Is field surge any good?

the1egend1ives

I love the idea of having a mass effect field around my character. But I'm worried that it sucks. And if so, are there any super stats that could make it more effective?

riverocean

It works best with PFF as your passive. Without PFF it's a lackluster AD.​​

cheesesloppy

It could be useful if you take the advantage. On a build without PFF though, Unbreakable basically trumps it in every single way.

the1egend1ives

cheesesloppy said:

It could be useful if you take the advantage. On a build without PFF though, Unbreakable basically trumps it in every single way.

I'm currently playing this this build. I still don't quite understand synergies between super stats and powers. Do you think it's feasible to swap out targeting computer and masterful dodge for PFF and Field Surge?

cheesesloppy

the1egend1ives said:

cheesesloppy said:

It could be useful if you take the advantage. On a build without PFF though, Unbreakable basically trumps it in every single way.

I'm currently playing this this build. I still don't quite understand synergies between super stats and powers. Do you think it's feasible to swap out targeting computer and masterful dodge for PFF and Field Surge?

PFF requires too many powers to make it work properly. As of right now, it just isn't a good power beyond taking for concept reasons. I would not take out what you have already, and would simply swap Masterful Dodge for Unbreakable if you're looking to have a sort of damage shield thing.

As for understanding Synergies, most Tooltips(Power Descriptions, too!) lay out the rules for what boosts what. As a rule of thumb, all Super Stats boost Every passive except Defiance, which relies solely on Con for its main feature. All Super Stats increase certain things depending on your role(Ranged Damage is more Damage and Threat Reduction) as well as giving their base bonuses. That's the jist of it, anyway.

Edit: You can also do what I do and take the Kinetic Manipulation legacy aura for aesthetics. Pretend your HP is the Shield!

flowcyto

The special adv on Field Surge isn't a final 15% dmg boost. Last I checked its in either the passive/lowest dmg or severity layers (ie affected by diminishing returns), and it'll have low uptime (esp after the CDR nerf)- so I generally wouldn't bother with that adv.

PFF and FS pair well together. Ya can change over to them, though ur making choice between a considerable amount of added dps via taking an offensive passive (and possibly w/ either dps role's dmg boost), vs. more survival w/ a defensive passive. Field Surge itself scales w/ rank, and not w/ any particular stat.

jennymachx

Stick to Masterful Dodge. The build looks to be DPS-focused. There's no point in taking Unbreakable if the main focus of the build is to dish out damage as much as possible and is not focused on tanking.

Masterful Dodge gives 15s of assured, consistent damage mitigation (even at rank 1 avoidance buff) concurrently while you're on the offense instead of relying on Unbreakable with its 15s longevity based on not attacking at all, which is counter-intuitive considering the build. Even if the player doesn't attack it breaks (ironic considering the AD's name) all too easily still when hit by stronger attacks from higher-ranked enemies.

The main point of FS really is to repair PFF. The temporary shield points that come with it is just a secondary thing and it doesn't regenerate so expect it to break really fast in combat. I don't see that being a fair trade off for the damage boost advantage. If you don't have PFF as your passive then you simply have better options for an AD.

EDIT: Had to look up "mass effect shield". Maybe Force Eruption is something you'd like to consider. Not exactly a shield but it has the aesthetics down and even repels melee'ers away from you. It even has a damage buff advantage that fits the ranged DPS sort of build since you have to stay in a spot to get the buff.

cyrone

cheesesloppy said:

PFF requires too many powers to make it work properly.

Please, stop. I'm going to soil myself with laughter.

As to the OP. As everyone else said, Field Surge is the partner power for Personal Force Field. It repairs the shield strength of PFF as well as grants a temporary shield on top of it.

Unbreakable, as was stated before, is better than Field Surge when it comes to survival options when using PFF.

Masterful Dodge pairs nicely with PFF as well, if you don't mind your shield to still take damage and not have time for the regeneration to ramp back up.

cyrone

the1egend1ives said:

I'm currently playing this this build. I still don't quite understand synergies between super stats and powers. Do you think it's feasible to swap out targeting computer and masterful dodge for PFF and Field Surge?

This is the route I would go if I were to be swapping powers out for PFF and FS.

Name:

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Intelligence (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Dexterity (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: The Glacier
Level 6: Covert Ops Training
Level 9: Healthy Mind
Level 12: Acrobat
Level 15: Coordinated
Level 18: Quick Recovery
Level 21: Negotiator

Powers:
Level 1: Sonic Blaster
Level 1: Experimental Blaster (Rank 2, Rank 3, Death Ray)
Level 6: Concentration
Level 8: Personal Force Field (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Sonic Boom Generator (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 14: Field Surge (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 17: Molecular Self-Assembly
Level 20: Miniaturization Drive (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 23: Unbreakable
Level 26: Sonic Device (Rank 2)
Level 29: Bionic Shielding (Rank 2, Overloaded Circuits)
Level 32: Ego Surge (Nimble Mind)
Level 35: Nanobot Swarm (Rejuvinating Injectors)
Level 38: Energy Shield (Rank 2)

Travel Powers:
Level 6:
Level 35:

Specializations:
Intelligence: Enlightened (3/3)
Intelligence: Tactician (2/2)
Intelligence: Detect Vulnerability (3/3)
Intelligence: Expertise (2/2)
Guardian: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Guardian: Ruthless (2/2)
Guardian: Find the Mark (2/3)
Guardian: The Best Defense (3/3)
Vindicator: Aggressive Stance (2/2)
Vindicator: Merciless (3/3)
Vindicator: Focused Strikes (3/3)
Vindicator: Offensive Expertise (2/2)
Mastery: Intelligence Mastery (1/1)

roughbearmattach

I use Field Surge on many builds, sometimes with the advantage, sometimes without.

It's fun, provides a cool visual, and helps survivability. With the advantage, it provides a little damage boost, and it can be used at the same time as an AO. Pairing Fireld Surge with Ego Surge is a nice combo.

No, it isn't optimal for most builds. No, it doesn't provide as much protection as Masterful Dodge. Unbreakable is usually better, though some builds get a very high shield from Field Surge.

So what.

Field Surge is plenty good for PvE. The game isn't hard enough to optimization to matter except for the toughest lairs (Andrith), Fire and Ice, and PvP.

pantagruel01

If you want a force field bubble, you're generally better off with protection field. It's true that for most PvE having field surge will not cripple you, but neither will not having an active defense at all.

cheesesloppy

cyrone said:

cheesesloppy said:

PFF requires too many powers to make it work properly.

Please, stop. I'm going to soil myself with laughter.

I dunno, I never managed to get it to work quite as well as everyone states it can be. Though as others said it's not that great for the tougher stuff which I tend to prefer. Like tanking 2-3 mobs in an alert for giggles. I don't even like Defiance for that.

Edit: Even so, this is about Field Surge. Good points.

flowcyto

cheesesloppy said:

I dunno, I never managed to get it to work quite as well as everyone states it can be. Though as others said it's not that great for the tougher stuff which I tend to prefer. Like tanking 2-3 mobs in an alert for giggles. I don't even like Defiance for that.

Edit: Even so, this is about Field Surge. Good points.

It kinda depends on the content ur doing, but PFF tank builds can be fine vs. most stuff w/ just the usual- 1-2 ADs, a reliable heal for backup, decent defensive gear/stats, and timely use of blocking.

pantagruel01

flowcyto said:

It kinda depends on the content ur doing, but PFF tank builds can be fine vs. most stuff w/ just the usual- 1-2 ADs, a reliable heal for backup, decent defensive gear/stats, and timely use of blocking.

So can an offensive passive. It's not that you can't do things with PFF, it's that there's almost always better options. Its only real strength is in situations with high spike damage but little or no sustained incoming dps.

flowcyto

pantagruel01 said:

So can an offensive passive. It's not that you can't do things with PFF, it's that there's almost always better options. Its only real strength is in situations with high spike damage but little or no sustained incoming dps.

Not really arguing otherwise w/ regards to PFF, which depends more on blocking than the others. Tanking most stuff w/ an offensive passive certainly is more up to the player's own familiarity w/ the content and more active use of defensive skills, though (not counting when an offensive passive's specific dmgRes type comes into play). Defensive passives just give you more fudge room, in most cases, and in cases of trash- allow you to be more brazen w/ regards to how many scattered mobs ya pull to AoE.

riverocean

My Unleashed uses Field Surge. It's OK... not great but OK. But that's after combining it with the Force Shield's Advantage and spamming Bountiful Chi Resurgence. Not 100% smooth but it works.

As far as PFF goes. I have a PFF build that I use mainly now. It's a ranged hybrid. PFF is great for 90% of the game. There are few enemies who give me trouble through. Namely VIPER & FROSTICUS. With VIPER I just take out those Brickbusters and Demolition guys fast as possible. I try to stay away from Frostie and focus more on Kenina Blaze.

roughbearmattach

I'd just like to point out that it's often best to make the build that you find fun and interesting, whether or not it is optimized. Champs really supports non-optimized characters.

I put together a 2GM tank build, which just spammed that attack, cycled MD and Unbreakable, and also cycled Ascenion and Ego Surge. Throw in dancing bullets AoE and Strafing Run for mobs and area attack. It was very effective in all boss fights, but I found it very boring and didn't stick with it.

Make the toon you want. If you want a one-click force field defense that takes no energy, just take Field Surge.

holloweaver

I play mainly melee tanks and I usually prefer Field Surge over Unbreakable.
Unbreakable : as the description says, the absorption stops the moment I start to attack so I've never really been able to rely efficiently on this AD.
Field Surge : stronger shield which offers me a better protection against a spike attack when I need that.
The adv on Field Surge is ok, even if it's not a final +15% damage bonus it's still good for a tank.

pantagruel01

holloweaver said:

Field Surge : stronger shield which offers me a better protection against a spike attack when I need that.

It actually isn't. Field surge is applied before mitigation, unbreakable after.

holloweaver

pantagruel01 said:

holloweaver said:

Field Surge : stronger shield which offers me a better protection against a spike attack when I need that.

It actually isn't. Field surge is applied before mitigation, unbreakable after.

... only if I do not attack, which is not what a tank should do so FS remains more efficient for me.

pantagruel01

holloweaver said:

... only if I do not attack, which is not what a tank should do so FS remains more efficient for me.

Misunderstanding my point. Let's say I have +150% damage resistance (between Defense and a defensive passive), and get hit with a 20,000 damage spike.

With Unbreakable (r1), first the damage gets reduced to 8,000 by my damage resistance, and then another 2,310 damage is absorbed by my unbreakable, and final damage is 5,690 (plus, I will have some leftover shield effect). With Field Surge (r1), first the damage gets reduced to 17,013 by the shield, and then damage resistance will reduce it to 6,805.

Field surge only provides superior spike resistance if your net damage resistance (including debuffs, etc) is 28% or lower.

rtma

Ideal synergy the AD with it's associated Passive, Theme or otherwise,
Field Surge with PFF,
Resurgence with Regen,
Unbreakable with Invulnerability,
And Masterful Dodge with Lightning Reflexes.
This is just a Guideline but use it as you see fit, if you're happy with it.

holloweaver

pantagruel01 said:

holloweaver said:

... only if I do not attack, which is not what a tank should do so FS remains more efficient for me.

Misunderstanding my point. Let's say I have +150% damage resistance (between Defense and a defensive passive), and get hit with a 20,000 damage spike.

With Unbreakable (r1), first the damage gets reduced to 8,000 by my damage resistance, and then another 2,310 damage is absorbed by my unbreakable, and final damage is 5,690 (plus, I will have some leftover shield effect). With Field Surge (r1), first the damage gets reduced to 17,013 by the shield, and then damage resistance will reduce it to 6,805.

Field surge only provides superior spike resistance if your net damage resistance (including debuffs, etc) is 28% or lower.

That's not my ingame experience between FS and Unbreakable.
I also heard enough "complains" about Unbreakable "not working" (i.e. : not processing the shield because the player was attacking).

"With Unbreakable (r1), first the damage gets reduced to 8,000 by my damage resistance, and then another 2,310 damage is absorbed by my unbreakable, and final damage is 5,690"... if I do not attack, however if I attack, Unbreakable is cancelled and I get hit for 8000.
"With Field Surge (r1), first the damage gets reduced to 17,013 by the shield, and then damage resistance will reduce it to 6,805" ...and there's 100% chance that the damage is reduced to 6805.

pantagruel01

rtma said:

Ideal synergy the AD with it's associated Passive, Theme or otherwise

Actual best synergy: masterful dodge is better with everything, and then either unbreakable or resurgence depending on your con.

rtma

pantagruel01 said:

Actual best synergy: masterful dodge is better with everything, and then either unbreakable or resurgence depending on your con.

They could give the same treatment to MD as they did LR, make it flat out dodge chance per rank + Whatever Avoidance scaled, like Rank 1 - 50%, Rank 2 - 60%, Rank 3 - 75%, Resurgence helps to recover Regen's Defense loss/HP and Boosts Regen Rate temporally(Unless it's a dated description), as for Unbreakable, didn't know it scales to CON, thought it was dependent on Rank how much you'd get Absorption wise.. O.-.o

pantagruel01

rtma said:

Unbreakable, didn't know it scales to CON, thought it was dependent on Rank how much you'd get Absorption wise.. O.-.o

It does, it's resurgence that scales with con, and on max con builds it can pull ahead of unbreakable. Any other build, unbreakable will be better.

rtma

pantagruel01 said:

It does, it's resurgence that scales with con, and on max con builds it can pull ahead of unbreakable. Any other build, unbreakable will be better.

Ah yes, Resurgence, and to pull off a crit heal, lolz, Have you tried using unbreakable with Regen? I'm sure it can be useful denying damage while Regen Recovers HP, even PFF.