The Ban

vorshoth

Something I find a lot of people aren't really sure about in RP is the Ban. As I get it, it is the block upon deities manifesting or using their powers in any real reality except via some loopholes, which are, to my knowledge, unspecified.
Is there any more information about it? I guess it was added in because gods and suchlike absolute power folk are very tempting to out into a superhero setting, despite how much they can easily change it into being about them and only them.

How would it affect creations or things created by gods, or objects that predate the ban? Could be an interesting thing for a tabletop campaign that, tracking down objects with unusual powers that are steeped in myth for a secretive international agency... Quest for Eris' Apple in modern day Greece.

At a guess, I would suppose that creatures that have less power than gods, but have abilities linked to that god, can be summoned into the world. For example, from a Champions Online standpoint, angels can be summoned (although I suppose they'd be Elysium ones, from what I've been hearing about those ones from people who have the relevant books).

Where does the ban fit into the whole tree of loads of loads of planes thing I have vaguely heard of? Is it all encompassing or is it restricted to just 'real' worlds like the one Earth is on? I keep on thinking that's be an interesting thing to play with, for the material worlds to be protected by the ban, but once you pass the boundary into another reality, you get devoured by starved, half-mad gods seeking potential faith to subsist upon.

Also, and probably the clincher in my questions... Which book would be best to get info on all this?

taintedmess

As Far as I understand it the gods were kicked out off/removed them selves from the mortal plane.

The Ban just apply to gods though as far I can tell and not all mythical creatures so for example Zeus, Hades, Mars and any other god you can think of cant operate on the mortal plane they can send avatars or minions though so angels would be allowed but the dude with the beard not so much. Also beings like Hercules would be OK as there demi gods

bulgarex

The Ban began to come into effect as a result of the rise of "ethical" religions around 500 BCE, those which postulated divinity based on standards of virtue and morality, rather than the arbitrary humanlike gods of the past. E.g. the teachings of Zoroaster, Gautama Buddha, Lao-Tzu, and later religious reformers. These reformers asserted that the rightful location of godhead was in more elevated states of being, not islands or mountaintops in the material world; which forced the gods of the old faiths out of this world for the most part. The Ban followed the new religions as they spread over the Earth. For example, the pre-Columbian gods of the Americas didn't suffer the effects of the Ban until the arrival of European conquerors. Ironically, the gods of the new faiths were just as restricted as those of the old.

There were some "loopholes," as you put it, allowing the gods to act on Earth in a limited fashion (more on that below), but as ambient magic declined over the world during the centuries preceding the modern era, even those loopholes were largely unusable. However, with the resurgence of magic in 1938 it became possible for the gods to bypass the Ban in those limited ways again.

The Ban prevents gods of Earthly religions (i.e. gods created by the collective spiritual energy of their worshippers) from manifesting on this world with their full godly power. The gods can dispatch less-powerful servants from their home dimension to act on their behalf. They can craft avatars with a fraction of their might, which can remain on Earth indefinitely. They may imbue Earth mortals with some of their powers (and often personality) to act as their agents. Gods can project their full power through gates directly linking Earth with their home dimension. Great rituals or sacrifices, or mighty artifacts, may permit a god to fully manifest on Earth for a limited period of time and/or over a restricted area. Finally, gods may mate with mortals to create a hybrid with supernatural powers, which the god can possess as a vessel through which they may act with full power and without restraint. Examples of all of these can be found within Champions lore.

For purposes of the Ban's restrictions and workarounds, the term "god" also applies to demons of all human faiths, past and present. However, it doesn't affect extradimensional beings of godlike magical might who are not the products of human belief, such as Tyrannon, Skarn, or the Kings of Edom.

bwdares

Yeah in our RP we use it to limit the gods to how they are in comic books. High powered non aging super heores.

We tend to be more mature with them, at least I think so, and it is fun to have different takes on them.

bulgarex

Sorry, missed this point in the OP.

vorshoth wrote: »

Also, and probably the clincher in my questions... Which book would be best to get info on all this?

The foremost source for all mystical things in the Champions Universe is the Hero Games book entitled, appropriately enough, The Mystic World. It describes the entire occult cosmology of the CU, a number of notable dimensions, power players both on Earth and in the Multiverse, groups, organizations, and cults, Earthly mystic sites of significance, well-known "supermagic" spells, major occult artifacts, and more.

TMW is available from the Hero Games website store, both PDF and hardcopy: https://www.herogames.com/browse.htm?keywords=The+Mystic+World&categoryID=-1&releaseDate=-1&available=Y&book=Y&pdf=Y&characterPack=Y&multiBook=Y&other=Y&damaged=Y . Note that like all Hero Games books written for the Fifth Edition of the game (current one is Sixth), TMW is now half its original price from the Hero store.

theravenforce

In light of this interesting information..I have a few questions:

1- I have a character called Alara The Light Guardian.

She is an extra dimensional being who wields pure light energy to heal and aid her allies, she isn't a goddess, but she -could- be viewed as god like. She is capable of resurrecting fallen allies and protecting those around her from harm.

She does not wield her light for offensive purposes in the main, only when she is forced to, even then she only uses a very small portion (Celestial Conduit ).

Would she be affected by The Ban? Her reason for being on Earth is that her superiors sent her here to assist the mortal population.

(Note: Whilst she can technically be killed (not an easy task), her essence is light itself so she can always "reform" or survive.)

Whilst she has magic, she is more of a minor magic user and uses her light to defend herself and her allies.

Also, if a character is able to bend reality using magic or able to manipulate time (From slowing it down or stopping it to reading time lines) would they be affected by the Ban? (The toon in question is my CharmCaster an extra dimensional mage)

jonsills

bulgarex wrote: »

The Ban prevents gods of Earthly religions (i.e. gods created by the collective spiritual energy of their worshippers) from manifesting on this world with their full godly power. The gods can dispatch less-powerful servants from their home dimension to act on their behalf. They can craft avatars with a fraction of their might, which can remain on Earth indefinitely...

For purposes of the Ban's restrictions and workarounds, the term "god" also applies to demons of all human faiths, past and present. However, it doesn't affect extradimensional beings of godlike magical might who are not the products of human belief, such as Tyrannon, Skarn, or the Kings of Edom.

So it sounds like Alara shouldn't be affected by the Ban.

theravenforce

jonsills wrote: »

So it sounds like Alara shouldn't be affected by the Ban.

Thank you for this clarification! (I cannot believe I missed that U_U")

bulgarex

I concur with jonsils. The Champions "Multiverse" of magical dimensions contains many beings of godlike power and varied motivations, some effectively being the "gods" of their own dimensions, who are not affected by the Ban at all and could operate freely on Earth. Mind you, some of these are dependent on their home worlds for at least a portion of their power, which may limit them in certain ways when they travel to other universes; but that has nothing to do with the Ban.

The number of dimensions is effectively infinite, so there's nothing stopping you from inventing your own and populating it with whatever entities suit your purposes.

bulgarex

While I'm here, I thought I should touch on a few other points the OP brought up. But just to reiterate, The Mystic World is really the book to answer most of your supernatural-related CU questions. (But see also the end of this post.)

vorshoth wrote: »

How would it affect creations or things created by gods, or objects that predate the ban? Could be an interesting thing for a tabletop campaign that, tracking down objects with unusual powers that are steeped in myth for a secretive international agency... Quest for Eris' Apple in modern day Greece.

It's unclear whether the Ban has any effect at all on artifacts created by the gods, other than as extensions of the gods' personal power. But some such objects explicitly exist on Champions Earth, and retain at least some of their legendary powers.

Whether a particular god and his works came into existence before or after the Ban has no bearing. The Ban is a blanket effect.

vorshoth wrote: »

At a guess, I would suppose that creatures that have less power than gods, but have abilities linked to that god, can be summoned into the world. For example, from a Champions Online standpoint, angels can be summoned (although I suppose they'd be Elysium ones, from what I've been hearing about those ones from people who have the relevant books).

Yes, any angels appearing in CO or the PnP game universe are the creations of human faith, originating from the dimension of Elysium. These are not "real" angels, assuming such entities actually exist (the PnP books take no religious stand). However, the greatest angels may have power rivalling the gods of myth, so it's likely they'd also be similarly restricted. The Vibora Bay sourcebook states that Therakiel is "nowhere near as powerful as he was when he was a full angel" (VB p. 109), although how much of that is due to his "fallen" status is unclear.

vorshoth wrote: »

Where does the ban fit into the whole tree of loads of loads of planes thing I have vaguely heard of? Is it all encompassing or is it restricted to just 'real' worlds like the one Earth is on? I keep on thinking that's be an interesting thing to play with, for the material worlds to be protected by the ban, but once you pass the boundary into another reality, you get devoured by starved, half-mad gods seeking potential faith to subsist upon.

The Ban on Champions Earth is a product of the conditions of faith pertaining there. Alternate Earths (diverging from the history of CU Earth in some way) may have their own version of the Ban, or may not, depending on local conditions. The same thing applies to alien worlds in Earth's universe, such as in the Milky Way Galaxy, or in other universes. Such worlds can have their own analogues to the dimensions of Elysium, the Netherworld, or Faerie, populated by their own supernatural beings. It's unspecified how Champions Earth's Ban would affect godlike entities from such worlds who try to visit it. (Most of the above info comes from the discussion of the CU Multiverse in Book Of The Empress.)

While many of the mythic gods who dwell in the dimension of Faerie no longer receive active worship, people remembering them seems to help sustain them. They also draw upon the tremendous store of accumulated belief that is Faerie itself. They're certainly less powerful than in their heyday, or than those still worshipped today. And some gods of ancient cultures who are long forgotten have "died" completely, or else were morphed into different gods as human belief about them evolved.

OTOH the demons of the Netherworld sustain themselves upon the souls of mortals who fall into their clutches. Many demons were once gods of defunct faiths who turned to soul-sucking to survive and retain their power.

Interestingly, as human cultures have interacted more with each other in recent centuries, the sharp boundaries between the territories of various pantheons have become more blurred. They've met, clashed or allied, and even mated in some cases, producing new divine beings not recorded in any legend. For example, one Hero Games book mentions a demigod named Chrysaor who acts as a superhero on Earth. He's the offspring of Aphrodite by a warrior angel she seduced, mainly to prove she could.

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bulgarex

The main purpose of the Ban, from a metagaming point of view, was to prevent a lot of ultra-powerful gods from running around the Earth either causing trouble or solving mankind's problems for them. But make no mistake, many mythic gods and demons are active on Champions Earth in person or through proxies, as heroes, villains, or for their own purposes.