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PTS Update (6/14): FC.20.20110614.0
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Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
FC.20.20110614.0 Patch Notes
PTS Update ETA: 2:30 PM PST (GMT-7)
Known Issues:
The Impulse
Force
PTS Update ETA: 2:30 PM PST (GMT-7)
Known Issues:
- Known issues will be posted here.
The Impulse
- This archetype has an additional power choice. At level 8, The Impulse can now choose between Personal Force Field and Kinetic Manipulation.
Force
- Inertial Dampening Field: Stacking multiple instances of this power will now produce reduced results. With just one person in the party running the power, the amount of protection is unchanged. With all 5 party members running the power, the amount of protection is half of what it used to be.
- Force Detonation: Recharge time has been reduced to 10 seconds, down from 15.
- Force Detonation: Cost reduced ~10 Energy.
- Containment Field: Cost reduced ~3 Energy.
- Force Eruption: Damage increased ~5%.
- Force Eruption: Tap cost reduced ~1 Energy; cost per charge time reduced ~1 Energy.
- Force Geyser: Cost reduced ~3 Energy.
Post edited by Archived Post on
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Comments
Yes!
[post=1857918]Less than two hours after the Archetype was first announced:[/post]
Oh well.
Reading more on the PTS forums: Can someone point me to this Stat rebalancing people keep refering to?
Are we talking the Pipedreams and wishes thread or something that Cryptic is ACTUALLY going to do?
From first post of this thread: http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=130904
WAY COOL GUYS best AT so far good work
Thanks Temprus.
Well I expect the rest of my toons to kicked in the jewels via that, it would only make sense after the TK changes.
I don't want to put words in his mouth, as maybe the info wasn't finalized. But until he responds, he did say this in the Force Framework thread
PFF just needs... something
...or do they do already? o.o
EDIT:
And PFF. Something. At least SOMETHING.
Just watch:
Force Detonation and Ebon Rift's Vengeful Shadows
4 points to get full benefit 2 points to get full benefit
500 base damage 1500 base damage
1 second activation time 0.5 second activation time
50 ft. knockback(scales) 100 ft. knockback(doesn't scale)
10 ft. aoe 15 ft. aoe
81 enduracne cost(after patch) 31 endurance cost
10 seconds cooldown(also only after patch) 15 seconds cooldown
Can't be channeled for additional damage Can be channeled for additional damage
Wtf? The only thing that is better on detonation is cooldown, but it's meaningless buff since you don't spam that power, but use it only when enemies are clustered together, and that happens much more rarely than every 10 seconds. Most PVE villains are immune to fall damage or saved by low roofs too so it makes str scaling on force detonation useless(in pvp fall damage is wasted 90% of the time too thx to closed maps\high grounds\some specific travel powers)
I'm not even mentioning TOTALLY useless and outclassed powers like Orbital Cannon, but rly, what kind of spreadsheets are you guys using, makes me wonder.
Also lockdown from Crushing Wave should be removed, also Force Geyser NEEDS better animation and should scale with str, cos 800 fall damage on rank 3 that doesn't even work 100% of the time? Really?
Contaiment field needs less activation time or -50% damage component removed. Force Eruption needs larger aoe or less activation time. PFF needs many buffs, don't even know where to start) Advantages on both Force Cascade and Force Eruption should start working on tap once again.
I actually have a toon I'm trying to use PFF on... and it really is like trying to harvest alligator teeth... from a live, angry, hungry, and untranquilized mother alligator guarding her nest.
...So the Impulse can have a passive or a toggle, but NEVER a passive and the toggle most likely to help keep the weaksausce passive working?
I seriously don't get what you guys are going for here. I get the feeling we are failing to impress upon you how bad PFF is.
What toggle are you refering to? I ask as I only noticed an offensive and defensive passive.
Replace force detonation with force implosion. I can think of all sorts of valuable benefits to collecting a mob of foes in a tiny space.
You are confused. The toggle is called Inertial Dampening Field. Kinetic Manipulation is an offensive passive.
My very first thought too. The AT was put out there for input and I think the majority was PFF is really bad so then KM was added as a choice. All I can say is it would suck to be Silver and make the wrong choice.
I know now thanks to a post elsewhere by Ame that they don't want to tweak PFF now because that would just be a band-aid. They have some ideas, but Ame placed a change somewhere between not right now and a full force review.
The problem is a bunch of people will buy this AT with real money and then possibly choose PFF and many of us know how that will play out. Plus, I took Field Surge way early. The AT has to wait a loooong time. I'm thinking PFF should be removed and the AT should be straight Avenger DPS.
Wow.
You have a point Kien.
The power balance formulas for Champions either are in shambles, or they are not being used.
Well, it pulls everyone in it's radius to the center, so practically rift with advantage is a 15 ft. aoe knock.
Oh, the spreadsheets ARE being used. And thus the problem. We have tried to tell them for as long as there have been power reviews that the spreadsheets they are using are dung and should be disposed of in a manner appropriate thereto. I'm not against spreadsheets. I use them myself time to time, but I can also recognize when the spreadsheets are giving me information that is not in keeping with the reality of the situation and adjust or eliminate them as needed.
Looking back at the various reviews that have been done both before and after the start of F2P, I can see massive nerfs done wholesale then came the melee buff and the nerf to energy builders (Fine, call it a standardization if you want, but they standardized it to the low end of the choices available instead of the high end, and I call that a nerf. Thank you, Balseraph.) Then with the coming of F2P, we see several power reviews where powers are getting buffed up. I guess it finally sank in that every time they did a massive bunch of nerfs they lost a portion of their players. But with all the nerfs and buffs, the powers still follow no rhyme or reason in their balancing (or lack thereof). The long and the short of it is that the spreadsheets either need a massive overhaul or need to be completely redone.
Yeah, it sucks them in but the pull is very weak and 90% of all mobs (and every mob of Villain status or higher can resist the pull with impunity.
Why is the IDF nerf unnecessary? Gamers that use it, including myself, admit that it's a bit over-powered when everyone on your team has it.
I've actually played where 4 people had it running. That means when we were close to each other we were getting somewhere around 240 flat-damage reduction. That's a lot.
They're just nerfing the team/stack portion of it, which is definitely needed. So if all 5 people have it, you'll be getting *around* 150 mitigation instead of 300.
But seriously. PFF guys. Come on. You know you want to make it awesome.
Sorry, was thinking of Inertial Dampening Field, not KM
I have made a pure force toon when i saw the kinetic manipulator offensive passive and wanted to try it out. It works fantastic. It boosts damage, decreases ranged attacks a bit and overall makes force.. pardon the pun A FORCE TO BE RECKONED WITH. haha But PFF as much as i've tried to make it work both before powers used specific superstats and after when they use flat superstats andd its still lacking for a "defensive passive". The other "Defensive" passives are great.. you get more damage resistance which makes tanking possible... But PFF just doesn't have that edge.
The only champion i've gotten it to work decently on is an offensive character.. it gives me just enough defense to kill most minions before my HP starts getting effected... well unless i'm fighting tough villains or supervillains. But for regular pve it seems just the right balance.
SOOO why not combine the force passive that already works well (kinetic manipulator) and the defensive part which doesn't work well at all as a straight defensive power (personal force field) and combine it into a straight offensive power. Perhaps "Kinetic force field manipulator"
You wouldn't even have to change the numbers on the shield strength since the shield absorbs all damage before any defensive stats take effect. It would give you just enough defense to throw down your force powers without taking too much damage to your HP. Yet in a prolonged battle say against a supervillain you'd still be susceptible to the heavy damage.
I like the idea, though the numbers might need a little tweaking. I also suggest that this be made the only guardian-only passive in the game which would to me justify making it a little stronger than if it would be avaliable in other roles.
Yes, but is KM balanced without adding a few thousand health Forcefield to it ?
I have Orbital Cannon and Force Detonation on multiple level 40 pvp toons (SH pvp, and not duel, though Force Detonation is good for duels)
A really fun stronghold combo is Orbital Cannon-Force Detonation->some hold/repel (like Heatwave, Force Geyser or Concussor Beams). Orbital Cannon is an awesome PvE power because of the delay - lets you start a second alpha (like Gigabolt or Shoulder Launcher). Force Detonation is a good PvE/PvP power for quick defense vs melee (especially vs the MA form toons). For ranged toons using STR/Enrage, Force Detonation can be very powerful.
Oh Wow!! Great changes!!
I really love that last line!
What you did there, I see it.
It's 100% justified however. Believe me when I say 5 people running IDF trivializes PvE, even on Elite.
It MURDERS your energy generation, both from your energy builders and energy unlocks.
That's what the stacking AoPM is for. Though, really...I don't notice much more of a penalty after the first stack. Maybe I'm not paying enough attention.
Team up with more than 2 IDF users and you'll be killing zombies/mobs/bosses at snail pace.
It isn't really noticeable in Stronghold or other PvP gametypes, since players kinda do their own things there. It is noticeable when everyone gangs up on the bosses though. UTC is an exception, especially cage match. You pretty much have to be grouped up to stand a chance, and you're within IDF distance like that most of the time.
Like Sage, I call shenanigans on this. AoPM's additional REC/END more than makes up for the IDF penalty. Running TT on Elite with 4-5 IDF and 2-3 AoPM I've always come out ahead in the energy department.
IDF needs this stacking reduction, period.
It's not that common.
In teams where you don't have AoPM, IDF is murder to energy generation when stacked. Which happens quite often.
Um... The debuff to your energy generation only happens if you're the one actually using the power. If you happen to have the buff on you from somebody else, the debuff part doesn't affect you.
If it did actually work that way...wow.
However, thankfully it doesn't. However a toggle+IDF can kill your regeneration the exact same amount as if you toggled 2 idfs. It's not that big of a deal.
It's murder to energy generation even with just the user having it, but only to them.
And the reason why Zandar mentioned AoPM is because, when we usually run Therakiel (which is where the two of us personally see IDF stacking most often, as it's me and one other at least), I'm usually the healer, and I use AoPM.