Alerts killed the heroic feeling

bjoernr

Maybe its me but it does not feel very heroic if you need 5-10 seconds to beat an enemy.
The bossfights are okay but the minions ... instead of stronger enemies there should be only more of them.

astazia

Are you trying to do alerts at level 10? Everything that's not a boss dies almost instantly in all the alerts I've been in. Occasionally I see some level 5-10 try to solo kite something away from the party and it either takes them a while or they die, but if you are at least level 20 and staying with the group everything should instagib. I'm not saying don't enter at level 10, but just don't expect to feel very heroic at that level because the scaling system sucks.

championshewolf

bjoernr wrote: »

Maybe its me but it does not feel very heroic if you need 5-10 seconds to beat an enemy.
The bossfights are okay but the minions ... instead of stronger enemies there should be only more of them.

5 to 10 seconds is too long? I'm sorry, but beating peons doesn't espouse heroism to me.

secksegai

I agree with the OP, at least as far as preferring quantity.

One of my favorite things with Red alert is its not just this one bad guy with massive hp, but 6 total badguys with henchman with just "enhanced" hp.

The tank and spank gets really old when it can describe over 90% of the boss fight experiences.

battybattybats

I do think more needs to be done to enhance the heroic immersive experience of Alerts.

Some great ideas were thrown around for natural disaster alerts and more story alerts and quirky rescue reggie from the tree alerts which would be good.

Giving us more of a chance to smash through walls and wade through weaker minions would help.

Giving us dynamic intro cinematics that include our hero/es in close-up (think of the 'the walk' scene cliche where the team strides dramatcally down a corridor).

Out of alerts we get civilians running up to us and praising us or mentioning us as we go past. This helps us get a sense of an impact on the world and a sense of our place in the world. It's awesome. More needs to be done to help players get this kind of sense from alerts.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

smoochan

Totally agree. 5 heroes vs 1 villian.... there certainly is a basis for it in the genre, but when that's the case over and over and over, it really just starts to feel like we're ganging up on them, and the only reason they have that many hit points is because they've had to pile on defenses to keep from getting beat up by us bullies.


Red Winter takes a step in this direction, but the first part is still 5 v 1, 5 v 1, 5 v 1... then it becomes 5 v 3.


What I would really like to see is a fight involving 5 villains, all at the same time. Furthermore, make it so that each player can only have aggro from 1 villain at a time, and a sort of reverse crippling challenge where the villian takes greatly reduced damage from everyone other than their current aggro target, so that it turns into five one-on-one matches.

Basically, something other than the "zerg of heroes vs one bad guy" scenario we've gotten so used to.

rstzed

It is so quick to get to LVL 15 I don't understand why you would want to run alerts before LVL 15. I would recommend finishing the Westside mission thread before running alerts. It doesn't take that long.

neuraldamage

You want to feel heroic? Then why are you doing alerts?

The alerts are mostly about "Gimme!", not heroism. :eek:

Do the missions with the storylines and crank up the difficulty instead. I don't believe they have removed that content yet.

astazia

smoochan wrote: »

Totally agree. 5 heroes vs 1 villian....

Except that's not what he said at all. He thinks bosses are fine, he thinks 5v1 is fine, what he doesn't like is it taking a long time to kill henchmen, which shouldn't be the case. I mean I would agree that I would prefer a big swarm of enemies to a single strong one a whole team beats on for a while, but that would make the game harder to run for some people, and make AoE king.

secksegai wrote: »

The tank and spank gets really old when it can describe over 90% of the boss fight experiences.

Something I like about this game and alerts is that it's not really "tank and spank" in the sense that you need a tank to hold agro and a healer to keep them alive. At least half of my characters can solo many of the alerts, at least the ones without a time limit, the other 4 people just speed things up. Sure somebody eventually locks down agro, but it's not out of necessity and it's not really part of the strategy, it just happens. Basically people just zone in, wait for the cinematic, then go balls out. It's certainly more enjoyable than an assist train on the tank.

bdragon4co

rstzed wrote: »

It is so quick to get to LVL 15 I don't understand why you would want to run alerts before LVL 15...

Because its horribly boring after the 30th time. But by then, you should have some Heirloom gear, so there's no complaint.

gaelyn1

it can't be heroic for 3/5 or 4/5 level 40 characters, when the alerts are made and balanced to be made with 3/5 or 4/5 even 5/5 (good) level 10 characters...

And remember the poll just after the release of "on alert".
Heeeeeeeelp alerts are too difficult !!!!
http://co.perfectworld.com/news/?p=579831
I would describe the SMASH ALert difficulty as:
Just Right 1036
Too Easy 157
Too Hard 1120

Sure, players went in theses alerts with no gear, level 10-20, without doing their respecialization even if this is take less time to do them than whining on the forums for many days.
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=145950&page=3

And now, they are too much easy. (they were always too much easy,even at the release)
But with this kind of behavior of the CO's community, until Cryptic learn to not listen them, we have a few chances to have a real heroic feeling in this game.
Without difficulty, without challenge, no heroic feeling.

But let's see the good side. Now the players can level their characters a lot more quickly with alerts than to do missions in the open maps, they can complain that the open missions maps are empty. Wait, finally, i don't know if this is really a good point.
I assume there will never be one good point in this forum, in fact. Hehehe.

battybattybats

gaelyn1 wrote: »

it can't be heroic for 3/5 or 4/5 level 40 characters, when the alerts are made and balanced to be made with 3/5 or 4/5 even 5/5 (good) level 10 characters...

And remember the poll just after the release of "on alert".
Heeeeeeeelp alerts are too difficult !!!!
http://co.perfectworld.com/news/?p=579831
I would describe the SMASH ALert difficulty as:
Just Right 1036
Too Easy 157
Too Hard 1120

Sure, players went in theses alerts with no gear, level 10-20, without doing their respecialization even if this is take less time to do them than whining on the forums for many days.
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=145950&page=3

And now, they are too much easy. (they were always too much easy,even at the release)
But with this kind of behavior of the CO's community, until Cryptic learn to not listen them, we have a few chances to have a real heroic feeling in this game.
Without difficulty, without challenge, no heroic feeling.

But let's see the good side. Now the players can level their characters a lot more quickly with alerts than to do missions in the open maps, they can complain that the open missions maps are empty. Wait, finally, i don't know if this is really a good point.
I assume there will never be one good point in this forum, in fact. Hehehe.

If they are too easy why do i find that if i use my heavy attacks too much and catch aggro a smash nearly always fails due to the others not being able to make up the damage shortfall caused by my sepnding time blocking? Actually since i went from 39 to 40 the amount of smash failures for my character went up a lot. Now i really struggle not to catch aggro.

gaelyn1

battybattybats wrote: »

If they are too easy why do i find that if i use my heavy attacks too much and catch aggro a smash nearly always fails due to the others not being able to make up the damage shortfall caused by my sepnding time blocking? Actually since i went from 39 to 40 the amount of smash failures for my character went up a lot. Now i really struggle not to catch aggro.

The answer is in the question.
but i can add some details, you can choose:
1) the others players don't do enough damage, because their build is bad (freeform), because they have a poor gear (alerts don't drop as gear as the missions in open world if you level with only alerts), etc...
When you see players who can't kill a simple mob in less than 30 secs, there is a problem.
Sometimes, you can even see them blocking or die because they can't kill the simple mob, not the boss, a simple mob. It's a shame.
2) If the tank is competent, if there is a tank, you don't have to block.
3) You're right, the job of the dps characters is to manage their own aggro. Sometimes it's better to stop dps for 1 or 2 secs and not having to block without interruption for 20 secs later. But when you use palliate or blocking and nobody takes aggro in less than 5 secs, or you take aggro just after your palliate, the problem is always the same. There is no tank, or he's bad, or the others players do the same dps than your energy builder and the team is bad. And this is often as this.

But when you takes less than 20-30 secs to finish a smash with a good group and in prime time you can't finish an alert in 2 mns, this isn't because the alert is too hard, but because the players are bad. Very bad.
I give you a tip. When you enter alert, type O and see what the level of others players.
90%, they are between level 6 and 11. What do you want (and what do they want) finish an alert when 4/5 players have just the auto attack and one or two attacks rank 1 ?
They don't want to xp with missions in the west side, they prefer loose time to fail 9/10 alerts. It's a choice.
Mine is to quit when more than 2 players are level 6-15, or doing them in premade guild team, until Cryptic made a different queue for level 30-40. And all my alerts are win. Everybody makes his choices. :biggrin:

smoochan

gaelyn1 wrote: »

The answer is in the question.
but i can add some details, you can choose:
1) the others players don't do enough damage, because their build is bad (freeform), because they have a poor gear (alerts don't drop as gear as the missions in open world if you level with only alerts), etc...
When you see players who can't kill a simple mob in less than 30 secs, there is a problem.
Sometimes, you can even see them blocking or die because they can't kill the simple mob, not the boss, a simple mob. It's a shame.
2) If the tank is competent, if there is a tank, you don't have to block.
3) You're right, the job of the dps characters is to manage their own aggro. Sometimes it's better to stop dps for 1 or 2 secs and not having to block without interruption for 20 secs later. But when you use palliate or blocking and nobody takes aggro in less than 5 secs, or you take aggro just after your palliate, the problem is always the same. There is no tank, or he's bad, or the others players do the same dps than your energy builder and the team is bad. And this is often as this.

But when you takes less than 20-30 secs to finish a smash with a good group and in prime time you can't finish an alert in 2 mns, this isn't because the alert is too hard, but because the players are bad. Very bad.
I give you a tip. When you enter alert, type O and see what the level of others players.
90%, they are between level 6 and 11. What do you want (and what do they want) finish an alert when 4/5 players have just the auto attack and one or two attacks rank 1 ?
They don't want to xp with missions in the west side, they prefer loose time to fail 9/10 alerts. It's a choice.
Mine is to quit when more than 2 players are level 6-15, or doing them in premade guild team, until Cryptic made a different queue for level 30-40. And all my alerts are win. Everybody makes his choices. :biggrin:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heORiZ8l484

jonsills

Gaelyn, there are those who run the ones that give XP Bonuses (Smashes? Unsure of the type) because they're trying to level faster through missions, which often don't give nearly enough XP. For instance, I've been leveling Captain Americlown that way - when my boost runs out, I look for a Red Winter or Dockside Dustup to get it back.

And your style can result in missing some really fun runs, like the Red Winter that we won with less than a second to go. It was the most comic-like experience I've had in the game so far! (Then again, you might have been the one who quit another run and made us lose because Soviet Guard still had a sliver of HP left when time ran out...)

smoochan

jonsills wrote: »

! (Then again, you might have been the one who quit another run and made us lose because Soviet Guard still had a sliver of HP left when time ran out...)

I wonder just how many of these elitist d-bags realize that they're the ones causing the failure when they bail on the group.


Quitters cause so many more failed smashes than any low level ever did. The irony.

biffsmackwell

neuraldamage wrote: »

You want to feel heroic? Then why are you doing alerts?

The alerts are mostly about "Gimme!", not heroism. :eek:

Gimme? Stopping bank robberies, stopping trains from exploding, helping clean up a toxic disaster, stopping nuclear missiles from launching... that all sounds heroic to me.

battybattybats wrote: »

If they are too easy why do i find that if i use my heavy attacks too much and catch aggro a smash nearly always fails due to the others not being able to make up the damage shortfall caused by my sepnding time blocking? Actually since i went from 39 to 40 the amount of smash failures for my character went up a lot. Now i really struggle not to catch aggro.

My latest character that I've been running alerts with, was a Might character. Naturally, I roll in the Brawler role. Go up and punch stuff as hard as I can. However, I have to sit and wait until someone else starts attacking, because if I aggro everything, I die. Even with some heals and active defenses.

So around level 30ish, I decided to take a passive defense (Regeneration), and roll in Hybrid mode. The rest of the build is still the same. Now when I go into an alert, I'm always the first one in, and I don't die, and normally I hold all the aggro (unless we got a tank in the team).

All that to say this - Maybe try switching to an active defense?

Regarding blocking: I did an alert yesterday, where some shooty-shooty gun guy grabbed aggro pretty quickly. He sat there and blocked for about 20 seconds, possibly more, when he got down to like 10% health. That's 20 seconds that we had less DPS on the boss. If you let him kill you, that's only 10 seconds off the clock, and you're back doing DPS right away. If you're low on health, have aggro, and all your heals/defenses are on cooldown for more than 10 seconds, blocking isn't worth it.

smoochan wrote: »

I wonder just how many of these elitist d-bags realize that they're the ones causing the failure when they bail on the group.

Quitters cause so many more failed smashes than any low level ever did. The irony.

Yesterday, during a two minute drill that seemed to be taking too long, I checked my team's levels. Four people level 15 and under. I offered up a snarky remarky, but we ended up finishing the alert. I was quite surprised, and glad that I didn't just quit in the beginning due to their levels (I was 37ish at the time - and just as a note, I very rarely leave mid-alert, and never at the beginning).

gaelyn1

jonsills wrote: »

Gaelyn, there are those who run the ones that give XP Bonuses (Smashes? Unsure of the type) because they're trying to level faster through missions, which often don't give nearly enough XP. For instance, I've been leveling Captain Americlown that way - when my boost runs out, I look for a Red Winter or Dockside Dustup to get it back.

And your style can result in missing some really fun runs, like the Red Winter that we won with less than a second to go. It was the most comic-like experience I've had in the game so far! (Then again, you might have been the one who quit another run and made us lose because Soviet Guard still had a sliver of HP left when time ran out...)

Sure. This is a way to xp more quickly and i understand some players do it.
But this is why a lot of alerts fail. Try some alerts and count how many victories on 10 alerts with 3 or more level 30-40 characters in the team, and now count how many victories on 10 alerts with only 1 or 2 levels 40 and 3 others level 6-10 almost useless.
And if you 'll be honest, you'll see that the statistics are not the same. In pug, not with an sg team, we're agree.

Yes, this can be fun, sometimes. And this can be rarely a victory contrary to all expectations. But after more than a month to see that the alerts who fail are almost always those with low levels, i assume.

But as you say, and smoochan too:

smoochan wrote: »

I wonder just how many of these elitist d-bags realize that they're the ones causing the failure when they bail on the group.
Quitters cause so many more failed smashes than any low level ever did. The irony.

This isn't the players who quit the alert, because they have seen since april that 99% of alerts fails when there is 3/5 or 4/5 level 6-15, who are those who cause the failure.
When 4 players and a useless level 6 win an alert, they could win the alert even without the level 6, if they were 4 players.
Me, i wonder just how many of theses low levels realize that they're the ones causing the failure when they can't win an alert when they are 4 players to do it. Because if 5 players can do it in 30 secs, 4 players can do it in less of 1mn.
If they can't do it in 2 mns, the problem isn't with the player who have quit. Hope that the high level character(s) do the job and just have to pick the reward is not the solution at the problem. And this, this isn't ironic.

And i wish you a good evening, i quit this thread, i have some alerts to do.

smoochan

gaelyn1 wrote: »

This isn't the players who quit the alert, because they have seen since april that 99% of alerts fails when there is 3/5 or 4/5 level 6-15, who are those who cause the failure.
When 4 players and a useless level 6 win an alert, they could win the alert even without the level 6, if they were 4 players.
Me, i wonder just how many of theses low levels realize that they're the ones causing the failure when they can't win an alert when they are 4 players to do it. Because if 5 players can do it in 30 secs, 4 players can do it in less of 1mn.
If they can't do it in 2 mns, the problem isn't with the player who have quit. Hope that the high level character(s) do the job and just have to pick the reward is not the solution at the problem. And this, this isn't ironic.

And i wish you a good evening, i quit this thread, i have some alerts to do.

It's already been proven with extensive testing that low levels do not cause alerts to fail. You're a bit uninformed on this issue, it seems.

Anyways, have fun playing the game for once instead of complaining about it

bioshrike

The bigger problem is people who overuse their EB in lieu of any actual attacks, people who heal unnecessarily, (I emphasize "unnecessary" because if someone is at >90% HP, then please use your attacks, as your DPS will be more helpful), and people who accidentally or through lack of skill/experience aggro additional groups. Having said that, I think that the buffer for poor play becomes larger as you grow in level, due to the extra tools (i.e. powers, talents, advantages, gear, and specializations), that a higher level character possesses. When all you have is 1 or 2 attacks and possibly no passive, the room for error is nearly nonexistent. So, if you're a good player, you can win even at a very low level. If you're an average or novice player, then the odds become stacked against you...

neuraldamage

smoochan wrote: »

It's already been proven with extensive testing that low levels do not cause alerts to fail if they are using heirloom gear.

Fixed that for you.

Frankly I've seen smash alerts fail without ANY low level toons (under 15) from time to time. :eek:

beldin

neuraldamage wrote: »

Fixed that for you.

And .. Heirloom gear doesn't do much at level 6 .. so another reason i'm for level 15
since thats when you get the full benefit from it

smoochan

neuraldamage wrote: »

Fixed that for you.

Frankly I've seen smash alerts fail without ANY low level toons (under 15) from time to time. :eek:

The tests didn't include heirloom gear, they included only the gear from the starter pack given to you by the head trainer. Unfixed

beldin

smoochan wrote: »

The tests didn't include heirloom gear, they included only the gear from the starter pack given to you by the head trainer. Unfixed

If you mean the same tests that i remember, a group of only lvl 6 chars from experience players
still had fails on Black Fang .. and such a group with 40 will kill him in maybe 30 seconds.

agentnx5

neuraldamage wrote: »

You want to feel heroic? Then why are you doing alerts?

The alerts are mostly about "Gimme!", not heroism. :eek:

Do the missions with the storylines and crank up the difficulty instead. I don't believe they have removed that content yet.

This is a good point. And frankly I'd prefer some more exploration & plot more than just...

"{insert name here}, ON ALERT!"

zenzenarimasen

neuraldamage wrote: »

You want to feel heroic? Then why are you doing alerts?

The alerts are mostly about "Gimme!", not heroism. :eek:

Do the missions with the storylines and crank up the difficulty instead. I don't believe they have removed that content yet.

SHHHH! Keep your voice down. We don't want to give them any ideas.

(I kid, I kid)

nepht

beldin wrote: »

And .. Heirloom gear doesn't do much at level 6 .. so another reason i'm for level 15
since thats when you get the full benefit from it

Agreement here on the level 15 minimum entry.

But I dont know when you in an alert and your fighting Jack fool and no one dies thats feels pretty heroic.

Beating up Black Fang less so

neuraldamage

beldin wrote: »

If you mean the same tests that i remember, a group of only lvl 6 chars from experience players still had fails on Black Fang .. and such a group with 40 will kill him in maybe 30 seconds.

Yes that's the test I remember as well. It was experienced players showing up with lowbies in "whatever gear they brought" including heirloom gear.

Now if you've duplicated the lowbie tests with more realistic parameters, then I've missed it (entirely possible) and would sure like a link to the thread. Because what you are claiming and what I've seen in 3 months of farming alerts, including hundreds of Smash alerts (yes, Crush isn't the only one with spreadsheets) are not quite meshing together.

nepht

neuraldamage wrote: »

Yes that's the test I remember as well. It was experienced players showing up with lowbies in "whatever gear they brought" including heirloom gear.

Now if you've duplicated the lowbie tests with more realistic parameters, then I've missed it (entirely possible) and would sure like a link to the thread. Because what you are claiming and what I've seen in 3 months of farming alerts, including hundreds of Smash alerts (yes, Crush isn't the only one with spreadsheets) are not quite meshing together.

Did some test with proper noobs from my sg ones with crappy gear and nope I didnt go into the alerts with em .

It was a 40% win 60% fail ratio

They lost most of the time but when they won they felt heroic

supercollider75

neuraldamage wrote: »

Yes that's the test I remember as well. It was experienced players showing up with lowbies in "whatever gear they brought" including heirloom gear.

Now if you've duplicated the lowbie tests with more realistic parameters, then I've missed it (entirely possible) and would sure like a link to the thread. Because what you are claiming and what I've seen in 3 months of farming alerts, including hundreds of Smash alerts (yes, Crush isn't the only one with spreadsheets) are not quite meshing together.

Firstly, I don't want to restart any arguments about 'appropriate testing' & it being not representative' as that was never the aim of the 'tests' and sadly my pictures on my final post on the thread has been eaten in the forum change but frankly it was along the lines of "headdesk/derail/Bear Ghrylls "better drink my own piss""
Lowbie SMASH Challenge LINK: http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=148293

All we did was prove it is possible for a team of lowbies who know what they are doing to beat Black Fang (and therefore throw doubt on the claims that having one or two under 15 toons on a Smash team would practically guarantee a lose).
(3/5 win rate - losses happened when team leveled up and SK math changed.)

The team all wore starter pack primaries. Two players had the heirloom secondaries on but the bonus from that was utterly minimal, a single lvl 6 secondary would have been been a noticable improvement on the heirloom secondaries. As it is Starter Pack Primaries confer more of a bonus than the heirloom at level 6 as there's only one SS to boost so the 2nd & 3rd SS boosts go to waste. Heirloom gear only really becomes fully effective at level 15. out of interest the Armadillo or Cyber Gear with their set bonuses would be a far better proposition that nemesis gear for anything like that.

However, having done that I can't recommend it and personaly feel a level 11 gate on alerts and us having Canada Crisis back at level 6 for alts would be a good solution.

Now that said beating Black Fang with a team of lowbies DID make me feel heroic when we did it but that's because it was a genuine 'edge of the seat, are we gonna pull this off' vibe and I still got that when I've gone and tested several ATs at level6 against Black Fang.

Unless I'm trying to prove something (or have a very understanding full team) I only start alerts at level 11 and even then only in heirloom gear or the Q cyber/armadillo type gear that levels with you.

Can't agree with a level 15 requirement as I know many players who are frantically alting and powerleveling (me included) while we wait for the next morsel of new content. By level 11 we can usually roflstomp just about any alert and are already weary of Westside.
However I approve of cryptic putting a "WARNING: you if you are under level 15 you may find this alert challenging" (just like I wish they'd do to the Lockout boss battle areas) to help warn/deter newbies.

neuraldamage

The funny thing is I actually have felt heroic a few times in alerts. Most involve last-second wins and/or near-death experiences though. :eek:

And I will readily admit that the rare "smooth as silk" Alert PuG is a thing of beauty when it happens. :biggrin:

But sadly mass aggro, running "tanks", chasing flying off into the distance villains, mouthy "heroes" and ugh, leeches that won't even attempt to take down henchmen are far more common than "smooth as silk".

nepht

neuraldamage wrote: »

....
But sadly mass aggro, running "tanks", chasing flying off into the distance villains, mouthy "heroes" and ugh, leeches that won't even attempt to take down henchmen are far more common than "smooth as silk".

You wont like the graphic novel Watchmen cause it full of the above

But yeah tanks that knock Hi Pan all over the place is a truly *headdesk* moment.

neuraldamage

supercollider75 wrote: »

Lowbie SMASH Challenge LINK: http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=148293

All we did was prove it is possible for a team of lowbies who know what they are doing to beat Black Fang (and therefore throw doubt on the claims that having one or two under 15 toons on a Smash team would practically guarantee a lose).
(3/5 win rate - losses happened when team leveled up and SK math changed.)

<snippage for our sanity>

Yes that is the one I am thinking about, thanks.

I didn't think that result should be construed as "low-levels don't cause failure" when it clearly showed that while it is possible to succeed under optimal parameters, it was not an absolute.

I too thought the OP that started this stated a failure rate that was a bit high but was and still am not prepared to say it is a fallacy that lowbies do not cause alert failure. Of course there are other factors that cause failure even for high level toons but that is another discussion and frankly this is all just mental masturbation while we wait for Zen conversion as PWE shows no intentions of changing the mechanics for alerts.

So... show me the Zen.

neuraldamage

nepht wrote: »

You wont like the graphic novel Watchmen cause it full of the above

But yeah tanks that knock Hi Pan all over the place is a truly *headdesk* moment.

Oh god, I absolutely hated the movie. :redface:

beldin

supercollider75 wrote: »

All we did was prove it is possible for a team of lowbies who know what they are doing to beat Black Fang (and therefore throw doubt on the claims that having one or two under 15 toons on a Smash team would practically guarantee a lose).
(3/5 win rate - losses happened when team leveled up and SK math changed.)

No put the same team with their 40s in a group for Black Fang and they will destroy him
in 30 seconds .. what proves that 40s are 4 times more effective than level 6 players.

nepht

neuraldamage wrote: »

Oh god, I absolutely hated the movie. :redface:

I have nightmares of giant blue CGI wangs because of that movie

biffsmackwell

nepht wrote: »

You wont like the graphic novel Watchmen cause it full of the above

But yeah tanks that knock Hi Pan all over the place is a truly *headdesk* moment.

I've knocked Hi-Pan on purpose before. It was a two minute drill. I'm on my level 11ish Might character. Hi-Pan is getting low on health, but so am I. I've got aggro, clock is ticking down (like 20 seconds or so to go), all my heals are on cooldown, and I'm still taking damage through blocking.

I'm waiting for someone to grab aggro from me. I'm just sitting there blocking. Nothing. So since I've got aggro and I'm about to die and the clock is ticking down, I make a last-minute decision. If I die that's 10 seconds off the clock and the whole thing is over. Mr. Pan starts an attack and I charge my haymaker. My haymaker goes off first, sending him flying away. As soon as my attack lands I'm already closing the distance between us. He lands and I start charging the haymaker again. Bam, he goes flying, I've still got aggro, but am taking no damage. Still at a sliver of health. Once again, I close the distance and smash his face in.

Hi-Pan dies soon after, with almost no time left.

Of course, some guy starts talking crap to me after the alert, telling me "why are you knocking the boss around, noob?" and all that jazz. According to him, his friend had aggro "the entire time". I didn't have aggro 100% of the time, but I had it most of the time. Now, if his friend had aggro the entire time, or even most of the time, why would I be almost dead and with heals on cooldown, and why was he attacking me? The trash had been taken out early on, so that's not where the damage was coming from.

neuraldamage wrote: »

Oh god, I absolutely hated the movie. :redface:

Same here, also hated the graphic novel.

nepht

biffsmackwell wrote: »

I've knocked Hi-Pan on purpose before. It was a two minute drill. I'm on my level 11ish Might character. Hi-Pan is getting low on health, but so am I. I've got aggro, clock is ticking down (like 20 seconds or so to go), all my heals are on cooldown, and I'm still taking damage through blocking.

I'm waiting for someone to grab aggro from me. I'm just sitting there blocking. Nothing. So since I've got aggro and I'm about to die and the clock is ticking down, I make a last-minute decision. If I die that's 10 seconds off the clock and the whole thing is over. Mr. Pan starts an attack and I charge my haymaker. My haymaker goes off first, sending him flying away. As soon as my attack lands I'm already closing the distance between us. He lands and I start charging the haymaker again. Bam, he goes flying, I've still got aggro, but am taking no damage. Still at a sliver of health. Once again, I close the distance and smash his face in.

Hi-Pan dies soon after, with almost no time left.

Of course, some guy starts talking crap to me after the alert, telling me "why are you knocking the boss around, noob?" and all that jazz. According to him, his friend had aggro "the entire time". I didn't have aggro 100% of the time, but I had it most of the time. Now, if his friend had aggro the entire time, or even most of the time, why would I be almost dead and with heals on cooldown, and why was he attacking me? The trash had been taken out early on, so that's not where the damage was coming from.



Same here, also hated the graphic novel.

Thats a whole different kettle of fish . You knocked him for tactical reasons not all over the place just cause you can. Thats the proper use of knockback done a by a vet that knows what they are doing and not some nub behemoth hulk clone.

Yeah theses guys that claim they had ALL the agrro when it was your own face that was in the enemy target box the whole time, been there

smoochan

beldin wrote: »

No put the same team with their 40s in a group for Black Fang and they will destroy him
in 30 seconds .. what proves that 40s are 4 times more effective than level 6 players.

Yes. Level 40s are more effective than level 6s. Did.... did you think that was somehow being disputed by someone?

yougan

if they made events out of then instead of simple missions they might actually bring the game alive, now most players are ether doing quests in an instance or play alerts which are also instances.
open missions are not worth it since they have a timer that can sometimes take hours and the score board makes the open missions like a contest against other players, i want to see allot more cooperation with players instead of all the hostility against each other.
we are heroes in this game but apparently we are more like bulldogs fighting for the best and tastiest meat, we can get the same thing in doom or tribes or any other multiplayer game.