Invuln or Defiance?

navar

Looking at the numbers and doing the math provided, I would think Defiance would be the winner hands down....but from asking around in game to random players, everyone says Invuln is the best Tank passive.

I have looked up some info on this web site, but to no avail, all info is from back in 2012 and sadly outdated. That info is very old that the mechanics of Defiance does not even work in the same way anymore. Everything has been very simplified since 2012.

So...could use some help here with my final build....which passive is better for Tanking, and why?

williamkony

Defiance hasn't really changed from what it was before. Threads from 2012 will still likely give some good information.

Like most powers, each one has their own advantages and disadvantages.


Defiance
+Up to 120% resistance when fully stacked
+Very high energy return with a good Constitution score
+Doesn't need to be ranked up to be at full effectiveness
-Requires high Constitution to be effective
-Requires build up to reach its full potential. Not good at the beginning of fights, or if you don't get hit for long periods of time (Between groups of enemies, against sporadic attackers like Gravitar)


Invulnerability
+Flat damage reduction is incredibly potent against large groups of relatively weak enemies
+Fully effective without the need for buildup
+Can be used effectively with any stats
-Not as effective against hard hitters as Defiance
-Requires that you put ranks into it



They're each good for different character setups. If you have a lot of resistance from the Defense stat, for example, you'll likely get more mileage out of Invulnerability given the variation in types of defense. Your personal preference plays a part, too; if your goal is to be an effective Alert tank, Invulnerability will be preferable given the large amounts of enemies. If your goal is to tank against large bosses such as Clarence or Kigatilik or whoever, Defiance would help more.

On my main, I use Defiance since I need the energy from it, and my advantage points are spread thin. On many other characters, I prefer to use Invulnerability for its "fuller coverage" in regards to what kinds of enemies I can face. It all comes down to your specific needs.

navar

Nice response and insightful. Thank you.

helbjorn

The only tiny correction I would make to Will's excellent rundown is that the energy return from Defiance is based on REC, not CON. Unless there's been a change I missed somewhere.

bshue1

helbjorn wrote: »

The only tiny correction I would make to Will's excellent rundown is that the energy return from Defiance is based on REC, not CON. Unless there's been a change I missed somewhere.

There has been. According to Mecha Teddy's Attribute and Scaling guide, the energy gain from Defiance is largely from CON with a small amount coming from REC.

http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=164451

williamkony

helbjorn wrote: »

The only tiny correction I would make to Will's excellent rundown is that the energy return from Defiance is based on REC, not CON. Unless there's been a change I missed somewhere.

bshue1 wrote: »

There has been. According to Mecha Teddy's Attribute and Scaling guide, the energy gain from Defiance is largely from CON with a small amount coming from REC.

http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=164451

Yup, I know for a fact Constitution affects it. X) My main gets around 100 energy per stack of Defiant gained with stacked Constitution, and has very low Recovery.