Nemesis system suggestions

qynn411

The nemesis system is one of the best and most memorable features of this game. It is completely unique, and one of the few reasons I continue to come back to Champions. That said, it needs some love to truly make it the best it could be. Some of the things that would improve it:

-Updated powers. How long have wind, earth, and heavy weapons been out? And are they on the nemesis powers list? Not the last time I checked (which was, admittedly, a while ago, so correct me if I am wrong on this.)

-Themes. Not all villains would build a giant death ray. Not all villains would attempt to attain some supernatural artifact. Our nemesis need to have themes like Magic, Science, etc. While yes, this would require work and the *gasp* creation of new content, it would endlessly please just about everyone.

-More minions. I feel that the options there are so limited. Even if we aren't allowed to create the minions (which would be even better), just more options would be nice.

-More personality choices. A devious and scheming character that isn't an evil genius, or an average joe, albeit evil, kinda personality, or perhaps a vengeful, or even a Deific personality, for those of us with gods as our foes.

-Naming the minions. A minor thing for me, but one that would be a cool little feature. For example, if I have a name for a race of aliens and I choose the alien minion option, I might want to give them names for social class within their race or something.

Just a few suggestions and thoughts I had. If you have any counterpoints, feel free to post them(which you invariably will anyways).

bludskarr

(Hope this doesn't end up as a double post, the site sorta forgot I signed in after I hit 'reply'.)

We should get our Nem earlier too. Maybe before we leave Westside. In the comics heroes meet their archenemy fairly early in their career. How about if it turns out our Nem is the real power behind Hi Pan's evil scheme. In a lot of ways the hero is defined by who apposes him/her and it doesn't feel right to wait so long before making this important connection.

And maybe have him/her show up in more story lines as well. Not just random attacks from their minions but appearances in 'normal' missions.

The Nemesis System is still something that makes this game stand out and really should get more attention.

avengeld

^^ what he said, even having the nemesis show up at the hideout for those of us who have them(without turning it into a glorified tower defense mini-game), that would make things alot of fun, and alot of people would use hideouts for more than just storage space

leihngwei

They need to change the colour bar to the fixed palette used in the Powers section.

I have a set of preferred colours for powers. I do not want to waste time trying to find that one pixel in a 360 pixel bar, when one of 120 will do. Especially when my graphic settings are different from yours, and the next guy.

qynn411

I had another couple suggestions:

-Nemesis minion color choices. Even if we don't get more minions to choose from, this lets me make my enemies match my villain.

-Nemesis Lieutenant creation. I would love to be able to create at least some of the bosses you fight other than just your nemesis. If the theme system is integrated, this would be less useful, as lieutenants would be fit with the villains theme, but as it is now, they don't always go with your villain's appearance and concept.

-Remove the time limit for level 40s. Once you hit that level, nemesis missions are one of the few fun things you can still do solo.

Just a few extra thoughts.

leihngwei

Ideas for Nemesis Alerts.

1. Gated. No nemesis, no access to the alert, no more generic nemesis. :biggrin:

2. The system will access and randomly choose from a players' entire list of nemeses, not just the active one. With a maximum of 18 nemeses per player, that is a potential 90 (5 x 18) to choose from. :eek:

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jerax1011

leihngwei wrote: »

Ideas for Nemesis Alerts.

1. Gated. No nemesis, no access to the alert, no more generic nemesis. :biggrin:

2. The system will access and randomly choose from a players' entire list of nemeses, not just the active one. With a maximum of 18 nemeses per player, that is a potential 90 (5 x 18) to choose from. :eek:

I like number one if the nem alerts are separated from the usual alert line up, as in there will always be a nem alert active for the players. This would especially be fun if there was an alert version of Nem Con, where all 5 nems are present in a melee free-for-all type scenario.

I have do disagree with number 2, while it would be neat to see others nems, many put away are also gone in an RP sense for the hero (which could be dead, disappeared, or all sorts of other possibilities)

avianos

What I want to see is a Whole Update Dedicated for Nemesis and Custom Sidekicks

1. Bug Fixes and Updates on Nemesis Missions which were LEFT TO DIE
2. Expansion of Nemesis Mission and Personality
3. More Power Choises (Earth, Wind, Heavy Weapons were left to die as well)
4. Fully Customizable Nemesis' Minions (the list does not provide enought minion types, and some people like myself want Special Minions for our Nemesis\
5. More Nemesis appearence in Missions, Adventure Packs, Comic Series, Alerts
6. Nemesis in the Lore Missions
7. Nemesis Rampage (because Why Not? but LOCK the chance of getting the Default Infernal crap for players who never bothered to create Nem)
8. Costume Sidekicks linked with Nemesis (because you need your Loyal Do-Gooder to help you with your Arch Villain)

)

Honestly Before On-Alerts, Nemesis system was one of my favorite features in the game... and they left it to DIe...

jerax1011

avianos wrote: »

What I want to see is a Whole Update Dedicated for Nemesis and Custom Sidekicks

1. Bug Fixes and Updates on Nemesis Missions which were LEFT TO DIE
2. Expansion of Nemesis Mission and Personality
3. More Power Choises (Earth, Wind, Heavy Weapons were left to die as well)
4. Fully Customizable Nemesis' Minions (the list does not provide enought minion types, and some people like myself want Special Minions for our Nemesis\
5. More Nemesis appearence in Missions, Adventure Packs, Comic Series, Alerts
6. Nemesis in the Lore Missions
7. Nemesis Rampage (because Why Not? but LOCK the chance of getting the Default Infernal crap for players who never bothered to create Nem)
8. Costume Sidekicks linked with Nemesis (because you need your Loyal Do-Gooder to help you with your Arch Villain)

)

Honestly Before On-Alerts, Nemesis system was one of my favorite features in the game... and they left it to DIe...

Only thing I'd adapt is to make the sidekick thing optional, since some heroes prefer to be solo. Otherwise I like all of these ideas

/signed!

spordelia

/Signed

All that's been suggested above, I'd also add: being able to rename and/or delete a Nemesis - some of us have had the same (very first) Nemesis for the longest time, and a LOT has changed - you can change their look/power/minion type, but not their names. You can lock them up, but not delete a Nemesis, start from scratch. Whether it's a Nemesis you didn't think that through, too many, or created early on when we had fewer options. I think that'd be an useful feature, and a good starting point to improving the Nemesis system.

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qynn411

gradii wrote: »

wrong, 1 wont solve a thing. you could have the entire team in that alert have active nems and still end up with a generic. what you should be asking for, is the removal of generics completely if 1 person on the team has an active nem.

As far as I know, it chooses from the nems of the people there. Thus, if everyone has one, it shouldn't be a generic. I could be completely wrong, but that was what I had heard it was.

jerax1011

gradii wrote: »

wrong, 1 wont solve a thing. you could have the entire team in that alert have active nems and still end up with a generic. what you should be asking for, is the removal of generics completely if 1 person on the team has an active nem.

I could care less if there was a generic nem once and a while. So no, not wrong. Just a different opinion.

colonelmarik

I'd like to see Nemesis Confrontation changed too. My Nemesis is a Dr. Doom type, he wouldn never be subordinate to Dr. Destroyer, not unless he planned to betray him.

I'd have the Nemesis Confrontation begin by facing each nemesis individually, and then have them team up at the end, working together as a team. Perhaps whichever one is the last standing might get a cutscene where he declares he's tricked his allies, and he's stealing their power to become all powerful - until the heroes actually defeat him.

Something better, at any rate.


Also, let us choose minions from existing groups, like Viper or Purple Gang.


How about using the Nemesis in some of the extra missions you get from rescuing people; you know, instead of just a destroid or other generic boss.


There's a ton of potential in the nemesis system that's not being tapped. However, we've been saying that for years and have been ignored. I don't expect that to change, unfortunately.

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spordelia

colonelmarik wrote: »

Also, let us choose minions from existing groups, like Viper or Purple Gang.

THIS also, how could I forget..! Thank you @ColonelMarik for adding this to the list of suggestions

qynn411

I've had yet another idea: Motivation!! Not all villains want to rule the world. Some want to destroy it, others just want money, and there are so many different reasons villains are created. In fact, the motivation is one of the main things that can make a villain great.

colonelmarik

Way back in the day, I posted an elaborate system to allow CoV characters to have AGENDAS, letting them be villains for themselves, rather than just lackeys to Lord Recluse.

The premise was that villains have a larger goal, like conquering the world. This would be the AGENDA.

He would then choose a MEANS to his end. For example, he might try to blackmail the world into making him ruler, or he may try to actually conquer the world with giant robots.

At this point, he would need to accumulate the things he needed to achieve the means. This might include any number of subordinate goals, depending on the means he has chosen. For example, to build an army of killer robots, he would need a base, the materials for the robots (such as steel, electronic components, computer components, weapons, etc), the facilities to construct the robots, and some means of controlling them.

These subgoals could be assigned to minions (in CoV, I suggested he might farm some of it out to other players!), or he could do it himself. I included some connection to pvp, by allowing players to try to intervene in his submissions.

Of course, at the end of it all, he would have to fail, but it would end in an suitably epic mission. I had suggested a timed mission in which the villain would face all the NPC heroes (there, Statesman et al, here it would be Defender and the Champions), plus any PC pvp heroes. His defenses would depend on how he progressed through the submissions. If he did some missions to get better defenses for his HQ, he'd do better.

The idea here is the mission would be theoretically unwinnable. At its end, when he loses, he gains rewards for getting that far. If by some miracle, he actually WINS the mission, he gains a temporary buff making him a genuine supervillain, with stats like most of the NPC bad guys.


Of course, this was for PC playable villains. It would need to be modified for Champs.

I should also say, I've worked out a means to allow PC villains in THIS game, but it would mean a lot of development, and I don't see that happening.

ashensnow

I've always wanted the ability to build my nemesis from the ground up. Not just costume and power set, actual build. Then allow us to set the nemeses danger rating so that his power level can be ramped up further

Sigh...

flyingfinn

They could put a 'Nefarious Meter' to Nemesis Creator, once they manage to actually do something with Nemesis System. 'Nefarious Meter' would set the toughness of your Nemesis, up to like Cosmic scale Villain, add new powers, new henchmen.

colonelmarik

The thing with building from the ground up is that people would deliberately build pushovers so they could farm nemesis tokens. You would need to establish a group of powers all nemeses would need to have, such as:

Single target attack (ranged and melee)
Area effect attack (ranged and melee)
Passive
Block
Healing
Travel

After that, you would add powers at your choice.

mlmii

Either that or go the other route and build nems that non-one else has the ability to beat.

spinnytop

colonelmarik wrote: »

The thing with building from the ground up is that people would deliberately build pushovers so they could farm nemesis tokens. You would need to establish a group of powers all nemeses would need to have, such as:

Single target attack (ranged and melee)
Area effect attack (ranged and melee)
Passive
Block
Healing
Travel

After that, you would add powers at your choice.

I would actually do the opposite. There's a reason all my nemesi are darkness, and not a one of them is single blade I would probably end up being banned from Nemcon groups for the things I would create.... or rather, I would only be able to run with the pvpers who no doubt would create similar monstrosities owo



Also, lemme just add: OH NO! People would easily be able to beat their nemesis and farm nemesis tokens.... just like now

dantheiceman1

posts like these get made all the time, the ORIGINAL post of this nem system is in my sig have a look and read at that

because alot of the ideas are pretty much the same except that one is alot older