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How to fix the Nemesis missions/content sensibly.
cybersoldier1981
Posts: 2,501 Arc User
First and foremost, let's get the following things out of the way because they're 'smaller' than the main idea:
1- Fix the bugs. The ones that make my nemesis vanish in Missions and Alerts, and their minions vanish as well. There's also this thing where the minions appear, and inexplicably fall dead.
2- Improve the rewards. As of right now, at Nemesis number four, I have no reason whatsoever to do any nemesis missions. There is nothing left but action figures. Costume pieces and decent gear would make great rewards.
3- Let us customize minions. Because, quite honestly... yours are boring and they kind of suck. I want to fight my nemesis and his/her minions, not a scripted costume with one of 10 options. Let me make those cyborg zombie mutants, the psychopathic stripper ninjas, and those space pirate lizards. And for the love of God, let us pick the nemesis/minion weapon costumes. There's no reason in the world my 'Military Weapons' enemies should be firing laser guns.
Now that all that is out of the way... Here's the good stuff.
1- For starters, one would choose the Nemesis Type. This determines his actions and how they are presented. Examples/Concepts that could be chosen from: Alien, Artificial Intelligence, Criminal, Lunatic, Hostile Paramilitary, Mystical, Infernal, monster, Supervillain. Look, I know the list doesn't include what everyone wants, and it won't ever do that. And the words could be changed around a lot. That's not the point. I'll come back to this later on.
2- Your Nemesis will then need a Nemesis Motivation. This is sort of simple, as this determines what story and missions your nemesis follows. Some Concepts to choose from could be: Conquest, revenge, Crime of the Century, Power, Destruction, Anarchy. Again, this list isn't going to cater to everyone's fantasy, and it could easily be changed and tweaked. I'm just throwing out examples off the top of my head here.
So, here's how this would work- you choose these two things instead of the one Nemesis Type (the one that does nothing but determine what they say). So, let's just say for example you chose for your Nemesis to be a Mystical type with Power as his motivation. His missions would revolve around him trying to achieve power through mostly mystical means. If you chose the Artificial Intelligence and Destruction, your robot enemy would have missions that revolve around him trying to destroy important things and trying to get the power to do so on a grander scale. You're getting the idea here.
Now, there's one more thing. And shame on you, Cryptic.
3- Choose Nemesis alliance. Your nemesis could be allied with one of the many organizations in Champions Online- VIPER, DEMON, ARGENT, Westside Gangs, Vibora Bay Gangs. Since your idea of having a nemesis trying to thwart you means 'sending his employees out to attack you while you're fighting stuff and inexplicably carrying vital information about upcoming operations', this could also happen when you attack their allies. Also, in the missions where certain villains guest-star, this could determine the cast of those individuals as well as contribute to the story.
1- Fix the bugs. The ones that make my nemesis vanish in Missions and Alerts, and their minions vanish as well. There's also this thing where the minions appear, and inexplicably fall dead.
2- Improve the rewards. As of right now, at Nemesis number four, I have no reason whatsoever to do any nemesis missions. There is nothing left but action figures. Costume pieces and decent gear would make great rewards.
3- Let us customize minions. Because, quite honestly... yours are boring and they kind of suck. I want to fight my nemesis and his/her minions, not a scripted costume with one of 10 options. Let me make those cyborg zombie mutants, the psychopathic stripper ninjas, and those space pirate lizards. And for the love of God, let us pick the nemesis/minion weapon costumes. There's no reason in the world my 'Military Weapons' enemies should be firing laser guns.
Now that all that is out of the way... Here's the good stuff.
1- For starters, one would choose the Nemesis Type. This determines his actions and how they are presented. Examples/Concepts that could be chosen from: Alien, Artificial Intelligence, Criminal, Lunatic, Hostile Paramilitary, Mystical, Infernal, monster, Supervillain. Look, I know the list doesn't include what everyone wants, and it won't ever do that. And the words could be changed around a lot. That's not the point. I'll come back to this later on.
2- Your Nemesis will then need a Nemesis Motivation. This is sort of simple, as this determines what story and missions your nemesis follows. Some Concepts to choose from could be: Conquest, revenge, Crime of the Century, Power, Destruction, Anarchy. Again, this list isn't going to cater to everyone's fantasy, and it could easily be changed and tweaked. I'm just throwing out examples off the top of my head here.
So, here's how this would work- you choose these two things instead of the one Nemesis Type (the one that does nothing but determine what they say). So, let's just say for example you chose for your Nemesis to be a Mystical type with Power as his motivation. His missions would revolve around him trying to achieve power through mostly mystical means. If you chose the Artificial Intelligence and Destruction, your robot enemy would have missions that revolve around him trying to destroy important things and trying to get the power to do so on a grander scale. You're getting the idea here.
Now, there's one more thing. And shame on you, Cryptic.
3- Choose Nemesis alliance. Your nemesis could be allied with one of the many organizations in Champions Online- VIPER, DEMON, ARGENT, Westside Gangs, Vibora Bay Gangs. Since your idea of having a nemesis trying to thwart you means 'sending his employees out to attack you while you're fighting stuff and inexplicably carrying vital information about upcoming operations', this could also happen when you attack their allies. Also, in the missions where certain villains guest-star, this could determine the cast of those individuals as well as contribute to the story.
Post edited by cybersoldier1981 on
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They need more options for types of nems and the alliance is the perfect idea,some of us do make nems that are allied with these organizations but cant show it,I think they should also allow minion customization and allow organization enemies to be minions.
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Ive always thought that we should be allowed to have multiple nemeses at the same time. We should be allowed to create one of each personality type so that our mad rampaging monster nemesis shows up in those missions written for such a villain, but not in those calling for reasoned villainy.
It means that each nemesis would only show up a fraction of the time, but each mission would be covered by a nemesis that fit its story.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
(Anybody remember Spidey's infamous "Sinister Six"? :eek: )
.
- If as a player i'm cocky enough to make 5 (i'd cap it there) NEM's...
- ...And they all show up at once.
- ...AND i manage to survive...
...I'd like the bragging rights... :biggrin:.
.
...And maybe some extra reward? :redface:
| ME | A "Guide" Book" | | I, have a "DREAM! | ( Member since Feb 2008 ) ... ?
[SIGPIC]http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b132/AngelOfCaine/STILLS/Misc/CO-Sig_01e.png[/SIGPIC]
Now THAT would be awesome, especially if it were by level. As a level 40, you could have up to five of them- and perhaps even have them in some sort of alliance with one another and hurl an even more challenging mission at you (perhaps even optional, given you might need to get help on this one).
Which opens up another possibility: Your toon and mine around and about, drinking beers and shooting guns and wakin' up everybody's kids and stuff, and BAM- I gotta go fight my Nemesis, 'Bro Molestro'. I totally need your help, man- And you and I fight him, kick his butt, raid his beer cooler, make out with his sister, and say swear words in front of his mother. Oh, he's so mad. So he goes and gets your Nemesis, Lord Socksandsandals! And they form this mission that we could totally get some sweet loot from (questionite?) if we both do this mission together.
Especially since i do have a Nemesis for my main toon whose motivation IS revenge.
With the current system, the missions wouldn't make any sense for this nemesis since it wants revenge on my character for something that happened in the past. He doesn't want to take over the world or destroy it.
He just wants to kill that one man he holds a grudge against.
As it is, the nemesis system is not too bad but very limited and - lets be honest there - due to it boiling down to essentially the same story arc over and over and over again it's just... not really any motivation there.
Heck, for one of my current chars i have no nemesis planned since I don't have any fun in it anymore with the current system.
A revamp as suggestet by cybersoldier1981 (and improved by the other posters here) would solve that problem in so many ways. Finally it would be so fun again to have one or more nemeses!
Formerly known as "@BlackMethos".
But someone at PWE already had that handle, dammit!!!
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Really what I'd like is a complete overhaul of the nemesis system merging it with a mission builder. Have presets where you just drop in your choice of minion and nemesis, but also a full kit for building your own missions with their own scripts. And make it available from lvl 15 or so. That way a hero gets more play with their nemesis and has a lot more to show friends.
Imagine what being able to write the missions would do for nemesis types. It'd be a chance to have a real nemesis. My Scourge could be hounded by an overly righteous angel of heaven. My repentant demon could be attacked by her former demon master. (I can think of simple ways to prevent farming constructed missions too. Minion limits based on the map used, a set exp calculated by number of minions and level of them. Having the missions still require finding a clue and thus not infinitely repeatable.)
If I want more of a challenge on one particular character I could build his nemesis accordingly. For a less optimized character I might decide to go with a less intense nemesis build.
I really only have a couple of characters that I care about. It always bothered me that the one whose concept calls for a particularly potent nemesis has never lasted longer than a very few hits in a fight.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
A TRUE hero doesn't care for bragging rights or rewards. They just want to live in a world free of crime and robots.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
An "I conquered all my nemeses and all I got was a lousy T-shirt" costume piece?
:biggrin:
M-O-O-N, that spells @Rhyatt
Originally Posted by mijjestic: Ultimately, though, MMO players throwing stones at each other in this fashion is basically one nerd pointing and laughing at another nerd whose glasses are thicker.
Laws yes!
| ME | A "Guide" Book" | | I, have a "DREAM! | ( Member since Feb 2008 ) ... ?
[SIGPIC]http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b132/AngelOfCaine/STILLS/Misc/CO-Sig_01e.png[/SIGPIC]
to me the simpest way to start fixing the nemesis system is to make each of the 3 personilitys has thier own quest chain.
Then you add more nem personility and more quest chains
Having customizable minions is a must and sounds easy enough.
I love the "sinster six" nemesis idea.
I also love the nemesis team up idea,where you beat your nem with a player and their nem comes back with your nem and fight.
Oh and can we please! have a mission where our nem attacks us in public!
Perhap it could work where you see a message in your chat(only you can see it) that say "(your hero's name) I (your nem's name) challenge you".
You go to city hall and infront of it is police barrier,you click to enter the barrier and you are in your own instance of the front of city hall,with police and civilans looking on.
Oh an devs can we please! get it where other players in nem con,alerts or nem missions can see our nem's bio?
I would like to see more personalities for nems,the maniac personality I thought would be like foxbat,not some crazy person,and the sinister six idea of a league/group of nems is something I would REALLY like to see.The open world nem mission would be cool,like an open mission nem attack.And for the nem info PLEASE SHOW THE NEM INFO,WHY DID WE MAKE THEIR BIO IF ONLY WE CAN SE IT?!?!
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