HW Tank advice?

omnius

I've decided I'm going to retcon my HW from DPS to Tank role because I've learned that I'm more of a ranged DPS guy but I still love this powerset. I think this build is pretty much standard but still have questions:

Do I have enough Challenge and in the right places?
Should I be using Defiance or Invulnerability?
Any other changes in my SS, specs, powers, or adv points needed?

HW Tank - Freeform (Tank)
v3.44:37

Super Stats
Level 6: Strength (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Recovery (Secondary)

Talents
Level 1: The Devastator (Str: 10, Con: 10, Rec: 10, End: 8)
Level 6: Paramilitary Training (Str: 3, Con: 3, Rec: 3, End: 3)
Level 9: Relentless (Str: 5, Rec: 5)
Level 12: Quick Recovery (Con: 5, Rec: 5)
Level 15: Physical Conditioning (Str: 5, Con: 5)
Level 18: Bodybuilder (Str: 5, End: 5)
Level 21: Boundless Reserves (Con: 5, End: 5)

Powers
Level 1: Bludgeon
Level 1: Eruption (Rank 2, Magma Burst)
Level 6: Enrage (Giant Growth)
Level 8: Defiance (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Pulverizer
Level 14: Iron Cyclone (Vortex Technique, Challenge!)
Level 17: Endorphin Rush (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 20: Annihilate (Rank 2, Scorching Blade, Challenge!)
Level 23: Resurgence (Rank 2)
Level 26: Arc of Ruin (No Quarter, Wildfire)
Level 29: Guard (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 32: Decimate
Level 35: Aggressor
Level 38: Unleashed Rage (Rank 2, Commanding Presence)
Adv. Points: 36/36

Travel Powers
Level 6: Tornado Flight (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Athletics (Rank 2)

Specializations
Strength: Swole (3/3)
Strength: Physical Peak (2/3)
Strength: Brutality (2/2)
Strength: Juggernaut (3/3)
Protector: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Protector: Beacon of Hope (1/3)
Protector: Unrelenting (1/2)
Protector: Bulwark (2/2)
Protector: Defensive Expertise (3/3)
Warden: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Warden: Ruthless (2/2)
Warden: Elusive (2/2)
Warden: The Best Defense (3/3)
Mastery: Protector Mastery (1/1)

Devices

flowcyto

Yea, for Challenge, you typically want it on your main single-target attack, and on a AoE w/ good coverage for trash (as long as it's not a power w/ a long cd).

Generally, Invuln is better vs. smaller to medium hits due to the flat dmg reduction it grants, while Defiance's higher dmgRes (when stacked) makes it better vs. very large hits. Defiance is strong for builds that MT hard content w/ healers around, while Invuln is more versatile (esp since it doesn't have to be stacked). I'd prob recommend Invuln for you, though either passive could be made to work.

For the rest of the build, it looks okay overall. You could swap R2 in Eruption for R2 of Iron Cyclone or R3 the Ult (assuming Eruption is mostly just for putting up CFlames initially), move Challenge from Iron Cyclone to Arc of Ruin, and/or maybe consider other options in Protector spec (like Resolute or Debilitating Challenge), but the build can also work fine as is.

omnius

I just threw challenge on Cyclone because of the larger coverage. I'm guessing you're saying Arc instead because I'll be using it more often and also because cyclone is basically just for the knock-to, is that correct or for another reason? Will Arc's 10' coverage be enough AoE threat?
Also wondering how you would change Protector spec around to be better

flowcyto

Well, you'll likely also be using Arc in your single-target rotation (for debuffs), so tapping that could also naturally put up 2ndary Challenge on bosses while using Annihilate for primary challenge (you can do this w/ Iron Cyclone too, since it's also a pbAoE, but it's not as ideal to tap Iron Cyclone for single-target fights here). Arc isn't as wide of an AoE tag as Iron Cyclone, though, so yea it's kinda just up to you. Either approach could prob be fine, as long as you adapt your playstyle around it a bit.

In Protector, the main thing to get is Bulwark (and Fortified Gear for a Tank, though that's obv not unique to the spec); most of the other choices can be nice in different ways, so it just depends on what extra bonuses you'd like to have.

omnius

Thinking of these minor changes. I HATE flying enemies especially when you knock up and they stay up there so I'm trying to fit NttG in the build. That means no R2 for either Eruption or IC but do I really need it when Annihilate and AoR are my main hitters? Eruption is just for applying a knock and CF, and IC is basically just a knock-to grab with meh base damage anyway. I suppose that extra Furious on a full maintain can be a nice little bonus (I had one adv point left so I stuck another challenge in IC just for an extra initial wider threat grab).

Yes/No?

HW Tank - Freeform (Tank)
v3.44:37

Super Stats
Level 6: Strength (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Recovery (Secondary)

Talents
Level 1: The Devastator (Str: 10, Con: 10, Rec: 10, End: 8)
Level 6: Paramilitary Training (Str: 3, Con: 3, Rec: 3, End: 3)
Level 9: Relentless (Str: 5, Rec: 5)
Level 12: Quick Recovery (Con: 5, Rec: 5)
Level 15: Physical Conditioning (Str: 5, Con: 5)
Level 18: Bodybuilder (Str: 5, End: 5)
Level 21: Boundless Reserves (Con: 5, End: 5)

Powers
Level 1: Bludgeon
Level 1: Eruption (Magma Burst)
Level 6: Enrage (Giant Growth)
Level 8: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Pulverizer
Level 14: Iron Cyclone (Vortex Technique, Challenge!)
Level 17: Endorphin Rush (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 20: Annihilate (Rank 2, Scorching Blade, Challenge!)
Level 23: Resurgence (Rank 2)
Level 26: Arc of Ruin (No Quarter, Wildfire, Challenge!)
Level 29: Telekinetic Shield (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 32: Decimate (Nailed to the Ground)
Level 35: Aggressor
Level 38: Unleashed Rage (Rank 2, Commanding Presence)
Adv. Points: 36/36

Travel Powers
Level 6: Tornado Flight (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Athletics

Specializations
Strength: Swole (3/3)
Strength: Physical Peak (2/3)
Strength: Brutality (2/2)
Strength: Juggernaut (3/3)
Protector: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Protector: Beacon of Hope (1/3)
Protector: Unrelenting (1/2)
Protector: Bulwark (2/2)
Protector: Defensive Expertise (3/3)
Warden: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Warden: Ruthless (2/2)
Warden: Elusive (2/2)
Warden: The Best Defense (3/3)
Mastery: Protector Mastery (1/1)

Devices

flowcyto

Yea, you don't necessarily need Iron Cyclone here either. Its Vortex adv and extra reach can be nice to have, but you can also get by w/ just Arc being your main AoE, if you want to replace the Cyclone w/ something else. But it's up to you if you want to make any changes like that.

omnius

I'm just going to go back to Havoc Stomp w/ Major Impact. I like having a knock-to that's larger than 10' and unlike Cyclone, was fun to use.

How do you mod a STR HW tank as far as superstats go? Not sure what kind of STR/CON/REC mix I should be doing for enhanced/armoring mods, nor what kind of core mods to use. Also not sure which types of primaries/secondaries for gear (meaning stuff like built in severity gloves, +HP boots, and stuff like that)

flowcyto

Yea, Havoc Stomp w/ it's knock-in adv can be fine to take instead here.

The main stats you get as a tank will depend on how much health (Con) vs. dps/threat gen (Str) you want, and also accounting for having enough Rec to be fine on energy generally. If you're doing easier content, then you can lean more heavily into Str, while you'll prob want to stack Con for difficult content.

For primary offense gear, +crit% and +severity% are still good for both dps and threat gen, but you could also look into getting Confront mods (for even more threat gen; better if you're doing content that forces you to block often and/or if you're playing w/ allies that have very high dps), or even bonus healing mods (if you have decent self-healing powers). Primary defense is usually best geared towards getting more +maxHP for tanks, but you can also get some extra +defense if you have some '+%defense from gear' specs. Primary utility gear can be a mix of cost discount and cd reduction, though you could also consider the +dmg utility mod for the HW powerset here (Ironclad's Willpower). 2ndary gear can be similar versions of the primary gear, but w/ less customization options and stats overall.