Superman does heroic things on a constant basis. A lot of times at great personal sacrifice. It's only with the Injustice storyline that he finally compromises on his heroic ideals and kills Joker because he caused Lois' death.
I don't get this rationale that just because he's written as an immensely powerful superhero that it gets in the way of him or her doing heroic things. The point of superheroes is that they use their super abilities for the welfare and betterment of common everyday folk who could never do otherwise. Superman is that definitive archetype.
Batman having no superpowers and using just his exceptional intellect and mastery of all known fighting skills definitely gives him an appeal that sets him apart other superheroes, but it doesn't make him more heroic by default. It would certainly make him more relatable because of his humanity though. Even then Batman represents such an exceptional standard of human ability that it comes off as unrealistic, especially when writers have to think of various plot devices to let him defeat supervillains that could kill him by just blinking.
As far as role models go, both heroes are role models in their own right. Superman shows that with great power and being responsible with it, a lot of good can be achieved with it. He's regarded as a moral beacon by his peers for a reason. Batman overcomes his personal trauma and comes out stronger, and it motivates him to strive to help others and be the best kind of human being possible. Despite the darker side of humanity having wronged him in such a great way, he maintains the ideal that humanity is not beyond saving.
Unless two galaxies stacked on top of one another were about to crash into Earth and Supes sprained his elbow pushing them away, I'm not impressed. People should take Batman as a moral beacon over Supes anyday. If Supes had any sense of responsibility he'd be living on another planet in the solar system and only show up on Earth when there's a threat that warrants his presence so when some ridiculously op thing shows up to fight him he doesn't tear half a city apart. Batman takes the hard way to keep collateral damage as low as possible. Superman puts us all in danger so he can get himself some earth tail on the reg.
Ridiculously OP threats that have or have nothing to do with seeking out Superman appearing on Earth in seconds without prior warning is exactly why Supes stays on Earth, or at times aboard the Watchtower.
Even Batman at times is forced to admit that Supes is a needed deterrent against such threats.
Someone like Darkseid might have a grudge against him, but other threats like Brainiac probably wouldn't care and would treat Supes like any other obstacle getting in the way.
Supes can fly fast enough that he could get to Earth in time. If something appears on earth and kills everyone in less time than it would take Supes to fly from the edge of the solar system to Earth then he wouldn't have been able to do anything anyway. That's the problem with trying to make meaningful threats for OP characters, you just start getting ridiculous, and Supes crossed ridiculous years ago. They would need to have a permanent depowering storyline for him to have any hope of being interesting or heroic ever again.
Supes can fly fast enough that he could get to Earth in time. If something appears on earth and kills everyone in less time than it would take Supes to fly from the edge of the solar system to Earth then he wouldn't have been able to do anything anyway. That's the problem with trying to make meaningful threats for OP characters, you just start getting ridiculous, and Supes crossed ridiculous years ago. They would need to have a permanent depowering storyline for him to have any hope of being interesting or heroic ever again.
It's also why Bat-god exists... Because realistically, anyone who's a threat to Superman could one-shot Batman.
My favorite Superman stories are centered on him doing things OTHER than punching dudes in the face. Like how he convinced Livewire and Scorch to be heroes.
First, Supes was depowered years back. Even now, he's nowhere near the power levels of Silver Age Superman.
Second, it's really not that hard to make stories that challenge him. Not every threat can be punched into submission, you know. And Superman doesn't have any special persuasive abilities that don't involve his physique, nor does he have an ability to fight cultures. (And, of course, he's just as vulnerable as anyone to magic, and magical threats aren't that rare in the DC universe...)
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
> @spinnytop said: > Goku achieving a new power level is more interesting than anything Super Man has ever done.
Considering how ridiculously over the top DBZ or DBS tends to be and with the core narrative having to do with increasing power levels for both protagonists and antagonists to seemingly no end just so they can have ridiculously over the top battles, I hardly find Goku to be a more interestingly written character than Superman. That's my personal opinion anyway.
The viewpoint being made about how ridiculously OP threats have to be created all the time just for Supes to fight them making him a boring non-heroic character can be applied to Goku as well, because Goku is such a massively powerful hero character like Supes is. Every powerful villain Goku has to fight and defeat has always been replaced with a more powerful one each time.
My hair color is yellow! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair color is shiny yellow! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is now longer!! And a more shiny yellow!! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is now like a crimson...maybe a sort of blush color (someone hand me a color wheel). I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is blue! I is God! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is white...I’m just old now. This is very inconvenient.
My hair color is yellow! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair color is shiny yellow! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is now longer!! And a more shiny yellow!! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is now like a crimson...maybe a sort of blush color (someone hand me a color wheel). I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is blue! I is God! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is white...I’m just old now. This is very inconvenient.
...they arent officially out of ideas until they make them into legos or modernize them to hipster.
...wait, nm. :I
^this one just hurts my feelings!
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.
Bootleg lego and horrible t-shirt designs from the early 90s..The Horror! No but really those things are really awful.
As far as Superman goes, I like the stories where he does good deeds, like saving people from natural disasters or accidents, being a good role models for the kids, and lending a helping hand to the sick or the elderly. It doesn't take a humongous earth shatter event for Superman to shine, sometimes it is just the little things and how he chooses to use his god like powers to do good that makes him truly heroic.
The viewpoint being made about how ridiculously OP threats have to be created all the time just for Supes to fight them making him a boring non-heroic character can be applied to Goku as well, because Goku is such a massively powerful hero character like Supes is. Every powerful villain Goku has to fight and defeat has always been replaced with a more powerful one each time.
Superman does heroic things on a constant basis. A lot of times at great personal sacrifice. It's only with the Injustice storyline that he finally compromises on his heroic ideals and kills Joker because he caused Lois' death.
I don't get this rationale that just because he's written as an immensely powerful superhero that it gets in the way of him or her doing heroic things. The point of superheroes is that they use their super abilities for the welfare and betterment of common everyday folk who could never do otherwise. Superman is that definitive archetype.
Batman having no superpowers and using just his exceptional intellect and mastery of all known fighting skills definitely gives him an appeal that sets him apart other superheroes, but it doesn't make him more heroic by default. It would certainly make him more relatable because of his humanity though. Even then Batman represents such an exceptional standard of human ability that it comes off as unrealistic, especially when writers have to think of various plot devices to let him defeat supervillains that could kill him by just blinking.
As far as role models go, both heroes are role models in their own right. Superman shows that with great power and being responsible with it, a lot of good can be achieved with it. He's regarded as a moral beacon by his peers for a reason. Batman overcomes his personal trauma and comes out stronger, and it motivates him to strive to help others and be the best kind of human being possible. Despite the darker side of humanity having wronged him in such a great way, he maintains the ideal that humanity is not beyond saving.
Wut. Batman is way more heroic than Superman. Bats is just a massive edgelord thats all.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Alright you kids break it up, this isnt a Batman V Superman thread.
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.
Comments
I don't get this rationale that just because he's written as an immensely powerful superhero that it gets in the way of him or her doing heroic things. The point of superheroes is that they use their super abilities for the welfare and betterment of common everyday folk who could never do otherwise. Superman is that definitive archetype.
Batman having no superpowers and using just his exceptional intellect and mastery of all known fighting skills definitely gives him an appeal that sets him apart other superheroes, but it doesn't make him more heroic by default. It would certainly make him more relatable because of his humanity though. Even then Batman represents such an exceptional standard of human ability that it comes off as unrealistic, especially when writers have to think of various plot devices to let him defeat supervillains that could kill him by just blinking.
As far as role models go, both heroes are role models in their own right. Superman shows that with great power and being responsible with it, a lot of good can be achieved with it. He's regarded as a moral beacon by his peers for a reason. Batman overcomes his personal trauma and comes out stronger, and it motivates him to strive to help others and be the best kind of human being possible. Despite the darker side of humanity having wronged him in such a great way, he maintains the ideal that humanity is not beyond saving.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Even Batman at times is forced to admit that Supes is a needed deterrent against such threats.
Someone like Darkseid might have a grudge against him, but other threats like Brainiac probably wouldn't care and would treat Supes like any other obstacle getting in the way.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
My favorite Superman stories are centered on him doing things OTHER than punching dudes in the face. Like how he convinced Livewire and Scorch to be heroes.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
My characters
Second, it's really not that hard to make stories that challenge him. Not every threat can be punched into submission, you know. And Superman doesn't have any special persuasive abilities that don't involve his physique, nor does he have an ability to fight cultures. (And, of course, he's just as vulnerable as anyone to magic, and magical threats aren't that rare in the DC universe...)
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
> Goku achieving a new power level is more interesting than anything Super Man has ever done.
Considering how ridiculously over the top DBZ or DBS tends to be and with the core narrative having to do with increasing power levels for both protagonists and antagonists to seemingly no end just so they can have ridiculously over the top battles, I hardly find Goku to be a more interestingly written character than Superman. That's my personal opinion anyway.
The viewpoint being made about how ridiculously OP threats have to be created all the time just for Supes to fight them making him a boring non-heroic character can be applied to Goku as well, because Goku is such a massively powerful hero character like Supes is. Every powerful villain Goku has to fight and defeat has always been replaced with a more powerful one each time.
My hair color is shiny yellow! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is now longer!! And a more shiny yellow!! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is now like a crimson...maybe a sort of blush color (someone hand me a color wheel). I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is blue! I is God! I’m the mostest powerfulest person ever...until it’s inconvenient.
My hair is white...I’m just old now. This is very inconvenient.
...wait, nm. :I
^this one just hurts my feelings!
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.
As far as Superman goes, I like the stories where he does good deeds, like saving people from natural disasters or accidents, being a good role models for the kids, and lending a helping hand to the sick or the elderly. It doesn't take a humongous earth shatter event for Superman to shine, sometimes it is just the little things and how he chooses to use his god like powers to do good that makes him truly heroic.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.