No love for the mouse?

wisedoom

Whatever happened to games these days? It used to be sweet and simple when we were able to move our characters around with just a simple mouse? Now we have to have complex moves with the keypad. The last game I played, we were able to maneuver the character with just a simple mouse. Going from Q to W to even an A to a 1 or a 2 key is confusing as hell. C'mon Arc, you can do better than this. You could learn a lot from a former company like Gazillion or even Jagex's runescape when it comes to movie the on-game chararcter around the area he or she is in. Let's go back to useing the mouse like it was designed to do. Even the contol layout that DCOU is degrading it's game and this game is getting close to the poor programming functions they have. We need more solutions and to bring gaming back into a comfort zone.

pantagruel01

Set a bind to toggle mouse look (its in your options). When enabled, you go in the direction you're facing.

nevyn34

I play with an Xbox 360 controller. It works really well once you get used to the button layout but there are some things I have to keep my trackball handy for. The only thing I need a keyboard for is yelling "Block the storms!".

revanantmorituri

I understand your frustration at not using your favorite control scheme: I felt the same when I tried out DCUO and Neverwinter, and was restricted to using the mouse as my primary directional control. To each his or her own.

wisedoom

pantagruel01 said:

Set a bind to toggle mouse look (its in your options). When enabled, you go in the direction you're facing.

I tried that, it ended jup looking like the control layout that DCUO has and their control layout sucks. Like Runescape you can click on the map on where you want to go and the character goes in that direction. Your character follows the direction where you mouse clicks on. And the same can be said about the attack sequences, click on on-game character, he attacks it.

flyingfinn

Sadly in this game, you actually have to move your character on your own.
And you have to target a npc and click your power buttons also.
Not all the games are designed with the same Diablo game engine.
You actually have to try and find most suitable options on your own,
rather than bicker about how some other awesome game does its stuff. You know, have fun.
Have you found anything positive you would like to say about this game yet?
How far have you actually played CO?
Just curious.
And still, ARC isn't the one you should point your negativity/positivity(if you happen find some)

pantagruel01

wisedoom said:

pantagruel01 said:

Set a bind to toggle mouse look (its in your options). When enabled, you go in the direction you're facing.

I tried that, it ended jup looking like the control layout that DCUO has and their control layout sucks. Like Runescape you can click on the map on where you want to go and the character goes in that direction. Your character follows the direction where you mouse clicks on. And the same can be said about the attack sequences, click on on-game character, he attacks it.

The problem with 'click on where you want to go' is that it works very poorly in 3d; there's no real way to click on a point in midair to say you want to go there. There's a reason most 3d games use WASD movement.

As for click to attack, you can certainly set auto-attack to toggle (never cancels), in which case clicking on an enemy will cause you to attack them. Unfortunately, your auto-attack in CO is your energy builder, which is a fairly crappy power.

narf

Middle mouse click turns on auto run. So, you can move with the mouse. I also have my attacks bound to my mouse side buttons. Works fine with a mouse for me. I do wish I could use my bizzaro numberpad control scheme instead of being stuck with WASD for movement, so I understand the frustration of not being able to use your favorite control scheme, but overall it doesn't bother me.

narf

wisedoom said:

C'mon Arc, you can do better than this.

Cryptic Studios is who you're looking for.

biffsmackwell

wisedoom said:

C'mon Arc, you can do better than this.

...

Let's go back to ...

You kinda answer your own question. Limiting movement to two dimensions by using click-to-move is taking a huge step back. To most people, that's not better.

I knew a guy that really liked pinball games, a lot more than video games. He thought they were better too, but video games are a step forward. Video games can do anything pinball games can do, and even better, like drastically changing the layout of the game and whatever. It's kinda the same situation here. You like 2-D click-to-move gameplay better, and your opinion is fine, but there's just so much more you can do with 3-dimensional movement and being able to move your camera to any angle.

My advice is to just try and get used to this game's controls and soon enough you'll appreciate it for what it is. Personally I like both styles of games, and played Marvel Heroes alongside Champions, and I liked each for what they were. I never thought that one should be more like the other; they were both fun and different experiences.

markhawkman

Well, Doomy(I don't care if you like being called that), check this out and tell me if you think it could be done using just a mouse for controls:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-dY3AJWVHs

chaelk

i use mouse and keyboard.

sterga

Why not just hold the left and right buttons together to move? Move the mouse / trackball to change direction? If I feel especially lazy, I simply click the middle mouse button to auto run. ARPGs with fixed, top down cameras are fine with Click-to-Move, but in your typical MMO it's awful.

I find WASD controls equal poop for most MMOs because hand movement to the number keys feel awkward. It's also something I hate about games like Skyrim when you want to make a caster with more than two spells.​​

spinnytop

wisedoom said:

Now we have to have complex moves with the keypad.

wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaassssssssssssssssssssssssddddddddddddddddddd

Sit in wonder of my magnificent gaming abilities.

beezeeze

Sorry Marvel Heroes shutdown OP but you really should learn to embrace change, give it some time and I am certain you will get used to it.

wisedoom

gradii said:

Why would anyone use a mouse to move the character in an MMO is beyond me. WASD exist and work far better. the mouse exists for mouse look.​​

Why not? A game like this and the type of movement that it uses that involves a 360° area map is a design that should be mainly for hand held controllers. But when you're using a PC, things are a lot more difficult to deal with on this game. You may as well and stand there the majority of the time and let the on-game characters you're in battle with, kill you off.....just because you're expect to scramble all over the place and when you get hit and wind up flying back into something, your camera's view of the game get changed which is kind of dumb. No one wants to have to deal with 360° rotation on a PC on any PC game. This game has a lot of room for improvements. It needs a function like the game, Wild Buster has.

flyingfinn

I think it's kind of funny that you're pushing, over and over compleatly different kind of gameplay and controls to a game that has gameplay and controls, that are implemeted in multiple mmos. All that are nothing like stuff you keep presenting.
It would have to be compleatly new game.

wisedoom said:

No one wants to have to deal with 360° rotation on a PC on any PC game..

Are you joking? Or trolling? Or what?
You must be doing something....


So let me say again. Compleatly different games, with compleatly different game mechanics.
2D games. G00GLE it.

biffsmackwell

Champions is never going to steer more towards a fixed-camera, point-and-click movement game. For a game that already allows for total freedom of movement, what you want it to be would be a huge step backwards. You're basically saying stuff like "nobody likes air travel, we already have horses. Getting to more places faster makes no sense."

If the game were changed to what you want it to be, it would be a huge disappointment to many people. I liked Marvel Heroes for what it was, but I would never want Champions to turn into that game. I'm afraid that Champions just might not be the game for you since you seem to be disappointed with many things about it, and you think it should be changed to be more like other, very different games.

I think maybe you should try Freedom Force.

ealford1985

I would give up on this guy

beezeeze

biffsmackwell said:

I think maybe you should try Freedom Force.

I picked up freedom force from gog.com for like 3 dollars when it was on sale... totally worth it. It has all the fixed isometric camera angles that wisedoom is looking for. A+

markhawkman

beezeeze said:

biffsmackwell said:

I think maybe you should try Freedom Force.

I picked up freedom force from gog.com for like 3 dollars when it was on sale... totally worth it. It has all the fixed isometric camera angles that wisedoom is looking for. A+

I played that game a lot. IMO it's implementation of flying was... barely adequate to be playable. It had several severe limitations that you just couldn't do anything with. For example, flying characters were utterly immune to melee. To "compensate" for this there were multiple mechanics that would let non-flyers screw over flyers and force them to stop flying... Like a debuff called "gravity" that would cause you to crash into the ground and take a lot of damage....

pantagruel01

There is no easy way to balance flight in a game that has ground-based melee characters.

legendarylycan

markhawkman wrote: »

I think maybe you should try Freedom Force. I picked up freedom force from gog.com for like 3 dollars when it was on sale... totally worth it. It has all the fixed isometric camera angles that wisedoom is looking for. A+I played that game a lot. IMO it's implementation of flying was... barely adequate to be playable. It had several severe limitations that you just couldn't do anything with. For example, flying characters were utterly immune to melee. To "compensate" for this there were multiple mechanics that would let non-flyers screw over flyers and force them to stop flying... Like a debuff called "gravity" that would cause you to crash into the ground and take a lot of damage....

apparently kaizerin is a big freedom force fan, then...​​

markhawkman

shadowfang240 said:

markhawkman said:

I think maybe you should try Freedom Force. I picked up freedom force from gog.com for like 3 dollars when it was on sale... totally worth it. It has all the fixed isometric camera angles that wisedoom is looking for. A+

I played that game a lot. IMO it's implementation of flying was... barely adequate to be playable. It had several severe limitations that you just couldn't do anything with. For example, flying characters were utterly immune to melee. To "compensate" for this there were multiple mechanics that would let non-flyers screw over flyers and force them to stop flying... Like a debuff called "gravity" that would cause you to crash into the ground and take a lot of damage....

apparently kaizerin is a big freedom force fan, then...​​

And probably several other devs too. Many of the similarities are obvious things, but there are many. However the way CO does things is generally better. FF had NO regen. You had to FIND items hidden in levels or you didn't heal at all ever. Which made that gravity trick a ridiculous cheap shot since it dealt massive damage and was a regular attack.

pantagruel01 said:

There is no easy way to balance flight in a game that has ground-based melee characters.

I don't really see that as a major limitation really. It's only an issue if it makes a character effectively immune to damage.

pantagruel01

markhawkman said:

pantagruel01 said:

There is no easy way to balance flight in a game that has ground-based melee characters.

I don't really see that as a major limitation really. It's only an issue if it makes a character effectively immune to damage.

If melee attacks have a range of X, and flight allows an altitude greater than X, flight makes you immune to ground-based melee.

markhawkman

pantagruel01 said:

markhawkman said:

pantagruel01 said:

There is no easy way to balance flight in a game that has ground-based melee characters.

I don't really see that as a major limitation really. It's only an issue if it makes a character effectively immune to damage.

If melee attacks have a range of X, and flight allows an altitude greater than X, flight makes you immune to ground-based melee.

And in CO that never happens Enemies always either use a ranged attack or jump and hit you.