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Improving Cosmic Fights (Lezard Explains How)
lezard21
Posts: 1,510 Arc User
1 tank 2-3 healers and as much DPS as the zone cap allows before "hits don't register" and zone cap is reduced again.
What am I describing?
If your answer is 75% of the Cosmic fights then congratulations! Your monitor is turned on!
Anywho, while I cannot speak to the original intended intention of the revamped Cosmic fights, their encouragement of the Holy Trinity of MMOs is a fact.
However said trinity's distribution is...very poor. Particularly Tank distribution, but also healers to a lesser extent.
Additional Tanks are not required and end up being just a lazy mode in the best of the cases or a hindrance in the worst ones.
Additional healers for fights other than Kiga and Eido end up fighting over credit availability.
Now, I can only assume this part, but since Cosmic main hits are able to be split among 3 players (fixed from 3 targets since before you could use pets and circles to split damage with you) I'd say that the original intended intention was for the fights to require multiple tanks.
As we know, this turned out not to be the case due to the mighty "defensive passive" + "shift key" combo.
Now, how could oh we ever fix this issue?
While this would certainly force the use of splits, it would also have the undesireable consequence that, should an offtank screw up and die, the MT will immediately die in the next attack even if he was doing everything perfect.
While I would be totally fine with this, I am pretty sure 99% of the community would hate this. Plus we already have one Cosmic with said mechanic (Dino) and I'd rather we keep it unique to her.
The alternative I propose is as follow:
THUS, as a result of this:
Discuss \o/
(Remember every number I used is for theorycrafting only and the important part to discuss is the pros/cons of said mechanic)
What am I describing?
If your answer is 75% of the Cosmic fights then congratulations! Your monitor is turned on!
Anywho, while I cannot speak to the original intended intention of the revamped Cosmic fights, their encouragement of the Holy Trinity of MMOs is a fact.
However said trinity's distribution is...very poor. Particularly Tank distribution, but also healers to a lesser extent.
Additional Tanks are not required and end up being just a lazy mode in the best of the cases or a hindrance in the worst ones.
Additional healers for fights other than Kiga and Eido end up fighting over credit availability.
Now, I can only assume this part, but since Cosmic main hits are able to be split among 3 players (fixed from 3 targets since before you could use pets and circles to split damage with you) I'd say that the original intended intention was for the fights to require multiple tanks.
As we know, this turned out not to be the case due to the mighty "defensive passive" + "shift key" combo.
Now, how could oh we ever fix this issue?
"RAMP UP THE COSMIC DAMAGE WAY UP HIGH!"
While this would certainly force the use of splits, it would also have the undesireable consequence that, should an offtank screw up and die, the MT will immediately die in the next attack even if he was doing everything perfect.
ADD A SECOND APE/KIGA/EIDOLON TARGET THAT THE OFFTANK HAS TO PULL AWAY
While I would be totally fine with this, I am pretty sure 99% of the community would hate this. Plus we already have one Cosmic with said mechanic (Dino) and I'd rather we keep it unique to her.
STOP STROKING YOUR OWN EGO AND GET TO THE POINT!
The alternative I propose is as follow:
- Every Cosmic main attack places 3 stacks of a healing debuff (for the sake of number theorycrafting let's say 4% debuff per stack) on the Tank. Said stacks last for a while (let's say 15 seconds), are not refreshable BUT can be further stacked.
- Stacks can be split amongst 2 other players. If there is 1 offtank present, MT will get 2 stacks per hit and offtank will get 1 stack per hit. If there's 2 offtanks present, each tank will get 1 stack per hit.
- In a window of 15 seconds, if the Cosmic does nothing but attack the MT, it will be able to get 5 hits off at most
THUS, as a result of this:
- With splits MT will get a 20-40% healing debuff at most which is manageable by 1 or 2 healers considering the MT will also be taking less damage due to split
- Without splits, MT will end up getting up to 60% Healing Debuff on him, which is a huge deal cutting healing in half. MT will have to play a lot more defensively during this time
- 1 single healer will have a hard time keeping him up topped at that point, adding value to additional healers
- The fact that the stacks build up over time means that the MT is not immediately screwed as soon as the Offtanks die, leaving room for the Offtanks to be rezzed or release and run back.
Discuss \o/
(Remember every number I used is for theorycrafting only and the important part to discuss is the pros/cons of said mechanic)
0
Comments
The real tanking problem at cosmics is mostly tanks who don't want to tank -- either they're in tank role because the AT doesn't give them a choice, or they actually want to be tough dps, and do that through some combination of tank role, high con, and defensive passive.
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Also funny nothing is brought up about CC in this discussion, the one role where it's actively detrimental to have more than one unless it's something wonky like 4 separate CCs using single-target holds on designated dogs.
As far as existing cosmics, I don't know. Suggestions like altering how CON scales will likely be met with a riot, even if that might make balancing easier.
-Sterga
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Some cosmics can take a long time for various reasons, but there are times of the day when all 3 can go down in an hour. Just depends on who's bringing what to the fight and how well each person fills that role.
And what Panta says is completely accurate.
In some ways I like the Viper and dino adds at dino. Adds a little spice now and then.
Kind of wish they'd tweak kiga to make his attacks splittable. Give the other tanks something more to do than worry if they are going to grab aggro while standing with the dps and then get everyone killed when kiga turns and breathes.
This. Look at TA where 40% of the party is composed of tanks, one of which can even be a pseudo/hybrid/CC tank. Small group content has much better distribution. Unfortunately out of all the endgame stuff they've tried, open-world cosmics are the most popular.
Considering that the only things we ever have to wait for at cosmics are tanks, healers, and CC, are we really sure that not requiring more of these people to show up is actually a problem we want to solve? If I had to pick which I hate more, feeling pointless as an offtank or having to wait for an offtank, I sure as heck hate the second more. As for healers and struggling for credit, I already solved that problem by giving my healers attacks so they can make enough credit that way.
I used to think that it would be beneficial to add more things for more tanks to do at cosmics but some things have happened since then that have convinced me that that would just lead to more waiting at best, and an ungodly mess at worst. Cosmics are just simple, brainless open world endgame stuff. If we want more compelling content with better role distribution, it should come from epic lairs.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
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My characters
The great thing about High Noon is that the towers don't create specific required roles, they just need somebody who can do the job and that someone can come from a fairly wide range of combinations of builds. Also, people from the middle can go out and help shore up towers if need be. It's completely different from adding another specific thing to tank with a specific type of tank who has to sink or swim completely on their own merits.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.