strike.

Rest can just be a typical Might build (Enrage, Haymaker, Demolish, etc).
Prob wanna stat STR/Con/Int for something like that.

jellycupsowbug

Force Cascade is really hard to power without SS End, or combining SS Int and Rec. Because energy scales with level, getting it early might not be a good idea.

Crushing Wave doesn't work well with Enrage.

Force Eruption is ok, but you would usually be better off with a Might Attack, due to the range. It works while held, though.



We could really use a "Force Cascade lite".

flowcyto

jellycupsowbug wrote: »

We could really use a "Force Cascade lite".

well, w/o using an energy form to reduce the cost, that would be Typhoon atm (or Gigabolt).

theravenforce

Force and Might as it has been said before, can work well together.

I'd suggest perhaps focusing on ONE main power set, which acts as your core focus, with the other power set being there for additional purpose rather than trying to balance out the two (not saying this is impossible, but in terms of an easier play style, it would be advised).

An example build, which has literally been thrown together, would be something like this:

PowerHouse (Link to this build)

Name: Force/Might Version 1 - Might MAIN

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Strength (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Intelligence (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: The Behemoth
Level 6: Brilliant
Level 9: Physical Conditioning
Level 12: Body and Mind
Level 15: Enduring
Level 18: Mighty
Level 21: Healthy Mind

Powers:
Level 1: Clobber
Level 1: Defensive Combo
Level 6: Mighty Leap (Crippling Challenge)
Level 8: Roomsweeper (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Enrage (Giant Growth)
Level 14: Force Snap (Rank 2, Entropic Collapse)
Level 17: Molecular Self-Assembly
Level 20: Unleashed Rage (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 23: Aggressor (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 26: Masterful Dodge
Level 29: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 32: Force Detonation (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Conviction (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 38: Bountiful Chi Resurgence (Rank 2)

Travel Powers:
Level 6:
Level 35:

Specializations:


Main focus of the build would be Might melee with Force as an added power set with the build, used mainly for show.

You could invert this and have it mainly as a force based build with a few might attacks for utility purposes, for example....Thunderclap for Stun component and Demolish for debuffing against targets who are nearby.

Like this for example:

PowerHouse (Link to this build)

Name: Force/Might Version 2 - Force MAIN

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Ego (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Intelligence (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: The Invincible
Level 6: Enduring
Level 9: Indomitable
Level 12: Brilliant
Level 15: Healthy Mind
Level 18: Ascetic
Level 21: Academics

Powers:
Level 1: Force Bolts (Energy Refraction)
Level 1: Force Blast (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 6: Force Eruption (Gravitational Polarity)
Level 8: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Concentration
Level 14: Conviction (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 17: Molecular Self-Assembly
Level 20: Force Shield (Force Sheathe)
Level 23: Aggressor (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 26: Masterful Dodge
Level 29: Thunderclap (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 32: Force Detonation (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Demolish (Rank 2, Below the Belt)
Level 38: Bountiful Chi Resurgence (Rank 2)

Travel Powers:
Level 6:
Level 35:

Specializations:

There are various ways to experiment with these sets. You could also focus on knocking targets out of melee range with Roomsweeper and follow it up with Ranged force attacks for example.

It really does depend on what YOU want out of the build/character.

Hope this helps

bludskarr

This is one of those things that seems like it would be a natural fit. But, damn, it's a pain really. Force has to be the hardest set to mix with a melee set because almost all of it's powers knock your target out of melee range. Force snap does a knock-toward. But it's resisted or partially resisted a lot. So you'll probably want mostly Might. One fun think to do is wind up a roomsweeper and then, while that animation is still going, start charging a Force Blast. If done just right the blast will hit just as the target is about to land from the roomsweeper.

An uppercut followed right by a force detonation can be fun too; pop them up in the air then blast them across the room. That'll probably be the only Force powers you can really use and they will still knock your targets way out of melee range, but you could use the combo as a finishing move.

I'm starting you off with Regeneration, it's great for most of the game but you may want to retcon it out later.

PowerHouse (Link to this build)

Name:

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Strength (Primary)
Level 10: Intelligence (Secondary)
Level 15: Dexterity (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: The Specialist
Level 6: Martial Focus
Level 9: Coordinated
Level 12: Body and Mind
Level 15: Academics
Level 18: Professional Athlete
Level 21: Shooter

Powers:
Level 1: Clobber
Level 1: Defensive Combo
Level 6: Roomsweeper
Level 8: Regeneration
Level 11: Force Blast
Level 14: Uppercut
Level 17: Mighty Leap
Level 20: Molecular Self-Assembly
Level 23: Enrage
Level 26: Force Detonation
Level 29: Force Shield
Level 32: Aggressor
Level 35: Resurgence
Level 38: Unleashed Rage

Travel Powers:
Level 6: Flight
Level 35: Teleportation

Specializations:
Strength: Swole (3/3)
Strength: Physical Peak (1/3)
Strength: Aggression (2/2)
Strength: Balance (2/2)
Strength: Brutality (2/2)
Vindicator: Aggressive Stance (2/2)
Vindicator: Merciless (3/3)
Vindicator: Focused Strikes (3/3)
Vindicator: Offensive Expertise (2/2)
Brawler: No Escape (1/3)
Brawler: Penetrating Strikes (2/2)
Brawler: Ruthless (2/2)
Brawler: Finishing Blow (2/3)
Brawler: Setup (2/2)
Brawler: Offensive Expertise (1/2)
Mastery: Vindicator Mastery (1/1)

xcaligax

I dont think he's actually looking for a build guys. I think he's more looking for a definite confirmation from anybody experienced enough to say if it works or not.

It can work. Again, just as an example, both power sets build from enrage. So if you build around the Enrage form, you can do it.

jellycupsowbug

I've been trying to shoehorn Force into my Enrage builds for months, and I'm never satisfied. The Force powers always feel like a waste, except for Force Bolts and Force Shield. I can do it without ruining my build, but the Force powers don't end up getting used in actual game play. The segregation of melee and ranged damage detracts too much from this sort of build. It doesn't even make sense for this genre. This isn't a medieval strategy game.

You should probably try it out in the PowerHouse/PTS, and see if you enjoy it.

flowcyto wrote: »

well, w/o using an energy form to reduce the cost, that would be Typhoon atm (or Gigabolt).

They don't have controllable knock, and are also T3 energy hogs. I'm looking for a bread and butter power that is comparable in performance to SMG Burst, or Hurricane, but with a similar look and feel to Force Blast and Cascade.

Gigabolt spam is pretty fun, though. I haven't seriously tried Typhoon yet. I don't like the animation for most of my concepts.

flowcyto

xcaligax wrote: »

I dont think he's actually looking for a build guys. I think he's more looking for a definite confirmation from anybody experienced enough to say if it works or not.

Well, the OP did mention wanting to be steered to the right kind of build, so it could be interpreted like that.

They don't have controllable knock, and are also T3 energy hogs. I'm looking for a bread and butter power that is comparable in performance to SMG Burst, or Hurricane, but with a similar look and feel to Force Blast and Cascade.

Gigabolt spam is pretty fun, though. I haven't seriously tried Typhoon yet. I don't like the animation for most of my concepts.

Hm, well ya could try out TK Wave. It may be a 50ft cone, but it has a nice charged frontal knock and it kinda 'feels' like a force power (in sound and anim) when ranked up.


As far as a ranged knock build not really meshing w/ melee- just depends what powers ya wanna mix, imo. Ofc, its a given you'll not be optimal when going for a theme like that, so its just a question of how much ur willing to compromise for a concept.

ashensnow

Not sure if he has updated it recently but I know that KJ3 has great success with his Sho'Nuff build:

http://champions-online.proboards.com/thread/490

jellycupsowbug

I've got TK wave on one right now. The best thing about it is having NttG on a huge aoe. The cd helps with MSA, too. The damage is embarrasing. I'd be better off with Havok Stomp or ThunderClap, but they don't match my concept well.

bravehoptoad

Here's that Sho Nuff build in Powerhouse. Basically it's a might build that uses the Force energy builder to add an Energy Form to make Force Cascade cheap. It also has Force Sheathe for energy.

I guess if you have to add only a bit of Force, Force Cascade is the bit to add.

PowerHouse (Link to this build)

Name:

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Strength (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Intelligence (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: The Devastator
Level 6: Tireless
Level 9: Healthy Mind
Level 12: Negotiator
Level 15: Body and Mind
Level 18: Physical Conditioning
Level 21: Enduring

Powers:
Level 1: Force Bolts (Energy Refraction)
Level 1: Unleashed Rage (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 6: Roomsweeper (Rank 2, Rank 3, Challenging Strikes)
Level 8: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Mighty Leap
Level 14: Enrage (Endorphin Rush)
Level 17: Unbreakable (Better You Than Me)
Level 20: Resurgence (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 23: Force Cascade (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 26: Molecular Self-Assembly
Level 29: Conviction
Level 32: Ego Surge (Nimble Mind)
Level 35: Haymaker (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 38: Force Shield (Force Sheathe)

Travel Powers:
Level 6: Flight (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Teleportation

Specializations:
Strength: Physical Peak (3/3)
Strength: Aggression (2/2)
Strength: Balance (2/2)
Strength: Juggernaut (3/3)
Protector: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Protector: Bulwark (2/2)
Protector: Defensive Expertise (2/3)
Protector: Resolute (3/3)
Guardian: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Guardian: Ruthless (2/2)
Guardian: Tenacious (2/2)
Guardian: The Best Defense (3/3)
Mastery: Protector Mastery (1/1)

crypticbuxom

Might and Force? Well the obvious answer is that Earth Form is your BEST friend. It buffs ALL physical damage and gives you resistance against it, being the most used damage type in the game.

You can use either Enrage or Concentration depending what you want your main stat to be. If you are going to knock a lot use Enrage/Str or if you like staying far away use Concentration/Ego. If you like being in range and melee a lot, best go with Enrage/Str.

As most builds, choose a Con secondary and make it high so you can survive most things. Grab a self heal to keep it up. Your other stat should be Intelligence (no need to have gear boost it at all), using MSA as an extra energy return since there are plenty of low cooldown powers in both the Might and Force sets. Have your Primary Utility get plenty of cost discount.

With that just pick whatever powers you want from both sets, except for the sonic damage ones from Might. Unleashed Rage is the exception since its damage is based on Enrage if you went that route.

You're golden.

helbjorn

crypticbuxom wrote: »

Might and Force? Well the obvious answer is that Earth Form is your BEST friend. It buffs ALL physical damage and gives you resistance against it, being the most used damage type in the game.

If EF buffed Unleashed Rage, it would be perfect for this combo. Since it doesn't, Unstoppable or WoTW are probably better choices DPS-wise unless you don't plan on taking UR (which would be crazy, IMO). WotW's Dodge component may put it above EF in regards to overall survivability.