Telekinesis

bludskarr

tel-e-ki-ne-sis noun: 1.the supposed ability to move objects at a distance by mental power or other nonphysical means.

I blame Psylock for this. CO started life as a Marvel MMO and because of her the definition in game is; noun: 1. Mind blades. There are a few move object powers in the set, true, but no "work horse" powers. They're charge-up-cool-down hits or relies on world objects that are often not available. Things you might use once or twice a fight. The rest of the time you're either hitting things with mind swords or throwing mind knifes or lances. I would like to suggest a few powers that might reflect the classic power.

1.) TK push: Using the same character animation as Telekinetic Assault. The attacker's hands are surrounded by telekinetic energy. And the target, with no intervening beams or effects, is repelled with splashing telekinetic energy flashing around the "impact" area. TK Push stacks ego leach at the same rate as Assault and has comparable damage, but shorter range to account for the repel effect.

2.) TK Pull: Using the same character animation as Ebon Rift. It's a lot like a reverse of TK Push with a reverse repel effect much like Tractor Beam. It consumes Ego Leach one stack at a time and increases in damage for each stack consumed per tic.

3.) TK Punch: Using the same character animation as Upper Cut but used for a ranged attack. The attacker balls up his fist which becomes surrounded with telekinetic energy. A 'comet' of telekinetic energy mirrors the attackers action at the target knocking the target into the air, consuming Ego Leach for better damage. This is a sort of alternative to Telekinetic Lance balanced so that the damage and falling damage are about the same as Telekinetic Lance total.

4.) Mind Field: (A bit of a play on Mine Field) The attacker throws his hands up and every thing in an AoE is knocked up. A sort of reskin of Force Detonation but using knock up instead. If you want you can even have Telekinetic spears lance up from the ground.

What do you think?

sakuratamaki

You could use some force powers if you are using thematically a pure "telekinetic" character without the whole mind blade/ bolt thing

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vincyre

IIRC, there's already a telekinesis cone knockback attack that doesn't use the mindblades at all.

spinnytop

If you want your characters telekinesis to involve creating force out of nowhere to push people around... well, there's already a power set for that, it's called Force.


Want to use your telekinesis to rip rocks out of the ground and throw them at people? There's already a power set for that, it's called Earth.


Want to use your telekinesis to rub air molecules together until they burst into flame? Yep, Fire powerset. Use your telekinesis to slow molecules down until they get so cold they freeze? Ice powerset!

You're right, telekinesis is more than just the ability to create weapons made of "mental energy", which is why it would be kind of silly for them to try to incorporate everything that telekinesis could possibly be into one power set, especially when you consider that most of it is already in game.

You can easily take those powers that do what you want your characters "telekinesis" to do, and just color them pink so everything looks right for you.


Look how long it took for Telepathy to get any attention. You really want to become the #TELEKINESISNOW guy?

chaoswolf820

spinnytop wrote: »

You can easily take those powers that do what you want your characters "telekinesis" to do, and just color them pink so everything looks right for you.

That's what my TK character does with FireFlight - I just refluff it as being a psychic aura.

Turn it purple, and my dark-sorcery character's got a magical flight, too.

Try green, for a radiation-powered or fel-flame character!

FireFlight is really versatile, just by shifting color, for a lot of uses.

rstzed

A large number of powers can be attributed to telekinesis. Flight, most force powers, wind etc. Just because you use an out of set power does not necessarily take you out of concept.

bludskarr

spinnytop wrote: »

If you want your characters telekinesis to involve creating force out of nowhere to push people around... well, there's already a power set for that, it's called Force.


Want to use your telekinesis to rip rocks out of the ground and throw them at people? There's already a power set for that, it's called Earth.


Want to use your telekinesis to rub air molecules together until they burst into flame? Yep, Fire powerset. Use your telekinesis to slow molecules down until they get so cold they freeze? Ice powerset!

You're right, telekinesis is more than just the ability to create weapons made of "mental energy", which is why it would be kind of silly for them to try to incorporate everything that telekinesis could possibly be into one power set, especially when you consider that most of it is already in game.

You can easily take those powers that do what you want your characters "telekinesis" to do, and just color them pink so everything looks right for you.


Look how long it took for Telepathy to get any attention. You really want to become the #TELEKINESISNOW guy?

I know you can cobble together a concept from many power sets. Everyone has at one time or another, and that's fine as far as it goes. But often there isn't a whole lot of synergy between sets. Earth powers tend to exploit disorient debuffs and stack rage, which Force only has minimal use for.

Pyrokinesis is thematically different from telekinesis and is covered by Fire okay.

I'm not asking for a lot. And I'm not asking for it now. I'm just suggesting that maybe some power sets could reflect the classical aspects of their domains a bit better. Telekinesis isn't the only set I have some problems with, it's just the one I had a few ideas about at the time.

You mention Telepathy. Classically those powers center around reading thoughts and controlling minds. I'll grant in this particular game that thought reading would be hard to reflect. But mind control could be reflected better. But instead we get some healing powers, some emotion altering debuffs and turning into a mind-giant for a while to smash things.

I absolutely applaud creative expansion of themes. I just happen to think the basics could be covered as well.

spinnytop

I believe there is only one Earth power that deals with Enrage!, and otherwise the set focuses on the Stagger debuff, which reduces resistence to all damage, so plenty of synergy there. Force doesn't actually even have much synergy with itself; the only thing it really provides is those knocks that would really make you feel like you're using telekinesis, rather than "Pink ego sword powers!". So, as far as the "push telekinetic", synergy isn't a problem.


I'm all for new powers, but not so sure I want them spending time just copying currently existing powers just for the sake of giving them new visuals. On the other hand, adding an option to change the visuals of powers would be kind of neat, though I think there is a certain intent there with pairing effects with a given visual so that players know what's coming at them.

I think for all intents and purposes, the real Telekinesis power set is actually Force... the Telekinesis powerset should be named something like "Ego Manifestation"... or better yet, merge it with Telepathy, and just call the whole thing Telepathy.

Imagine if all the "ego blade" powers had instead been a part of the Force tree and did physical damage instead of ego damage? That would actually have made a fair bit of sense.

theravenforce

bludskarr wrote: »

You mention Telepathy. Classically those powers center around reading thoughts and controlling minds. I'll grant in this particular game that thought reading would be hard to reflect. But mind control could be reflected better. But instead we get some healing powers, some emotion altering debuffs and turning into a mind-giant for a while to smash things.

I absolutely applaud creative expansion of themes. I just happen to think the basics could be covered as well.

We can't actually smash anything whilst using MoTM, since all damage resistance values are taken away for entire duration of the "super transform". :rolleyes:

We don't have Mind Control, faction conversion etc could potentially break stuff, like mission encounters where NPCs need to be defeated and instead we control them. (unless they altered a hell load of missions or limited it so much that it was a useless power point.)

Basics for Force, TK and Telepathy as well as a number of other powersets really have not been covered at all. I mean..no proper defensive force fields in Force? Lame. No really good TK (power) implementation? Lame. No AoE Confuse which actually forces targets to attack foes? Lame.

Funny thing is, in Beta we had the following:

AoE Force Shield - Now gone.

Confuses worked in PvP and in PvE very well - Nerfed and now only single target

TK (Power) - Not sure if this was ever implemented well but there was a time when you could click and move objects manually with TK power, from what I remember seeing.

theravenforce

spinnytop wrote: »

I think for all intents and purposes, the real Telekinesis power set is actually Force... the Telekinesis powerset should be named something like "Ego Manifestation"... or better yet, merge it with Telepathy, and just call the whole thing Telepathy.

That would be called doing it wrong, not to mention being a dumb move. Telepaths cannot move objects with their mind unless they specifically have Telekinesis, neither can they forge force of will constructs without TK. Which is why they are separate.

The Force Powerset is basically Force Detonation, Force Cascade and Force Geyser. The rest of the powers are pretty much lacklustre. This power set should be able defensive and offensive force field usage.

Telekinesis Power set has the ability to move earth (TK Maelstrom), fling opponents into the stratosphere (TK Wave) and create constructs (TK Lance) amongst other things. This power set should be able constructs and matter manipulation and moving objects.

spinnytop

theravenforce wrote: »

That would be called doing it wrong, not to mention being a dumb move. Telepaths cannot move objects with their mind unless they specifically have Telekinesis, neither can they forge force of will constructs without TK. Which is why they are separate.

The Force Powerset is basically Force Detonation, Force Cascade and Force Geyser. The rest of the powers are pretty much lacklustre. This power set should be able defensive and offensive force field usage.

Telekinesis Power set has the ability to move earth (TK Maelstrom), fling opponents into the stratosphere (TK Wave) and create constructs (TK Lance) amongst other things. This power set should be able constructs and matter manipulation and moving objects.

So then why can telepaths basically create the same pink stuff that telekinesis can? According to you, there are a few telepathy powers that should be moved over to telekinesis. I mean hell, let's be honest, you're right, there's a bunch of stuff in the Telepathy tree that honestly shouldn't be there. Why can you use the ability to read minds to heal people? So get rid of the heals. What's up with that big pink force field? Reading minds doesn't get you that, get rid of it.

Face it, in the Champions universe, telepathy isn't what you think it is; telepathy is only partially the ability to connect with someone's mind. The other part of telepathy in the champions universe is the ability to create pink stuff that has physical properties. For some reason, this same ability to create pink stuff is also called "Telekinesis"... so, what is a Telekinesis super hero in the champions universe? Basically the same thing as a Telepathy super hero who just never gained that ability to connect to peoples' minds to affect them (the only way they can stun someone is to choke them with a pink stuff rope, or smack them with rocks propelled with pink energy).

There's this whole powerset called "Pink Stuff Creation" that was for some reason intertwined with the Telepathy and Telekinesis power sets.. probably because once they got done creating actual Telepathy and Telekinesis powers(that hadn't been covered by other power sets), they realized they didn't have enough powers to make a full power set, let alone two, so they were like "Uuuuh...k... mental people can make stuff out of their ego".

Sure, doing it right :rolleyes:

theravenforce

spinnytop wrote: »

So then why can telepaths basically create the same pink stuff that telekinesis can? According to you, there are a few telepathy powers that should be moved over to telekinesis. I mean hell, let's be honest, you're right, there's a bunch of stuff in the Telepathy tree that honestly shouldn't be there. Why can you use the ability to read minds to heal people? So get rid of the heals. What's up with that big pink force field? Reading minds doesn't get you that, get rid of it.

First off, not sure where you got that from (highlighted red part).

Secondly, your lack of interest into what Telepathy actually does in comparison to TK is exactly why you don't understand.

So allow me to educate you on what I believe is "according to me".

Healing in Telepathy

- Psionic Healing - Psychic Healing/Surgery, a basic telepathic feat of speeding up regenerative power of said target by accessing their mind.

- Empathic Healing - Psychic Healing/Surgery, a basic telepathic feat of speeding up regenerative power of said target by accessing their mind.

- Mindful Reinforcement - A psychic shield (you could say a mental barrier to pain receptors in an allies mind, thereby shielding them from pain) which upon ceasing infuses your ally with regenerative mental energy, thereby healing them. You could say the visual shield is an illusion which is a by product or an intended effect of the mental shielding. Like a telepathic manifestation.

If you actually take the time to READ the description of the power and perhaps apply your mind, you'd know that they in fact do belong in Telepathy.

Face it, in the Champions universe, telepathy isn't what you think it is; telepathy is only partially the ability to connect with someone's mind.

You have obviously failed to understand what Telepathy is in Champions Universe, if you believe people like Menton (if you know who he is :rolleyes:) can only "partially connect with people's minds".

Creating and forging psychic bonds is only part of what a telepath can do.

The other part of telepathy in the champions universe is the ability to create pink stuff that has physical properties. For some reason, this same ability to create pink stuff is also called "Telekinesis"... so, what is a Telekinesis super hero in the champions universe? Basically the same thing as a Telepathy super hero who just never gained that ability to connect to peoples' minds to affect them (the only way they can stun someone is to choke them with a pink stuff rope, or smack them with rocks propelled with pink energy).

Well, congrats you've got me to repeat a statement that I made to you in another thread so here it is!

"Not only is that statement a testament to your -flawed- logic but it makes you -sound- completely stupid."

Are you aware of what a Telepath is? In comparison to a Telekinetic? A blatant example would be Professor X (Telepath) and Jean Grey (Telekinetic) from Marvel. You would do well to read up on them and then try to wrap your mind around solid definitions.

There's this whole powerset called "Pink Stuff Creation" that was for some reason intertwined with the Telepathy and Telekinesis power sets.. probably because once they got done creating actual Telepathy and Telekinesis powers(that hadn't been covered by other power sets), they realized they didn't have enough powers to make a full power set, let alone two, so they were like "Uuuuh...k... mental people can make stuff out of their ego".

Sure, doing it right :rolleyes:

Please define "pink stuff". Since you clearly have little to no interest in Mentalist powers should we really rely on you to properly classify them? The answer, in case you are wondering is no.

It's truly a wonder to see people talk about something they have, at best a very vague idea about.

EDIT: I apologise if I sound harsh, but it really irritates me when people cannot see the difference between two blatantly different sets of powers.

bludskarr

I'm not necessarily saying that the powers in the sets can't fit under the headings of Telekinesis or even Telepathy. I'm just saying they don't really cover the basic, more classical archetypes of the powers well. There are some "move things around" powers in TK, but they're not your main attacks, the bread and butter of the set. They're situational, once-in-a-while powers. One can certainly stretch TK into manifested physical objects but that aspect isn't really on the short list of abilities people tend to think of when they would be called on to define telekinesis. If you started describing a superhero to someone by saying "He can create solid objects with his mind, like blades and lances and swords." They would probably think of Green Lantern or Quasar. I'm only suggesting a handful of powers that might convey the most basic of the definition is all. They aren't perfect, but I think they could be implemented without much concern of being game breaking.


Heck, I can think of a couple powers for telepathy that would ground the set in the mythology of the word that might bring it all together.

1.) Thrall: You engage an enemy in mental combat turning them into a controllable 'pet'. Make it a maintain the does 'psychic damage' and if they are defeated they're yours until released or defeated. Rank 1 allows you to take over henchmen, rank 2 for villains and 3 for master villains. A bit like the Beast Master special ability from FFXI. Regardless of the mobs original power level they would cap off at the same damage, hit points, etc. you would get from any other pet power.

2.) Hypnosis: As a maintain you switch the allegiance of one enemy for the duration of the attack. Say, 10 seconds with a successful resistance cutting that time in half. The target acts as an uncontrolled pet. It's a bit like a hold, but instead of your character being able to attack for the duration of the hold only your target can.

theravenforce

bludskarr wrote: »

1.) Thrall: You engage an enemy in mental combat turning them into a controllable 'pet'. Make it a maintain the does 'psychic damage' and if they are defeated they're yours until released or defeated. Rank 1 allows you to take over henchmen, rank 2 for villains and 3 for master villains. A bit like the Beast Master special ability from FFXI. Regardless of the mobs original power level they would cap off at the same damage, hit points, etc. you would get from any other pet power.

2.) Hypnosis: As a maintain you switch the allegiance of one enemy for the duration of the attack. Say, 10 seconds with a successful resistance cutting that time in half. The target acts as an uncontrolled pet. It's a bit like a hold, but instead of your character being able to attack for the duration of the hold only your target can.

Trust me, I've made PLENTY of Faction Conversion Telepathy Mind Control Power suggestions. I even asked if it was possible or a viable choice and I was told why not.

And I did mention the reason earlier on:

theravenforce wrote: »

We don't have Mind Control, faction conversion etc because it could potentially break stuff, like mission encounters where NPCs need to be defeated and instead we control them. (unless they altered a hell load of missions or limited it so much that it was a useless power point.)

spinnytop

Listen, you can type till your fingers fall off about all these various rationalizations for what is actually going on "behind the scenes" when these powers are being used... but on my screen, mentalists slap people around with pink stuff. Occasionally that pink stuff seems to be a side effect of a telepath actually making a connection with someones mind, but those powers are few and far between. The majority of the time, they're making stuff out of pink ego energy and either stabbing people with it, using it to put the person's cells back together, or making a big globe around them with it.


A few corrections regarding misinterpretations you made about my post:

1)

theravenforce wrote: »

You have obviously failed to understand what Telepathy is in Champions Universe, if you believe people like Menton (if you know who he is :rolleyes:) can only "partially connect with people's minds".

What I actually typed was:

spinnytop wrote: »

Face it, in the Champions universe, telepathy isn't what you think it is; telepathy is only partially the ability to connect with someone's mind. The other part of telepathy in the champions universe is the ability to create pink stuff that has physical properties.

As you can see, I am not making the statement that telepaths in the champions universe can only partially connect to someones mind. I am making the statement that telepathy is only partially the ability to connect with someones mind, with the other part being the ability to create pink stuff.

2)

theravenforce wrote: »

First off, not sure where you got that from (highlighted red part).

You typed:

theravenforce wrote: »

That would be called doing it wrong, not to mention being a dumb move. Telepaths cannot move objects with their mind unless they specifically have Telekinesis, neither can they forge force of will constructs without TK. Which is why they are separate.

Telepaths cannot move objects with their mind (such as the cells of a person's injured body). They cannot create force of will constructs such as big pink bubbles, and various pink monsters. That's where I got that from.

3)

theravenforce wrote: »

Secondly, your lack of interest into what Telepathy actually does in comparison to TK is exactly why you don't understand.

I have a great interest in what Telepathy actually does in the game, because when I envisioned myself making a telepathic character in a game, I never imagined that it would involved the ability to conjure all this pink stuff. I imagined that it would involve the ability to stun people, mentally cripple them, confuse them, mind control them, make them pass out, and all that other stuff that people traditionally associate with telepaths.

4)

theravenforce wrote: »

If you actually take the time to READ the description of the power and perhaps apply your mind, you'd know that they in fact do belong in Telepathy.

I have read the descriptions of Telepathy. They failed to counteract the visuals that were put in place for the various powers, primarily because that is what I am experiencing. You can type up a wonderful explanation for why my dishwasher is a pinball machine...however, when I go to play with it, it's just not going to provide the expected experience, no matter how good the rationalization was.

5)

theravenforce wrote: »

Are you aware of what a Telepath is? In comparison to a Telekinetic? A blatant example would be Professor X (Telepath) and Jean Grey (Telekinetic) from Marvel. You would do well to read up on them and then try to wrap your mind around solid definitions.

Show me the pink stuff.

6)

theravenforce wrote: »

Please define "pink stuff". Since you clearly have little to no interest in Mentalist powers should we really rely on you to properly classify them? The answer, in case you are wondering is no.

Go use a mentalist power. The color may be different, but you'll quickly see the stuff I'm talking about. How do I define it? Certainly not as what one would expect telepathy or telekinesis to look like. I classify it as "The stuff they put in because they ran out of stuff to put into a telepathy and telekinesis tree". Should we really rely on cryptic to properly classify it? Not if their definition is "Makes pink stuff and hits people with it".

7)

theravenforce wrote: »

EDIT: I apologise if I sound harsh, but it really irritates me when people cannot see the difference between two blatantly different sets of powers.

No apology needed. You're not the first person to get upset and start ranting based on misinterpretations on these forums, and you won't be the last.

theravenforce

spinnytop wrote: »

. The majority of the time, they're making stuff out of pink ego energy and either stabbing people with it, using it to put the person's cells back together, or making a big globe around them with it.

It's called psionic energy or mental energy both telekinetics and telepaths possess such energy, however, it depends upon how they are able to use it which defines what they are.

As you can see, I am not making the statement that telepaths in the champions universe can only partially connect to someones mind. I am making the statement that telepathy is only partially the ability to connect with someones mind, with the other part being the ability to create pink stuff.

This "pink stuff" which you refer to is a physical representation of the power, purely for understanding and visual purposes. The attack is still a mental attack, attacking the MIND of an opponent not the body.

Telepaths cannot move objects with their mind (such as the cells of a person's injured body). They cannot create force of will constructs such as big pink bubbles, and various pink monsters. That's where I got that from.

Again you have misunderstood what I typed and therefore have come to incorrect conclusions. I've already explained what Mindful Reinforcement can be viewed as and as for the "various pink monsters" it's called an illusion. Again, I implore you to read what the powers are described as doing.

I have a great interest in what Telepathy actually does in the game, because when I envisioned myself making a telepathic character in a game, I never imagined that it would involved the ability to conjure all this pink stuff. I imagined that it would involve the ability to stun people, mentally cripple them, confuse them, mind control them, make them pass out, and all that other stuff that people traditionally associate with telepaths.

Did you expect all of this to be invisible? Brain waves generally are not seen in the normal spectrum. If you stood there attacking people by flicking your hands and seemingly staring at them with your fingers on your temple then flicking your head back with nothing to show for it, you'd look pretty stupid.

Ego Blast - Used to have a Stun component on full charge (removed and changed to disorient)

Mental Storm - Mentally cripples opponents by reducing their resistance to your damage.

Mind Lock - Confuse Power.

Mind Control - Not likely to happen in CO because of NPC interaction complication. Best you can do is Placate, hold or confuse them

Ego Sleep - As close to as a "knock out" power as you'll get without killing the target.

"Pink stuff" is there for a visual representation.

I have read the descriptions of Telepathy. They failed to counteract the visuals that were put in place for the various powers, primarily because that is what I am experiencing. You can type up a wonderful explanation for why my dishwasher is a pinball machine...however, when I go to play with it, it's just not going to provide the expected experience, no matter how good the rationalization was.

Revise the highlighted portion. Did you mean convey instead of counteract? It cannot provide the "expected experience" if you expect everything to be invisible and based on brain waves. If you don't want to accept the reasoning then that is up to you.

Show me the pink stuff.

You'll see that Emma Frost vs Psylocke fight shows a similar version to what Ego Blast is shown as being in CO, so there is nothing wrong with their depiction of mental powers (except Mental Storm, I'm not a fan of brain-tricity FX, but it works). And yes, they are using Telepathy in the fight scene.

Go use a mentalist power. Certainly not as what one would expect telepathy or telekinesis to look like. I classify it as "The stuff they put in because they ran out of stuff to put into a telepathy and telekinesis tree". Should we really rely on cryptic to properly classify it? Not if their definition is "Makes pink stuff and hits people with it".

I think it's safe to say I've used Mentalist powers lol :rolleyes:

What you are -trying- to convey is the psychic energy they are producing and attacking foes with.

Would you prefer Telepathy to have no visual FX at all?

You're not the first person to get upset and start ranting based on misinterpretations on these forums, and you won't be the last.

Likewise.

Anyways, instead of further derailing this thread, if you want to reply or continue this, take it to forum PM's.

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bludskarr

bludskarr wrote: »

1.) Thrall: You engage an enemy in mental combat turning them into a controllable 'pet'. Make it a maintain the does 'psychic damage' and if they are defeated they're yours until released or defeated. Rank 1 allows you to take over henchmen, rank 2 for villains and 3 for master villains. A bit like the Beast Master special ability from FFXI. Regardless of the mobs original power level they would cap off at the same damage, hit points, etc. you would get from any other pet power.

2.) Hypnosis: As a maintain you switch the allegiance of one enemy for the duration of the attack. Say, 10 seconds with a successful resistance cutting that time in half. The target acts as an uncontrolled pet. It's a bit like a hold, but instead of your character being able to attack for the duration of the hold only your target can.

For #1 if the target dies while you're maintaining this power the target dies then the game spawns a copy, much like the sidekick device. Counts as a "kill" for all purposes of 'kill X number of those guys' type missions.

Number 2 (heh) only mind controls the target for the duration of the maintain, about 10 seconds or so. Then you have to fight it again.

Shouldn't break any missions.

Anyway, so um. Telekinesis ideas?

chaoswolf820

Telepathy and Telekinesis, so they say, are things difficult if not impossible to comprehend by those who are weak-minded.

Several posters in the thread, with their stubbornness and ignorance, seem to prove this.

theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

Reanimator advantage. Rez serum. why can't we have faction conversion again? its right there.

In the exact way that I was asking for it, yeah, I've already explained this.

If you don't know why, I'd suggest going back and reading though what I posted.

Telepaths do not have to kill off someone to mind control them.

That advantage actually turns your foe into a generic pet, so it is no longer your foe but a zombie, great if your theme is a necromancer not so great if your a telepath.

meedacthunist

spinnytop wrote: »

Show me the pink stuff.

In X-Men books, who are most likely inspiration for our psionic powerset, if there was any graphical FX drawn for telepaths it was most often a pink one. Jean Grey and Psylocke. It changed only in modern comic books and even then pink FX is still in use from time to time.

Aside of that, however, their costumes weren't pink (I think that only Psylocke briefly had pink costume in her old British body). In CO it's all pink FX on pink costume which makes telepaths (especially PSI) looking ridiculous.

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

it could be set up so they appear to be mind controlled and in effect are to the player, but the program considers them defeated and turned into a new mob? could that work? the mob could look the same as it did before and have the same powers but the death animation could be omitted.

Would require delving into Mob AI. (which would then beg the question, if they -can- dig into mob AI why have they not updated mobs for On Alert power levels instead of nerfing mechanics which are too potent for pre On Alert content we currently have?)

It would mean that there would have to be two copies of EVERY SINGLE mob that could be controlled on the off chance you decide to control them. A tedious task in itself.

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

while it's true it's hard to do, I wouldn't give up. we have been getting more dev attention lately, perhaps one day they will be willing to put the work in to give us these awesome powers. (and a foundry)

I have actually directly asked the Devs if it would be possible after I initially went crazy and suggested a bunch of Telepathic Powers a few years back (might have been early last year), Mind Control being one of them

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

and did they tell you it's 100% never possible? cuz it would be cool to have. if its even a slight chance, I'd hope for it someday.

plus being able to mind control players in pvp using the same tech used in STO when you die within melee range of a borg drone. that would be awesome.

100000% Never.

Especially in PvP, I have suggested Mind Control for PvP before and when you think about it, that is probably the ultimate griefing tool, taking control of someone's character away from them.

The only way "Mind Control" as a concept/theme could be revitalised is if Alien Crystal was reverted back to the way it used to be AND Confuses worked in PvP properly like they used to:

e.g. CCer applies Confuse to attacker. Whenever attacker attempts to target CCer and kill them off, their attention is immediately switched to nearby ally, successfully taking out their ally.

I actually did this on Mentella, I gathered Cyrone and two more friends and team duelled them with old Alien Crystal and they were actually fighting among themselves, it was like the "ultimate CC".

It's a pity this is no longer possible.

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chaoswolf820

gradii wrote: »

well why would someone even go into pvp at all if they arent prepared to have powers used on them? I mean its not like such a power would be usable on other players outside of pvp.

Trust me, one of the few universal things among MMOs it that players HATE when control of their characters is taken away from them, be it via direct game mechanics or via forcing them into unavoidable decisions in the storyline.

Mind-Controlling other players would ruin the game, both in-play and by driving away players.

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

STO does it. Make it an AoE confuse and have it scale on CC strength better. have it work on henchmen thru enforcer.

1) STO is not CO

2) Confuse as a mechanic needs to be reverted back to the way it used to be.

3) Confuses in game scale with CC str as well as they can. They are all capped at a Strength 2 Hold Class. Which means they cannot work on Super Villains or above regardless of Manipulator or not (from what I remember). Manipulator only increases duration of the Confuse, not the strength like it did with Alien Crystal at one point.

When I think about it.. how likely is it that a CC review could make CC even LESS desirable than it is now. Probably fairly likely...

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

well my point was, do it in such a way that the DURATION is increased with pres, or int with Battle of Wits, and have manipulator buff that further.

also it really should be an aoe, maybe with targeting similar to ego sleep.

Duration does increase with PRE, BoW and Manipulator Buff. Grab an Alien Crystal and watch the duration timer go up. Or even get Mind Lock and stack Manip and see the duration go up.

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

funny, last time I tried it it went up very little. like a tiny tiny difference. could it have been broken before? (and yes I had very decent pres at the time, and manipulator)

The amount it increases by is pathetic at best. Increased duration on a bad mechanic is a waste of time generally.

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theravenforce

gradii wrote: »

heh I was suggesting that it be MADE useful...

the duration should scale better with CC strength, and it should be AoE. if those changes were made, I could see it having SOME use at least. the strength need not scale.

It would then make it like the Mental Weakness Debuff, if that debuff was able to increase in strength via CC then it would be a lot more desirable (however due to the nature of the debuff it could cause complications).

The issue with Confuse is:

- What the mechanic actually does

- Strength Class.

It should FORCE enemies to attack either a random object or their allies ONLY.

Strength Class 2 is it's current power level, Alien Crystal used to operate on old Confuse which was a +XXX mechanic which was increased by Manipulator (to the point where you could force Super Villains to attack their own minions). I doubt it will ever be changed back so the mechanic of the effect should be altered.