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A Quick Question For All You New Players!

jorifice1jorifice1 Posts: 588 Arc User
edited September 2012 in Champions Online Discussion
Just a quick question:
Many of us Champs regulars have been complaining about the level gating of the Character Creator basically since PW started doing it. Just about all of us CO Fogies agreed that it was a Bad Idea.
It occurs to me no one ever bothered to ask the NEW PLAYERS their opinions on the matter. Right now we have an influx of experienced, engaged players who are in a very good position to make a judgement on this issue.
So, what do you think?
Does it streamline your early game play, allowing you to jump right into the Tutorial?
Or is it pointlessly neutering the single best feature of the game?
Or something in between?
Or none of the above?
Thanks in advance for the responses!
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'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
Post edited by jorifice1 on

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    roughbearmattachroughbearmattach Posts: 4,784 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I realized that I when I start a new character appearance by loading a previous one, and modifying from there, I get whatever appearance I want.

    This avoids the "gating" completely.

    :D
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    grifvindhgrifvindh Posts: 53 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Yeah, I think it's pretty pointless. It doesn't save the player from confusion, it makes the game look limited. And unfairly so.
    I was @Curveball in City of Heroes.
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    lokikinlokikin Posts: 624 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Stupid as it is, it wouldn't be as bad if they at least informed a player of the limitations and the conditions to be met to unlock the costume array...

    Without dangling the costume pieces as some sort of carrot, what's the point?

    :confused:
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    Originally Posted by mijjestic: Ultimately, though, MMO players throwing stones at each other in this fashion is basically one nerd pointing and laughing at another nerd whose glasses are thicker.

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    klaw10klaw10 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Deleted by Klaw10
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    seismecaseismeca Posts: 47 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    jorifice1 wrote: »
    pointlessly neutering the single best feature of the game

    Sounds about right.
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    stardiverstardiver Posts: 76 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    How is the character creator "level-gated?" Honest question here, because if this means what I think it means, that might be a deal-breaker.
    |
    Of all the things I've lost,
    It think I miss my mind the most.
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    angelofcaineangelofcaine Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    stardiver wrote: »
    How is the character creator "level-gated?" Honest question here, because if this means what I think it means, that might be a deal-breaker.
    You have to have an existing level 10 character to access ALL costume parts at creation :wink:
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    stardiverstardiver Posts: 76 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    angelofcaine wrote: »
    You have to have an existing level 10 character to access ALL costume parts at creation :wink:

    But once I do, every other character I create can have access to all the options even at level 1? What happens if I delete the level 10? If the answer to the former is "yes" then I honestly don't mind. It's BAD BAD BAD for first impressions, but it's not "level-gated" as it would be in City of Heroes. For me, bad level-gating is Ascension armour - you can only use it on a character who is level 50, even if you've unlocked it already.

    I've always been of the mind that asking me to do something once is almost never bad. Even if that something is disruptive and creates a problem, so long as I can solve it once and not worry about it again, then I honestly don't give a toss.

    I know we're not supposed to compare Champions Online and City of Heroes, but if "level-gating" here only requires one applicable character, then that's a vastly superior system.
    |
    Of all the things I've lost,
    It think I miss my mind the most.
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    silvergryphsilvergryph Posts: 63 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    angelofcaine wrote: »
    You have to have an existing level 10 character to access ALL costume parts at creation :wink:

    Yes, when you create your first character you are only presented with a tiny portion of the options available to choose from when designing your character. After you reach level 10, if you log out and back in and either create a new character or visit the tailor to modify your costume you will see way more options. Some have said that if you just log back in after completing the tutorial you unlock the hidden stuff. I don't really have a way of testing that without creating a second account.

    Just as an FYI you can also unlock many more costume options from items that drop in the world, perk rewards, and recognition vendors. There are also packs you can purchase with Zen bought with real money, earned via monthly stipend for Gold accounts, or earned in game through selling questionite on the exchange.

    Find out what all that giberish means on the wiki!
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    silvergryphsilvergryph Posts: 63 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    stardiver wrote: »
    But once I do, every other character I create can have access to all the options even at level 1? What happens if I delete the level 10?

    Rest assured, once you have unlocked the full creator on one character, you should never have to deal with the "streamlined charactor creator" again on that account.

    Also, all the costume pieces unlocked in the other ways I mentioned above unlock account wide. At least, I can't think of any exceptions at the moment. (If there are any I'm sure someone will be along to correct me shortly.) And once unlocked they stay unlocked even if you delete the character that originally unlocked it.
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    thecheeseslicerthecheeseslicer Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I don't mind it, but it would be better if players were informed about it at the start of the game when they're creating their character.
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    docclarksavagejrdocclarksavagejr Posts: 52 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I'm going with "pointlessly neutering". I think it's something that should be changed.

    Oh and hey "Stardriver"! I'm looking forward to your verbosity here!!
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    corethlcorethl Posts: 125 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Someone that I know who started a new account here went into fits of rage at seeing the "pared down" character creator. Worse still, only reason she made the new account was because of the bug that's keeping her from making a character with her silver slots (she was a previous Gold; she's not thrilled by having to delete characters down to one just to make a new character).
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    jonsillsjonsills Posts: 6,317 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    silvergryph wrote: »
    Also, all the costume pieces unlocked in the other ways I mentioned above unlock account wide. At least, I can't think of any exceptions at the moment. (If there are any I'm sure someone will be along to correct me shortly.)
    Last I heard, the Demon and Lemurian Recognition Items were bugged, in that they would only show up as unlocked for the character that actually purchased them. (Can't say if that's still true, because the only characters I have with enough PRIMUS Recognition to buy Demon items don't want 'em, so I'm holding off until I hear it's been fixed.)
    "Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"

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    n3thergoatn3thergoat Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    stardiver wrote: »

    I know we're not supposed to compare Champions Online and City of Heroes, but if "level-gating" here only requires one applicable character, then that's a vastly superior system.

    I'll disagree here Sam.

    I picked up CO for a test drive a bit after launch during a Steam sale and was able to make a version of Nethergoat that was closer to my vision than CoH was able to provide at that point (later additions to the tailor eventually brought CoH up to par).

    Messing around last night, I wasn't able to come anywhere *close* to an acceptable appearance. The only available tail was "wolf", for instance.

    This is a ridiculous restriction.
    If you want to gate something AT ALL, the gate should be meaningful.
    Level 10 doesn't strike me as meaningful, just an irritation.

    And it's an irritation that creates a bad impression of your game for new players, especially refugees from CoH who will be used to a tremendous variety of options from the get-go.

    Sam's disillusionment with certain sets being gated notwithstanding. =P
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    stardiverstardiver Posts: 76 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    It makes a bad first impression, no doubt about it. However, knowing about it now, if I had to pick between a global unlock of a whole bunch of stuff just by reaching level 10 and having to get to level 35 and run the Imperious Task Force twice or grind Rikti War Zone missions over and over and ****ing over again, just to unlock a piece for ONE character ONE time... Yeah, I'll take locking lots of stuff behind level 10. It's a bad first impression, but I can deal with first impressions. I can't deal with constant nagging irritations.

    Additionally, a question: Back during Champions' last Beta weekend before its subscription-based launch, I got a character up to level 12. Is it possible that this has "tagged" my account to see the whole costume editor? Because all the costume pieces I saw in the game then, I see now, as well. That character's gone now. I didn't delete it, it went "poof" with the F2P swapover before Perfect World became involved, but is it possible that changed what my account had?

    Also, while I don't mind the "first impressions" lock behind level 10, I DO mind unlockable costume pieces I have to get in drops or buy off vendors. It IS a large degree of consolation that I only have to "find" them once, of course, but I still dislike the idea behind it.
    |
    Of all the things I've lost,
    It think I miss my mind the most.
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    n3thergoatn3thergoat Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    stardiver wrote: »
    It makes a bad first impression, no doubt about it. However, knowing about it now, if I had to pick between a global unlock of a whole bunch of stuff just by reaching level 10 and having to get to level 35 and run the Imperious Task Force twice or grind Rikti War Zone missions over and over and ****ing over again, just to unlock a piece for ONE character ONE time... Yeah, I'll take locking lots of stuff behind level 10. It's a bad first impression, but I can deal with first impressions. I can't deal with constant nagging irritations.

    Well, we've hashed out our differences on this subject at length so I'll just repeat again that if you're going to gate something arbitrarily, it should be behind a meaningful accomplishment.

    Running a TF, collecting a certain currency, reaching the level cap- these are all meaningful accomplishments and the idea of a costume reward for the feat makes sense.

    Reaching some meaninglessly low level?
    How's that worthy of a costume reward?

    smh.
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    chalupaoffurychalupaoffury Posts: 2,553 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    My question is, do they charge you for changing your costume after the gate has been bypassed? If so, you're paying because of restrictions they placed on you, which is pretty immoral if you think about it.
    In game, I am @EvilTaco. Happily killing purple gang members since May 2008.
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    fudgemonstafudgemonsta Posts: 1,591 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    chalupaoffury wrote: »
    My question is, do they charge you for changing your costume after the gate has been bypassed? If so, you're paying because of restrictions they placed on you, which is pretty immoral if you think about it.

    Yes they do, however the price is exceedingly cheap, as in, roughly 10N for a full costume swap.
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    stardiverstardiver Posts: 76 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    n3thergoat wrote: »
    Reaching some meaninglessly low level?
    How's that worthy of a costume reward?

    It's easy to attain, for one. That wins my vote. I believe the point of this is to keep certain items back from "transient" players who just log in to have a look, then ship off to another game. I haven't the foggiest why they'd want to do this, but "reach level 10 on any character" mostly strikes me as a level requirement. Like having to spend $5 to get the ability to chat in almost any way.

    I'm just glad it's easily solvable, personally.
    |
    Of all the things I've lost,
    It think I miss my mind the most.
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    alchemedicalchemedic Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    The thread is discussing level 10 as the gate for the full (-ish, barring purchased items, etc.) costume creator.

    However, as soon as I got out of the tutorial and went to the Tailor (at level 6), I had many more options. I was likewise able to create new characters with the enhanced range of costume options.

    So while it may have been 10, I don't think that's the case. At least I can't explain why it would be, since my highest level character is 6.
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    n3thergoatn3thergoat Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    stardiver wrote: »
    It's easy to attain, for one. That wins my vote. I believe the point of this is to keep certain items back from "transient" players who just log in to have a look, then ship off to another game.

    Well, it certainly achieves the goal of making new players think your character creation system is crippled.

    Not sure why they think that would inspire anyone to stick around, but I'm just a gamer, what do I know....glad it doesn't get stuck in your craw anyway, Sam.
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    polishlightningpolishlightning Posts: 404 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    n3thergoat wrote: »
    Well, it certainly achieves the goal of making new players think your character creation system is crippled.

    Not sure why they think that would inspire anyone to stick around, but I'm just a gamer, what do I know....glad it doesn't get stuck in your craw anyway, Sam.

    This isn't how it always was. The only reason I can see them making the change is that when people were leaving the game, they were asked to fill out the "why are you leaving" survey, some must have posted the costume creator was to confusing.
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    stellariodragonstellariodragon Posts: 588 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Just to play devil's advocate here, but most of the comments from people who have "tried" CO but "couldn't get into it" was that they spent 2-3 hours making a perfect character, but by the time they finished the tutorial it was bed time. I'd have to say I understand the paring down of the costume creator for newbies. However, I think some sort of toggle like "Show advanced options" along the lines of "hide locked and unpurchased" would be a decent trade-off.
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    sagar201201sagar201201 Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2012
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    canadascottcanadascott Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Bumping to make sure game content threads aren't knocked off the front page.
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    canadascottcanadascott Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Another bump, unfortunately, is needed. Sorry folks.
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    fantasycharacterfantasycharacter Posts: 458 Arc User
    edited September 2012
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