i've been getting alot of people that says regeneration is not doing its tank roll any good at all and honestly it needs to be buffed up to were it is doing as good as the top tier tanking roles. one of the things that could work is increase the ammount of resistances regeneration have and maybe not have those resistances decay. that way we have more customization in with tanking plus we need a buff that increases a resistances to knockbacks, holds, roots,kind of like aggressor but for beastial tree but have it increase attack speed and speed up cooldowns of attack powers. this could easily be used as an ultimate now i think about it. do we even have a ultimate that works as a buff?
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Silverspar on PRIMUS
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also eventually in the future, like every other powerframe, Bestial Supernatural will get it's own themed Ultimate
ALL tanking passives should be viable for ALL content. PERIOD. no ifs ands or buts about it.
Maybe add an advantage to it to make it so both effects of regen are at full power all the time?
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There is no excuse for a defensive passive to lose its defensive benefits the way regen and PFF do.
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I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
One thing with Regeneration is, it doesn't interact as well with outside healing as Defiance or Invulnerability. Both of those give much better mitigation, so the same number of HP healed works out to more effective HP restored. Do you think it would make sense for regeneration to provide a buff to all healing received? Kind of like your teammate's healing spell and your own innate fast healing compound each other? (Of course, the base healing of Regeneration would have to be reworked. Unless the healing from regeneration is exempted from the passive's own healing boost.)
Now, as pointed out, Regeneration is reactive rather than preventative. I think that's an interesting distinction that's worth keeping. However, this makes Regeneration singularly bad at dealing with damage that comes in large bursts. If you get one-shotted, your healing doesn't bring you back from negative HP.
Since PFF incorporates both “healing” and an extra HP buffer above your normal HP, what if Regeneration got an HP buffer below your normal HP? So, when you're reduced to 0 or fewer hit points, you don't immediately die. Instead, the passive artificially keeps you alive for a short amount of time, and if you can heal back to at least 1 HP in that time, you live?
A different way to give Regeneration insulation against one shots would be if the passive could convert large chunks of damage into damage over time. So you'd take all the damage from the hit eventually, but your healing would have the chance to deal with it a little bit at a time. Then, in order to kill you, someone would have to be able to damage you at a rate that exceeds your healing, and keep it up for at least a little while. One big hit wouldn't do it anymore (unless it's so big than the resultant damage over time exceeds the rate at which you heal).
In any case, I'd like to see Regeneration tick much more frequently, at least in combat. I can understand if they don't want to put up with the overhead of frequent ticks happening constantly outside of combat. They've already got energy unlocks that turn themselves off when you're not in combat. Seems like they could build a similar switch into regeneration, except it just changes how often it ticks. Obviously, the amount healed per tick would need to be adjusted so that the rate of healing stayed the same.
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Now, since this game mostly doesn't use percent-based healing, there is one difference between a high-DR character and a high-HP one. The high-HP character can't heal as effectively.
If the healer casts a spell on someone with DR, that spell will counteract more enemy attacks. As I mentioned before, if anything, regeneration should improve healing from allies. If healing spells work by multiplying the effectiveness of your natural healing ability, the guy with the outstanding natural healing ability will get far more benefit.
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As I see it, the game needs to introduce a way of surviving one-shots that isn't just an increase to effective HP. I think that's definitely possible, and I've got four suggestions here. Two of them I already mentioned in this same thread but … meh.
Through and Through: No single instance of damage you take can exceed X% of your maximum HP. Any greater damage is reduced to this amount.
Nine Lives: When you would normally be killed, you instead are left with X HP. This effect can occur at most once every Y seconds.
Last Legs: When you take more damage than you have remaining HP, you do not immediately die. Instead, you acquire an “HP debt” equal to the difference, and a timer begins. If the timer reaches zero before the HP debt is cleared, you immediately die. You also immediately die if your HP debt exceeds your maximum HP. While in this state, any healing you would receive instead reduces your HP debt, and any damage you would receive increases it.
Delayed Symptoms: Any time you would take a single instance of damage (post mitigation) greater than X, you instead receive that same amount of damage in small increments across the next Y seconds. This damage bypasses any mitigation.
As I see it, the game needs to introduce a way of surviving one-shots that isn't just an increase to effective HP. I think that's definitely possible, and I've got four suggestions here. Two of them I already mentioned in this same thread but … meh.
Through and Through: No single instance of damage you take can exceed X% of your maximum HP. Any greater damage is reduced to this amount.
Nine Lives: When you would normally be killed, you instead are left with X HP. This effect can occur at most once every Y seconds.
Last Legs: When you take more damage than you have remaining HP, you do not immediately die. Instead, you acquire an “HP debt” equal to the difference, and a timer begins. If the timer reaches zero before the HP debt is cleared, you immediately die. You also immediately die if your HP debt exceeds your maximum HP. While in this state, any healing you would receive instead reduces your HP debt, and any damage you would receive increases it.
Delayed Symptoms: Any time you would take a single instance of damage (post mitigation) greater than X, you instead receive that same amount of damage in small increments across the next Y seconds. This damage bypasses any mitigation.
Edit: Thank God I type my posts in a word processor and copy/past them. The board ate this post when I tried to edit it to fix one of the bold tags.
- They don't receive any healing for an extended period.
- They get oneshotted.
Guess bosses should split their attacks into (100/X) separate hits. Either Y is a large value and you get oneshotted anyway, or you're left with unkillable tanks with 5k hp. This is an increase in effective HP. This makes HP completely meaningless; you now have infinite hp.Epic Stronghold
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That's what hit points do. They “even out” spikes in healing and damage. And there will always be spikes, because damage occurs in discreet instances.
One-shots are just cases where the interval across which damage and healing can even out goes to zero. It's just a particular sub-case, not a second case.
The people who design the bosses are the same people who design the defensive passives. If they want a boss to ignore a particular defensive ability, they can do that no matter what said defensive ability is.
Honestly, you might as well be saying that Invulnerability and Defiance are bad ideas just because the designers could change a bosses attacks to bypass all damage reduction, if they wanted to.
Yes, this defense would be good against single, large instances of damage and bad against repeated small instances of damage. In the same way, the flat damage reduction portion of Invulnerability is good against repeated small instances of damage and bad against single, large instances of damage.
I thought we could use a mechanic that functions as the opposite of that part of Invulnerability. So what are you saying? It's okay to have one passive that varies in effectiveness based on the sizes of the chunks of damage, but a second, reversed version of the same trade off is ludicrous?
For one thing, the timer is more like “how often you can flub your block.” And anyway, single big hits aren't the only damage a player receives.
You can just let yourself get hit with the big attack, knowing you'll have (let's say) 30 HP left no matter what. But if you then take 40 damage from an ongoing poison effect before that your ability resets, you're dead. There are also any additional enemies a boss might summon, and minor attacks they might throw out between the big ones.
This ability leaves you alive, but in a precarious position. You might recover, or you might die. It depends on how events play out.
Anyway, Kingdom Hearts uses a system like the one I described, and it works great. So saying it could never be made to work is ridiculous.
Yes, but it's not just and increase to effective hit points. Defiance, Invulnerability, and Personal Force Field all increase effective hit points, but they each manage to put their own spin on it. These “danger zone” hit points are distinct from normal hit points due to the special mechanics that apply when you're down in them.
It would work the same to double the character's HP and apply the special mechanic when below half HP. I considered phrasing it that way too. What really matters isn't whether or not extra HP are granted. It's whether or not the passive winds up being anything more than a boring rehash of old stuff, and whether the “feel” it winds up with suits the intended theme.
On the contrary, you still need hit points to soak up that damage over time. Even if you're getting healed, the healing and damage are coming in chunks at different times. You need hit point to even things out.
Also, bear in mind that, depending on how much damage is being divided into these smaller pieces, and how many of your own delayed damage effects you manage to be subject to at a given time, the rate at which damage comes in might exceed the rate at which you can heal. If you're taking damage faster than you heal it, and that keeps up, you'll wind up dead no matter how many hit points you have. It's just a question of how long it takes.
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It would be sort of like our progressive income taxes. Make an average amount of money, and they take 30% of it. Make a ton of money, and they take 90% of it. Make very little money, and they don't take any.
More money earned/damage deal always equates to more money in your pocket/damage taken, but the ratio isn't constant.
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Silverspar on PRIMUS
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Silverspar on PRIMUS
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