Absolutely, but wouldn't it be nice if the devs started trying to encourage players to take those lvl40 alts on into the game, and play more, rather than mercilessly pushing those who want to have the newest, latest, bestest?
For as many of you there are who seem to like and play this game a lot you sure seem loath to actually go out and do the content provided. You know, AP, Dailies, Unity Missions...that sort of stuff. Oh no it takes longer now... better just give up!
Some of us have gotten used to doing things a certain way for, what, four, five years now? Knowing that I can hit a milestone in a decent amount of time (for those of us without unlimited time) and keep playing that character with his new gear... And now the development team just decides that it's too fast and changes it. That sucks. Whether they're right or not, it's the way I've grown accustomed to playing, have never been told it was wrong before, and now this changes everything.
Take for example that I've never bothered trying to get anything better than heroics. The reason for this? It takes too log and I'd rather be doing other stuff. When it comes to a choice between a long grind and doing something else... Yes, "give up" is one of my options. It may sound like BS to you but it's just how I am. I'd rather start a new character at that point, but now knowing that the new guy will also hit that wall, just makes me not want to bother.
It seems really dismissive to say that some of us "seem to like and play this game a lot..." but I've been here since launch, have played over 80 characters, have spent a ton of money, and have rolled with all the punches the game threw at me. There's not a lot that I complain about it because at the end of the day, it's still my favorite game. I don't mind power nerfs. I don't mind vehicle nerfs. I don't mind that there's content designed for the best players, stuff that I may never see, because you can't please everyone all the time, and that's fine. Even through his change, I'm probably not going to stop playing, but it's going to change the way I play in a way I find unfavorable.
Not unreasonable at all. We're all going to have to adapt and for some it is going to be more painful than others.
A month of casual play to get gear that I don't even really need doesn't really bother me... but that is just me and I can in no way speak for anyone else. I just wish more people felt this way because I find all this negativity very unappealing.
Biff said it all so perfectly, I won't quote or reiterate. I'd like to add my voice though, for whatever that's worth.
Cryptic, please lower the prices on Heroic gear to something more reasonable. Like half what you're charging now. You don't need to squeeze your endgame players for more cash. Who do you think opens your lockboxes anyway? Don't alienate your biggest supporters. There's no money in that.
Not unreasonable at all. We're all going to have to adapt and for some it is going to be more painful than others.
A month of casual play to get gear that I don't even really need doesn't really bother me... but that is just me and I can in no way speak for anyone else. I just wish more people felt this way because I find all this negativity very unappealing.
'We're all going to have to adapt' is fatalistic. We might choose to, some more grudgingly than others, but it's hardly a reason to give up on change. Do you follow the PTS changes? I would say most likely the reason we all are facing 150 Heroics instead of 200 is because of constant requests to reduce the prices.
In other words, honest feedback helps, 'negative' to the intent and designs of the devs or not. They will balance everyone's input...sometimes...and compromise where they will (it's not plain exactly know how that works, but the evidence that they do is plain enough). Some want the prices quartered, others want them halved, others go with the flow and take things as they are. Granted, some use a sledgehammer where perhaps cookies or some delicious pie would be more effective...
And personally, I find mudcrabs unappealing. Horrible things.
Really it all comes down to if they think they see this experiment in Heroic Gear pricing brings in more money to the company. That's literally the bottom line. However, there have been a lot of changes in the game lately, so it may not be possible for them to gauge accurately which changes are bringing in more profit. Presumably if all the people who oppose the change in prices could organize a campaign to convince players not to put any money into the game this might register, but that's probably like herding cats.
I have 100 characters. I have time-bending powers and can play each of them a bunch of hours every day. Let's say I can farm 30 SCR per character.
SCR per character: I can farm 3000 SCR in a day. Communal SCR: I can farm 3000 SCR in a day.
See? You're not getting less, it's just bound per character. Here's another interesting concept to consider.
Sure, let's play with big numbers, would you?
So, prior to this patch with 3000 SCR, I could get (3000/35) 85 Heroic gears and gear (85/3) 28 characters. Now with 3000 SCR, I can get 20 Heroic gears and gear 6 characters. This is 420% less.
And now let's have a look the other way : to gear 28 characters I need 12600 SCR. This is 420% more.
I know you don't like analogies with real life and you're right it's very slippery but still, suppose how it would look like in real life : you'll be paid 420% less (or you'll have to work 420% more time) and everything will cost 420% more.
I have 100 characters. I have time-bending powers and can play each of them a bunch of hours every day. Let's say I can farm 30 SCR per character.
SCR per character: I can farm 3000 SCR in a day. Communal SCR: I can farm 3000 SCR in a day.
See? You're not getting less, it's just bound per character. Here's another interesting concept to consider.
Sure, let's play with big numbers, would you?
So, prior to this patch with 3000 SCR, I could get (3000/35) 85 Heroic gears and gear (85/3) 28 characters. Now with 3000 SCR, I can get 20 Heroic gears and gear 6 characters. This is 420% less.
And now let's have a look the other way : to gear 28 characters I need 12600 SCR. This is 420% more.
I know you don't like analogies with real life and you're right it's very slippery but still, suppose how it would look like in real life : you'll be paid 420% less (or you'll have to work 420% more time) and everything will cost 420% more.
I think to them that looks logical
Buffing everything to stupid high levels and nerfing everything to piss poor levels yields the same results, but not the same community reactions.
Haha okay, first off I will admit that using multiple characters to farm Heroic gear is still a valid thing, because the gear is not Bind on Pickup. Yes, you can use still multiple characters to farm the required Silver Champions Recognition. But we're moving the goalposts here quite a bit, aren't we? First, your argument against mine is that "sure, this only rewards players that chose to play that certain way." Now, that argument doesn't fully meet your end goal, so you switch to "sure, more of your characters can still get the Recognition!"
The goal posts haven't been moved at all Biff. In fact, I don't know what the "goal" here is. I'm just listing facts that counter the idea that this somehow punishes players who have a lot of characters, and as far as I can tell I have succeeded in doing that. I'm also confused as to what you're trying to say in this paragraph... what was "that certain way"? My point was never that this only rewards people with a single character ( because how are they rewarded more than those people with multiple? ). The point, which I guess you may have missed, was that this makes people with few characters feel less like they're being forced to make multiple characters in order to benefit as much as other players. You can even look through my previous posts and see that I said exactly that. I think your "goal posts" thing is off base here.
The developers themselves said that Heroic gear is what you'll want to be wearing, minimum, for running this content.
They may just be saying that for the "common" players. You know, the people who aren't really accustomed to content that will challenge them in any way in this game and who might have trouble just with the basics of TA, forget any of the "pay attention and react" mechanics. The dungeon won't prevent you from entering if you don't meet the ilvl ( some games do that ), and you're not going to drop dead the second you aggro a boss if you're wearing merc gear. Heck, you could be wearing that other gear... you know the stuff that has stats on it in place of a mod slot. Don't tell anyone, but I've been going on a few runs with a character that still has that kind of gear equipped, tee hee
PS - I'm actually looking forward to people asking for groups for pre-Heroic endgame gear dungeons since I didn't ever get to play those very extensively. So far it seems that everyone is still just skipping it and only doing content that drops SCR ( even though, oddly enough, that content drops SCR! ).
PS2 - Some people say "Im skipping heroic and farming justice". I wonder how many of those people will get enough SCR for heroic just from rampage drops
Haha okay, first off I will admit that using multiple characters to farm Heroic gear is still a valid thing, because the gear is not Bind on Pickup. Yes, you can use still multiple characters to farm the required Silver Champions Recognition. But we're moving the goalposts here quite a bit, aren't we? First, your argument against mine is that "sure, this only rewards players that chose to play that certain way." Now, that argument doesn't fully meet your end goal, so you switch to "sure, more of your characters can still get the Recognition!"
The goal posts haven't been moved at all Biff. In fact, I don't know what the "goal" here is. I'm just listing facts that counter the idea that this somehow punishes players who have a lot of characters, and as far as I can tell I have succeeded in doing that. I'm also confused as to what you're trying to say in this paragraph... what was "that certain way"? My point was never that this only rewards people with a single character ( because how are they rewarded more than those people with multiple? ). The point, which I guess you may have missed, was that this makes people with few characters feel less like they're being forced to make multiple characters in order to benefit as much as other players. You can even look through my previous posts and see that I said exactly that. I think your "goal posts" thing is off base here.
The developers themselves said that Heroic gear is what you'll want to be wearing, minimum, for running this content.
They may just be saying that for the "common" players. You know, the people who aren't really accustomed to content that will challenge them in any way in this game and who might have trouble just with the basics of TA, forget any of the "pay attention and react" mechanics. The dungeon won't prevent you from entering if you don't meet the ilvl ( some games do that ), and you're not going to drop dead the second you aggro a boss if you're wearing merc gear. Heck, you could be wearing that other gear... you know the stuff that has stats on it in place of a mod slot. Don't tell anyone, but I've been going on a few runs with a character that still has that kind of gear equipped, tee hee
PS - I'm actually looking forward to people asking for groups for pre-Heroic endgame gear dungeons since I didn't ever get to play those very extensively. So far it seems that everyone is still just skipping it and only doing content that drops SCR ( even though, oddly enough, that content drops SCR! ).
PS2 - Some people say "Im skipping heroic and farming justice". I wonder how many of those people will get enough SCR for heroic just from rampage drops
I'm pretty sure in another thread someone in another thread did the math(or this one, perhaps) that made the math out to be, with multiple characters, to be about a 420% increase in efforts and prices. It looked pretty sound but what do you care? You don't like making new toons sooo...again, all of the above is irrelevant, as you don't have an inclination to max out new alts. Can't stand to be wrong, eh spinny?
I have 100 characters. I have time-bending powers and can play each of them a bunch of hours every day. Let's say I can farm 30 SCR per character.
SCR per character: I can farm 3000 SCR in a day. Communal SCR: I can farm 3000 SCR in a day.
See? You're not getting less, it's just bound per character. Here's another interesting concept to consider.
Sure, let's play with big numbers, would you?
So, prior to this patch with 3000 SCR, I could get (3000/35) 85 Heroic gears and gear (85/3) 28 characters. Now with 3000 SCR, I can get 20 Heroic gears and gear 6 characters. This is 420% less.
And now let's have a look the other way : to gear 28 characters I need 12600 SCR. This is 420% more.
I know you don't like analogies with real life and you're right it's very slippery but still, suppose how it would look like in real life : you'll be paid 420% less (or you'll have to work 420% more time) and everything will cost 420% more.
Buffing everything to stupid high levels and nerfing everything to piss poor levels yields the same results, but not the same community reactions.
I wish I could find the post with the max amount of SCR you can get in a day, so I could do my own math to show how long it would take someone(this is what a casual is, by the way for those who don't know or understand clearly) who sometimes has to go a week or 1/2-3/4 a week without play. I believe it was one of the PTS threads?.
Buffing everything to stupid high levels and nerfing everything to piss poor levels yields the same results, but not the same community reactions.
The goal posts haven't been moved at all Biff. In fact, I don't know what the "goal" here is. I'm just listing facts that counter the idea that this somehow punishes players who have a lot of characters, and as far as I can tell I have succeeded in doing that. I'm also confused as to what you're trying to say in this paragraph... what was "that certain way"? My point was never that this only rewards people with a single character ( because how are they rewarded more than those people with multiple? ). The point, which I guess you may have missed, was that this makes people with few characters feel less like they're being forced to make multiple characters in order to benefit as much as other players. You can even look through my previous posts and see that I said exactly that. I think your "goal posts" thing is off base here.
Point: you. However, the argument that you'd feel like making multiple characters just to gear up one character kinda falls flat and feels self-defeating. Have you ever really felt forced to make more characters just to grind more gear? I'll agree that with event currency it's a much bigger advantage (which the little cynic inside me swears up and down that missions that grant extra event currency will somehow in the near future be made account missions so you can only take them once per day), but for gear? Nah. Your benefit comes straight from the way you like to play: not having a ton of characters to grind gear for in the first place. The problem of having a lot of characters to grind gear for comes from choosing to have a lot of characters, so I see no reason for this problem to include a remedy. While I'm out grinding my 35th set of Heroic gear, you're probably out grinding Justice and Onslaught or the new stuff. Do you still feel forced to make new characters?
Related: I think the diminishing returns on tokens from Rampages, if true, is pretty dumb and thought that even before this whole thing.
They may just be saying that for the "common" players. You know, the people who aren't really accustomed to content that will challenge them in any way in this game and who might have trouble just with the basics of TA, forget any of the "pay attention and react" mechanics. The dungeon won't prevent you from entering if you don't meet the ilvl ( some games do that ), and you're not going to drop dead the second you aggro a boss if you're wearing merc gear. Heck, you could be wearing that other gear... you know the stuff that has stats on it in place of a mod slot. Don't tell anyone, but I've been going on a few runs with a character that still has that kind of gear equipped, tee hee
PS - I'm actually looking forward to people asking for groups for pre-Heroic endgame gear dungeons since I didn't ever get to play those very extensively. So far it seems that everyone is still just skipping it and only doing content that drops SCR ( even though, oddly enough, that content drops SCR! ).
PS2 - Some people say "Im skipping heroic and farming justice". I wonder how many of those people will get enough SCR for heroic just from rampage drops
I'm not going to form an argument over who you assume they were targeting when they said that. But they said what they said, and at the same time made it take longer to get that gear. I'm glad you can do it in level 30 greens, I'm sure Imp can show us all up and do it on a naked Inferno, but that doesn't change the fact that this is a pretty advanced lair, and I don't feel like bringing my level 6 to the recruiting drive. I'd want to bring my best, and that bars any character that hasn't raided my Mercenary/Legion stash.
For as many of you there are who seem to like and play this game a lot you sure seem loath to actually go out and do the content provided. You know, AP, Dailies, Unity Missions...that sort of stuff. Oh no it takes longer now... better just give up!
We've had this content for 3+ years now. Some of us have done these missions multiple times across multiple character enough times that they become mind numbing. Let me reiterate an example of how absurd these prices are, bat flight costs 975 tokens. Bat flight flight is one the most useless travel powers in the game.
All the increased prices will do is increase the burn out rate of players as they engage in this mindless grind.
We've had this content for 3+ years now. Some of us have done these missions multiple times across multiple character enough times that they become mind numbing. Let me reiterate an example of how absurd these prices are, bat flight costs 975 tokens. Bat flight flight is one the most useless travel powers in the game.
All the increased prices will do is increase the burn out rate of players as they engage in this mindless grind.
Also, for many players, the ability to switch toons alleviates some of the perception of grind, as it introduces a little more variety. 975 tokens seems an extreme (for me, probably unachievable) goal for a single unlock on one toon. Spread out across multiple toons, it would feel more feasible and less of a grind. I would most likely never have unlocked any Justice Gear sets if I could only bind the gear to the toon that had acquired the tokens.
We've had this content for 3+ years now. Some of us have done these missions multiple times across multiple character enough times that they become mind numbing. Let me reiterate an example of how absurd these prices are, bat flight costs 975 tokens. Bat flight flight is one the most useless travel powers in the game.
All the increased prices will do is increase the burn out rate of players as they engage in this mindless grind.
Also, for many players, the ability to switch toons alleviates some of the perception of grind, as it introduces a little more variety. 975 tokens seems an extreme (for me, probably unachievable) goal for a single unlock on one toon. Spread out across multiple toons, it would feel more feasible and less of a grind. I would most likely never have unlocked any Justice Gear sets if I could only bind the gear to the toon that had acquired the tokens.
This. I've had some folks question how I could stand to go through Westside so many times, but at least each time I did so, it was on a different toon with a different setup. Captain Punchfist ran headlong into his enemies and punched them into oblivion; the Duck Knight crept about just outside the range of their vision until he could set up an attack that would take them all out; Screwloose tried to get as many enemies around him as possible so that he could unleash his electric personality and drop them all at once. And I seldom create more than one or two characters in a month, sometimes even longer, so it's not like all I do is variations on Westside.
Some of the same people want me to take one toon, and run the same few missions over and over and over and over in rapid succession. That's not fun - that's work. And as a job, the pay sucks.
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
PS - I already have more than enough SCR to get a heroic piece and I feel like I barely even did anything since the patch. Stop being lazy you bums :-3
I'm not going to form an argument over who you assume they were targeting when they said that. But they said what they said, and at the same time made it take longer to get that gear. I'm glad you can do it in level 30 greens, I'm sure Imp can show us all up and do it on a naked Inferno, but that doesn't change the fact that this is a pretty advanced lair, and I don't feel like bringing my level 6 to the recruiting drive. I'd want to bring my best, and that bars any character that hasn't raided my Mercenary/Legion stash.
Biff, you remember all those times I argued that people should do stuff just because it's fun, and then you responded by pointing out that people like that are a minority and that the majority of players are "reward chasers" and that they just won't do content if there's no meaningful reward behind it? Looks like you were right, but now it looks like you wish the devs didn't agree with you or didn't know about that, because they're putting that fact into action. Now sure, a lot of people are saying that this is actually going to cause them to play less, but conventional knowledge shows that you were right and players are much more likely to do content if there's a reward behind it. Now, a lot of other games take this idea and make you run one piece of content over and over ( guess why I got bored of Blade and Souls ). However, I like how CO is tackling it, in that they are giving you all sorts of different ways to get the same reward ( apparently with even more to come! ). You don't have to do one thing over and over to get Heroic Gear, like you would in a lot of other games - you have choices, you can do this or that. You can even do a thing that gets you Justice Gear/Distinguished gear and also be farming Heroic Gear at the same time ( you technically can't skip the SCR grind and just go to jus/dis grind, they won't let you ).
So yes, they made it take longer to get that gear... however they also vastly improved the process of getting it.
And yes, the devs did say that; it warms my heart to see someone who is unwilling to entertain the idea that dev info is inaccurate and that players would know the game better than they. You are truly one in a thousand.
I don't know what youre level 6 and recruiting drive have to do with anything... I don't think you can even que for recruiting drive at level six.
As for bringing your best, isn't it great that we finally have content where that actually means something? Imagine telling someone "I only bring my best to rampages" or "I won't even que for that until I'm properly geared" for any content before this. Now the question is, does every character in your roster really need to be "the best"? All 127 of them?
As for bringing your best, isn't it great that we finally have content where that actually means something? Imagine telling someone "I only bring my best to rampages" or "I won't even que for that until I'm properly geared" for any content before this. Now the question is, does every character in your roster really need to be "the best"? All 127 of them?
Just how poorly geared are the characters you leech rampages with if you think only now people say "I only bring my best to rampages"?
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
I'm not going to form an argument over who you assume they were targeting when they said that. But they said what they said, and at the same time made it take longer to get that gear. I'm glad you can do it in level 30 greens, I'm sure Imp can show us all up and do it on a naked Inferno, but that doesn't change the fact that this is a pretty advanced lair, and I don't feel like bringing my level 6 to the recruiting drive. I'd want to bring my best, and that bars any character that hasn't raided my Mercenary/Legion stash.
Biff, you remember all those times I argued that people should do stuff just because it's fun, and then you responded by pointing out that people like that are a minority and that the majority of players are "reward chasers" and that they just won't do content if there's no meaningful reward behind it? Looks like you were right, but now it looks like you wish the devs didn't agree with you or didn't know about that, because they're putting that fact into action. Now sure, a lot of people are saying that this is actually going to cause them to play less, but conventional knowledge shows that you were right and players are much more likely to do content if there's a reward behind it. Now, a lot of other games take this idea and make you run one piece of content over and over ( guess why I got bored of Blade and Souls ). However, I like how CO is tackling it, in that they are giving you all sorts of different ways to get the same reward ( apparently with even more to come! ). You don't have to do one thing over and over to get Heroic Gear, like you would in a lot of other games - you have choices, you can do this or that. You can even do a thing that gets you Justice Gear/Distinguished gear and also be farming Heroic Gear at the same time ( you technically can't skip the SCR grind and just go to jus/dis grind, they won't let you ).
So yes, they made it take longer to get that gear... however they also vastly improved the process of getting it.
And yes, the devs did say that; it warms my heart to see someone who is unwilling to entertain the idea that dev info is inaccurate and that players would know the game better than they. You are truly one in a thousand.
I don't know what youre level 6 and recruiting drive have to do with anything... I don't think you can even que for recruiting drive at level six.
As for bringing your best, isn't it great that we finally have content where that actually means something? Imagine telling someone "I only bring my best to rampages" or "I won't even que for that until I'm properly geared" for any content before this. Now the question is, does every character in your roster really need to be "the best"? All 127 of them?
"Now it looks like you wish the devs didn't agree with you..."
Nope, wrong. The one single thing that left the sour taste in my mouth is the change that they made, not any other content or reward thing they added. Listen up. Getting this gear was a part of my regular gameplay for many of my characters. I didn't bother with Justice or anything else because they're obviously meant for people willing to put that much effort into it. That's all fine by me, they can put their higher rewards behind any kind of gear/skill/whatever wall they want, and if its too much for me to bother with for whatever reason, I simply won't do it, and I'll be glad to say that it's just that I don't want to put that effort in. This is something that's always been on me, and I don't blame Cryptic for it. But now, they've pushed out something I used to have the patience for into an area that I don't particularly care for, and I've voiced my dissatisfaction toward it, without putting any blame on anyone. I haven't said Cryptic sucks, haven't said they need to learn how to make games, nothing like that. This change makes me want to play less. That's it. I'm entitled to think for myself and post my thoughts when someone brings it up, yeah?
I'm glad you like the way Champions tackled this, and I don't think it's a bad way to go, either, but I would have much preferred that they apply this to a new form/tier of gear and left Heroic alone. Just my opinion and preference.
"And yes, the devs did say that..."
Ooh, cheap shot. Forgive me for taking the official word over a bunch of anecdotal evidence. Think about this. I have several characters that meet the "required" gear so I'm not complaining about not being able to do this lair. All I'm saying is that it takes longer to get the gear that they said is required. i don't care about any other factors. That gear takes longer to get now. Unless you can prove to me that you can get it with less hours played than it took to do UNITY 1 for a few hours, then I'm not interested in any other rebuttals.
"I don't know what your level 6..."
Once upon a time, any player could bring any character into any alert. Bring the guy with the level 6 character often meant you're the cause of the whole thing falling apart. Don't tell me you've already forgotten? And also don't tell me you used to solo recruiting drives at level 13, not interested in that, either.
"...isn't it great we finally have content where that actually means something?"
Yes, but don't get a big head about it, I don't think I said otherwise.
"Now the question is..."
Can you give me a heads up on how many times I have to answer this question? Cripes, it comes up more than my aunt Tilly's oatmeal.
I don't have to have every single one of my characters in the best gear. First of all, I don't go for anything higher than Heroics usually, so there's that. Second, you probably won't understand this anyway because you don't like having lots of alts and evidently you can't wrap your head around why this change makes us people who do like lots of alts go all poopy-pants, but here goes. When I make a new character, sometimes I end up really liking their look, or liking their build, or how they play. I don't go looking through people's build directories and sit down and say "today I'm going to build a power armor tank that has to take this power at level 6, this one at 14, and by 25 he'll be the most unstoppable (least stoppable?) gnome in armored pantaloons that ever graced the face of Champions, never mind what he's gonna be like when he's in Justice gear with this and that mods and cores. So, I just get an idea for a look, or a stupid name, and while playing, this character becomes a "favorite" and I end up wanting to play him more than the guy that's been level 7 ever since September 1, 2009, more than the guy I stopped playing at level 30, and more than a guy who was just a stupid name, like Biclops, because this new character is a stupid name and he was real fun playing because I'd always get a chuckle in alerts, The Unflushable Dump. For any number of reasons, I end up really liking this new character, and that makes me want to keep playing him well after level 40. I wanna punch Gravitar's face in with him, I want to take him to do team content when that very rare chance comes up, and I want him to be the one punching the nads off the latest and greatest open mission boss like Mechanon or Clarence.
Playing these characters is fun, and I like having fun, so I play those characters more, and so I put the effort in to get them Heroic gear and some decent mods because these fun characters will be even more fun when they've got some solid gear on, so I don't feel like a wet noodle dual wielding wet noodles.
And, with being ADD and all (this is real ADD, not "oops I forgot my car keys, I'm so ADD, lol"), I often find myself creating a new character to have fun on. (The ADD may also be a contributing factor to the "if it takes too long, I just won't bother doing it" factor. Jury's still out because I'm too embarrassed to ask my doctor about important life issues like Justice Gear.)
And, with being ADD and all (this is real ADD, not "oops I forgot my car keys, I'm so ADD, lol"), I often find myself creating a new character to have fun on. (The ADD may also be a contributing factor to the "if it takes too long, I just won't bother doing it" factor. Jury's still out because I'm too embarrassed to ask my doctor about important life issues like Justice Gear.)
I don't have ADD, nor fake ADD, and the amount of grind for my formerly standard heroic gear has put it squarely into "not bother with it" for me.
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
PS - I already have more than enough SCR to get a heroic piece and I feel like I barely even did anything since the patch. Stop being lazy you bums :-3
So after a week of playing you have enough to get one piece of heroic gear? You do realize that after a week before the update you'd be done?
PS - I already have more than enough SCR to get a heroic piece and I feel like I barely even did anything since the patch. Stop being lazy you bums :-3
So after a week of playing you have enough to get one piece of heroic gear? You do realize that after a week before the update you'd be done?
PS - I already have more than enough SCR to get a heroic piece and I feel like I barely even did anything since the patch. Stop being lazy you bums :-3
So after a week of playing you have enough to get one piece of heroic gear? You do realize that after a week before the update you'd be done?
Oh no a whole week!
How many hours a day.
Buffing everything to stupid high levels and nerfing everything to piss poor levels yields the same results, but not the same community reactions.
PS - I already have more than enough SCR to get a heroic piece and I feel like I barely even did anything since the patch. Stop being lazy you bums :-3
So after a week of playing you have enough to get one piece of heroic gear? You do realize that after a week before the update you'd be done?
Oh no a whole week!
How many hours a day.
How would I know? I don't keep track of that. I log on for a bit whenever I feel like it, do some stuff, then log off. I'm not serious about my mmos like some of you people with your "rewards/hour" spreadsheets.
How would I know? I don't keep track of that. I log on for a bit whenever I feel like it, do some stuff, then log off. I'm not serious about my mmos like some of you people with your "rewards/hour" spreadsheets.
Nice, so just dismiss very valid concerns because you think the people with those concerns are super serious gaming nerds who are spreadsheet-obsessed (what even?), because they're not as laid-back and as carefree as you are as a gamer. Because that's not obnoxiously holier-than-thou at all. Just get over yourself.
A month of casual play to get gear that I don't even really need doesn't really bother me... but that is just me and I can in no way speak for anyone else. I just wish more people felt this way because I find all this negativity very unappealing.
Yeaaah sure, you're not speaking for anyone else and yet see fit to rail on others for not doing as much content for however stupidly long that's required as you feel they need to be doing.
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Take for example that I've never bothered trying to get anything better than heroics. The reason for this? It takes too log and I'd rather be doing other stuff. When it comes to a choice between a long grind and doing something else... Yes, "give up" is one of my options. It may sound like BS to you but it's just how I am. I'd rather start a new character at that point, but now knowing that the new guy will also hit that wall, just makes me not want to bother.
It seems really dismissive to say that some of us "seem to like and play this game a lot..." but I've been here since launch, have played over 80 characters, have spent a ton of money, and have rolled with all the punches the game threw at me. There's not a lot that I complain about it because at the end of the day, it's still my favorite game. I don't mind power nerfs. I don't mind vehicle nerfs. I don't mind that there's content designed for the best players, stuff that I may never see, because you can't please everyone all the time, and that's fine. Even through his change, I'm probably not going to stop playing, but it's going to change the way I play in a way I find unfavorable.
I really don't think that's so unreasonable.
A month of casual play to get gear that I don't even really need doesn't really bother me... but that is just me and I can in no way speak for anyone else. I just wish more people felt this way because I find all this negativity very unappealing.
Cryptic, please lower the prices on Heroic gear to something more reasonable. Like half what you're charging now. You don't need to squeeze your endgame players for more cash. Who do you think opens your lockboxes anyway? Don't alienate your biggest supporters. There's no money in that.
In other words, honest feedback helps, 'negative' to the intent and designs of the devs or not. They will balance everyone's input...sometimes...and compromise where they will (it's not plain exactly know how that works, but the evidence that they do is plain enough). Some want the prices quartered, others want them halved, others go with the flow and take things as they are. Granted, some use a sledgehammer where perhaps cookies or some delicious pie would be more effective...
And personally, I find mudcrabs unappealing. Horrible things.
So, prior to this patch with 3000 SCR, I could get (3000/35) 85 Heroic gears and gear (85/3) 28 characters.
Now with 3000 SCR, I can get 20 Heroic gears and gear 6 characters.
This is 420% less.
And now let's have a look the other way : to gear 28 characters I need 12600 SCR.
This is 420% more.
I know you don't like analogies with real life and you're right it's very slippery but still, suppose how it would look like in real life : you'll be paid 420% less (or you'll have to work 420% more time) and everything will cost 420% more.
42 40s, LTSer.
PS - I'm actually looking forward to people asking for groups for pre-Heroic endgame gear dungeons since I didn't ever get to play those very extensively. So far it seems that everyone is still just skipping it and only doing content that drops SCR ( even though, oddly enough, that content drops SCR! ).
PS2 - Some people say "Im skipping heroic and farming justice". I wonder how many of those people will get enough SCR for heroic just from rampage drops
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
PS: Oh wait!! I have it right here!
42 40s, LTSer.
42 40s, LTSer.
Related: I think the diminishing returns on tokens from Rampages, if true, is pretty dumb and thought that even before this whole thing.
I'm not going to form an argument over who you assume they were targeting when they said that. But they said what they said, and at the same time made it take longer to get that gear. I'm glad you can do it in level 30 greens, I'm sure Imp can show us all up and do it on a naked Inferno, but that doesn't change the fact that this is a pretty advanced lair, and I don't feel like bringing my level 6 to the recruiting drive. I'd want to bring my best, and that bars any character that hasn't raided my Mercenary/Legion stash.
All the increased prices will do is increase the burn out rate of players as they engage in this mindless grind.
Poll: Currencies like GCR should be account-bound or there should be a method to transfer between toons
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
Some of the same people want me to take one toon, and run the same few missions over and over and over and over in rapid succession. That's not fun - that's work. And as a job, the pay sucks.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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My super cool CC build and how to use it.
So yes, they made it take longer to get that gear... however they also vastly improved the process of getting it.
And yes, the devs did say that; it warms my heart to see someone who is unwilling to entertain the idea that dev info is inaccurate and that players would know the game better than they. You are truly one in a thousand.
I don't know what youre level 6 and recruiting drive have to do with anything... I don't think you can even que for recruiting drive at level six.
As for bringing your best, isn't it great that we finally have content where that actually means something? Imagine telling someone "I only bring my best to rampages" or "I won't even que for that until I'm properly geared" for any content before this. Now the question is, does every character in your roster really need to be "the best"? All 127 of them?
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Nope, wrong. The one single thing that left the sour taste in my mouth is the change that they made, not any other content or reward thing they added. Listen up. Getting this gear was a part of my regular gameplay for many of my characters. I didn't bother with Justice or anything else because they're obviously meant for people willing to put that much effort into it. That's all fine by me, they can put their higher rewards behind any kind of gear/skill/whatever wall they want, and if its too much for me to bother with for whatever reason, I simply won't do it, and I'll be glad to say that it's just that I don't want to put that effort in. This is something that's always been on me, and I don't blame Cryptic for it. But now, they've pushed out something I used to have the patience for into an area that I don't particularly care for, and I've voiced my dissatisfaction toward it, without putting any blame on anyone. I haven't said Cryptic sucks, haven't said they need to learn how to make games, nothing like that. This change makes me want to play less. That's it. I'm entitled to think for myself and post my thoughts when someone brings it up, yeah?
I'm glad you like the way Champions tackled this, and I don't think it's a bad way to go, either, but I would have much preferred that they apply this to a new form/tier of gear and left Heroic alone. Just my opinion and preference.
"And yes, the devs did say that..."
Ooh, cheap shot. Forgive me for taking the official word over a bunch of anecdotal evidence. Think about this. I have several characters that meet the "required" gear so I'm not complaining about not being able to do this lair. All I'm saying is that it takes longer to get the gear that they said is required. i don't care about any other factors. That gear takes longer to get now. Unless you can prove to me that you can get it with less hours played than it took to do UNITY 1 for a few hours, then I'm not interested in any other rebuttals.
"I don't know what your level 6..."
Once upon a time, any player could bring any character into any alert. Bring the guy with the level 6 character often meant you're the cause of the whole thing falling apart. Don't tell me you've already forgotten? And also don't tell me you used to solo recruiting drives at level 13, not interested in that, either.
"...isn't it great we finally have content where that actually means something?"
Yes, but don't get a big head about it, I don't think I said otherwise.
"Now the question is..."
Can you give me a heads up on how many times I have to answer this question? Cripes, it comes up more than my aunt Tilly's oatmeal.
I don't have to have every single one of my characters in the best gear. First of all, I don't go for anything higher than Heroics usually, so there's that. Second, you probably won't understand this anyway because you don't like having lots of alts and evidently you can't wrap your head around why this change makes us people who do like lots of alts go all poopy-pants, but here goes. When I make a new character, sometimes I end up really liking their look, or liking their build, or how they play. I don't go looking through people's build directories and sit down and say "today I'm going to build a power armor tank that has to take this power at level 6, this one at 14, and by 25 he'll be the most unstoppable (least stoppable?) gnome in armored pantaloons that ever graced the face of Champions, never mind what he's gonna be like when he's in Justice gear with this and that mods and cores. So, I just get an idea for a look, or a stupid name, and while playing, this character becomes a "favorite" and I end up wanting to play him more than the guy that's been level 7 ever since September 1, 2009, more than the guy I stopped playing at level 30, and more than a guy who was just a stupid name, like Biclops, because this new character is a stupid name and he was real fun playing because I'd always get a chuckle in alerts, The Unflushable Dump. For any number of reasons, I end up really liking this new character, and that makes me want to keep playing him well after level 40. I wanna punch Gravitar's face in with him, I want to take him to do team content when that very rare chance comes up, and I want him to be the one punching the nads off the latest and greatest open mission boss like Mechanon or Clarence.
Playing these characters is fun, and I like having fun, so I play those characters more, and so I put the effort in to get them Heroic gear and some decent mods because these fun characters will be even more fun when they've got some solid gear on, so I don't feel like a wet noodle dual wielding wet noodles.
And, with being ADD and all (this is real ADD, not "oops I forgot my car keys, I'm so ADD, lol"), I often find myself creating a new character to have fun on. (The ADD may also be a contributing factor to the "if it takes too long, I just won't bother doing it" factor. Jury's still out because I'm too embarrassed to ask my doctor about important life issues like Justice Gear.)
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
42 40s, LTSer.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.